Re: Help

[Tanada]

"jen.d" wrote:
>
> I'm wondering if anyone can help. Muggles has turned mean. Very mean. He's
> attacking Kid and I don't know why and I've tried to handle it for nearly 2
> months and it continues. She does nothing, she just sits there, lays there,
> or runs away when he goes all weird and then he attacks her and sometimes
> she doesn't run away. It's to the point I cannot leave them unsupervised or
> home alone together.
>
>

Can you try re-introducing them? Separating them for a while and
gradually getting them together again? Is Muggles mean with you? He
may need kitty prozac. I think I'd talk with TED about it and see what
he says, and then re-introduce them as part of his treatment. Whatever
you decide to do, the kitties are purring and we're sending relaxing
thoughts towards Muggles.

Pam, Rob, and the NC nine

[polonca12000]

I have no ideas unfortunately, except maybe keeping him in a room by himself
for a while after he attacks Kid.
Lots of purrs and best wishes,
--
Polonca & Soncek

"jen.d" > wrote in message
. ca...
> I'm wondering if anyone can help. Muggles has turned mean. Very mean.
He's
> attacking Kid and I don't know why and I've tried to handle it for nearly
2
> months and it continues. <snip>

[fuga =^o^=]

Fuga was mounting and trying to mate Java 20 times a day. I went in and I
spoke to the vet about what options were available. She told me that we
needed to separate Fuga and Java and slowly re-introduce them. We kept them
separate for about 4 days. Java started getting depressed and thought that
she was being punished so we stopped.

Basically we kept rotating the room she was in and would keep her away from
fuga, so sometimes she was locked in the office and sometimes she had access
to the whole apartment.

Eventually fuga's behaviour stopped and anytime it started we isolated him
for about 15 min to 1 hour. Now he only goes after Java about once a
week..

My vet told us that as soon as a problem behaviour arises you have to do
something about it quickly.. otherwise it become more difficult to break.
Good luck.. I will keep my fingers crossed that Muggles settles down
quickly. I hope he's not suffering too much from megacolon.

Fuga

[Marina]

"jen.d" > wrote
> I'm wondering if anyone can help.

I wish I could help, but I can only send
Muggles-calm-down-and-leave-Kid-alone purrs, so lots of those and a scritch
to poor Kid.

--
Marina, Frank and Nikki

[Victor M. Martinez]

Maybe Feliway would help?

--
Victor M. Martinez

http://www.che.utexas.edu/~martiv

[m. L. Briggs]

On Fri, 29 Aug 2003 05:07:30 GMT, "jen.d" > wrote:

>I'm wondering if anyone can help. Muggles has turned mean. Very mean. He's
>attacking Kid and I don't know why and I've tried to handle it for nearly 2
>months and it continues. She does nothing, she just sits there, lays there,
>or runs away when he goes all weird and then he attacks her and sometimes
>she doesn't run away. It's to the point I cannot leave them unsupervised or
>home alone together.
>
>He knows what he's doing is bad. He gets a funny squeak and I break them
>up, but he gets spooked cause he knows what he's doing is bad and he runs
>away with his ears back. Sometimes I don't break them up in time and I yell
>"NO" and he runs away all scared like -- so he knows better but he's been
>doing this for like two months. He gets the spray bottle or "NO" and he
>still continues doing this.
>
>I don't know what to do. I don't want to permanently drug him, he's fixed of
>course and so is she, they've been together all their lives (they're both 2)
>and Rescue Remedy doesn't work on him. I'm going to order feliway now I've
>tried Rescue remedy but if that doesn't work I don't know what to do. Right
>now I cannot afford a behaviorist (even if it would work for a dumb cat),
>and he's recently had all his tests done with that bowel thing (he's been
>fine for over a month) and tests all turned up regular. On top of all of
>this, he is totally stupid.
>
>This change started when he came back from the vets (his megacolon) and Kid
>hissed at him for a few days. She's fine now, but he started being
>aggressive and it hasn't gone away. He's always kind of not left her alone
>and gotten weird with her sometimes (like when she's in the litterbox and
>sometimes in summer when he humps her) but he's never been this agressive,
>never like this. She's not doing anything to him, just minding her own
>business (until he attacks her, then she screams). I really need help
>suggestions of things I can try, because Kid can't have this she has enough
>problems as it is. This is not normal play.
>
>Jen.
>
I am not an expert, but I read that neutering does not take away the
desire -- only the ability especially in male cats. It sounds like s
frustrated kitty. Keeping him away from her seems to be the best
idea.

