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Bill Graham
August 14th 13, 08:19 PM
We feed a stray cat. He isn't really a stray, because we have seen him go
into another house down the block. But since he has no collar or chip, we
suspect they don't own him either. At any rate, he is sick. His thyroids
aren't working properly and he is skinny as a rail even though he eats at
least two cans of cat food a day in our kitchen alone, and God only knows
how much he eats from the neighbors. The question is, should we capture him,
give him to our roving vet to have his thyroid removed? This would cost us
around $500, but we love cats and have spent a lot more than this on them in
the past. When one of our other cats, Junie had the same problem, we paid
for her operation, and there are a lot worse ways for us to spend $500.IOW,
it isn't the money that I am asking about, but the morality of us catching
and operating on what may well be someone else's cat. I could talk to them,
but I am afraid that they will think I want money from them, and/or they may
just put poor Max down so he won't be a bother to some nosy neighbor. IOW, I
would prefer to just catch him, put him in a cat carrier, call the roving
vet, get him operated on, and let him go without ever telling anyone else
about it. What do you guys think?

Mack A. Damia
August 14th 13, 08:35 PM
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 12:19:01 -0700, "Bill Graham" >
wrote:

>We feed a stray cat. He isn't really a stray, because we have seen him go
>into another house down the block. But since he has no collar or chip, we
>suspect they don't own him either. At any rate, he is sick. His thyroids
>aren't working properly and he is skinny as a rail even though he eats at
>least two cans of cat food a day in our kitchen alone, and God only knows
>how much he eats from the neighbors. The question is, should we capture him,
>give him to our roving vet to have his thyroid removed? This would cost us
>around $500, but we love cats and have spent a lot more than this on them in
>the past. When one of our other cats, Junie had the same problem, we paid
>for her operation, and there are a lot worse ways for us to spend $500.IOW,
>it isn't the money that I am asking about, but the morality of us catching
>and operating on what may well be someone else's cat. I could talk to them,
>but I am afraid that they will think I want money from them, and/or they may
>just put poor Max down so he won't be a bother to some nosy neighbor. IOW, I
>would prefer to just catch him, put him in a cat carrier, call the roving
>vet, get him operated on, and let him go without ever telling anyone else
>about it. What do you guys think?

You will feel better doing what you want to do, and you are like me in
this respect: we do not like to see animals suffering.

--

Bill Graham
August 14th 13, 11:35 PM
Mack A. Damia wrote:
> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 12:19:01 -0700, "Bill Graham" >
> wrote:
>
>> We feed a stray cat. He isn't really a stray, because we have seen
>> him go into another house down the block. But since he has no collar
>> or chip, we suspect they don't own him either. At any rate, he is
>> sick. His thyroids aren't working properly and he is skinny as a
>> rail even though he eats at least two cans of cat food a day in our
>> kitchen alone, and God only knows how much he eats from the
>> neighbors. The question is, should we capture him, give him to our
>> roving vet to have his thyroid removed? This would cost us around
>> $500, but we love cats and have spent a lot more than this on them
>> in the past. When one of our other cats, Junie had the same problem,
>> we paid for her operation, and there are a lot worse ways for us to
>> spend $500.IOW, it isn't the money that I am asking about, but the
>> morality of us catching and operating on what may well be someone
>> else's cat. I could talk to them, but I am afraid that they will
>> think I want money from them, and/or they may just put poor Max down
>> so he won't be a bother to some nosy neighbor. IOW, I would prefer
>> to just catch him, put him in a cat carrier, call the roving vet,
>> get him operated on, and let him go without ever telling anyone else
>> about it. What do you guys think?
>
> You will feel better doing what you want to do, and you are like me in
> this respect: we do not like to see animals suffering.

Yes. I would sooner help an animal than a human being. Humans understand why
they are the way they are, and what can be done about it if anything.
Animals don't have this luxoury. They may think that they are suffering
because they did something wrong, and this tears me up. If I were Bill
Gates, I woulod spend all my money on animals and the hell with the kids
with cleft pallats. They can grow up, work hard, save their money, and get
themselves fixed by modern medicine. But what can a poor animal do? And for
those who say, "But you are himan and should help your own kind", I say, "I
am a living thing, and that is more basic than being humal. Animals are my
own kind. They, like me, are trapped in this miserable universe. Only they
have no way to help themselves to a better life.

