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kitkat via CatKB.com
September 29th 06, 03:15 PM
I have two adopted cats and both were outdoor cats in the past with previous
owners. Both of my cats look longingly out the windows and try to escape
anytime the door opens even for a second. One of my cats seems "depressed".
He sleeps all day and never moves from under a chair. However, the couple
times he's gotten out he prances around and appears very active - something
I've NEVER seen in our home.

I've been told by countless people , including vets, that keeping a cat
indoors greatly increases their longevity and keeps them much safer. But
should I also take into consideration their happiness? And if I were to let
them out, how would I train them to come home? Almost immediately after I
got my first cat shatner, he bolted out of the house and didn't come home for
FIFTEEN DAYS! I nearly went insane. Plus, I'm not wild about the idea of
the cats bringing home gross stuff like fleas.

--
Message posted via CatKB.com
http://www.catkb.com/Uwe/Forums.aspx/cat-health/200609/1

September 29th 06, 03:58 PM
On Fri, 29 Sep 2006 14:15:45 GMT, "kitkat via CatKB.com" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>I have two adopted cats and both were outdoor cats in the past with previous
>owners. Both of my cats look longingly out the windows and try to escape
>anytime the door opens even for a second. One of my cats seems "depressed".
>He sleeps all day and never moves from under a chair. However, the couple
>times he's gotten out he prances around and appears very active - something
>I've NEVER seen in our home.
>
>I've been told by countless people , including vets, that keeping a cat
>indoors greatly increases their longevity and keeps them much safer. But
>should I also take into consideration their happiness? And if I were to let
>them out, how would I train them to come home? Almost immediately after I
>got my first cat shatner, he bolted out of the house and didn't come home for
>FIFTEEN DAYS! I nearly went insane. Plus, I'm not wild about the idea of
>the cats bringing home gross stuff like fleas.

Personally, I'm fine with cats going outside if you treat it the same
as you would dogs. You wouldn't think of just opening up your door
and letting a dog out, hoping that he came home that night, would you?
However, taking them for walks on leash and harness, or allowing them
out into a secure area that they can't get out of, works for me. Of
course, it's a lot more work, since you will need to either create the
secure area or convince the cat that it wants to wear a harness, but
it can be a good compromise to the indoor/outdoor debate, in my
opinion.

Rebecca

Deeanna
September 29th 06, 04:50 PM
Hi!
Is there any way that you can make it safe for your kitty's to go
outdoors, such as a fenced in yard? I turned two cats, strays as a
matter of fact, from outdoor to indoor with very few problems,
fortunately. One, Rocky, did not like it much at first, but he soon
came around and realized that the indoor life, with monitored outdoor
time, was a good life. As long as I had a fence, I would let him out
unattended. I think he just enjoyed the fresh air because he never
really went any where.. Once he went into a neighbor's yard, but that
was as far as he ever traveled. The other, Rambo, was quite content
living indoors in a life of luxury.

How long have you had the kitties? Have they been spayed/neutered?
Intact cats want to go out so they can roam and find a mate. One of my
girls did that to me back in May. I let them all out, as usual, but on
this particular day she decided to take off and explore; two days
before she was scheduled to be spayed. She came home two days later,
though. It really scared me because I had not had her for very long
and I was very concerned that she would not make her way back. But,
thank the good Lord, she did. We were very close to moving at that
point, so I decided to put all seven of them on restriction. I could
not take another disappearance. Believe me, after her little
adventure, she didn't want to go out either.

It takes some time, but it can be done. I have one now who has been an
indoor kitty since we got him as a kitten and for some reason decided
he wanted to go out a lot when we lived in AL. I let him out in a
fenced in yard, but he soon learned how to go under the fence and off
he went. He ALWAYS came back, though, bless his little heart.
Sometimes he would be rather muddy; let me tell you, red mud shows up
quite well on a white cat! :)

Keeping your cats indoors has other benefits as well. Not only do you
increase their life span, but you become known as a considerate
neighbor. I do not have children, but if I did I would be pretty
ticked off if my two year old walked up to me with a piece of cat poo
in his/her hand. Two of my neighbors in AL were afraid of cats;
imagine what impression they would have of me if I were to let my cats
roam in their yards knowing they were afraid of them. I do not like
for cats to come in my yard either, especially when they start fights
with my cats.