[Daniel Mahoney]

"m. L. Briggs" > wrote in message


> I am not an expert, but I read that neutering does not take away the
> desire -- only the ability especially in male cats. It sounds like s
> frustrated kitty. Keeping him away from her seems to be the best
> idea.

Or perhaps, as someone else has sugggested, talking to the vet
about kitty prozac. If administered in careful doses, it doesn't
have to make the kitty sluggish.

Dan


--
Posted via Mailgate.ORG Server - http://www.Mailgate.ORG

[Brenda Watkins]

"jen.d" > wrote in message
. ca...
> I'm wondering if anyone can help. Muggles has turned mean. Very mean.
He's
> attacking Kid and I don't know why and I've tried to handle it for nearly
2
> months and it continues. She does nothing, she just sits there, lays
there,
> or runs away when he goes all weird and then he attacks her and sometimes
> she doesn't run away. It's to the point I cannot leave them unsupervised
or
> home alone together.
>
> He knows what he's doing is bad. He gets a funny squeak and I break them
> up, but he gets spooked cause he knows what he's doing is bad and he runs
> away with his ears back. Sometimes I don't break them up in time and I
yell
> "NO" and he runs away all scared like -- so he knows better but he's been
> doing this for like two months. He gets the spray bottle or "NO" and he
> still continues doing this.
>
> I don't know what to do. I don't want to permanently drug him, he's fixed
of
> course and so is she, they've been together all their lives (they're both
2)
> and Rescue Remedy doesn't work on him. I'm going to order feliway now
I've
> tried Rescue remedy but if that doesn't work I don't know what to do.
Right
> now I cannot afford a behaviorist (even if it would work for a dumb cat),
> and he's recently had all his tests done with that bowel thing (he's been
> fine for over a month) and tests all turned up regular. On top of all of
> this, he is totally stupid.
>
> This change started when he came back from the vets (his megacolon) and
Kid
> hissed at him for a few days. She's fine now, but he started being
> aggressive and it hasn't gone away. He's always kind of not left her alone
> and gotten weird with her sometimes (like when she's in the litterbox and
> sometimes in summer when he humps her) but he's never been this agressive,
> never like this. She's not doing anything to him, just minding her own
> business (until he attacks her, then she screams). I really need help
> suggestions of things I can try, because Kid can't have this she has
enough
> problems as it is. This is not normal play.
>
> Jen.
>
>
we're sending lots of special calming purrs to Muggles.
Brenda

[Steve Touchstone]

On Fri, 29 Aug 2003 15:36:24 -0600, m. L. Briggs >
wrote:

