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Max[_2_]
July 4th 10, 09:57 PM
It has been quite a long while since I have been able to post here. I
have no idea why, I believe it had something to do with Google
changing things around. I generally view these threads via google
groups.

Some of you may or may not recall that I took in a feral cat this past
February.

Anyway, five months later... It has been a long, long haul, but kitty
is doing quite well, I would say.

Any further advice, tips, thoughts are always appreciated.

Kitty is getting along well with my other two cats, much to my
surprise. I still cage him at night. I get him in the cage because he
knows that is where he eats and drinks. His litter box is also in
there. When he comes in at night I love on him, pet him and play with
him. He loves the attention when he is in his cage.

In the morning I also play and love and pet him before I feed him and
let him out for the day.

The issue we have is that once he is out of the cage, I couldn't catch
him to save my life. I mean, when he sees us, if we are moving around
in the house, he dashes down the steps and hides out until he feels
safe enough - but if the other cats are around he will be less afraid
of us and hang out a few steps down. Last night I loved and petted
both my other cats while my little feral kitty watched... I think that
helps him feel more secure around us.

I feel that we have come such a long way with kitty. But at the same
time, we still have some work to do. I have a pretty good idea that it
won't be long before I can put the cage away for good, but I would
feel much better about putting the cage away once I am able to
"handle" him when he is outside the cage.

Anyway, just thought I would leave an update and see what sort of
responses/advice I can glean.

Thanks for your time.
Melissa

John Ross Mc Master
July 5th 10, 12:35 AM
On Sun, 4 Jul 2010 13:57:24 -0700 (PDT), Max
> wrote:

>It has been quite a long while since I have been able to post here. I
>have no idea why, I believe it had something to do with Google
>changing things around. I generally view these threads via google
>groups.
>
>Some of you may or may not recall that I took in a feral cat this past
>February.
>
>Anyway, five months later... It has been a long, long haul, but kitty
>is doing quite well, I would say.
>
>Any further advice, tips, thoughts are always appreciated.
>
>Kitty is getting along well with my other two cats, much to my
>surprise. I still cage him at night. I get him in the cage because he
>knows that is where he eats and drinks. His litter box is also in
>there. When he comes in at night I love on him, pet him and play with
>him. He loves the attention when he is in his cage.
>
>In the morning I also play and love and pet him before I feed him and
>let him out for the day.
>
>The issue we have is that once he is out of the cage, I couldn't catch
>him to save my life. I mean, when he sees us, if we are moving around
>in the house, he dashes down the steps and hides out until he feels
>safe enough - but if the other cats are around he will be less afraid
>of us and hang out a few steps down. Last night I loved and petted
>both my other cats while my little feral kitty watched... I think that
>helps him feel more secure around us.
>
>I feel that we have come such a long way with kitty. But at the same
>time, we still have some work to do. I have a pretty good idea that it
>won't be long before I can put the cage away for good, but I would
>feel much better about putting the cage away once I am able to
>"handle" him when he is outside the cage.
>
>Anyway, just thought I would leave an update and see what sort of
>responses/advice I can glean.
>
>Thanks for your time.
>Melissa


The kitty should live inside a house with a loving human and other
cats AND the doors to the outside should always be shut.
The human should be a paranoid about cats escaping. He will come more
and more to trust humans.

cshenk
July 5th 10, 06:31 PM
"Max" wrote

> you may or may not recall that I took in a feral cat this past
> February.
>
> Anyway, five months later... It has been a long, long haul, but kitty
> is doing quite well, I would say.

Stop caging the cat. Do not let the cat out. Cats are not dogs to be 'den
trained' and ferals are *definately* not suitable for it.

