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View Full Version : BAD BAD experience today with my cat at the vet.


bobsacemano
February 1st 06, 03:50 AM
I took my cat in today because he seemed to be having trouble
breathing. He is a 15 year old domestic shorthair who has only been
sick one other time, and only been to the vet once for neutering as a
kitten.

He of course was very scared by them and stopped breathing hardly at
all, they drained his lungs almost emergency style and then delivered
what seemed like a fear based sales pitch:

"He most likely has feline aids or feline leukimia, his lungs are
filling with fluid and he cannot be helped unless we keep him for 6-7
weeks and drain and rinse his lungs with solution and keep him on
atinobiotics. This only has an 15% chanc eof working. If you choose to
do the human thing he wont suffer at all. If you don't he will most
likely die a horrible death gasping and panicing for air and crying out
at home"

I declined as when I seen him again he was breathing normally and was
"him" and got antibiotics instead and hope by some chance they will
work.

All I could think is if I went in with pnemonia and was told I have
3-4 days to live because I have aids, simply from the doctor listening
to my lungs with a stethescope I would think the doctor had went
insane. Then if he hit me over the head with a dead chicken (about as
weird the cat getting his temp taken rectally I suppose) and I had
trouble breathing and he drained my lungs to help me, I would not think
all is lost and would wanna try some antibiotics.

Or at LEAST die at home with my last experience not being some strange
place and weird people.

I have NO guilt for this, even if his last minutes are terrible, he
will get a few more days I suppose, and have memories of us loving him
and playing with him. PLUS he seems fine now, the vet assured us his
lungs would refill with fluid and he would die, but I have trouble
believing it with his curent condition.

I DO however have a couple questions, is it possible the vet is wrong?
Is there anything I should know here? Not to comfort me, but maybe to
save him? (I need no comfort in the fact that he will not be crying out
for help in his last seconds unable to breath, as if something cannot
breath it cannot force air out of its lungs to cry out, I am almost
sure he will drown in his sleep at the worst, and this "horrible death"
was a sales pitch of some sort).

Anything I am not being told, should I take him to another vet?

Joe Canuck
February 1st 06, 04:56 AM
bobsacemano wrote:

> I took my cat in today because he seemed to be having trouble
> breathing. He is a 15 year old domestic shorthair who has only been
> sick one other time, and only been to the vet once for neutering as a
> kitten.
>
> He of course was very scared by them and stopped breathing hardly at
> all, they drained his lungs almost emergency style and then delivered
> what seemed like a fear based sales pitch:
>
> "He most likely has feline aids or feline leukimia, his lungs are
> filling with fluid and he cannot be helped unless we keep him for 6-7
> weeks and drain and rinse his lungs with solution and keep him on
> atinobiotics. This only has an 15% chanc eof working. If you choose to
> do the human thing he wont suffer at all. If you don't he will most
> likely die a horrible death gasping and panicing for air and crying out
> at home"
>
> I declined as when I seen him again he was breathing normally and was
> "him" and got antibiotics instead and hope by some chance they will
> work.
>
> All I could think is if I went in with pnemonia and was told I have
> 3-4 days to live because I have aids, simply from the doctor listening
> to my lungs with a stethescope I would think the doctor had went
> insane. Then if he hit me over the head with a dead chicken (about as
> weird the cat getting his temp taken rectally I suppose) and I had
> trouble breathing and he drained my lungs to help me, I would not think
> all is lost and would wanna try some antibiotics.
>
> Or at LEAST die at home with my last experience not being some strange
> place and weird people.
>
> I have NO guilt for this, even if his last minutes are terrible, he
> will get a few more days I suppose, and have memories of us loving him
> and playing with him. PLUS he seems fine now, the vet assured us his
> lungs would refill with fluid and he would die, but I have trouble
> believing it with his curent condition.
>
> I DO however have a couple questions, is it possible the vet is wrong?
> Is there anything I should know here? Not to comfort me, but maybe to
> save him? (I need no comfort in the fact that he will not be crying out
> for help in his last seconds unable to breath, as if something cannot
> breath it cannot force air out of its lungs to cry out, I am almost
> sure he will drown in his sleep at the worst, and this "horrible death"
> was a sales pitch of some sort).
>
> Anything I am not being told, should I take him to another vet?
>

Seeking a 2nd opinion is a always a good idea.

