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chatnoir
January 25th 07, 03:54 AM
Found my cat on collasped on the floor Sunday night! Rushed it to the
Cat Emergency Clinic! They could find nothing and I was sent home with
it! It did not improve Monday, so, I took it to my regular Vets on
Tuesday Morning! Finally today they discovered my cat had
cardiomyopathy! They closed at 8 today, so I had to take it to the
Emergency clinic again for tonight since my cat was in severe
respiratory distress!! Had a long session with my cat before I took
him to the emergency clinic for tonight! He was just as out of it as
he was on Sunday! Sunday, I looked at him and said, "this cat is
dying"! Looked the same tonight! Not sure he will make it through the
night. Has anyone had a cat with the same condition? Seems it won't
live long; but I wonder what its life will be like on the heart
medicine and the reduced capacity of the heary? Seems, the cat will go
with heart failure or from blood clots. But I was wondering about if
the cat will just be suffering till it dies!

bluemaxx
January 25th 07, 08:02 AM
What type of cardiomyopathy does your cat have? Hypertrophic or Dilated?
How advanced is it? Did your veterinary specialist state exactly what your
cats prognosis is, i.e. how long he thinks your cat will live? Have you had
ultra-sounds done to find out the exact damage to your cats heart? And is
your cat already on medication? If he isn't on any meds yet, get your cat
on them as soon as possible because they will make a marked difference in
how your cat breathes.

I lost my cat of 12 years to Dilated Cardiomyopathy a few years ago. But I
did everything possible to make his remaining months of life comfortable and
stressfree, which did include numerous medications and force feeding on
occasion.

But only you can decide what to do and how far to go with your cat. Read
everything you can on the web about your cats type of cardiomyopathy so you
know exactly what's going on in your cat's body. And it would be very nice
to know the name of your cat. My very best wishes.

Linda
Tucker-cat photos: http://www.picturetrail.com/bluemaxx
Cat Surgery Fund eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZtwolegs

"chatnoir" > wrote in message
oups.com...
: Found my cat on collasped on the floor Sunday night! Rushed it to the
: Cat Emergency Clinic! They could find nothing and I was sent home with
: it! It did not improve Monday, so, I took it to my regular Vets on
: Tuesday Morning! Finally today they discovered my cat had
: cardiomyopathy! They closed at 8 today, so I had to take it to the
: Emergency clinic again for tonight since my cat was in severe
: respiratory distress!! Had a long session with my cat before I took
: him to the emergency clinic for tonight! He was just as out of it as
: he was on Sunday! Sunday, I looked at him and said, "this cat is
: dying"! Looked the same tonight! Not sure he will make it through the
: night. Has anyone had a cat with the same condition? Seems it won't
: live long; but I wonder what its life will be like on the heart
: medicine and the reduced capacity of the heary? Seems, the cat will go
: with heart failure or from blood clots. But I was wondering about if
: the cat will just be suffering till it dies!
:

Phil P.
January 25th 07, 02:41 PM
"chatnoir" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> Found my cat on collasped on the floor Sunday night! Rushed it to the
> Cat Emergency Clinic! They could find nothing and I was sent home with
> it! It did not improve Monday, so, I took it to my regular Vets on
> Tuesday Morning! Finally today they discovered my cat had
> cardiomyopathy! They closed at 8 today, so I had to take it to the
> Emergency clinic again for tonight since my cat was in severe
> respiratory distress!!

Speak to your vet about a diuretic (furosemide a/k/a Lasix)- this should
help your cat breathe easier. Your cat's respiratory distress is probably
caused by fluid in the lungs. In cardiomyopathy, especially hypertrophic
cardiomyopathy, the left ventricle becomes thick (hypertrophy) and stiff
which increases the pressure in the LV when it relaxes (diastole). The
increased pressure results in pulmonary hypertension which causes vascular
fluid to seep through the walls of the veins (pulmonary edema). A diuretic
will get rid of the fluid and allow your cat's lungs to expand and breathe
easier. Once the pulmonary edema resolves and he's breathing normally again,
the dose should be tapered to the lowest possible dose that controls the
edema-- Cats are very sensitive to diuretics and can become dehydrated very
quickly. Be sure your vet also gives your cat a potassium supplement with
the diuretic. The diuretic will make your cat produce urine more rapidly
which can deplete his body stores of potassium.