Terry[_2_]
July 7th 10, 08:45 PM
> The kitty should live inside a house with a loving human and other
> cats AND the doors to the outside should always be shut.
> The human should be a paranoid about cats escaping. He will come more
> and more to trust humans.
I have four feral cats. Their outside days are over. They tame up a lot
quicker if they stay inside around you all the time. After a while they
don't want to go out. Even when a door is wide open, they just stare out
or move away from it. I think they now see the house as a safe haven
from the dangers of the outside world.

Max[_2_]
July 7th 10, 11:48 PM
On Jul 7, 3:45*pm, Terry > wrote:
> > The kitty should live inside a house with a loving human and other


This is really helpful, Terry, this gives me some encouragement. I
know you are right; I believe he will come around. When I do get to
pet him, he really seems to enjoy the attention and being petted. He
purrs and rolls around on the floor and pushes into me. He also lays
around on his back, legs in the air when he is in his cage - very
comfortable... Like our Max cat does (and Butterball seems to also
have learned this behavior from Max).

However, I am not unaware of the incredible boredom he must face when
he is in his cage.

I am still hoping for some responses from folks who have used the
method I have been using. I am certain, given this cat, and our
current situation, that his level of socialization has been greatly
speeded up by this method. Otherwise, he would have been living
downstairs with little or no contact from us and we would never even
be able to lay our eyes on him.

We live in a ranch style house with an "upstairs" and "lower level".
"Kitty" hides in the lower level (which we don't use much) a lot, but
he comes up to play with my other two boys. I am SO SO SO GLAD he gets
along well with them, because some cats couldn't. My two cats are both
Alpha's, but Max has finally established himself as THE "ALPHA CAT".
LOL! That has caused Max and Butterballs relationship to finally
stabilize and they are pretty close now.

In any case, "Kitty" has been loose in the house now since last night.
I have not seen hide nor hair of him except when we got up this
morning and he was playing with Max and Butterball, and again when we
came home from running some errands, "Kitty" was playing with Max and
Butterball, so in some sense, at least he is getting some
socialization from my two other cats, and he is getting some
[probably] much needed space from "life in a home" downstairs today...

One of the problems that I notice is that on his "free house runs" is
that he is a lot more wild and less open to contact with me once we do
get him caged again (which I do want to continue doing because if he
should need veterinarian care or need some help in another way, I can
see to it - and it gives me more time to work with him - AND it helps
that he associates his cage to being fed. He comes to his cage for his
food - NO he is not necessarily hungry).

Perhaps I am being too impatient.

I am really hoping to hear from the people who have used this method.
It was originally Phil P and MaryL, who CLEARLY, OBVIOUSLY have some
experience with this.

And I very much appreciate everyone's thoughts and ideas. Thanks for
everything!

Thanks :-)
M

cshenk
July 8th 10, 12:31 AM
"Max" wrote

> I am really hoping to hear from the people who have used this method.
> It was originally Phil P and MaryL, who CLEARLY, OBVIOUSLY have some
> experience with this.

Hopefully they will answer you the way you wish to hear it. Having brought
over 15 or so ferals, my methods are not yours. I've also never had one
take as long as yours has. I don't expect 'lap kitty' as not even normal
home raised cats always turn that bent of personality.

What expectations do you have of a feral?

> In any case, "Kitty" has been loose in the house now since last night.
> I have not seen hide nor hair of him except when we got up this
> morning and he was playing with Max and Butterball, and again when we
> came home from running some errands, "Kitty" was playing with Max and
> Butterball, so in some sense, at least he is getting some
> socialization from my two other cats, and he is getting some
> [probably] much needed space from "life in a home" downstairs today...

This is *normal* as the cat adapts.

> One of the problems that I notice is that on his "free house runs" is
> that he is a lot more wild and less open to contact with me once we do
> get him caged again.

Duh. Cats, *especially ferals* do not like cages. I am sure you can find a
way to get the cat to the vet at need. It's never been a problem here and
raised my first feral in 1979.

cshenk
July 8th 10, 12:32 AM
"Terry" wrote

>> The kitty should live inside a house with a loving human and other
>> cats AND the doors to the outside should always be shut.
>> The human should be a paranoid about cats escaping. He will come more
>> and more to trust humans.