We moved to FL and have a large backyard but no fence. We do have a
screened in pool and that is where my kitties go if they want to go
outside. Even if we do put up a fence, I will be hesitant to let them
out because the pond behind our house has gators in it. There is no
way on God's green earth that my cats are going to be an appetizer for
those gators. :^)
Deeanna




kitkat via CatKB.com wrote:
> I have two adopted cats and both were outdoor cats in the past with previous
> owners. Both of my cats look longingly out the windows and try to escape
> anytime the door opens even for a second. One of my cats seems "depressed".
> He sleeps all day and never moves from under a chair. However, the couple
> times he's gotten out he prances around and appears very active - something
> I've NEVER seen in our home.
>
> I've been told by countless people , including vets, that keeping a cat
> indoors greatly increases their longevity and keeps them much safer. But
> should I also take into consideration their happiness? And if I were to let
> them out, how would I train them to come home? Almost immediately after I
> got my first cat shatner, he bolted out of the house and didn't come home for
> FIFTEEN DAYS! I nearly went insane. Plus, I'm not wild about the idea of
> the cats bringing home gross stuff like fleas.
>
> --
> Message posted via CatKB.com
> http://www.catkb.com/Uwe/Forums.aspx/cat-health/200609/1

m4816k
September 29th 06, 06:16 PM
"kitkat via CatKB.com" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]
>I have two adopted cats and both were outdoor cats in the past with
>previous
> owners. Both of my cats look longingly out the windows and try to escape
> anytime the door opens even for a second. One of my cats seems
> "depressed".
> He sleeps all day and never moves from under a chair. However, the couple
> times he's gotten out he prances around and appears very active -
> something
> I've NEVER seen in our home.
>
> I've been told by countless people , including vets, that keeping a cat
> indoors greatly increases their longevity and keeps them much safer. But
> should I also take into consideration their happiness? And if I were to
> let
> them out, how would I train them to come home? Almost immediately after I
> got my first cat shatner, he bolted out of the house and didn't come home
> for
> FIFTEEN DAYS! I nearly went insane. Plus, I'm not wild about the idea of
> the cats bringing home gross stuff like fleas.

Unlike some, I'll try to make it short:) Depends on a cat. My is indoors
during the night, and is free outside (mostly in our backyard) during the
day. If a cat is satisfied indoors and doesen't show the desire to go out,
than it's not cruel at all, although I still recommend letting it out now
and then to enjoy more space and keep in shape. If he/she however
desperately wants to go out, than it's a torture to be kept in. But that's
just my opinion. Good luck!

The Polish-Kraut
September 29th 06, 08:55 PM
>I have two adopted cats and both were outdoor cats in the past with previous
>owners. Both of my cats look longingly out the windows and try to escape
>anytime the door opens even for a second. One of my cats seems "depressed".
>He sleeps all day and never moves from under a chair. However, the couple
>times he's gotten out he prances around and appears very active - something
>I've NEVER seen in our home.
>
>I've been told by countless people , including vets, that keeping a cat
>indoors greatly increases their longevity and keeps them much safer. But
>should I also take into consideration their happiness? And if I were to let
>them out, how would I train them to come home? Almost immediately after I
>got my first cat shatner, he bolted out of the house and didn't come home for
>FIFTEEN DAYS! I nearly went insane. Plus, I'm not wild about the idea of
>the cats bringing home gross stuff like fleas.


If you want to let them out but are worried about them you could tie
them out or walk them on a lease (SP) OR build / buy an enclosure for
them also.

Mine have always been indoor only cats and love looking out the window
but have never tryed to get out. I took 2 of them in when about 7
weeks old and the 3rd I got from Humane Society. She was born there
was never out.

The 4th one that was an outdoors cat we took in when she was about 4
and pregnant. After she had her babies and was fixed she lost all
interest in going out after a while. We would open the door for her
and eventually she would look out and then go jump in her chair and go
to sleep. After a while she stopped even going to the door.


My furbabies

http://members.aol.com/larrystark/

cybercat
September 29th 06, 10:04 PM
"The Polish-Kraut" > wrote in message
...

>
> If you want to let them out but are worried about them you could tie
> them out

But of course don't tie them out unattended.