Had a long session with my cat before I took
> him to the emergency clinic for tonight! He was just as out of it as
> he was on Sunday! Sunday, I looked at him and said, "this cat is
> dying"! Looked the same tonight! Not sure he will make it through the
> night. Has anyone had a cat with the same condition? Seems it won't
> live long; but I wonder what its life will be like on the heart
> medicine and the reduced capacity of the heary?

With the right combination of medications, you cat could live a near normal
life.

Speak to your vet about diltiazem. Its a calcium channel blocker that will
help your cat's heart muscles relax and increase ventricular filling. This
should reduce the pressure and stop the fluid buildup in his lungs.
Diltiazem might also reduce the thickness of the left ventricle which might
also reduce the size of the left atrium. As far as I'm concerned, diltiazem
is a wonder drug for cats with HCM.


Seems, the cat will go
> with heart failure or from blood clots.


Diltiazem also inhibits platelet aggregation- so the blood doesn't clump
together and form clots. Most clots form in the left atrium because it
enlarges from the pressure in the ventricle and slows the flow of blood--
like the flow of water in a stream slows down where the stream widens. In
addition to inhibiting platelet aggregation, diltiazem also reduces the size
of the atrium so the flow of blood speeds up. This also reduces the chances
of clots forming.




But I was wondering about if
> the cat will just be suffering till it dies!


As I said, with the right combination of medications, you cat could live a
near normal life. But you need to see a cardiologist *ASAP*. Vets in general
practice are not nearly as well trained as veterinary cardiologists.

Here's a list of veterinary cardiologists-
http://www.acvim.org/uploadedFiles/pdfs/Directory/Cardio_Geo.pdf look for
one closest to you.

Keep the faith,

Phil

chatnoir
January 25th 07, 07:03 PM
On Jan 25, 1:02 am, "bluemaxx" > wrote:
> What type of cardiomyopathy does your cat have?
>Hypertrophic or Dilated?

They have not said yet!



> How advanced is it?

They said they usually find it only when it was advanced. And they
said yes it is advanced!


> Did your veterinary specialist state exactly what your
> cats prognosis is, i.e. how long he thinks your cat will live?

Hard to say! They said the cat is still fairly unresponsive and cool
in the extremities! The cat should be trying to tear the teach and
Vets apart but it is purring!

Have you had
> ultra-sounds done to find out the exact damage to your cats heart?

Yes, they did all that

And is
> your cat already on medication?

3 heart medications!

If he isn't on any meds yet, get your cat
> on them as soon as possible because they will make a marked difference in
> how your cat breathes.
>
> I lost my cat of 12 years to Dilated Cardiomyopathy a few years ago. But I
> did everything possible to make his remaining months of life comfortable and
> stressfree, which did include numerous medications and force feeding on
> occasion.
>
> But only you can decide what to do and how far to go with your cat. Read
> everything you can on the web about your cats type of cardiomyopathy so you
> know exactly what's going on in your cat's body


Well I pick him up this afternoon to take home!

.. And it would be very nice
> to know the name of your cat.

Zapata! I had just taken a course in Mexican history when I got two
kittens - Zapata and Pancho Villa!

