PDA

View Full Version : 7-year-old cat with "smoker's cough" !


Eddy[_2_]
September 8th 11, 09:59 PM
Does anyone recognise the following?

Puss will be sleeping happily and then he'll start "coughing". It seems
he's trying to move something. He keeps on coughing but whatever it is
doesn't move or stop aggravating him and so he gets anxious and gets
quickly down onto the floor and into the crouch position, stretching his
neck out parallel to the floor and almost touching the floor with his
chin. In this position he keeps "coughing", perhaps for a whole minute,
until the irritation stops. Then he returns to entirely normal
behaviour - until next time.

This has been going on for some weeks now. About a month ago he had
some kind of nasal or sinus infection, resulting in yellow discharge
from one nostril, and the vet prescribed five days of an antibiotic.
That cleared that problem, but this occasional "coughing" remains.

We have thought it must be a hairball because this is much the same kind
of "coughing" that he and his twin brother have done occasionally ever
since they were kittens. So each week they are always given a bit of
hairball oil. However, for this cat we have been giving him some
hairball oil every day now for the past week, to hopefully clear any
hair, if hair is indeed the problem. But he's still having a
"coughing" session daily - perhaps two or three times per day.

When you get down the floor with him when this happens you get the
impression that it's like "smoker's cough", that there's something
there, if not hair, then perhaps some buildup of mucous or other fluid.

It's a very long journey from our house to the nearest vet, so I thought
I would first see if anyone here recognises this condition and knows
about it.

Thanks for any advice.

Eddy.

Bill Graham
September 8th 11, 10:08 PM
Eddy wrote:
> Does anyone recognise the following?
>
> Puss will be sleeping happily and then he'll start "coughing". It
> seems he's trying to move something. He keeps on coughing but
> whatever it is doesn't move or stop aggravating him and so he gets
> anxious and gets quickly down onto the floor and into the crouch
> position, stretching his neck out parallel to the floor and almost
> touching the floor with his chin. In this position he keeps
> "coughing", perhaps for a whole minute, until the irritation stops.
> Then he returns to entirely normal behaviour - until next time.
>
> This has been going on for some weeks now. About a month ago he had
> some kind of nasal or sinus infection, resulting in yellow discharge
> from one nostril, and the vet prescribed five days of an antibiotic.
> That cleared that problem, but this occasional "coughing" remains.
>
> We have thought it must be a hairball because this is much the same
> kind of "coughing" that he and his twin brother have done
> occasionally ever since they were kittens. So each week they are
> always given a bit of hairball oil. However, for this cat we have
> been giving him some hairball oil every day now for the past week, to
> hopefully clear any hair, if hair is indeed the problem. But he's
> still having a "coughing" session daily - perhaps two or three times
> per day.
>
> When you get down the floor with him when this happens you get the
> impression that it's like "smoker's cough", that there's something
> there, if not hair, then perhaps some buildup of mucous or other
> fluid.
>
> It's a very long journey from our house to the nearest vet, so I
> thought I would first see if anyone here recognises this condition
> and knows about it.
>
> Thanks for any advice.
>
> Eddy.

Well, if he was a Human, you would get him a "CAT" scan. (No pun intended)
But, since he's just a cat, there wouldn't be much you could do about it if
he has some kind of tumour anyway, so there isn't much you can do, but wait
to see if it gets worse, and then put him down near the end. He might be
allergic to something, or it may be just hair or dander. This is the season
for excess hair. Be sure you brush him frequently.

Wayne Mitchell
September 9th 11, 02:13 AM
Eddy > wrote:

>He keeps on coughing but whatever it is
>doesn't move or stop aggravating him and so he gets anxious and gets
>quickly down onto the floor and into the crouch position, stretching his
>neck out parallel to the floor and almost touching the floor with his
>chin. In this position he keeps "coughing", perhaps for a whole minute,
>until the irritation stops. Then he returns to entirely normal
>behaviour - until next time.

This sounds like a classic asthma attack. My Will would do this a dozen
times a day before we got his asthma under control.

Take him to a vet and get a thoracic radiograph. Chances are it will
show the diagnostic "donuts and tramlines" which are caused by thickened
bronchial walls and trapped air.

If it is asthma, he needs be put on a regimen of glucocorticoid
steroids. Typically that will be either oral prednisolone or injected
depo medrol (methylprednisolone). Eventually, you will want to move him
over to the inhaled steroid fluticasone propionate (Flovent/Flixotide),
because it is non-systemic and doesn't have the potential for adverse
effects that pred does.
--

Wayne M.

---MIKE---
September 9th 11, 12:45 PM
When I had Ike (RB) he had the same symptoms. It was asthma and the vet
would give him a prednisone shot. This would stop the attacks right
away. The relief would last about four months when it would start
again. This occurred until Ike disappeared.

barb
September 9th 11, 02:49 PM
You could try Googling for extra info and then phone call to your vet.

Barb

Eddy[_2_]
September 9th 11, 03:51 PM
Wayne Mitchell wrote:

> This sounds like a classic asthma attack. My Will would do this a dozen
> times a day before we got his asthma under control.
>
> Take him to a vet and get a thoracic radiograph. Chances are it will
> show the diagnostic "donuts and tramlines" which are caused by thickened
> bronchial walls and trapped air.
>
> If it is asthma, he needs be put on a regimen of glucocorticoid
> steroids. Typically that will be either oral prednisolone or injected
> depo medrol (methylprednisolone). Eventually, you will want to move him
> over to the inhaled steroid fluticasone propionate (Flovent/Flixotide),
> because it is non-systemic and doesn't have the potential for adverse
> effects that pred does.

Wayne, many thanks for this very helpful and precise advice. It is
greatly appreciated.

Eddy.

Eddy[_2_]
September 9th 11, 03:53 PM
---MIKE--- wrote:

> When I had Ike (RB) he had the same symptoms. It was asthma and the vet
> would give him a prednisone shot. This would stop the attacks right
> away. The relief would last about four months when it would start
> again. This occurred until Ike disappeared.