This is called the Live Doggy Buffet.

Ryan Robbins
September 30th 06, 01:06 AM
"kitkat via CatKB.com" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]
>I have two adopted cats and both were outdoor cats in the past with
>previous
> owners. Both of my cats look longingly out the windows and try to escape
> anytime the door opens even for a second. One of my cats seems
> "depressed".
> He sleeps all day and never moves from under a chair. However, the couple
> times he's gotten out he prances around and appears very active -
> something
> I've NEVER seen in our home.
>
> I've been told by countless people , including vets, that keeping a cat
> indoors greatly increases their longevity and keeps them much safer. But
> should I also take into consideration their happiness?

Cats are much happier when they are alive and healthy than dead.

It is not cruel at all to change an outdoor cat to an indoor cat. It's the
best thing you can do for a cat. Keep in mind that you can always take the
cat outdoors on a leash and harness, and that indoor cats need stimulation.

Ryan Robbins
September 30th 06, 01:08 AM
"m4816k" > wrote in message
...
> If he/she however desperately wants to go out, than it's a torture to be
> kept in.

Pure nonsense.

Lynne
September 30th 06, 02:40 AM
Ryan Robbins wrote:
>
> Cats are much happier when they are alive and healthy than dead.
>
AMEN.

> It is not cruel at all to change an outdoor cat to an indoor cat. It's the
> best thing you can do for a cat. Keep in mind that you can always take the
> cat outdoors on a leash and harness, and that indoor cats need stimulation.

I agree on all counts.

As an aside, my 3 year old cat Rudy slipped out unnoticed one day a few
months ago. Apparently he had a high time, even though I grabbed him
in the yard within an hour. After his escape, he constantly whined at
the door to go out. So we got him a harness and leash and took him on
walks around the yard. He LOVED it. He didn't even seem to care that
I was following him closely even when he ran and jumped. I'm not sure
he realized he was on a leash at all.

Truth be told, though, it's a pain in the ass to follow a cat around a
yard for any length of time, so the novelty soon wore off (for me). I
stopped our little adventures--even my daughter got tired of it--and he
kept up the whining. But only for a few weeks. He can work door knobs
but hasn't figured out deadbolts (yet), so he still tries to open the
back door, but he doesn't complain anymore. Of course he's spoiled and
played with very frequently so I don't feel the least bit guilty. If I
believed he would be safe outside, roaming freely, I would let him out.
I'm sure he would love it. We have a fence, but it would not contain
him and I don't want him to be road pizza... or worse.

Ryan Robbins
September 30th 06, 11:27 AM
"Lynne" > wrote in message
ups.com...
>
> Ryan Robbins wrote:
>>
>> Cats are much happier when they are alive and healthy than dead.
>>
> AMEN.
>
>> It is not cruel at all to change an outdoor cat to an indoor cat. It's
>> the
>> best thing you can do for a cat. Keep in mind that you can always take
>> the
>> cat outdoors on a leash and harness, and that indoor cats need
>> stimulation.
>
> I agree on all counts.
>
> As an aside, my 3 year old cat Rudy slipped out unnoticed one day a few
> months ago. Apparently he had a high time, even though I grabbed him
> in the yard within an hour. After his escape, he constantly whined at
> the door to go out.

My Sara, who died in April from renal failure at the age of 14, came to my
family as a stray back in 1994. She just showed up one day on the porch and
wouldn't leave. After a few weeks we took her in. Two years later, I took
her with me when I moved out, because the other female cat in the house
tormented her the entire two years.

It wasn't until 2000 that I got a harness and leash and took Sara out in the
backyard for walks. She never objected to the harness when I put it on her
so she could get used to it. But that first outing for her in six years left
her shaking.

And then, a few hours after we came back in, she stood at the door and
meowed and meowed and scratched and scratched and meowed. She did it for
about a week straight. Eventually she realized that we would go out every
day the weather was good and I had time, which I made for her. At first, I
set the minimum time for an outing at 15 minutes, then 20 minutes, then 32
minutes (32 minutes was what I accidentally stopped my watch's timer on
while setting it for 30).

Oh, she tried her best to get out in those first few weeks. But after awhile
she calmed down.

She taught me the importance of taking a half-hour breather every day to
stroll around, without television, the computer, or the radio.

