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View Full Version : Re: FIP diagnosis, advice needed


kaeli
July 18th 03, 04:20 PM
In article >,
enlightened us with...
> Hi all,
>
> My best friend's youngest cat, a Birman aged 15 months, was diagnosed
> with FIP this morning (dry form).
>

Get a second opinion. FIP looks like many other things and the only true
way to tell is a biopsy.
My cat was diagnosed with FIP and she actually has a recurrent URI -
Feline Herpes aka Rhinotraceitis.

> The vet based his diagnosis on a high titre value combined with blood
> test results of kidney, liver and pancreas. On top of that, we learned
> from his breeder that his littermate had to be put to sleep last week,
> he was totally emanciated and had had a few fits. Unfortunately, she
> had not asked the vet to do a PM. We learned from the breeder's vet
> that he suspected FIP.
>

FIP is relatively rare and according to the most recent research, cannot
be transmitted cat to cat. What is transmitted is the virus which can
mutate INTO FIP, Coronovirus.
The most recent research is showing that FIP is a systemic disease that
is caused by a mutation of Coronavirus. Up to 90 percent of cats have
had Coronavirus, but few develop FIP. The cat gets Coronavirus, then the
virus changes in the cat. However, recent tests show that the cat sheds
only Coronavirus.
There is still much debate and a lot of old info on the 'net. If you do
research, pay attention to when the page was made.

>
> We've heard about steroids to help fight infection and increase his
> appetite (which at the moment is fine, now he's being pampered with
> chicken and tuna).
>
> Also, what can we expect to happen in the next few weeks or months?
>

If it truly is FIP, it is fatal. His organs will fail gradually. It is a
horrible death. I would not subject a cat to it, personally.
However, his symptoms may be from a different cause. My personal opinion
is that I would get him on antibiotics, such as Baytril, to combat
secondary infections, give subQ fluids if needed, and get him tested for
other possible illnesses. Has he been tested for FIV, FeLV, and
diabetes?
Also, give him vitamins and an appetite inducer such as Felovite or
Nutrical once a day to boost his immune system.

IANAV, so be sure to talk to several vets in your area and try
alt.med.veterinary for more specific and advanced opinions. If your
newsserver doesn't carry that one, you can get it through an online
service like Google or DejaNews.

-------------------------------------------------
~kaeli~
There is no justification or rationalization
for mutilation. Ban declawing as inhumane.
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/wildAtHeart
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/kaelisSpace
-------------------------------------------------

kaeli
July 18th 03, 04:20 PM
In article >,
enlightened us with...
> Hi all,
>
> My best friend's youngest cat, a Birman aged 15 months, was diagnosed
> with FIP this morning (dry form).
>

Get a second opinion. FIP looks like many other things and the only true
way to tell is a biopsy.
My cat was diagnosed with FIP and she actually has a recurrent URI -
Feline Herpes aka Rhinotraceitis.

> The vet based his diagnosis on a high titre value combined with blood
> test results of kidney, liver and pancreas. On top of that, we learned
> from his breeder that his littermate had to be put to sleep last week,
> he was totally emanciated and had had a few fits. Unfortunately, she
> had not asked the vet to do a PM. We learned from the breeder's vet
> that he suspected FIP.
>

FIP is relatively rare and according to the most recent research, cannot
be transmitted cat to cat. What is transmitted is the virus which can
mutate INTO FIP, Coronovirus.
The most recent research is showing that FIP is a systemic disease that
is caused by a mutation of Coronavirus. Up to 90 percent of cats have
had Coronavirus, but few develop FIP. The cat gets Coronavirus, then the
virus changes in the cat. However, recent tests show that the cat sheds
only Coronavirus.
There is still much debate and a lot of old info on the 'net. If you do
research, pay attention to when the page was made.

>
> We've heard about steroids to help fight infection and increase his
> appetite (which at the moment is fine, now he's being pampered with
> chicken and tuna).
>
> Also, what can we expect to happen in the next few weeks or months?
>

If it truly is FIP, it is fatal. His organs will fail gradually. It is a
horrible death. I would not subject a cat to it, personally.
However, his symptoms may be from a different cause. My personal opinion
is that I would get him on antibiotics, such as Baytril, to combat
secondary infections, give subQ fluids if needed, and get him tested for
other possible illnesses. Has he been tested for FIV, FeLV, and
diabetes?
Also, give him vitamins and an appetite inducer such as Felovite or
Nutrical once a day to boost his immune system.