Thanks, Mike.

Seven years of extraordinary delight this cat has given. Of course we
hoped he would have similarly excellent health for a further 10 years,
if not more. So sad.

Eddy.

Eddy[_2_]
September 9th 11, 03:58 PM
Bill Graham wrote:

> Well, if he was a Human, you would get him a "CAT" scan. (No pun intended)
> But, since he's just a cat, there wouldn't be much you could do about it if
> he has some kind of tumour anyway, so there isn't much you can do, but wait
> to see if it gets worse, and then put him down near the end. He might be
> allergic to something, or it may be just hair or dander. This is the season
> for excess hair. Be sure you brush him frequently.

Thanks, Bill.

I've been brushing him every day since he was a kitten. From April this
year until about now I have been quite alarmed how every day I have got
so much fur out of his coat, using a flee comb. So I've been doing my
bit. But as I always feel there is still probably some loose fur even
after I have given him a good brushing, it's possible I suppose that he
is still managing to lick down some fur. On the other hand, I wonder
why his current coughing has not occurred to such a degree in each of
his previous six summers.

Eddy.

honeybunch
September 9th 11, 10:36 PM
On Sep 9, 10:58*am, Eddy >
wrote:
> Bill Graham wrote:
> > Well, if he was a Human, you would get him a "CAT" scan. (No pun intended)
> > But, since he's just a cat, there wouldn't be much you could do about it if
> > he has some kind of tumour anyway, so there isn't much you can do, but wait
> > to see if it gets worse, and then put him down near the end. He might be
> > allergic to something, or it may be just hair or dander. This is the season
> > for excess hair. Be sure you brush him frequently.
>
> Thanks, Bill. *
>
> I've been brushing him every day since he was a kitten. *From April this
> year until about now I have been quite alarmed how every day I have got
> so much fur out of his coat, using a flee comb. *So I've been doing my
> bit. *But as I always feel there is still probably some loose fur even
> after I have given him a good brushing, it's possible I suppose that he
> is still managing to lick down some fur. *On the other hand, I wonder
> why his current coughing has not occurred to such a degree in each of
> his previous six summers.
>
> Eddy.

Have you considered allergies? Is he an outdoor cat? Have you made
any changes in household?

Gandalf[_4_]
September 9th 11, 11:34 PM
On Fri, 9 Sep 2011 09:49:42 -0400, "Barb" >
wrote:

>You could try Googling for extra info and then phone call to your vet.
>
>Barb

Sounds like a classic cat asthma attack.

Your cat needs to be seen by a vet NOW.

Asthma is fairly easily managed, fortunately.

Bill Graham
September 10th 11, 06:38 AM
Eddy wrote:
> Bill Graham wrote:
>
>> Well, if he was a Human, you would get him a "CAT" scan. (No pun
>> intended) But, since he's just a cat, there wouldn't be much you
>> could do about it if he has some kind of tumour anyway, so there
>> isn't much you can do, but wait to see if it gets worse, and then
>> put him down near the end. He might be allergic to something, or it
>> may be just hair or dander. This is the season for excess hair. Be
>> sure you brush him frequently.
>
> Thanks, Bill.
>
> I've been brushing him every day since he was a kitten. From April
> this year until about now I have been quite alarmed how every day I
> have got so much fur out of his coat, using a flee comb. So I've
> been doing my bit. But as I always feel there is still probably some
> loose fur even after I have given him a good brushing, it's possible
> I suppose that he is still managing to lick down some fur. On the
> other hand, I wonder why his current coughing has not occurred to
> such a degree in each of his previous six summers.
>
> Eddy.

Well, allergies seem to develop with time. People who work in animal
shelters seldom last more than five years or so. Wait until this fall, when
he stops shedding. Perhaps the cough will go away. If it does, then you can
be pretty sure it is an allergy.

Eddy[_2_]
September 10th 11, 07:01 PM
honeybunch wrote:

> Have you considered allergies? Is he an outdoor cat? Have you made
> any changes in household?

Hi, Honeybunch. Only last night did I start to consider the possibility
of allergies, and that was after discovering many videos on YouTube when
I typed in "feline asthma". One of these videos features a presentation
by a vet and is most helpful. Others also mention the possibility of
allergy.

This is a big house with wooden floors downstairs and carpet upstairs
and today I've spent the whole day cleaning, hoovering and mopping.
Just in case.

As for anything else inside the house that might be causing an allergy,
no, there have been no additions or changes. The packaging of his cat
food changed about 2 months ago so I checked that this morning and it IS
only the packaging that's changed and not the actual contents of the
tins. However as up until 2 months ago, or thereabouts, puss used to
have similar coughing fits perhaps once a fortnight and since he was a
kitten, I'm thinking of buying a stash of new cat food, a different
brand, just in case there's something causing an allergy in the brand
that he has been on continuously since he turned a year old.

Apart from that we do live in the country and farmers have been cutting
hay a great deal recently and perhaps pollens too have been in the air,
except that in no previous summer has he had these serious coughing
fits. Everything else outside is as normal.

Up until a week ago we told ourselves he was probably consuming voles
and mice while out and about and that was the reason, i.e. his gut was
full of fur. (Usually he brings the voles and mice indoors and if we
are not about he sometimes consumes them, leaving distasteful organs in
a neat little pile!) However, as above, he's been hunting voles and
mice now for all of his seven years and he's not had these fits before.

Last night we started keeping a record of the fits we happen to witness,
what time of day they happen etc.

Thanks for your help.

Eddy.

Eddy[_2_]
September 10th 11, 07:03 PM
Bill Graham wrote:
> Well, allergies seem to develop with time. People who work in animal
> shelters seldom last more than five years or so. Wait until this fall, when
> he stops shedding. Perhaps the cough will go away. If it does, then you can
> be pretty sure it is an allergy.