She was so well with the harness and leash and going out that I could just
say, "Sara, do you want to go out?" and she would wake up and run to the
door and sit. She slipped the harness a couple of times (I still don't know
how), but both times she didn't venture far -- probably because I always
rewarded an outing with Pounce. Eventually Sara knew when time was up and
she would start heading back to the front door, or she would hear my watch's
alarm and lead me back.


>He didn't even seem to care that
> I was following him closely even when he ran and jumped. I'm not sure
> he realized he was on a leash at all.

I think the mistake most people make when they think of taking a cat out on
a leash is thinking that you can take the cat around like you would a dog.
You and I know that's not true: The cat takes us around; we're just there to
establish the boundaries. There was never any "Sara, come over here"; she
would go where she wanted, when she wanted.

>He can work door knobs
> but hasn't figured out deadbolts (yet), so he still tries to open the
> back door, but he doesn't complain anymore.

Within days of taking Sara out on a leash for the first time she tried
opening the door, too. It was hilarious seeing her stand on her hind legs
and reach in desperation for the door knob. Even when she was sick last
winter she tried to open the door.


>We have a fence, but it would not contain
> him and I don't want him to be road pizza... or worse.

I live in a relatively quiet neighborhood, but I have had to remove the body
of a dead cat from the street, and I rushed a cat who had been run over by a
car to a vet hospital. The second cat had to be euthanized and its owner
never responded to the "Found" ad I put in the paper or to notes a passerby
put on doors.

Last week a man here in my city, in Maine, tried to rescue a kitten some
teenage thugs were using as a soccer ball. The kitten died on the way to the
vet. The police are investigating.

Outsider
September 30th 06, 03:36 PM
"Lynne" > wrote in
ups.com:


So we got him a harness and leash and
> took him on walks around the yard. He LOVED it. He didn't even seem
> to care that I was following him closely even when he ran and jumped.



If you think about it, why would he mind having his favorite human servant
there in case of a sudden need!

kitkat via CatKB.com
September 30th 06, 04:31 PM
I always find this forum so helpful. I've done the harness thing but one in
particular manages to wiggle out all the time (maybe I'm doing a bad job) -
it has that breakaway feature around the neck and that is a big problem.

BUT - to those that recommended an enclosure - my boyfriend and I have
considered this. we couldn't put a fence around the entire house however, as
we live on a lake - and I don't think my boyfriend is big on covering our
nice view. - this is a second reason I'm afraid to let them out - I don't
want them to slip and drown if the breakwall is slippery or something.
having a really tiny enclosure (we have a VERY small yard) seems more like a
playpen and not exactly the thrill of freedom that I'm thinking they crave.

I'll try the harness thing again - maybe it's too big.

Thanks so much for all of the advice. I've got a lot to think about.

p.s. the two boys are both neutered - but the one year old is a total nut and
really wants out.

--
Message posted via CatKB.com
http://www.catkb.com/Uwe/Forums.aspx/cat-health/200609/1

September 30th 06, 05:39 PM
On Sat, 30 Sep 2006 15:31:56 GMT, "kitkat via CatKB.com" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>BUT - to those that recommended an enclosure - my boyfriend and I have
>considered this. we couldn't put a fence around the entire house however, as
>we live on a lake - and I don't think my boyfriend is big on covering our
>nice view. - this is a second reason I'm afraid to let them out - I don't
>want them to slip and drown if the breakwall is slippery or something.
>having a really tiny enclosure (we have a VERY small yard) seems more like a
>playpen and not exactly the thrill of freedom that I'm thinking they crave.
>
Don't make the assumption that they are out for the "thrill of
freedom". I live in a townhome that has an fenced patio between the
house and the detached garage/carport. It's roughly 17x17 feet, with
planter beds along the two edges, and trees on both sides (thankfully
on the other side of the fences). The cats go out there, walk the
edges sniffing a bit, and then generally go find a nice sunny spot to
curl up in. They do like to watch the wildlife that comes to the
trees, and the squirrels that perch up on the roofs, and apparently I
have lizards living in the plants somewhere, because a few have come
in with the cats, although generally it's just the tails. They love
getting to go out there, and will run to the door if I ask if they
want to go out, but, surprisingly to me, they mostly nap when they are
out there. And when I took them for walks, it really was the same
issue... walk a little bit, then settle down for a while to wait for
something to come by, then walk a little bit more.