August 14th 13, 11:39 PM
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 12:19:01 -0700, "Bill Graham" >
wrote:

>We feed a stray cat. He isn't really a stray, because we have seen him go
>into another house down the block. But since he has no collar or chip, we
>suspect they don't own him either. At any rate, he is sick. His thyroids
>aren't working properly

How have you diagnosed that?

>IOW, I
>would prefer to just catch him, put him in a cat carrier, call the roving
>vet, get him operated on, and let him go without ever telling anyone else
>about it. What do you guys think?

I think removing his thyroid is a death sentence if you are not
prepared to give him thyroid supplements the rest of his life.

Bill Graham
August 14th 13, 11:46 PM
wrote:
> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 12:19:01 -0700, "Bill Graham" >
> wrote:
>
>> We feed a stray cat. He isn't really a stray, because we have seen
>> him go into another house down the block. But since he has no collar
>> or chip, we suspect they don't own him either. At any rate, he is
>> sick. His thyroids aren't working properly
>
> How have you diagnosed that?
>
>> IOW, I
>> would prefer to just catch him, put him in a cat carrier, call the
>> roving vet, get him operated on, and let him go without ever telling
>> anyone else about it. What do you guys think?
>
> I think removing his thyroid is a death sentence if you are not
> prepared to give him thyroid supplements the rest of his life.

No. I thought that too, bfore we had Junie's thyroid removed. But with cats,
they don't really need their thyroid glands. My wife has no thyroid, and she
has to take medicine for the rest of her life, or sleep 20 hours a day. Cats
sleep 20 hours a day anyway, and get along fine without any thyroid glands.

August 15th 13, 02:14 AM
On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 15:46:10 -0700, "Bill Graham" >
wrote:

>> I think removing his thyroid is a death sentence if you are not
>> prepared to give him thyroid supplements the rest of his life.
>
>No. I thought that too, bfore we had Junie's thyroid removed. But with cats,
>they don't really need their thyroid glands. My wife has no thyroid, and she
>has to take medicine for the rest of her life, or sleep 20 hours a day. Cats
>sleep 20 hours a day anyway, and get along fine without any thyroid glands.

Well, there's substantially more consequences in humans than just
sleeping a lot, but I yield to your knowledge about cats.

Bill Graham
August 15th 13, 04:29 AM
wrote:
> On Wed, 14 Aug 2013 15:46:10 -0700, "Bill Graham" >
> wrote:
>
>>> I think removing his thyroid is a death sentence if you are not
>>> prepared to give him thyroid supplements the rest of his life.
>>
>> No. I thought that too, bfore we had Junie's thyroid removed. But
>> with cats, they don't really need their thyroid glands. My wife has
>> no thyroid, and she has to take medicine for the rest of her life,
>> or sleep 20 hours a day. Cats sleep 20 hours a day anyway, and get
>> along fine without any thyroid glands.
>
> Well, there's substantially more consequences in humans than just
> sleeping a lot, but I yield to your knowledge about cats.

I'm not a vet, but our Junie had hers removed about four years ago, and all
it did was slow her down a bit. (she was kind of hyper before we had it
removed.) All I know about cats is what the vet told me. We are lucky here
in Salem., We have a roving vet who drives a van and travels around from
patient to patient. She specializes in cats. The only problem is, she has to
phone before she comes onto our block, or the cats will hear her van and
split before she gets here....:^)

buglady[_2_]
August 15th 13, 11:34 AM
On 8/14/2013 6:39 PM, wrote:

> I think removing his thyroid is a death sentence if you are not
> prepared to give him thyroid supplements the rest of his life.


You are correct. Fatality for thyroidectomy is about 10%. And if the
parathyroid glands are damaged calcium regulation can be upset.
For those interested in treatments for hyperthyroidism in cats read here:
http://www.2ndchance.info/hyperthyroid.htm
"Surgical removal of the diseased portions of your cat's thyroid glands
is sometimes another option. But during the surgery, the difficult
decision must be made as to how much of the glands to remove. There is
no precise way to make this decision. If too much of the cat's thyroids
are removed, the cat will become hypothyroid and need lifelong thyroid
medications. If too little of the glands are removed, the cat will
remain hyperthyroid. Sometimes, it is appropriate to remove all of the
thyroid. Cats usually have small islands of thyroid tissue scattered in
other locations in their bodies. These "ectopic thyroid cells" can
usually produce all the thyroid hormone the cat will need. But they can
also lead to the re-appearance of hyperthyroidism months or years later."