Pics:

http://www.wolfbat359.com/Catty025.jpg

http://www.wolfbat359.com/catcage147.jpg

http://www.wolfbat359.com/catcage142.jpg


My very best wishes.
>
> Linda
> Tucker-cat photos:http://www.picturetrail.com/bluemaxx
> Cat Surgery Fund eBay auctions: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZtwolegs
>
> "chatnoir" > wrote in ooglegroups.com...
> : Found my cat on collasped on the floor Sunday night! Rushed it to the
> : Cat Emergency Clinic! They could find nothing and I was sent home with
> : it! It did not improve Monday, so, I took it to my regular Vets on
> : Tuesday Morning! Finally today they discovered my cat had
> : cardiomyopathy! They closed at 8 today, so I had to take it to the
> : Emergency clinic again for tonight since my cat was in severe
> : respiratory distress!! Had a long session with my cat before I took
> : him to the emergency clinic for tonight! He was just as out of it as
> : he was on Sunday! Sunday, I looked at him and said, "this cat is
> : dying"! Looked the same tonight! Not sure he will make it through the
> : night. Has anyone had a cat with the same condition? Seems it won't
> : live long; but I wonder what its life will be like on the heart
> : medicine and the reduced capacity of the heary? Seems, the cat will go
> : with heart failure or from blood clots. But I was wondering about if
> : the cat will just be suffering till it dies!
> :

chatnoir
January 25th 07, 07:05 PM
On Jan 25, 7:41 am, "Phil P." > wrote:
> "chatnoir" > wrote in ooglegroups.com...
>
> > Found my cat on collasped on the floor Sunday night! Rushed it to the
> > Cat Emergency Clinic! They could find nothing and I was sent home with
> > it! It did not improve Monday, so, I took it to my regular Vets on
> > Tuesday Morning! Finally today they discovered my cat had
> > cardiomyopathy! They closed at 8 today, so I had to take it to the
> > Emergency clinic again for tonight since my cat was in severe
> > respiratory distress!!Speak to your vet about a diuretic (furosemide a/k/a Lasix)- this should
> help your cat breathe easier. Your cat's respiratory distress is probably
> caused by fluid in the lungs. In cardiomyopathy, especially hypertrophic
> cardiomyopathy, the left ventricle becomes thick (hypertrophy) and stiff
> which increases the pressure in the LV when it relaxes (diastole). The
> increased pressure results in pulmonary hypertension which causes vascular
> fluid to seep through the walls of the veins (pulmonary edema). A diuretic
> will get rid of the fluid and allow your cat's lungs to expand and breathe
> easier. Once the pulmonary edema resolves and he's breathing normally again,
> the dose should be tapered to the lowest possible dose that controls the
> edema-- Cats are very sensitive to diuretics and can become dehydrated very
> quickly. Be sure your vet also gives your cat a potassium supplement with
> the diuretic. The diuretic will make your cat produce urine more rapidly
> which can deplete his body stores of potassium.
>
> Had a long session with my cat before I took
>
> > him to the emergency clinic for tonight! He was just as out of it as
> > he was on Sunday! Sunday, I looked at him and said, "this cat is
> > dying"! Looked the same tonight! Not sure he will make it through the
> > night. Has anyone had a cat with the same condition? Seems it won't
> > live long; but I wonder what its life will be like on the heart
> > medicine and the reduced capacity of the heary?With the right combination of medications, you cat could live a near normal
> life.
>
> Speak to your vet about diltiazem. Its a calcium channel blocker that will
> help your cat's heart muscles relax and increase ventricular filling. This
> should reduce the pressure and stop the fluid buildup in his lungs.
> Diltiazem might also reduce the thickness of the left ventricle which might
> also reduce the size of the left atrium. As far as I'm concerned, diltiazem
> is a wonder drug for cats with HCM.
>
> Seems, the cat will go
>
> > with heart failure or from blood clots.Diltiazem also inhibits platelet aggregation- so the blood doesn't clump
> together and form clots. Most clots form in the left atrium because it
> enlarges from the pressure in the ventricle and slows the flow of blood--
> like the flow of water in a stream slows down where the stream widens. In
> addition to inhibiting platelet aggregation, diltiazem also reduces the size
> of the atrium so the flow of blood speeds up. This also reduces the chances
> of clots forming.
>
> But I was wondering about if
>
> > the cat will just be suffering till it dies!As I said, with the right combination of medications, you cat could live a
> near normal life. But you need to see a cardiologist *ASAP*. Vets in general
> practice are not nearly as well trained as veterinary cardiologists.
>
> Here's a list of veterinary cardiologists-http://www.acvim.org/uploadedFiles/pdfs/Directory/Cardio_Geo.pdf look for
> one closest to you.
>
> Keep the faith,
>
> Phil