So, they don't necessarily need a huge spot to go out in. I'd look
for a spot with at least some sunlight, breezes, and interesting
things going on around it.

Rebecca

The Polish-Kraut
September 30th 06, 06:20 PM
On Sat, 30 Sep 2006 15:31:56 GMT, "kitkat via CatKB.com" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>BUT - to those that recommended an enclosure - my boyfriend and I have
>considered this. we couldn't put a fence around the entire house however, as
>we live on a lake - and I don't think my boyfriend is big on covering our
>nice view.

Who said anything about fencing the house ?!?!?!?

An enclosure for the cat does not mean that the house has to go in it.
Are you really that dense ?!?!? It is an enclosure for the cat!!!

Take a look at http://www.cats-on-line.com/ for a couple example.
Some larger examples are at http://www.just4cats.com/page7.html

They can be as big or small as a person wants to make them.

cybercat
September 30th 06, 06:36 PM
"kitkat via CatKB.com" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]
>I always find this forum so helpful. I've done the harness thing but one
>in
> particular manages to wiggle out all the time (maybe I'm doing a bad
> job) -
> it has that breakaway feature around the neck and that is a big problem.
>
> BUT - to those that recommended an enclosure - my boyfriend and I have
> considered this. we couldn't put a fence around the entire house however,
> as
> we live on a lake - and I don't think my boyfriend is big on covering our
> nice view. - this is a second reason I'm afraid to let them out - I don't
> want them to slip and drown if the breakwall is slippery or something.
> having a really tiny enclosure (we have a VERY small yard) seems more like
> a
> playpen and not exactly the thrill of freedom that I'm thinking they
> crave.
>
> I'll try the harness thing again - maybe it's too big.
>
> Thanks so much for all of the advice. I've got a lot to think about.
>
> p.s. the two boys are both neutered - but the one year old is a total nut
> and
> really wants out.

Two words: screened enclosure. Off to the side, not in the way of the
view.

If hubby is handy, (or you are!) take a look here:

http://www.brushyland.com/cats/enclose.htm

Below is a simple kit:

http://www.purrfectfence.com/

I really like the last one here, where they go out through
a window:

http://www.animalnetwork.com/cats/enclosure.asp





--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

Lynne
September 30th 06, 08:39 PM
cybercat wrote:
> "kitkat via CatKB.com" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]
> >I always find this forum so helpful. I've done the harness thing but one
> >in
> > particular manages to wiggle out all the time (maybe I'm doing a bad
> > job) -
> > it has that breakaway feature around the neck and that is a big problem.
> >
> > BUT - to those that recommended an enclosure - my boyfriend and I have
> > considered this. we couldn't put a fence around the entire house however,
> > as
> > we live on a lake - and I don't think my boyfriend is big on covering our
> > nice view. - this is a second reason I'm afraid to let them out - I don't
> > want them to slip and drown if the breakwall is slippery or something.
> > having a really tiny enclosure (we have a VERY small yard) seems more like
> > a
> > playpen and not exactly the thrill of freedom that I'm thinking they
> > crave.
> >
> > I'll try the harness thing again - maybe it's too big.
> >
> > Thanks so much for all of the advice. I've got a lot to think about.
> >
> > p.s. the two boys are both neutered - but the one year old is a total nut
> > and
> > really wants out.
>
> Two words: screened enclosure. Off to the side, not in the way of the
> view.
>
> If hubby is handy, (or you are!) take a look here:
>
> http://www.brushyland.com/cats/enclose.htm
>
> Below is a simple kit:
>
> http://www.purrfectfence.com/
>
> I really like the last one here, where they go out through
> a window:
>
> http://www.animalnetwork.com/cats/enclosure.asp
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

Here's another option--looks pretty cool and will not obstruct the
view:
http://www.purrfectfence.com/

kitkat via CatKB.com
September 30th 06, 09:00 PM
foremost Kraut WORST- I'm not dense. The reason to ask questions is to get
answers. Sadly you appear to enjoy criticism more than support.

as for a screened in enclosure - we have one in the backyard - one of the
cats tore it and slipped out - but something more study may work and I'll
look into the kind links several of you provided.

--
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