> I have four feral cats. Their outside days are over. They tame up a lot
> quicker if they stay inside around you all the time. After a while they
> don't want to go out. Even when a door is wide open, they just stare out
> or move away from it. I think they now see the house as a safe haven
> from the dangers of the outside world.

Correct Terry.

Max[_2_]
July 8th 10, 03:36 AM
On Jul 7, 7:32*pm, "cshenk" > wrote:
> "Terry" wrote
>
> >> The kitty should live inside a house with a loving human and other
> >> cats AND the doors to the outside should always be shut.
> >> The human should be a paranoid about cats escaping. He will come more
> >> and more to trust humans.
> > I have four feral cats. Their outside days are over. *They tame up a lot
> > quicker if they stay inside around you all the time. After a while they
> > don't want to go out. Even when a door is wide open, they just stare out
> > or move away from it. I think they now see the house as a safe haven
> > from the dangers of the outside world.
>
> Correct Terry.

cshenk:

I have done my very best to appreciate what you have to say. It is too
bad that YOU are NOT open to new ideas or what others have to say,
preferring to assume yourself [and apparently, ONLY yourself] to be
some sort of expert. I can respect your success with your cats, but I,
personally, DON'T need to assume that I know what is best for everyone
else. You shouldn't either. Too bad, so sad. I am sure Phil has tons
more experience with ferals than you have. Why don't you ask him how
many ferals he has dealt with???????? I would say the same about
another person on this board but I honestly don't know.

Let me ask you this: Are you suggesting, stating (or perhaps you just
didn't really read the original posts or fully understand them) that
people with far, far, far MORE experience than you have no idea what
they are doing????

All cats have different personalities. I am so sorry you have assumed
your success rate has been totally to your credit. WOW!!! How
convenient for you!!! You must be pretty da$#@ed INSECURE!

I would not have to even feel a need to say this except that you have
your ideas and I have mine. Without exception you have pounded and
pounded home your distaste for the method I have used, even though I
BELIEVE that I was given very good advice ON THIS BOARD.

I DID NOT choose to start a flame war and I absolutely choose NOT to
keep it up, but you have kept on and on and on [AND ON AND ON AND ON
AND ON AND ON AND ON AND ON....]. I am guessing you are here because
you have no friends in real life.

I HEARD what you have to say, I appreciate what you have to say, but I
have chosen another path whether you agree or disagree. Too bad so sad
for you!!!

NOW I am looking for people who know what they are talking about when
I post.

BUTT OUT!!! If you don't agree, it is too bad for you!!!

You HAVE NO IDEA how much experience I have with cats, but you
certainly have made a LOT of ASSUMPTIONS. If you like I can refer back
to former posts to prove my points, but I prefer NOT TO.

MAKE MY DAY!!!