Joe Canuck
February 1st 06, 04:58 AM
Margarita Salt wrote:

> bobsacemano > wrote in
> rec.pets.cats.health+behav:
>
>
>> should I take him to another vet?
>
>
> Bingo! And I'm sure you know this, but he should have had regular vet
> visits all along for two solid reason: (1) To hopefully keep him from
> being fearful of all the trip entails, and (2) so that at the very
> least you have a vet who is familiar with your cat and his ailments and
> habits so that diagnoses aren't as much of a crapshoot
>

There are also some "solid" reasons for some folks that this doesn't
happen, particulary for those who move around a lot. Military people
come to mind.



> Take him to another vet, since you have no relationship with anyone in
> partcular, and get another opinion. I hope you and your kitty will be
> fine.
>
>
>

NMR
February 1st 06, 05:06 AM
"bobsacemano" >

Take him to another vet specially with this news a blood test would have
shown feline aids

I won't state medical advice but it could be lung infection or anything
never trust just one vet

Some vets are just not that good. In the morning take him to another vet
tell him why you brought him to the other vet but let this vet do a diagnose
instead of already having a mental picture done for him

And when it is time for him to go you will know it is time to take him to
get what needs to be done.

I am sorry you are in this situation. I would PING PHIL P in this newsgroup
and give the medical information that was given to you

-L.
February 1st 06, 06:27 AM
bobsacemano wrote:
> I took my cat in today because he seemed to be having trouble
> breathing. He is a 15 year old domestic shorthair who has only been
> sick one other time, and only been to the vet once for neutering as a
> kitten.

What were his symptoms - wheezing? coughing? gasping? pawing at mouth?

>
> He of course was very scared by them and stopped breathing hardly at
> all, they drained his lungs almost emergency style and then delivered
> what seemed like a fear based sales pitch:
>
> "He most likely has feline aids or feline leukimia,

First, this is a crock of ****. They should have asked you if it was
ok to test for both - the test takes 15 minutes, tops.

> his lungs are
> filling with fluid and he cannot be helped unless we keep him for 6-7
> weeks and drain and rinse his lungs with solution and keep him on
> atinobiotics. This only has an 15% chanc eof working. If you choose to
> do the human thing he wont suffer at all. If you don't he will most
> likely die a horrible death gasping and panicing for air and crying out
> at home"
>
> I declined as when I seen him again he was breathing normally and was
> "him" and got antibiotics instead and hope by some chance they will
> work.
>
> All I could think is if I went in with pnemonia and was told I have
> 3-4 days to live because I have aids, simply from the doctor listening
> to my lungs with a stethescope I would think the doctor had went
> insane.

And that would the the correct assumption.

> Then if he hit me over the head with a dead chicken (about as
> weird the cat getting his temp taken rectally I suppose) and I had
> trouble breathing and he drained my lungs to help me, I would not think
> all is lost and would wanna try some antibiotics.
>
> Or at LEAST die at home with my last experience not being some strange
> place and weird people.
>
> I have NO guilt for this, even if his last minutes are terrible, he
> will get a few more days I suppose, and have memories of us loving him
> and playing with him. PLUS he seems fine now, the vet assured us his
> lungs would refill with fluid and he would die, but I have trouble
> believing it with his curent condition.

This whole scenario sounds weird. Did they take an x-ray and show it
to you to prove to you the cat had pneumonia? Did you see them drain
the lungs? generally, pneumonia is not treated by drining the lungs
unless it is extremely severe, and if that was the case, they should
have taken an x-ray to see how severe it was.

>
> I DO however have a couple questions, is it possible the vet is wrong?

Very possible.

> Is there anything I should know here?

The above.