IANAV, so be sure to talk to several vets in your area and try
alt.med.veterinary for more specific and advanced opinions. If your
newsserver doesn't carry that one, you can get it through an online
service like Google or DejaNews.

-------------------------------------------------
~kaeli~
There is no justification or rationalization
for mutilation. Ban declawing as inhumane.
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/wildAtHeart
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/kaelisSpace
-------------------------------------------------

kaeli
July 18th 03, 06:23 PM
In article >,
enlightened us with...
> Hello ~kaeli~,
>
> Thanks for pointing out the vet-newsgroup, I posted my question there.
> Yes, he was tested for FELV and FIV as well, and test results came
> back negative. I'm not sure about diabetes, I'd have to check. Without
> wanting to get my friend's hopes up, I'll suggest she get a second
> opinion. Thanks for your suggestion and your response.
>
>
> Yvonne.
>

You're welcome.

Vets, and human doctors, can't possibly know everything. That's why it's
so important to get second and even third opinions when a cat gets
really sick.

Please see the links below for more detailed (and very recent) FIP info.
Sites include which tests the cat should get to confirm diagnosis.

http://web.vet.cornell.edu/public/fhc/fip.html
http://www.winnfelinehealth.org/health/FIP.html
http://www.animalhealthchannel.com/fip/index.shtml

-------------------------------------------------
~kaeli~
There is no justification or rationalization
for mutilation. Ban declawing as inhumane.
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/wildAtHeart
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/kaelisSpace
-------------------------------------------------

kaeli
July 18th 03, 06:23 PM
In article >,
enlightened us with...
> Hello ~kaeli~,
>
> Thanks for pointing out the vet-newsgroup, I posted my question there.
> Yes, he was tested for FELV and FIV as well, and test results came
> back negative. I'm not sure about diabetes, I'd have to check. Without
> wanting to get my friend's hopes up, I'll suggest she get a second
> opinion. Thanks for your suggestion and your response.
>
>
> Yvonne.
>

You're welcome.

Vets, and human doctors, can't possibly know everything. That's why it's
so important to get second and even third opinions when a cat gets
really sick.

Please see the links below for more detailed (and very recent) FIP info.
Sites include which tests the cat should get to confirm diagnosis.

http://web.vet.cornell.edu/public/fhc/fip.html
http://www.winnfelinehealth.org/health/FIP.html
http://www.animalhealthchannel.com/fip/index.shtml

-------------------------------------------------
~kaeli~
There is no justification or rationalization
for mutilation. Ban declawing as inhumane.
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/wildAtHeart
http://www.ipwebdesign.net/kaelisSpace
-------------------------------------------------

Yngver
July 18th 03, 11:00 PM
Yvonne wrote:

>My best friend's youngest cat, a Birman aged 15 months, was diagnosed
>with FIP this morning (dry form).

As another poster pointed out, there's a lot of misinformation out there about
FIP. Most cats diagnosed with it do not have it. The dry form is even more
doubtful since there are so many other things it could be.
>
>The vet based his diagnosis on a high titre value

High titre simply means the cat has been exposed to the feline coronavirus,
from which FIP mutates in a few cats. Most cats with high titres do not have
nor do they ever develop FIP. If the titre was quite high, it can indicate an
active coronavirus infection. The vet should re-test to see if the titre starts
to fall, which usually means the cat is clearing the infection.

combined with blood
>test results of kidney, liver and pancreas.

What did he find? According to one lab, fewer than twenty percent of the
samples sent for FIP testing turn out to be FIP.

On top of that, we learned
>from his breeder that his littermate had to be put to sleep last week,
>he was totally emanciated and had had a few fits. Unfortunately, she
>had not asked the vet to do a PM. We learned from the breeder's vet
>that he suspected FIP.

Since most of the time suspected FIP is not FIP, it's doubtful that's what the
littermate had. Even if he did, it's not known why the coronavirus mutates into
FIP in a few cats. There may not be any genetic connection, so I would not
assume that has any bearing on your friend's cat.
>
>Frodo, my friend's cat, caused my friend some concern as he was losing
>weight and had a poor appetite. Otherwise there are no symptoms, even
>though his blood tests suggest the onset of kidney and liver failure.

That could be from all sorts of things, many treatable. Your friend should get
a second opinion from another vet.
>
>My friend's decided to pamper him and give him the best last weeks or
>months of his life. The vet told her that the chances of him infecting
>her three other cats (ranging from 8 to 3 years of age) are small,
>meaning of course that he may already have infected them. She will
>have them tested once Frodo has passed away.