Yes, we may do that. We may monitor him very closely, keep records, and
see how he behaves after all the leaves have dropped and the ground is
covered in snow and ice. I think we can safely wait until then. His
fits aren't as bad as those featured on YouTube, although clearly of the
same type.

Thanks Bill.

Bill Graham
September 11th 11, 10:56 PM
Eddy wrote:
> Bill Graham wrote:
>> Well, allergies seem to develop with time. People who work in animal
>> shelters seldom last more than five years or so. Wait until this
>> fall, when he stops shedding. Perhaps the cough will go away. If it
>> does, then you can be pretty sure it is an allergy.
>
> Yes, we may do that. We may monitor him very closely, keep records,
> and see how he behaves after all the leaves have dropped and the
> ground is covered in snow and ice. I think we can safely wait until
> then. His fits aren't as bad as those featured on YouTube, although
> clearly of the same type.
>
> Thanks Bill.

When I retired, I didn't know how much of my time was going to be spent with
cats. Had I known, I probably would have retired near to UC Davis, where
their veternary facility is one of the best in the world. They relish
getting animals in there that have diseases that no one else can cure, so
their students can get the experience trying to cure them. I have had
several cats in my life who died from poor veternary knowlege/treatment. If
you think people in this country suffer from bad medicine, think what
happens to most pets. their chances of good medical treatment range from
poor to none.

Eddy[_2_]
September 12th 11, 06:37 PM
Bill Graham wrote:
> When I retired, I didn't know how much of my time was going to be spent with
> cats. Had I known, I probably would have retired near to UC Davis, where
> their veternary facility is one of the best in the world. They relish
> getting animals in there that have diseases that no one else can cure, so
> their students can get the experience trying to cure them. I have had
> several cats in my life who died from poor veternary knowlege/treatment. If
> you think people in this country suffer from bad medicine, think what
> happens to most pets. their chances of good medical treatment range from
> poor to none.

I believe you're right, Bill. I'm currently in the middle of a formal
complaint against behaviour at my doctor's surgery. It seems to be
resolving. I hope it does because we are very rural here and the next
surgery is an additional 30 minute's drive away. At the same time we
have good reason to have little respect for our local veterinary
practice. They're all very good-hearted there but they don't seem to
know their stuff. For example, our cat's twin brother was given a
course of oral antibiotics to cure his breathing problem. They didn't
work and so a month later they decided to X-ray him and found he had a
diseased heart. Hence we're doing as much research as we can re this
probable asthma problem before we stress the remaining twin with an
hour's drive in the car (30 minutes there, and 30 minutes back).

I want to thank you for your earlier suggestion that we focus on WHY he
may have asthma. It occurred to us last night as he leapt off the
coverlet that we draw around ourselves on the couch while watching TV,
and had yet another fit, that the coverlet was washed a few weeks ago
and his attacks seem to have got bad in roughly the same period.

This morning we found the following posting on a Forum:

"My husband is a retired medical scientist and makes the following
point: recent decades have seen a meteoric rise in the incidence of
asthma which the scientists have struggled to explain. Naturally if
clothes contain washing powder (including the additives such as enzymes)
not only can this affect the skin by direct contact but also the wearer
is constantly breathing in the powder into the lungs. Bed clothes
contaminated with washing powder would of course have a similar effect.
If you disturb dry, partially rinsed clothes in a shaft of sunlight you
will see for yourself what you are breathing in. How do we know that
this problem does not at least partly underpin the asthma epidemic?"

This spurred us on and then we found the following, showing that washing
powder enzymes are known to cause asthma.

An outbreak of asthma in a modern detergent factory

DrP Cullinan MDa, , , JM Harris MSca, ProfAJ Newman Taylor FRCPa, AM
Holea, M Jones PhDa, F Barnes PhDa and G Jolliffe MRCGPa

Department of Occupational and Environmental Medicine, Imperial College
School of Medicine, London SW3 6LR, UK

Summary
The striking decrease in the occurrence of protease-induced occupational
asthma in the detergent industry has been attributed to enzyme
encapsulation. We report an outbreak of asthma, at least equal in size
to those reported in the 1960s, in a modem European factory which has
exclusively used encapsulated enzymes. A survey revealed that enzyme
sensitisation and work-related respiratory symptoms were positively
correlated with airborne enzyme exposure. We suggest that encapsulation
alone is insufficient to prevent enzyme-induced allergy and asthma.


So the laundary liquid we've been using has been put in the shed and
we're picking up a different one, one that is supposed to be nigh on
environmentally perfect and free of as many artificialities and so forth
as possible.

Rene S.
September 12th 11, 08:50 PM
> Take him to a vet and get a thoracic radiograph. *Chances are it will
> show the diagnostic "donuts and tramlines" which are caused by thickened
> bronchial walls and trapped air.

ITA with this. Our Tucker has asthma and a few x-rays showed the
"donut" patterns typically shown in asthma.

He may need a dose of steroids to get things under control. I am not
crazy about giving steroids to cats, but if he's flaring up, you may
need to do this short term to calm things down.

I manage Tucker's asthma with a supplement (called Inflamzyme, from
Only Natural Pet), and bronchodiolaters as needed. His is mild,
fortunately, and I've kept it under control for nearly three years. If
his is moderate to severe, you may need to give steroids via an
inhaler. It's safer using an inhaler because a), it can treat his
symptoms quickly and b) the steroid doesn't enter the bloodstream like
a pill would.

*FWIW, I am not affiiated with Only Natural Pet, but am a consumer.