Am looking into it now! Thanks for the info!

chatnoir
January 26th 07, 12:37 PM
On Jan 25, 2:10 pm, Nomen Nescio > wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>
> From: "chatnoir" >
>
> On Jan 25, 1:02 am, "bluemaxx" > wrote:
>
> > What type of cardiomyopathy does your cat have?
> >Hypertrophic or Dilated?They have not said yet!
>
> Sounds like you better ask them. And maybe go to a new
> vet or, preferably, a cardiologist.

Has hypertrophic cardiomyopathy!


>
> > Have you had
> >> ultra-sounds done to find out the exact damage to your cats heart?
>
> >Yes, they did all thatThen they should know what the problem is.
>
> > And is
> >> your cat already on medication?
>
> >3 heart medications!Could you be more specific.
> I would think that one should be diltiazem.
> Also, Lasix would help with the fluid buildup and the fluid
> might possibly need to be physically drained.
> It also sounds like an anticoagulant is needed......aspirin or
> (more expensive) heparin (at Tufts, they're using a "low molecular
> weight" heparin for cats)

Giving Zapata Diltiazem, Enalapril, Furosemide and Clavamx! They will
give a potassium supplement starting monday!


>
> >Well I pick him up this afternoon to take home!Don't be shy about pressing them for answers.
> And make sure they are VERY clear as to what care is required
> at home.
> I'm currently caring for a cat with Hypertrophic Cardiomyopathy.
> We caught it very early and he's doing great and has even reversed
> the HCM somewhat.
> You'll really have to stay on top of this situation if you want to help your cat.


The only problem I see, which the Vets mentioned is that it is hard to
get medicines down Zapata! Gave him 1 ml of Diltiazem and he foamed up
a lot more that that after I gave it to him! So, getting medicines
down Zapata without him frothing it up will be a problem!


>
> >> to know the name of your cat.
>
> >Zapata! I had just taken a course in Mexican history when I got two
> >kittens - Zapata and Pancho Villa!I was studying Quantum Physics when we adopted a furry black cat
> with 2 white patches on her belly that moved further apart as she grew.
> I named her "Fission".
>
> Best of luck and (sorry, I can't resist)
> VIVA ZAPATA !
>
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Phil P.
January 26th 07, 01:05 PM
"chatnoir" > wrote in message
ups.com...

> The only problem I see, which the Vets mentioned is that it is hard to
> get medicines down Zapata! Gave him 1 ml of Diltiazem and he foamed up
> a lot more that that after I gave it to him! So, getting medicines
> down Zapata without him frothing it up will be a problem!

Put the diltiazem inside a #3 gelcap so he doesn't taste it. Diltiazem
tastes terrible to cats.

Phil

January 26th 07, 05:39 PM
"chatnoir" > wrote:

>The only problem I see, which the Vets mentioned is that it is hard to
>get medicines down Zapata! Gave him 1 ml of Diltiazem and he foamed up
>a lot more that that after I gave it to him! So, getting medicines
>down Zapata without him frothing it up will be a problem!

See if you can get then in compounded flavored chewables. A lot of pet
medicines can be ordered this way. Generally the chicken flavored
chews are more palatable than the beef.