>On Fri, 29 Aug 2003 05:07:30 GMT, "jen.d" > wrote:
>
>>I'm wondering if anyone can help. Muggles has turned mean. Very mean. He's
>>attacking Kid and I don't know why and I've tried to handle it for nearly 2
>>months and it continues. She does nothing, she just sits there, lays there,
>>or runs away when he goes all weird and then he attacks her and sometimes
>>she doesn't run away. It's to the point I cannot leave them unsupervised or
>>home alone together.
>>
>>He knows what he's doing is bad. He gets a funny squeak and I break them
>>up, but he gets spooked cause he knows what he's doing is bad and he runs
>>away with his ears back. Sometimes I don't break them up in time and I yell
>>"NO" and he runs away all scared like -- so he knows better but he's been
>>doing this for like two months. He gets the spray bottle or "NO" and he
>>still continues doing this.
>>
>>I don't know what to do. I don't want to permanently drug him, he's fixed of
>>course and so is she, they've been together all their lives (they're both 2)
>>and Rescue Remedy doesn't work on him. I'm going to order feliway now I've
>>tried Rescue remedy but if that doesn't work I don't know what to do. Right
>>now I cannot afford a behaviorist (even if it would work for a dumb cat),
>>and he's recently had all his tests done with that bowel thing (he's been
>>fine for over a month) and tests all turned up regular. On top of all of
>>this, he is totally stupid.
>>
>>This change started when he came back from the vets (his megacolon) and Kid
>>hissed at him for a few days. She's fine now, but he started being
>>aggressive and it hasn't gone away. He's always kind of not left her alone
>>and gotten weird with her sometimes (like when she's in the litterbox and
>>sometimes in summer when he humps her) but he's never been this agressive,
>>never like this. She's not doing anything to him, just minding her own
>>business (until he attacks her, then she screams). I really need help
>>suggestions of things I can try, because Kid can't have this she has enough
>>problems as it is. This is not normal play.
>>
>>Jen.
>>
>I am not an expert, but I read that neutering does not take away the
>desire -- only the ability especially in male cats. It sounds like s
>frustrated kitty. Keeping him away from her seems to be the best
>idea.

I'm sorry, but don't have any constructive suggestions - unless he
might be on some meds after he's earlier troubles. I wouldn't have
even thought of this if I hadn't just posted a reply to the thread
dealing with flagyl (metronidazole). That got me to remembering that
one of the possible side effects of flagyl is confusion and
irritability. Another possibility is a change in diet - I know I can
be a bit touchy when on a diet ;-) Whatever the cause, I agree with
those who are suggesting a temporary separation, as you don't want him
to learn any bad habits which might continue after the cause is gone.

[jen.d]

> Can you try re-introducing them? Separating them for a while and
> gradually getting them together again? Is Muggles mean with you?

Not mean with anyone other than Kid (fine with me, Jinks, and Pete), and
he's not consistently mean with her either - sometimes he's very nice to
her.

> He
> may need kitty prozac. I think I'd talk with TED about it and see what
> he says, and then re-introduce them as part of his treatment. Whatever
> you decide to do, the kitties are purring and we're sending relaxing
> thoughts towards Muggles.

I definitely want to stay away from the drugs if possible (he has had
Elavil, which is the prozac, once before). But if reintroducing doesn't
work, then that might be what we have to do. I sure hope not...

Jen.

[jen.d]

> Fuga was mounting and trying to mate Java 20 times a day. I went in and I
> spoke to the vet about what options were available. She told me that we
> needed to separate Fuga and Java and slowly re-introduce them. We kept
them
> separate for about 4 days. Java started getting depressed and thought
that
> she was being punished so we stopped.
>
> Basically we kept rotating the room she was in and would keep her away
from
> fuga, so sometimes she was locked in the office and sometimes she had
access
> to the whole apartment.
>
> Eventually fuga's behaviour stopped and anytime it started we isolated him
> for about 15 min to 1 hour. Now he only goes after Java about once a
> week..
>
> My vet told us that as soon as a problem behaviour arises you have to do
> something about it quickly.. otherwise it become more difficult to break.
> Good luck.. I will keep my fingers crossed that Muggles settles down
> quickly. I hope he's not suffering too much from megacolon.

Yeah, I think that this is what we'll have to do. It's no big deal really,
because Kid stays with us most of the day as it is, and when we sleep the
boy cats go to the catroom anyway (where they're perfectly happy beacuse
they always get fed when they're in there) - and she runs around the place
like a madwoman. So the "other times" aren't all that much time at all. I
really don't think he's trying to hump her again like he used to. Dunno.