Rene

Bill Graham
September 13th 11, 03:12 AM
Eddy wrote:
> Bill Graham wrote:
>> When I retired, I didn't know how much of my time was going to be
>> spent with cats. Had I known, I probably would have retired near to
>> UC Davis, where their veternary facility is one of the best in the
>> world. They relish getting animals in there that have diseases that
>> no one else can cure, so their students can get the experience
>> trying to cure them. I have had several cats in my life who died
>> from poor veternary knowlege/treatment. If you think people in this
>> country suffer from bad medicine, think what happens to most pets.
>> their chances of good medical treatment range from poor to none.
>
> I believe you're right, Bill. I'm currently in the middle of a formal
> complaint against behaviour at my doctor's surgery. It seems to be
> resolving. I hope it does because we are very rural here and the next
> surgery is an additional 30 minute's drive away. At the same time we
> have good reason to have little respect for our local veterinary
> practice. They're all very good-hearted there but they don't seem to
> know their stuff. For example, our cat's twin brother was given a
> course of oral antibiotics to cure his breathing problem. They didn't
> work and so a month later they decided to X-ray him and found he had a
> diseased heart. Hence we're doing as much research as we can re this
> probable asthma problem before we stress the remaining twin with an
> hour's drive in the car (30 minutes there, and 30 minutes back).
>
> I want to thank you for your earlier suggestion that we focus on WHY
> he may have asthma. It occurred to us last night as he leapt off the
> coverlet that we draw around ourselves on the couch while watching TV,
> and had yet another fit, that the coverlet was washed a few weeks ago
> and his attacks seem to have got bad in roughly the same period.
>
> This morning we found the following posting on a Forum:
>
> "My husband is a retired medical scientist and makes the following
> point: recent decades have seen a meteoric rise in the incidence of
> asthma which the scientists have struggled to explain. Naturally if
> clothes contain washing powder (including the additives such as
> enzymes) not only can this affect the skin by direct contact but also
> the wearer is constantly breathing in the powder into the lungs. Bed
> clothes contaminated with washing powder would of course have a
> similar effect. If you disturb dry, partially rinsed clothes in a
> shaft of sunlight you will see for yourself what you are breathing
> in. How do we know that this problem does not at least partly
> underpin the asthma epidemic?"
>
> This spurred us on and then we found the following, showing that
> washing powder enzymes are known to cause asthma.
>
> An outbreak of asthma in a modern detergent factory
>
> DrP Cullinan MDa, , , JM Harris MSca, ProfAJ Newman Taylor FRCPa, AM
> Holea, M Jones PhDa, F Barnes PhDa and G Jolliffe MRCGPa
>
> Department of Occupational and Environmental Medicine, Imperial
> College School of Medicine, London SW3 6LR, UK
>
> Summary
> The striking decrease in the occurrence of protease-induced
> occupational asthma in the detergent industry has been attributed to
> enzyme encapsulation. We report an outbreak of asthma, at least equal
> in size to those reported in the 1960s, in a modem European factory
> which has exclusively used encapsulated enzymes. A survey revealed
> that enzyme sensitisation and work-related respiratory symptoms were
> positively correlated with airborne enzyme exposure. We suggest that
> encapsulation alone is insufficient to prevent enzyme-induced allergy
> and asthma.
>
>
> So the laundary liquid we've been using has been put in the shed and
> we're picking up a different one, one that is supposed to be nigh on
> environmentally perfect and free of as many artificialities and so
> forth as possible.

If he is an "inside cat", you may be able to help him (and yourself) with an
air filtration device. There are several on the market that sit in the
middle of the room and clean the air by recycling it continuously through
filters and high-voltage plates that attract dust particles out of the air
that passes through them. Unfortunately, all my cats are outside cats, so
they have to depend on we humans to not contaminate the air with foreign
substances. This Summer, I had my favorite cat die from getting a dose of,
"Round-Up" weed killer from a neighbor's lawn treatment. - Just one of a
dozen or so hazards to outside cats......

Rene[_2_]
September 13th 11, 09:27 PM
> If he is an "inside cat", you may be able to help him (and yourself) with an
> air filtration device. There are several on the market that sit in the
> middle of the room and clean the air by recycling it continuously through
> filters and high-voltage plates that attract dust particles out of the air
> that passes through them. Unfortunately, all my cats are outside cats, so
> they have to depend on we humans to not contaminate the air with foreign
> substances. This Summer, I had my favorite cat die from getting a dose of,
> "Round-Up" weed killer from a neighbor's lawn treatment. - Just one of a
> dozen or so hazards to outside cats......

I agree with Bill's suggestion. Also, what kind of home cleansers or
air fresheners do you use? I've will use only certain things,
especially floors, where cats' faces are much closer to than ours. I
will use natural cleansers like vinegar or baking soda.

Does anyone in the household smoke? Secondhand smoke is bad for
asthmatic cats (and all people, for that matter).