>Not to comfort me, but maybe to
> save him? (I need no comfort in the fact that he will not be crying out
> for help in his last seconds unable to breath, as if something cannot
> breath it cannot force air out of its lungs to cry out, I am almost
> sure he will drown in his sleep at the worst, and this "horrible death"
> was a sales pitch of some sort).
>
> Anything I am not being told, should I take him to another vet?

If he continues to have trouble breathing, absolutely take him to
another vet. This entire fiasco sounds fishy. Was this an emergency
vet?

Without any more detail it sounds more likely that the cat was having
an asthma attack, they gave him some meds to resolve it and some
oxygen, and he was fine. A cat with pneumonia will act *very* sick.

Please supply a little more detail about what the symptoms were and
what treatment actually occurred - what did you see, if anything?

-L.

February 1st 06, 08:32 AM
Joe Canuck wrote:

> There are also some "solid" reasons for some folks that this doesn't
> happen, particulary for those who move around a lot. Military people
> come to mind.
>

The owner would still know what is normal for his cat. Some cats freak
out at the vet's office, so it would be helpful to know if breathing
changes are a normal reaction or something unusual.

When I take my cat to the vet with a problem, even though it is my
regular vet, he still relies on *my* opinion of what is normal for my
cat.

So, when I took Kira in as a kitten, and said she was lethargic, he
believed me even though she was walking around and not just laying
there. She was lethargic compared to her normal self.

The vet will ask about appetite, energy, etc. It helps to know what is
normal. And behavior at a vet visit is also part of that normal
behavior.

Several years ago, my mom found a cat on the side of the road. He had
been hit, and had some bad injuries including a broken jaw. We paid for
thevet care and brought him home. He seemed to be improving, but 2 1/2
weeks after bringing him home, he died. He seemed fine that morning,
but I knew it was serious when I got home from work. We didn't have a
24 hour vet then, so we were going to be there at the office when it
opened. He didn't make it that long.

There was nothing I could do, since I got him after he was hit by the
car. But I really wish that I would have known what was normal for him.
He seemed so mellow and easy going, but he could have been sick and in
pain, and we just didn't know. He was at the vet's office 3 times the
week he died, and everybody, including the vet, thought he was
improving. We just didn't have anything to compare his behavior to.

Vets are not telepathic or psychic. They rely on tehir experiences with
all the cats and dogs they have seen over the years. But that doesn't
mean that your cat is typical or normal. They still have to rely on the
owner to be the judge of behavior changes, which are clues to the
problem. And this includes knowing how the cat reacts to strangers and
vet exams.

Phil P.
February 1st 06, 08:32 AM
"bobsacemano" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>
> I took my cat in today because he seemed to be having trouble
> breathing. He is a 15 year old domestic shorthair who has only been
> sick one other time, and only been to the vet once for neutering as a
> kitten.
>
> He of course was very scared by them and stopped breathing hardly at
> all, they drained his lungs almost emergency style and then delivered
> what seemed like a fear based sales pitch:
>
> "He most likely has feline aids or feline leukimia, his lungs are
> filling with fluid and he cannot be helped unless we keep him for 6-7
> weeks and drain and rinse his lungs with solution and keep him on
> atinobiotics. This only has an 15% chanc eof working. If you choose to
> do the human thing he wont suffer at all. If you don't he will most
> likely die a horrible death gasping and panicing for air and crying out
> at home"


This is absolute erroneous nonsense. First of all, neither FIV (feline
'aids') nor Feline Leukemia produce pleural effusions. At your cat's age
FeLV and FIV are *very* highly unlikely- if not actually *impossible*-
unless your cat was bitten by a FeLV/FIV infected cat. If your cat had
either disease, you would have noticed a steady deterioration in his overall
physical condition over the last few months to years. The test to rule out
FeLV/FIV takes less than 10 minutes and can be performed by a simple blood
test in your vet's office. Its called FeLV/FIV Combo Snap test and costs
about $25.

>
> I declined as when I seen him again he was breathing normally and was
> "him" and got antibiotics instead and hope by some chance they will
> work.
>
> All I could think is if I went in with pnemonia and was told I have
> 3-4 days to live because I have aids, simply from the doctor listening
> to my lungs with a stethescope I would think the doctor had went
> insane.