The coronavirus is very infectious, so yes, they've probably already been
infected. But again, only rarely will it mutate into FIP. There doesn't seem to
be much point in testing them because the test can't tell her whether not they
will ever develop FIP.

>
>We're both devastated. I love him like he was a cat of my own.
>
>In general, scientists in the US and UK are slightly more advanced
>than here in Holland and since this is an international group, I would
>very much like to know whether you know of any meds that could
>alleviate Frodo's symptoms. I know there's no cure, but that of course
>doesn't mean he has to be uncomfortable. He will be closely monitored
>and as soon as my friend and her vet feel it's no longer fair to keep
>him alive, he will be put to sleep. As he's very active and playful at
>the moment, this definitely is not the right time.
>
>We've heard about steroids to help fight infection and increase his
>appetite (which at the moment is fine, now he's being pampered with
>chicken and tuna).
>
>Also, what can we expect to happen in the next few weeks or months?
>
Well, if it were me, I'd assume it's not FIP (because usually it isn't) and
look for another cause. Hopefully another vet can give more advice, but as the
other poster said, antibiotics and the appetite stimulant may help quite a bit
for now, while you try to find out what's really wrong. Good luck.

Yngver
July 18th 03, 11:00 PM
Yvonne wrote:

>My best friend's youngest cat, a Birman aged 15 months, was diagnosed
>with FIP this morning (dry form).

As another poster pointed out, there's a lot of misinformation out there about
FIP. Most cats diagnosed with it do not have it. The dry form is even more
doubtful since there are so many other things it could be.
>
>The vet based his diagnosis on a high titre value

High titre simply means the cat has been exposed to the feline coronavirus,
from which FIP mutates in a few cats. Most cats with high titres do not have
nor do they ever develop FIP. If the titre was quite high, it can indicate an
active coronavirus infection. The vet should re-test to see if the titre starts
to fall, which usually means the cat is clearing the infection.

combined with blood
>test results of kidney, liver and pancreas.

What did he find? According to one lab, fewer than twenty percent of the
samples sent for FIP testing turn out to be FIP.

On top of that, we learned
>from his breeder that his littermate had to be put to sleep last week,
>he was totally emanciated and had had a few fits. Unfortunately, she
>had not asked the vet to do a PM. We learned from the breeder's vet
>that he suspected FIP.

Since most of the time suspected FIP is not FIP, it's doubtful that's what the
littermate had. Even if he did, it's not known why the coronavirus mutates into
FIP in a few cats. There may not be any genetic connection, so I would not
assume that has any bearing on your friend's cat.
>
>Frodo, my friend's cat, caused my friend some concern as he was losing
>weight and had a poor appetite. Otherwise there are no symptoms, even
>though his blood tests suggest the onset of kidney and liver failure.

That could be from all sorts of things, many treatable. Your friend should get
a second opinion from another vet.
>
>My friend's decided to pamper him and give him the best last weeks or
>months of his life. The vet told her that the chances of him infecting
>her three other cats (ranging from 8 to 3 years of age) are small,
>meaning of course that he may already have infected them. She will
>have them tested once Frodo has passed away.

The coronavirus is very infectious, so yes, they've probably already been
infected. But again, only rarely will it mutate into FIP. There doesn't seem to
be much point in testing them because the test can't tell her whether not they
will ever develop FIP.

>
>We're both devastated. I love him like he was a cat of my own.
>
>In general, scientists in the US and UK are slightly more advanced
>than here in Holland and since this is an international group, I would
>very much like to know whether you know of any meds that could
>alleviate Frodo's symptoms. I know there's no cure, but that of course
>doesn't mean he has to be uncomfortable. He will be closely monitored
>and as soon as my friend and her vet feel it's no longer fair to keep
>him alive, he will be put to sleep. As he's very active and playful at
>the moment, this definitely is not the right time.
>
>We've heard about steroids to help fight infection and increase his
>appetite (which at the moment is fine, now he's being pampered with
>chicken and tuna).
>
>Also, what can we expect to happen in the next few weeks or months?
>
Well, if it were me, I'd assume it's not FIP (because usually it isn't) and
look for another cause. Hopefully another vet can give more advice, but as the
other poster said, antibiotics and the appetite stimulant may help quite a bit
for now, while you try to find out what's really wrong. Good luck.