Rene

honeybunch
September 13th 11, 10:51 PM
On Sep 12, 1:37*pm, Eddy >
wrote:
> Bill Graham wrote:
> > When I retired, I didn't know how much of my time was going to be spent with
> > cats. Had I known, I probably would have retired near to UC Davis, where
> > their veternary facility is one of the best in the world. They relish
> > getting animals in there that have diseases that no one else can cure, so
> > their students can get the experience trying to cure them. I have had
> > several cats in my life who died from poor veternary knowlege/treatment.. If
> > you think people in this country suffer from bad medicine, think what
> > happens to most pets. their chances of good medical treatment range from
> > poor to none.
>
> I believe you're right, Bill. *I'm currently in the middle of a formal
> complaint against behaviour at my doctor's surgery. *It seems to be
> resolving. *I hope it does because we are very rural here and the next
> surgery is an additional 30 minute's drive away. *At the same time we
> have good reason to have little respect for our local veterinary
> practice. *They're all very good-hearted there but they don't seem to
> know their stuff. *For example, our cat's twin brother was given a
> course of oral antibiotics to cure his breathing problem. *They didn't
> work and so a month later they decided to X-ray him and found he had a
> diseased heart. *Hence we're doing as much research as we can re this
> probable asthma problem before we stress the remaining twin with an
> hour's drive in the car (30 minutes there, and 30 minutes back).
>
> I want to thank you for your earlier suggestion that we focus on WHY he
> may have asthma. *It occurred to us last night as he leapt off the
> coverlet that we draw around ourselves on the couch while watching TV,
> and had yet another fit, that the coverlet was washed a few weeks ago
> and his attacks seem to have got bad in roughly the same period. *
>
> This morning we found the following posting on a Forum:
>
> "My husband is a retired medical scientist and makes the following
> point: recent decades have seen a meteoric rise in the incidence of
> asthma which the scientists have struggled to explain. Naturally if
> clothes contain washing powder (including the additives such as enzymes)
> not only can this affect the skin by direct contact but also the wearer
> is constantly breathing in the powder into the lungs. Bed clothes
> contaminated with washing powder would of course have a similar effect.
> If you disturb dry, partially rinsed clothes in a shaft of sunlight you
> will see for yourself what you are breathing in. How do we know that
> this problem does not at least partly underpin the asthma epidemic?"
>
> This spurred us on and then we found the following, showing that washing
> powder enzymes are known to cause asthma.
>
> An outbreak of asthma in a modern detergent factory
>
> DrP Cullinan MDa, , , JM Harris MSca, ProfAJ Newman Taylor FRCPa, AM
> Holea, M Jones PhDa, F Barnes PhDa and G Jolliffe MRCGPa
>
> Department of Occupational and Environmental Medicine, Imperial College
> School of Medicine, London SW3 6LR, UK
>
> Summary
> The striking decrease in the occurrence of protease-induced occupational
> asthma in the detergent industry has been attributed to enzyme
> encapsulation. We report an outbreak of asthma, at least equal in size
> to those reported in the 1960s, in a modem European factory which has
> exclusively used encapsulated enzymes. A survey revealed that enzyme
> sensitisation and work-related respiratory symptoms were positively
> correlated with airborne enzyme exposure. We suggest that encapsulation
> alone is insufficient to prevent enzyme-induced allergy and asthma.
>
> So the laundary liquid we've been using has been put in the shed and
> we're picking up a different one, one that is supposed to be nigh on
> environmentally perfect and free of as many artificialities and so forth
> as possible.


I think youre on to something here with the new detergent. I dont
think you live in the USA but you must have similar detergents to our
Free and Clear detergents. Its really something to watch out for with
pets and also for ourselves. Sad that Puss' twin brother had a
malformed heart. One never knows. House cats are blessings that are
only with us all too briefly.

Eddy[_2_]
September 15th 11, 06:23 PM
Rene S. wrote:
> > Take him to a vet and get a thoracic radiograph. Chances are it will
> > show the diagnostic "donuts and tramlines" which are caused by thickened
> > bronchial walls and trapped air.
>
> ITA with this. Our Tucker has asthma and a few x-rays showed the
> "donut" patterns typically shown in asthma.
>
> He may need a dose of steroids to get things under control. I am not
> crazy about giving steroids to cats, but if he's flaring up, you may
> need to do this short term to calm things down.
>
> I manage Tucker's asthma with a supplement (called Inflamzyme, from
> Only Natural Pet), and bronchodiolaters as needed. His is mild,
> fortunately, and I've kept it under control for nearly three years. If
> his is moderate to severe, you may need to give steroids via an
> inhaler. It's safer using an inhaler because a), it can treat his
> symptoms quickly and b) the steroid doesn't enter the bloodstream like
> a pill would.
>
> *FWIW, I am not affiiated with Only Natural Pet, but am a consumer.

Rene, many thanks for your words! Very helpful.

There has certainly been a decrease in Puss's fits over the last week,
and we think this is due to our having put away a newly-washed coverlet
in the living-room and not allowing him to sleep on the newly-washed
duvet in the bedroom. However, he is still having a fit occasionally.
But we understand that this could, possibly, be residual. We need to
keep monitoring and recording time and location of all fits. Will keep
your natural remedy in mind, just in case our change of washing
detergent doesn't actually solve the problem.

Eddy.

Eddy[_2_]
September 15th 11, 06:47 PM
Bill Graham wrote:
> If he is an "inside cat", you may be able to help him (and yourself) with an
> air filtration device. There are several on the market that sit in the
> middle of the room and clean the air by recycling it continuously through
> filters and high-voltage plates that attract dust particles out of the air
> that passes through them. Unfortunately, all my cats are outside cats, so
> they have to depend on we humans to not contaminate the air with foreign
> substances. This Summer, I had my favorite cat die from getting a dose of,
> "Round-Up" weed killer from a neighbor's lawn treatment. - Just one of a
> dozen or so hazards to outside cats......

Hi Bill.

We're in the country - fields, sheep, cows, a stream, tractors, and more
than voles and rabbits than a cat can cope with!

Your "Round-Up" reference alerts me!

I haven't used any round this place for several months although I will
have to again, in the next few weeks. (I always keep him locked inside
while I do it late afternoon and he only regains his freedom the next
morning.) But how did your cat die of the Round-Up? I mean, how did he
ingest it or absorb it?

Now you're making me wrack my brain for anything else round about this
property that might be responsible but can't think of a thing. We have
quite a range of ornamental plants in the garden. Never seen him
nibbling any one of these in particular but it could be that he is.

The only problem we have here is that since his brother died he's been
trekking a quarter of a mile each day to play with a neighbour's cats
and unfortunately that neighbout thinks very little of cats. He and his
wife keep three large dogs which they adore and keep inside and groom
and mollycoddle, but the cats are kept semi-feral outdoors just to keep
down the voles and rabbits! Food is put down for them in the garage and
they can sleep in there at night in the midst of winter. Anyway our lad
developed a serious respiratory infection about two months ago, with one
nostril oozing fluid which eventually became green fluid, so the vet put
him on antibiotics for five days and the condition cleared. She thought
he may have caught cat-flu or possibly Feline Chlamydophila (formerly
known as Chlamydia). We can't stop him from going up there for the
company and of course we can't command the neighbour to start loving his
cats and showing them some respect. But it's possible that he's
reacting to something up at the property rather than round here.