You would probably be correct.


Then if he hit me over the head with a dead chicken (about as
> weird the cat getting his temp taken rectally I suppose) and I had
> trouble breathing and he drained my lungs to help me, I would not think
> all is lost and would wanna try some antibiotics.
>
> Or at LEAST die at home with my last experience not being some strange
> place and weird people.
>
> I have NO guilt for this, even if his last minutes are terrible, he
> will get a few more days I suppose, and have memories of us loving him
> and playing with him. PLUS he seems fine now, the vet assured us his
> lungs would refill with fluid and he would die, but I have trouble
> believing it with his curent condition.


His lungs may refill with fluid again, but another thoracocentesis would
relieve respiratory distress immediately.


>
> I DO however have a couple questions, is it possible the vet is wrong?


Absolutely! The vet is not not only possibly wrong- he's *probably* wrong.


> Is there anything I should know here? Not to comfort me, but maybe to
> save him?


Yes.


(I need no comfort in the fact that he will not be crying out
> for help in his last seconds unable to breath, as if something cannot
> breath it cannot force air out of its lungs to cry out, I am almost
> sure he will drown in his sleep at the worst, and this "horrible death"
> was a sales pitch of some sort).
>
> Anything I am not being told, should I take him to another vet?


The first order of business is find another vet ASAP and get the fluid
analyzed to determine the *type* of fluid. Several diseases can produce
fluids- non of which are FIV/FeLV. There are several types of fluid ( e.g.,
transudates, modified transudates, septic exudates, nonseptic exudates,
neoplastic, chylous, hemorrhagic). The type of fluid depends on the disease
process that's producing the fluid. At your cat's age, my first guess would
be heart disease, CHF secondary to hyperthrophic cardiomyopathy- *both* of
which can be treated with medications.

In many, if not most cases pleural effusions can be controlled with
medications called "diuretics" (furosemide a/k/a Lasix). Although the fluid
may need be to be drained again (thoracocentesis) to provide immediate
relief until the diuretic takes affect. Once the effusion is under control,
the dose should be reduced to the lowest possible dose because cats are
sensitive to diuretics and prone to dehydration and electrolyte imbalances.


I strongly suggest you seek a secon opinion *ASAP* and order x-rays and an
ultrasound. The ultrasound should be performed *before* the fluid is
drained because the fluid actually enhances the ultrasound image- unless
your cat is in severe respiratory distress.

However, the most important step is having the fluid analyzed ASAP- this
will help identify the process that's producing the fluid and greatly help
the vet proper a treatment plan.

Please seek a second opinion *ASAP*.

Keep the faith.

Best of luck,

Phil.

Phil P.
February 1st 06, 08:51 AM
"-L." > wrote in message
oups.com...
>
> bobsacemano wrote:
> > I took my cat in today because he seemed to be having trouble
> > breathing. He is a 15 year old domestic shorthair who has only been
> > sick one other time, and only been to the vet once for neutering as a
> > kitten.
>
> What were his symptoms - wheezing? coughing? gasping? pawing at mouth?
>
> >
> > He of course was very scared by them and stopped breathing hardly at
> > all, they drained his lungs almost emergency style and then delivered
> > what seemed like a fear based sales pitch:
> >
> > "He most likely has feline aids or feline leukimia,
>
> First, this is a crock of ****.
They should have asked you if it was
> ok to test for both - the test takes 15 minutes, tops.


Wow! We actually agree on something! ;)