and here: http://www.catinfo.org/?link=felinehyperthyroidism

buglady
take out the dog before replying

Bill Graham
August 15th 13, 09:18 PM
buglady wrote:
> On 8/14/2013 6:39 PM, wrote:
>
>> I think removing his thyroid is a death sentence if you are not
>> prepared to give him thyroid supplements the rest of his life.
>
>
> You are correct. Fatality for thyroidectomy is about 10%. And if the
> parathyroid glands are damaged calcium regulation can be upset.
> For those interested in treatments for hyperthyroidism in cats read
> here: http://www.2ndchance.info/hyperthyroid.htm
> "Surgical removal of the diseased portions of your cat's thyroid
> glands is sometimes another option. But during the surgery, the
> difficult decision must be made as to how much of the glands to
> remove. There is no precise way to make this decision. If too much of
> the cat's thyroids are removed, the cat will become hypothyroid and
> need lifelong thyroid medications. If too little of the glands are
> removed, the cat will remain hyperthyroid. Sometimes, it is
> appropriate to remove all of the thyroid. Cats usually have small
> islands of thyroid tissue scattered in other locations in their
> bodies. These "ectopic thyroid cells" can usually produce all the
> thyroid hormone the cat will need. But they can also lead to the
> re-appearance of hyperthyroidism months or years later."
> and here: http://www.catinfo.org/?link=felinehyperthyroidism
>
> buglady
> take out the dog before replying

Well, all I know is that our Junie lived several years happily without any
thyroid glands at all, and without any medicastion, either. Before she had
them removed, we hat to smear some xreme containing thyroid medicine on her
ears every day. After the operation, she needed no medication at all, and
our vet is a very good one who specializes in cats. Not beine a vet myself,
I have little to go on but what my vet tells me and my past experience. The
results with Junie, and the advice of my vet say, "Take them out"....

Kelley Greene
August 31st 13, 06:29 AM
"Bill Graham" > wrote in message
...
IOW, I
> would prefer to just catch him, put him in a cat carrier, call the roving
> vet, get him operated on, and let him go without ever telling anyone else
> about it. What do you guys think?

This is what I would do. Say nothing... just have it done. :)

Kelley Greene
August 31st 13, 06:33 AM
"Bill Graham" > wrote in message
...
But what can a poor animal do? And for
> those who say, "But you are himan and should help your own kind", I say,
> "I am a living thing, and that is more basic than being humal. Animals are
> my own kind. They, like me, are trapped in this miserable universe. Only
> they have no way to help themselves to a better life.

I just tell people who say I should be donating my money and time to human
causes that I will indeed do that,... when the sick and unwanted homeless
"humans" of the world are being euthanized by the millions as are our cats
and dogs... that shuts them up instantly.

Bill Graham
September 1st 13, 12:07 AM
Kelley Greene wrote:
> "Bill Graham" > wrote in message
> ...
> IOW, I
>> would prefer to just catch him, put him in a cat carrier, call the
>> roving vet, get him operated on, and let him go without ever telling
>> anyone else about it. What do you guys think?
>
> This is what I would do. Say nothing... just have it done. :)

Yeah.... Since he is without a chip or a collar, that's what we will do. I
can;t stand to see him sick. He is spending more and more of his time with
us. Cats seem to know instinctively where they are better off... I guess
that's what millions of years of evolution have done for them.

Bill Graham
September 1st 13, 12:14 AM
Kelley Greene wrote:
> "Bill Graham" > wrote in message
> ...
> But what can a poor animal do? And for
>> those who say, "But you are himan and should help your own kind", I
>> say, "I am a living thing, and that is more basic than being humal.
>> Animals are my own kind. They, like me, are trapped in this
>> miserable universe. Only they have no way to help themselves to a
>> better life.
>
> I just tell people who say I should be donating my money and time to
> human causes that I will indeed do that,... when the sick and
> unwanted homeless "humans" of the world are being euthanized by the
> millions as are our cats and dogs... that shuts them up instantly.

It would also help if the religions of the world accepted animals into
God's, "chosen people" class. As it is, they are just fodder for our food
tables. I think we should be trying to breed chickens without brains, so we
can kill and eat them without any guilt. Obviously, God built a dangerous
and terrifying universe. Surely we can improve on that in many more ways
than we have......