Having said that, it was sunny all day yesterday and we watched as he
spent literally the whole day leaping about in the fields above spots
where he could obviously detect moles! 7pm last night he came in
utterly zonked!

Eddy.

Eddy[_2_]
September 15th 11, 06:51 PM
honeybunch wrote:
> I think youre on to something here with the new detergent. I dont
> think you live in the USA but you must have similar detergents to our
> Free and Clear detergents. Its really something to watch out for with
> pets and also for ourselves. Sad that Puss' twin brother had a
> malformed heart. One never knows. House cats are blessings that are
> only with us all too briefly.

Honeybunch, this is my second reply to the above. The first one somehow
didn't make it to the server - timed-out or something. So this one will
be brief.

Yes, am sure your US and our UK detergents are the same. The
multinationals are quick to profit from their new formulas. And of
course these days they put all sorts of chemicals in them in order to
produce that whiter wash.

We've bought a brand called "Ecover" - environmentally friendly (and
pricey). There's a better line called Surcare, with absolutely no
"parfum" at all but the supermarket was out of stock. So we'll see how
it goes.

Eddy.

Eddy[_2_]
September 15th 11, 06:54 PM
Rene wrote:

> I agree with Bill's suggestion. Also, what kind of home cleansers or
> air fresheners do you use? I've will use only certain things,
> especially floors, where cats' faces are much closer to than ours. I
> will use natural cleansers like vinegar or baking soda.
>
> Does anyone in the household smoke? Secondhand smoke is bad for
> asthmatic cats (and all people, for that matter).

Hi Rene. Carpets vacuumed with no sprays or powders, and the wooden
floors are vacuumed and wiped over with warm water only. And we use no
air fresheners. No smokers in the house either.

Have wondered about his cat food though. He long ago made it clear he
will eat only one brand! But surely a cat-food wouldn't cause asthma,
would it?

Eddy.

Bill Graham
September 15th 11, 08:53 PM
Eddy wrote:
> Bill Graham wrote:
>> If he is an "inside cat", you may be able to help him (and yourself)
>> with an air filtration device. There are several on the market that
>> sit in the middle of the room and clean the air by recycling it
>> continuously through filters and high-voltage plates that attract
>> dust particles out of the air that passes through them.
>> Unfortunately, all my cats are outside cats, so they have to depend
>> on we humans to not contaminate the air with foreign substances.
>> This Summer, I had my favorite cat die from getting a dose of,
>> "Round-Up" weed killer from a neighbor's lawn treatment. - Just one
>> of a dozen or so hazards to outside cats......
>
> Hi Bill.
>
> We're in the country - fields, sheep, cows, a stream, tractors, and
> more than voles and rabbits than a cat can cope with!
>
> Your "Round-Up" reference alerts me!
>
> I haven't used any round this place for several months although I will
> have to again, in the next few weeks. (I always keep him locked
> inside while I do it late afternoon and he only regains his freedom
> the next morning.) But how did your cat die of the Round-Up? I
> mean, how did he ingest it or absorb it?
>
> Now you're making me wrack my brain for anything else round about this
> property that might be responsible but can't think of a thing. We
> have quite a range of ornamental plants in the garden. Never seen him
> nibbling any one of these in particular but it could be that he is.
>
> The only problem we have here is that since his brother died he's been
> trekking a quarter of a mile each day to play with a neighbour's cats
> and unfortunately that neighbout thinks very little of cats. He and
> his wife keep three large dogs which they adore and keep inside and
> groom and mollycoddle, but the cats are kept semi-feral outdoors just
> to keep down the voles and rabbits! Food is put down for them in the
> garage and they can sleep in there at night in the midst of winter.
> Anyway our lad developed a serious respiratory infection about two
> months ago, with one nostril oozing fluid which eventually became
> green fluid, so the vet put him on antibiotics for five days and the
> condition cleared. She thought he may have caught cat-flu or
> possibly Feline Chlamydophila (formerly known as Chlamydia). We
> can't stop him from going up there for the company and of course we
> can't command the neighbour to start loving his cats and showing them
> some respect. But it's possible that he's reacting to something up
> at the property rather than round here.
>
> Having said that, it was sunny all day yesterday and we watched as he
> spent literally the whole day leaping about in the fields above spots
> where he could obviously detect moles! 7pm last night he came in
> utterly zonked!
>
> Eddy.

We feed squirrls, raccoons, a couple of possums and birds. After my neighbor
used the Round-up,The raccoons and possums disappeared for about a month. A
37-1/2 pound bag of dog kibbles that we used to buy every month, has lasted
over three months now. That Round up killed off half the wild life within
about a mile radius of us! My wife researched it on the internet, and found
out that it is notorious for killing pets and other animals. And they have
the nerve to advertise that it's, "Safe around pets".

Bill Graham
September 15th 11, 08:59 PM
Eddy wrote:
> honeybunch wrote:
>> I think youre on to something here with the new detergent. I dont
>> think you live in the USA but you must have similar detergents to our
>> Free and Clear detergents. Its really something to watch out for
>> with pets and also for ourselves. Sad that Puss' twin brother had a
>> malformed heart. One never knows. House cats are blessings that are
>> only with us all too briefly.
>
> Honeybunch, this is my second reply to the above. The first one
> somehow didn't make it to the server - timed-out or something. So
> this one will be brief.
>
> Yes, am sure your US and our UK detergents are the same. The
> multinationals are quick to profit from their new formulas. And of
> course these days they put all sorts of chemicals in them in order to
> produce that whiter wash.
>
> We've bought a brand called "Ecover" - environmentally friendly (and
> pricey). There's a better line called Surcare, with absolutely no
> "parfum" at all but the supermarket was out of stock. So we'll see
> how it goes.
>
> Eddy.