>
> > his lungs are
> > filling with fluid and he cannot be helped unless we keep him for 6-7
> > weeks and drain and rinse his lungs with solution and keep him on
> > atinobiotics. This only has an 15% chanc eof working. If you choose to
> > do the human thing he wont suffer at all. If you don't he will most
> > likely die a horrible death gasping and panicing for air and crying out
> > at home"
> >
> > I declined as when I seen him again he was breathing normally and was
> > "him" and got antibiotics instead and hope by some chance they will
> > work.
> >
> > All I could think is if I went in with pnemonia and was told I have
> > 3-4 days to live because I have aids, simply from the doctor listening
> > to my lungs with a stethescope I would think the doctor had went
> > insane.
>
> And that would the the correct assumption.
>
> > Then if he hit me over the head with a dead chicken (about as
> > weird the cat getting his temp taken rectally I suppose) and I had
> > trouble breathing and he drained my lungs to help me, I would not think
> > all is lost and would wanna try some antibiotics.
> >
> > Or at LEAST die at home with my last experience not being some strange
> > place and weird people.
> >
> > I have NO guilt for this, even if his last minutes are terrible, he
> > will get a few more days I suppose, and have memories of us loving him
> > and playing with him. PLUS he seems fine now, the vet assured us his
> > lungs would refill with fluid and he would die, but I have trouble
> > believing it with his curent condition.
>
> This whole scenario sounds weird. Did they take an x-ray and show it
> to you to prove to you the cat had pneumonia? Did you see them drain
> the lungs? generally, pneumonia is not treated by drining the lungs
> unless it is extremely severe, and if that was the case, they should
> have taken an x-ray to see how severe it was.
>
> >
> > I DO however have a couple questions, is it possible the vet is wrong?
>
> Very possible.
>
> > Is there anything I should know here?
>
> The above.
>
> >Not to comfort me, but maybe to
> > save him? (I need no comfort in the fact that he will not be crying out
> > for help in his last seconds unable to breath, as if something cannot
> > breath it cannot force air out of its lungs to cry out, I am almost
> > sure he will drown in his sleep at the worst, and this "horrible death"
> > was a sales pitch of some sort).
> >
> > Anything I am not being told, should I take him to another vet?
>
> If he continues to have trouble breathing, absolutely take him to
> another vet. This entire fiasco sounds fishy.

"Fishy"? Have you ever heard of such a BS story? This is probably one of
the worst BS stories I've ever heard of a vet giving a client. I'd say it
borders on gross incompetence. My guess is the vet is clueless and wants to
kill the cat before the client gets a second opinion and finds out the vet
is clueless and incompetent.

PawsForThought
February 1st 06, 01:53 PM
bobsacemano wrote:
> Anything I am not being told, should I take him to another vet?

I find it highly suspect that all of the sudden a 15 year old cat is
going to have FIV or FelV, and even worse that this vet didn't do the
proper testing for these diseases. I would absolutely take him to a
different vet at a different clinic.

Good luck and please keep us posted.

Lauren

see my cats: http://tinyurl.com/8glfv

mekki
February 1st 06, 06:25 PM
What do you think the vet is trying to "sell" you?

Taking your cat home to die in pain is not humane. If he is in pain,
euthanasia is the most humane option. Better he die painlessly in a
strange place (hopefully with you with him) than horribly in a familiar
place.

M.