Doesn't look like he has a chronic megacolon. We weaned him off the
Lactulose when he started getting regular "movements", and he's been
absolutely fine. Hopefully that'll continue. I figure he must have eaten
something he shouldn't have that bunged him up big time. But the pipes clear
just fine nowadays and he's having a blast causing mayhem for Kid.

Jen.

[jen.d]

> I am not an expert, but I read that neutering does not take away the
> desire -- only the ability especially in male cats. It sounds like s
> frustrated kitty. Keeping him away from her seems to be the best
> idea.

I think it takes away some of the desire, which is why they don't want to
roam anymore. From what I've seen and heard it doesn't take away everything
though =) From what I can tell, he isn't trying to hump her like before (at
least, not all the time). The actions are usually quite different.

I can't keep them isolated for the next 14 years though.

Jen.

[jen.d]

> Or perhaps, as someone else has sugggested, talking to the vet
> about kitty prozac. If administered in careful doses, it doesn't
> have to make the kitty sluggish.
>
> Dan

He's had it before (Elavil), but it's definitely a final resort =)

Jen.

[jen.d]

> I'm sorry, but don't have any constructive suggestions - unless he
> might be on some meds after he's earlier troubles. I wouldn't have
> even thought of this if I hadn't just posted a reply to the thread
> dealing with flagyl (metronidazole). That got me to remembering that
> one of the possible side effects of flagyl is confusion and
> irritability. Another possibility is a change in diet - I know I can
> be a bit touchy when on a diet ;-) Whatever the cause, I agree with
> those who are suggesting a temporary separation, as you don't want him
> to learn any bad habits which might continue after the cause is gone.


Yeah, that would definitely be a first thought, but he's not on any meds at
all and he's eating his regular assortment of foods he's had. Although, I
might just change it again incase somethings up with that. What makes me
think it's behavior as opposed to biological is that he's only acting up
with Kid and no one else. He's fine with Jinks, and us but not with Kid. I
sense something weird happened when we brought him home from the vets all
that time ago, and it's just gotten worse.

Anyway, I'll do separation and see where it goes.

Jen.

[jen.d]

thanks everyone for purrs.

Jen.

[[email protected]]

jen.d > wrote:

> I definitely want to stay away from the drugs if possible (he has had
> Elavil, which is the prozac, once before).

I can understand trying to avoid drugs if you can - why introduce another
complication, with potential side effects you don't want, into his life?
But I just want to say to the above comment that Prozac is nothing like
Elavil. Elavil is an old medication and definitely leaves a person (and
therefore, probably a cat, too) feeling drugged, whereas Prozac has far
fewer side effects (which is one reason for its popularity).

Joyce

[jen.d]

> > I definitely want to stay away from the drugs if possible (he has had
> > Elavil, which is the prozac, once before).
>
> I can understand trying to avoid drugs if you can - why introduce another
> complication, with potential side effects you don't want, into his life?
> But I just want to say to the above comment that Prozac is nothing like
> Elavil. Elavil is an old medication and definitely leaves a person (and
> therefore, probably a cat, too) feeling drugged, whereas Prozac has far
> fewer side effects (which is one reason for its popularity).
>
> Joyce

I've been told that Elavil is the version that they give to cats though (I
know there's a difference in the human prozac from elavil, becuase people
take elavil too). Least, that's what they said when Muggles got it. Do cats
actually get perscribed prozac proper?

Jen.

[jen.d]

> > I've been told that Elavil is the version that they give to cats though
(I
> > know there's a difference in the human prozac from elavil, becuase
people
> > take elavil too). Least, that's what they said when Muggles got it. Do
> > cats actually get perscribed prozac proper?
>
> It seems a little odd to me that vets would prescribe Elavil to cats
> and call it Prozac... what would be the purpose of that?
>
> Joyce, having a cup of tea, but I've decided to call it sushi. :)

No, that's not what I said. They didn't actually ever call it prozac, but
said it had a similar effect, and that's what they gave to cats. I know they
are different, but I don't know if they give prozac to acts, or if they give
elavil instead. I was just wondering if you know.

Jen.