About thirty years ago, I had a student from Israel swtaying at my house. He
was working as a Physicist at our project (SLAC) for the Summer. He was
amazed at how long milk would keep in my fridge.He said that in Israel, milk
would only keep two or three days, and here, it would keep for two weeks. I
asked him whether they pasteurized and homogenized it there, and he said,
"Oh yes. Certainly". So, the only conclusion I could draw was that we feed
hormones to our cows that preserve our milk for an unuswually long period of
time. Either that, or we put preservatives in the milk, and don't say it on
the outside of the cartons. Just another good excuse for drinking beer, I
guess....:^)

Rene[_2_]
September 15th 11, 09:05 PM
> Have wondered about his cat food though. *He long ago made it clear he
> will eat only one brand! *But surely a cat-food wouldn't cause asthma,
> would it?
>

A food could have an ingredient(s) that causes an allergy (like
humans). Many times, cat allergies manifest themselves as skin issues
(scratching, sores, etc.) or something more direct like vomiting. If
he eats only one brand, the manufacturer could have changed one thing
about the food that now bothers him.

Patok[_2_]
September 15th 11, 09:17 PM
Bill Graham wrote:
>
> About thirty years ago, I had a student from Israel swtaying at my
> house. He was working as a Physicist at our project (SLAC) for the
> Summer. He was amazed at how long milk would keep in my fridge.He said
> that in Israel, milk would only keep two or three days, and here, it
> would keep for two weeks. I asked him whether they pasteurized and
> homogenized it there, and he said, "Oh yes. Certainly". So, the only
> conclusion I could draw was that we feed hormones to our cows that
> preserve our milk for an unuswually long period of time. Either that, or
> we put preservatives in the milk, and don't say it on the outside of the
> cartons.

I noticed the same. That's why back home we always boiled the milk before using
it, even though it was pasteurized (and homogenized, I guess, since cream did not
form on it until after boiling).


> Just another good excuse for drinking beer, I guess....:^)

This reminds me of the following verse:

"There are many reasons for drinking,
but one has just entered my head:
If a man cannot drink when he's living,
how the hell can he drink when he's dead?"

--
You'd be crazy to e-mail me with the crazy. But leave the div alone.
*
Whoever bans a book, shall be banished. Whoever burns a book, shall burn.

Bill Graham
September 15th 11, 10:03 PM
Patok wrote:
> Bill Graham wrote:
>>
>> About thirty years ago, I had a student from Israel swtaying at my
>> house. He was working as a Physicist at our project (SLAC) for the
>> Summer. He was amazed at how long milk would keep in my fridge.He
>> said that in Israel, milk would only keep two or three days, and
>> here, it would keep for two weeks. I asked him whether they
>> pasteurized and homogenized it there, and he said, "Oh yes.
>> Certainly". So, the only conclusion I could draw was that we feed
>> hormones to our cows that preserve our milk for an unuswually long
>> period of time. Either that, or we put preservatives in the milk,
>> and don't say it on the outside of the cartons.
>
> I noticed the same. That's why back home we always boiled the milk
> before using it, even though it was pasteurized (and homogenized, I
> guess, since cream did not form on it until after boiling).

Unfortunately, boiling it may not change the chemicals or hormones that are
in it via the cow, so you may still be ingesting them. If there were some
way of removing those hormones, then someone would do it, and market hormone
free milk. The same thing is true of flurodated water. It doesn't just treat
the water, but also the teeth of someone's children. Us conservatives think
that they should go to the drugstore and buy their own childrens medicine to
treat their teeth, and not put their medicine in my drinking water. It may
not hurt me. (It probably doesn't) But its the principal of it that we
object to. We just want pure, clean, not-screwed-with drinking water. By the
same token, I want pure hormone-free milk. If they can't remove it, then
they shouldn't put it in the milk. And putting it in the cow is really the
same thing.

>
>
>> Just another good excuse for drinking beer, I guess....:^)
>
> This reminds me of the following verse:
>
> "There are many reasons for drinking,
> but one has just entered my head:
> If a man cannot drink when he's living,
> how the hell can he drink when he's dead?"

Wayne Mitchell
September 16th 11, 01:36 AM
Eddy > wrote:

>But surely a cat-food wouldn't cause asthma,
>would it?

In my own experience, and that of the many who report on the Yahoo
groups Feline_Asthma and FelineAsthma_InhaledMeds -- no.

Before I discovered that cats could be treated with inhaled medications
-- while Will was still inadequately controlled by two-monthly
injections of depo medrol -- his vet and I tried everything, including
two different trials of novel-protein, limited-ingredient food. His
asthma was unaffected. Others have reported the same.

It's not unusual for an asthmatic cat to *have* allergies to food. Will
does. Asthma is an immune-function disease, and those cats who have it
probably have other allergic reactions at higher than average rates. But
the allergens that are specific to asthma seem to be all airborne.
--

Wayne M.

Bill Graham
September 16th 11, 04:17 AM
Wayne Mitchell wrote:
> Eddy > wrote:
>
>> But surely a cat-food wouldn't cause asthma,
>> would it?
>
> In my own experience, and that of the many who report on the Yahoo
> groups Feline_Asthma and FelineAsthma_InhaledMeds -- no.
>
> Before I discovered that cats could be treated with inhaled
> medications -- while Will was still inadequately controlled by
> two-monthly injections of depo medrol -- his vet and I tried
> everything, including two different trials of novel-protein,
> limited-ingredient food. His asthma was unaffected. Others have
> reported the same.
>
> It's not unusual for an asthmatic cat to *have* allergies to food.
> Will does. Asthma is an immune-function disease, and those cats who
> have it probably have other allergic reactions at higher than average
> rates. But the allergens that are specific to asthma seem to be all
> airborne.