-L.
February 1st 06, 07:04 PM
Phil P. wrote:
> "bobsacemano" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
> >
> > I took my cat in today because he seemed to be having trouble
> > breathing. He is a 15 year old domestic shorthair who has only been
> > sick one other time, and only been to the vet once for neutering as a
> > kitten.
> >
> > He of course was very scared by them and stopped breathing hardly at
> > all, they drained his lungs almost emergency style and then delivered
> > what seemed like a fear based sales pitch:
> >
> > "He most likely has feline aids or feline leukimia, his lungs are
> > filling with fluid and he cannot be helped unless we keep him for 6-7
> > weeks and drain and rinse his lungs with solution and keep him on
> > atinobiotics. This only has an 15% chanc eof working. If you choose to
> > do the human thing he wont suffer at all. If you don't he will most
> > likely die a horrible death gasping and panicing for air and crying out
> > at home"
>
>
> This is absolute erroneous nonsense. First of all, neither FIV (feline
> 'aids') nor Feline Leukemia produce pleural effusions. At your cat's age
> FeLV and FIV are *very* highly unlikely- if not actually *impossible*-
> unless your cat was bitten by a FeLV/FIV infected cat. If your cat had
> either disease, you would have noticed a steady deterioration in his overall
> physical condition over the last few months to years. The test to rule out
> FeLV/FIV takes less than 10 minutes and can be performed by a simple blood
> test in your vet's office. Its called FeLV/FIV Combo Snap test and costs
> about $25.
>
> >
> > I declined as when I seen him again he was breathing normally and was
> > "him" and got antibiotics instead and hope by some chance they will
> > work.
> >
> > All I could think is if I went in with pnemonia and was told I have
> > 3-4 days to live because I have aids, simply from the doctor listening
> > to my lungs with a stethescope I would think the doctor had went
> > insane.
>
>
> You would probably be correct.
>
>
> Then if he hit me over the head with a dead chicken (about as
> > weird the cat getting his temp taken rectally I suppose) and I had
> > trouble breathing and he drained my lungs to help me, I would not think
> > all is lost and would wanna try some antibiotics.
> >
> > Or at LEAST die at home with my last experience not being some strange
> > place and weird people.
> >
> > I have NO guilt for this, even if his last minutes are terrible, he
> > will get a few more days I suppose, and have memories of us loving him
> > and playing with him. PLUS he seems fine now, the vet assured us his
> > lungs would refill with fluid and he would die, but I have trouble
> > believing it with his curent condition.
>
>
> His lungs may refill with fluid again, but another thoracocentesis would
> relieve respiratory distress immediately.
>
>
> >
> > I DO however have a couple questions, is it possible the vet is wrong?
>
>
> Absolutely! The vet is not not only possibly wrong- he's *probably* wrong.
>
>
> > Is there anything I should know here? Not to comfort me, but maybe to
> > save him?
>
>
> Yes.
>
>
> (I need no comfort in the fact that he will not be crying out
> > for help in his last seconds unable to breath, as if something cannot
> > breath it cannot force air out of its lungs to cry out, I am almost
> > sure he will drown in his sleep at the worst, and this "horrible death"
> > was a sales pitch of some sort).
> >
> > Anything I am not being told, should I take him to another vet?
>
>
> The first order of business is find another vet ASAP and get the fluid
> analyzed to determine the *type* of fluid.

Phil, I am not even sure the cat had fluid in its lungs. I think the
whole thing was a lie from the get-go. The cat could easily have been
choking on something, have asthma or a fur ball. I do think he should
take the cat to another vet asap, though!

-L.

February 1st 06, 07:15 PM
mekki wrote:
> What do you think the vet is trying to "sell" you?
>
> Taking your cat home to die in pain is not humane. If he is in pain,
> euthanasia is the most humane option. Better he die painlessly in a
> strange place (hopefully with you with him) than horribly in a familiar
> place.
>
> M.

in this case, euthanasia would be killing the cat for money because
it's unlikely any vet could be this incompetent in diagnosis, treatment
and prognosis. i am sure that would be his "excuse" if he were tried:
"i am not greedy - i just know nothin.."

what city did this occur in?

cybercat
February 1st 06, 08:06 PM
"mekki" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> What do you think the vet is trying to "sell" you?
>
> Taking your cat home to die in pain is not humane. If he is in pain,
> euthanasia is the most humane option. Better he die painlessly in a
> strange place (hopefully with you with him) than horribly in a familiar
> place.
>

I agree, but these are not the options. Many vets, including mine, will
come to your home and euthanize your animal in its own bed if you just
ask them to.

February 1st 06, 11:09 PM
wrote:
>
> Vets are not telepathic or psychic. They rely on tehir experiences with
> all the cats and dogs they have seen over the years. But that doesn't
> mean that your cat is typical or normal. They still have to rely on the
> owner to be the judge of behavior changes, which are clues to the
> problem. And this includes knowing how the cat reacts to strangers and
> vet exams.

And just because the cat is a good patient at one exam doesn't mean he
will be at any other time. Many a "good" Fluffy have days where they
are complete Tazmanian Devils, when it comes to visiting the vet.
Also, some cats respond better to some vets/techs that others. You
really need to find a practice where the people are good with *your*
animals and the place is clean, well managed, and the staff
knowledgable. The techs are the ones who will be handling your animal
90% of the time (especially in a drop-off or hospital setting), so IMO,
they are just as important to consider as the vets. I cannot tell you
how many animals I have handled where I had my hands on them 3 -10 or
even 20 times longer than the vets ever did.