Max[_2_]
July 8th 10, 03:46 AM
On Jul 7, 10:36*pm, Max > wrote:
> On Jul 7, 7:32*pm, "cshenk" > wrote:
>
> > "Terry" wrote
>
> > >> The kitty should live inside a house with a loving human and other
> > >> cats AND the doors to the outside should always be shut.
> > >> The human should be a paranoid about cats escaping. He will come more
> > >> and more to trust humans.
> > > I have four feral cats. Their outside days are over. *They tame up a lot
> > > quicker if they stay inside around you all the time. After a while they
> > > don't want to go out. Even when a door is wide open, they just stare out
> > > or move away from it. I think they now see the house as a safe haven
> > > from the dangers of the outside world.
>
> > Correct Terry.
>
> cshenk:
>
> I have done my very best to appreciate what you have to say. It is too
> bad that YOU are NOT open to new ideas or what others have to say,
> preferring to assume yourself [and apparently, ONLY yourself] to be
> some sort of expert. I can respect your success with your cats, but I,
> personally, DON'T need to assume that I know what is best for everyone
> else. You shouldn't either. Too bad, so sad. I am sure Phil has tons
> more experience with ferals than you have. Why don't you ask him how
> many ferals he has dealt with???????? I would say the same about
> another person on this board but I honestly don't know.
>
> Let me ask you this: *Are you suggesting, stating (or perhaps you just
> didn't really read the original posts or fully understand them) that
> people with far, far, far MORE experience than you have no idea what
> they are doing????
>
> All cats have different personalities. I am so sorry you have assumed
> your success rate has been totally to your credit. WOW!!! How
> convenient for you!!! You must be pretty da$#@ed INSECURE!
>
> I would not have to even feel a need to say this except that you have
> your ideas and I have mine. Without exception you have pounded and
> pounded home your distaste for the method I have used, even though I
> BELIEVE that I was given very good advice ON THIS BOARD.
>
> I DID NOT choose to start a flame war and I absolutely choose NOT to
> keep it up, but you have kept on and on and on [AND ON AND ON AND ON
> AND ON AND ON AND ON AND ON....]. I am guessing you are here because
> you have no friends in real life.
>
> I HEARD what you have to say, I appreciate what you have to say, but I
> have chosen another path whether you agree or disagree. Too bad so sad
> for you!!!
>
> NOW I am looking for people who know what they are talking about when
> I post.
>
> BUTT OUT!!! If you don't agree, it is too bad for you!!!
>
> You HAVE NO IDEA how much experience I have with cats, but you
> certainly have made a LOT of ASSUMPTIONS. If you like I can refer back
> to former posts to prove my points, but I prefer NOT TO.
>
> MAKE MY DAY!!!

Better yet, cshenk, why don't you go ahead and check out his
website??? MAYBE even you can learn something new!!!

cshenk
July 9th 10, 12:16 AM
"Max" wrote
"cshenk"wrote:

----------lines
I have done my very best to appreciate what you have to say. It is too
bad that YOU are NOT open to new ideas or what others have to say,
preferring to assume yourself [and apparently, ONLY yourself] to be
some sort of expert. I can respect your success with your cats, but I,
personally, DON'T need to assume that I know what is best for everyone
else. You shouldn't either. Too bad, so sad. I am sure Phil has tons
more experience with ferals than you have. Why don't you ask him how
many ferals he has dealt with???????? I would say the same about
another person on this board but I honestly don't know.

Let me ask you this: Are you suggesting, stating (or perhaps you just
didn't really read the original posts or fully understand them) that
people with far, far, far MORE experience than you have no idea what
they are doing????

All cats have different personalities. I am so sorry you have assumed
your success rate has been totally to your credit. WOW!!! How
convenient for you!!! You must be pretty da$#@ed INSECURE!

I would not have to even feel a need to say this except that you have
your ideas and I have mine. Without exception you have pounded and
pounded home your distaste for the method I have used, even though I
BELIEVE that I was given very good advice ON THIS BOARD.

I DID NOT choose to start a flame war and I absolutely choose NOT to
keep it up, but you have kept on and on and on [AND ON AND ON AND ON
AND ON AND ON AND ON AND ON....]. I am guessing you are here because
you have no friends in real life.

I HEARD what you have to say, I appreciate what you have to say, but I
have chosen another path whether you agree or disagree. Too bad so sad
for you!!!

NOW I am looking for people who know what they are talking about when
I post.

BUTT OUT!!! If you don't agree, it is too bad for you!!!

You HAVE NO IDEA how much experience I have with cats, but you
certainly have made a LOT of ASSUMPTIONS. If you like I can refer back
to former posts to prove my points, but I prefer NOT TO.

MAKE MY DAY!!!
----------

Sorry for trying to help you. Wont bother again. Dunno what made you think
all that crap you just posted at me.