Yes, and food allergies can cause swelling in the air passageways and
broncial tubes. Right now, I am worried about a problem I have had about
three or four times in the past. I eat something that causes my upper lip to
swell up for an hour or so. /Since I play the trumpet in a couple of bands,
this is disasterous, because when it happens, I can't get a sound out of the
instrument at all. The other day it happened after I ate some artificial
maple syrup. Since I didn't have anything else, (it was the first thing I
had in the morning) I suspect either the artificial flavoring or a
preservative in the syrup. So I am beginning to narrow it down. But God
only knows what they put in cat food. I'm not sure they even have to list
the ingredients on the package.

buglady
September 23rd 11, 03:15 PM
"Eddy" > wrote in message
...
The packaging of his cat
> food changed about 2 months ago so I checked that this morning and it IS
> only the packaging that's changed and not the actual contents of the
> tins.

..............I take it you're "across the pond"? Don't know what the rules
are for pet food packaging in your neck of the woods, but in the US they can
change the contents of the food and have 6 months to "catch up" with the
label.

So in most instances, one can "always" suspect the food.

buglady
takeout the dog before replying

Eddy[_2_]
November 12th 11, 01:48 PM
Hi Wayne,

Well, two months have gone by and in that time the vet has used a
step-by-step method that has been as easy on Puss as possible.

Firstly Puss was put on a ten-day course of antibiotics. That did not
clear the situation. So then Puss was given a steroid injection and
that had a remarkable effect.

So now we have an Aerokat device and a Flixotide inhaler and Puss has
had his first treatment.

The directions that come with the Flixotide are for humans and indicate
that humans should take one puff every day at a time when the breathing
is slow and that the daily treatment must not be broken or discontinued.

I am wondering what the situation with an adult cat is. They have
smaller lungs than we do, obviously. What's your experience?

Thanks,
Eddy.




Wayne Mitchell wrote:

> Eddy > wrote:
>
> >He keeps on coughing but whatever it is
> >doesn't move or stop aggravating him and so he gets anxious and gets
> >quickly down onto the floor and into the crouch position, stretching his
> >neck out parallel to the floor and almost touching the floor with his
> >chin. In this position he keeps "coughing", perhaps for a whole minute,
> >until the irritation stops. Then he returns to entirely normal
> >behaviour - until next time.
>
> This sounds like a classic asthma attack. My Will would do this a dozen
> times a day before we got his asthma under control.
>
> Take him to a vet and get a thoracic radiograph. Chances are it will
> show the diagnostic "donuts and tramlines" which are caused by thickened
> bronchial walls and trapped air.
>
> If it is asthma, he needs be put on a regimen of glucocorticoid
> steroids. Typically that will be either oral prednisolone or injected
> depo medrol (methylprednisolone). Eventually, you will want to move him
> over to the inhaled steroid fluticasone propionate (Flovent/Flixotide),
> because it is non-systemic and doesn't have the potential for adverse
> effects that pred does.
>

Wayne Mitchell
November 13th 11, 01:35 AM
Eddy > wrote:

>The directions that come with the Flixotide are for humans and indicate
>that humans should take one puff every day at a time when the breathing
>is slow and that the daily treatment must not be broken or discontinued.

Will and I are old hands, and it has been a long time since I stopped to
read the manufacturer's directions. It surprises me that it now says
once a day. Very few asthmatics, human or feline, can remain
well-controlled on once-a-day dosing. The bio-active half-life of
fluticasone averages about 8 hours in either species. Unless one wishes
to use very large doses, it makes more sense to dose at intervals of
about twelve hours.


>I am wondering what the situation with an adult cat is. They have
>smaller lungs than we do, obviously. What's your experience?

The AeroKat is designed for their lighter inhalations and smaller total
airflow. I would say that overall Flixotide has been even more
successful for cats than for humans.

Be aware that it can take a couple weeks for the Flixotide to build up
to maximum effect, though you should see some improvement in just a few
days.

If you are willing to do Yahoo groups, there are a couple that can help
shepherd you through the introduction and answer your questions:
http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/felineasthma_inhaledmeds/
(of which I am one of the moderators), and
http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/felineasthma/
which is a general asthma group, but talks about inhaled meds mostly
nowadays because that has become the gold standard of treatment.
--

Wayne M.

Eddy[_2_]
November 15th 11, 06:39 PM
Wayne Mitchell wrote:

> Will and I are old hands, and it has been a long time since I stopped to
> read the manufacturer's directions. It surprises me that it now says
> once a day. Very few asthmatics, human or feline, can remain
> well-controlled on once-a-day dosing. The bio-active half-life of
> fluticasone averages about 8 hours in either species. Unless one wishes
> to use very large doses, it makes more sense to dose at intervals of
> about twelve hours.

Thanks a lot Wayne for this background info. It's very helpful. So if
Puss starts coughing again I'll certainly not dither over increasing the
dose! As things stand though, touch wood, he seems to be doing fine on
one puff per day. However, he's only been on it for four days.

> If you are willing to do Yahoo groups, there are a couple that can help
> shepherd you through the introduction and answer your questions:
> http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/felineasthma_inhaledmeds/
> (of which I am one of the moderators), and
> http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/felineasthma/
> which is a general asthma group, but talks about inhaled meds mostly
> nowadays because that has become the gold standard of treatment.

Thanks for your reply to me on inhaledmeds group! I found that group as
a result of someone here sharing a number of appropriate URLs.

I may have found a website that will ship the inhaler to the UK at a
good price. However, I haven't yet thought how I will handle matters
with the vet, who will no doubt expect to dispense inhalers to me from
now on at twice the price!

Regards,
Eddy.

Eddy[_2_]
November 23rd 11, 05:29 PM
Hi Wayne,

Just looking through old posts in my newsreader and see your helpful
posts of a while back and am reminded to thank you very much for your
last post to me via the FAIM group.

You explained that although air can't get into the back of the Aerokat
chamber once the inhaler is in position, air can pass freely through the
inhaler itself. Ah, ha! I see!

That little Aerokat is a very clever little bit of kit, isn't it!

Once again, many thanks for your most helpful explanations.

Regards,
Eddy.