[LOL]

"jen.d" > wrote in message >...
> I'm wondering if anyone can help. Muggles has turned mean.

(snippety)
>
> Jen.


I'm sorry I have no suggestion, Jen - I have only ever dealt with one
cat at a time, so I don't have a clue what to do. We are sending
purrs, though, to Muggles, though since Mike is a mean cat too, I am
just hoping they don't make the situation worse with a multiplication
of the meanness. :-)

------
Krista

[[email protected]]

jen.d > wrote:

> No, that's not what I said. They didn't actually ever call it prozac,
> but said it had a similar effect, and that's what they gave to cats.
> I know they are different, but I don't know if they give prozac to acts,
> or if they give elavil instead. I was just wondering if you know.

Sorry - I was just joking around. I don't know much about psych meds
and cats. I have heard of cats being given Prozac (the real thing),
but hadn't heard of them being given Elavil, which of course does not
mean it hasn't happened.

Joyce

[Christine Burel]

Jen, please email me at without the LITTER addition.
I've been trying unsuccessfully to email you privately with some suggestions
and blasted Windows XP keeps reinserting the LITTER everytime I remove it
and so the mail keeps returning.
Christine

"LOL" > wrote in message
om...
> "jen.d" > wrote in message
>...
> > I'm wondering if anyone can help. Muggles has turned mean.
>
> (snippety)
> >
> > Jen.
>
>
> I'm sorry I have no suggestion, Jen - I have only ever dealt with one
> cat at a time, so I don't have a clue what to do. We are sending
> purrs, though, to Muggles, though since Mike is a mean cat too, I am
> just hoping they don't make the situation worse with a multiplication
> of the meanness. :-)
>
> ------
> Krista

[Jean H]

It's just a thought, but maybe there should be a bit of sympathy for fuga,
could be
like when a person is ill it sometimes changes their personality, oft-times
for the worse,
he may realise what he's doing is wrong, but still be unable to help himself
perhaps it
will be a long road of loving patience I hope you succeed for everyones
sake good luck
it took four and a half months of gentle love to train my ferral kitten to
the litter tray
it was a long time but it happened [thank god] no smacking and no yelling
but he got
there Ihope fugi does, your doing all you can jp


"jen.d" > wrote in message
. ..
> > Fuga was mounting and trying to mate Java 20 times a day. I went in and
I
> > spoke to the vet about what options were available. She told me that we
> > needed to separate Fuga and Java and slowly re-introduce them. We kept
> them
> > separate for about 4 days. Java started getting depressed and thought
> that
> > she was being punished so we stopped.
> >
> > Basically we kept rotating the room she was in and would keep her away
> from
> > fuga, so sometimes she was locked in the office and sometimes she had
> access
> > to the whole apartment.
> >
> > Eventually fuga's behaviour stopped and anytime it started we isolated
him
> > for about 15 min to 1 hour. Now he only goes after Java about once a
> > week..
> >
> > My vet told us that as soon as a problem behaviour arises you have to do
> > something about it quickly.. otherwise it become more difficult to
break.
> > Good luck.. I will keep my fingers crossed that Muggles settles down
> > quickly. I hope he's not suffering too much from megacolon.
>
> Yeah, I think that this is what we'll have to do. It's no big deal
really,
> because Kid stays with us most of the day as it is, and when we sleep the
> boy cats go to the catroom anyway (where they're perfectly happy beacuse
> they always get fed when they're in there) - and she runs around the place
> like a madwoman. So the "other times" aren't all that much time at all. I
> really don't think he's trying to hump her again like he used to. Dunno.
>
> Doesn't look like he has a chronic megacolon. We weaned him off the
> Lactulose when he started getting regular "movements", and he's been
> absolutely fine. Hopefully that'll continue. I figure he must have eaten
> something he shouldn't have that bunged him up big time. But the pipes
clear
> just fine nowadays and he's having a blast causing mayhem for Kid.
>
> Jen.
>
>
>
>
>
>