-L.

February 2nd 06, 07:12 AM
wrote:
> wrote:
> >
> > Vets are not telepathic or psychic. They rely on tehir experiences with
> > all the cats and dogs they have seen over the years. But that doesn't
> > mean that your cat is typical or normal. They still have to rely on the
> > owner to be the judge of behavior changes, which are clues to the
> > problem. And this includes knowing how the cat reacts to strangers and
> > vet exams.
>
> And just because the cat is a good patient at one exam doesn't mean he
> will be at any other time. Many a "good" Fluffy have days where they
> are complete Tazmanian Devils, when it comes to visiting the vet.

This is true. And another good reason while those yearly exams will
give you more chances to observe their reactions at exams as well as to
different people.

> Also, some cats respond better to some vets/techs that others. You
> really need to find a practice where the people are good with *your*
> animals and the place is clean, well managed, and the staff
> knowledgable. The techs are the ones who will be handling your animal
> 90% of the time (especially in a drop-off or hospital setting), so IMO,
> they are just as important to consider as the vets. I cannot tell you
> how many animals I have handled where I had my hands on them 3 -10 or
> even 20 times longer than the vets ever did.

I've been very pleased with both of my vets. I've had to leave my dog
at the one vet on 6 different occasions. She had mange and required a
special bath applied just above her eye. She is a rather shy dog from
previous abuse, and she will bite during grooming sometimes (she has
bitten me a couple times if I snagged her hair). So, I know she can be
difficult. They loved her, and she came out with a waggy tail.

Maynard had to stay the day once when he got a bad abcess. It was a
really busy day with several emergencies (at least one dog hit by a
car), so he was there awhile. They said he was a perfect gentleman, and
so well behaved that they didn't have to drug him when they shaved him
and cleaned out the abcess.

And JayJay, my newest boy. He went in with severe diarhea about a week
after I got him. Basically, a gentle giant, but not so happy when I
tried to clean his butt. He bit me, didn't cut the skin, but did rip
the vinyl glove I was wearing. So, while they he was there at the vet,
I asked them to shave some of the longer fur so it wold be better for
both of us. The vet came back and said it took 3 of them to do the job.
I've had to do a few trims since then, and I agree. He kicks hard, so
it takes at least one person holding him well while I do the trimming
and risk the kicks. He's not as bad before, but he's 18lbs of muscle,
and he can kick hard. I haven't had to trim him since we had our lesson
on nail trimming and kicking. So, he may not be so bad about trimming
now that he has had some lessons on kicking and how it is NOT allowed.

All of them were handled well, both in front of me and, from the
reactions of my animals as well as the people, while they are in the
back room as well.

I do admit that I have been lucky. Most of them are nervous and want to
hide in their carriers, but none of them have ever bitten (except Jenny
when getting groomed). Nobody freaks out and attacks. Kira is extremely
well behaved when she is sick. Really the only time that she doesn't
bite. She's always been a biter, but never at the vet's office. She has
let me do exams on her, and she will grumble when I find the spot the
hurts. She seems to understand that I am trying to fix the problem. The
only one that struggles at the vet is Jay Jay, and that is more of an
attempt to escape. He tries to push his way out of your arms. And he
kicks. He also makes some really lame growly noises that sound more
like a whine.

Knowing what they are like on a regular basis will help me know in the
future how they are doing. Just like I test a potentially sick cat by
offering them their favorite food. If they pass up a favorite, it's an
automatic vet trip. Unfortunately, Jay Jay jas no favorite. He just
eats kibble. On very rare occasions, he might eat one bite of chicken,
or couple pieces of shredded cheese. He won't eat canned food, tuna,
shrimp, or anything else you would expect. He's hard to test. Maynard
was easy. When I saw him show excitement for his favirite food and then
turn away without eating - that's when I knew his liver failure was too
far advanced. As their owners, we still know them better than anybody
else.