-mhd

chatnoir
January 26th 07, 09:02 PM
On Jan 26, 11:30 am, Nomen Nescio > wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>
> From: "chatnoir" >
>
> >The only problem I see, which the Vets mentioned is that it is hard to
> >get medicines down Zapata! Gave him 1 ml of Diltiazem and he foamed up
> >a lot more that that after I gave it to him! So, getting medicines
> >down Zapata without him frothing it up will be a problem!That sounds like Diltiazem in liquid form.
> Not sure why they'd use a liquid form of Diltiazem.
> My cat "TK" gets his Diltiazem in pill form.
> 1/2 pill of Diltiazem ER (extended release/30mg) once a day.
> We adopted him as an adult feral and he'll always have a wild
> side. So pilling him was a major event at first. It took both my
> wife and me to get the pill in him when we started (He gets his pill
> at 5:30 PM since it was the most likely time for my wife and I to be
> home at the same time). Now, almost 2 years later, I tap the stool
> in the kitchen and "TK" will jump up on the stool and wait to get his
> pill. It took a LOT of gentle handling, anger control after he spit the
> pill out for the fifth time, and praise when he finally did swallow the pill,
> to get him to that point, though.

Well, I talked the Vet into giving me the Intradermal Variety of the
Medicine! Given Zapatas history in taking oral medicines, I thought
this route would be best! The other cats totally avoid the New Zapata
so they are unlikely to lick the inside of his ear! In any case, I
will isolate Zapata in a room by himself! And if the gloves are as
impermeable as the Vet says, I should have no problem! This is a major
medicine and I want him to get its full effect!

I got the Vets to eliminate the antibioltic! I said that his major
problem is stabaliztion on these heart drugs. They agreeded!


> I'm not sure why the vet would choose a liquid form of the diltiazem and my
> only experience with an HCM cat is with "TK", but you may want to ask the
> vet about the Diltiazem ER pill. For "TK", it's one pill....once a day.
> "TK" is also getting an aspirin twice a week to help prevent blood clots.
> Although he has improved so much that at the last visit with the cardiologist,
> we were told that the aspirin wasn't really necessary,anymore, but he
> wouldn't want to discontinue it since "TK" has done so well on the current
> regimen.
>
> Again, best of luck.
>


Thanks! How long has your cat been effected with this condition?

chatnoir
January 26th 07, 09:04 PM
On Jan 26, 10:39 am, wrote:
> "chatnoir" > wrote:
> >The only problem I see, which the Vets mentioned is that it is hard to
> >get medicines down Zapata! Gave him 1 ml of Diltiazem and he foamed up
> >a lot more that that after I gave it to him! So, getting medicines
> >down Zapata without him frothing it up will be a problem!See if you can get then in compounded flavored chewables. A lot of pet
> medicines can be ordered this way. Generally the chicken flavored
> chews are more palatable than the beef.
>
> -mhd

Had tuna - his fav. But he totally spit it up!

chatnoir
January 26th 07, 10:35 PM
On Jan 26, 11:30 am, Nomen Nescio > wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>
> From: "chatnoir" >
>
> >The only problem I see, which the Vets mentioned is that it is hard to
> >get medicines down Zapata! Gave him 1 ml of Diltiazem and he foamed up
> >a lot more that that after I gave it to him! So, getting medicines
> >down Zapata without him frothing it up will be a problem!That sounds like Diltiazem in liquid form.
> Not sure why they'd use a liquid form of Diltiazem.
> My cat "TK" gets his Diltiazem in pill form.
> 1/2 pill of Diltiazem ER (extended release/30mg) once a day.
> We adopted him as an adult feral and he'll always have a wild
> side. So pilling him was a major event at first. It took both my
> wife and me to get the pill in him when we started (He gets his pill
> at 5:30 PM since it was the most likely time for my wife and I to be
> home at the same time). Now, almost 2 years later, I tap the stool
> in the kitchen and "TK" will jump up on the stool and wait to get his
> pill. It took a LOT of gentle handling, anger control after he spit the
> pill out for the fifth time, and praise when he finally did swallow the pill,
> to get him to that point, though.
> I'm not sure why the vet would choose a liquid form

Zapata was totally intimidated by the Vets into a kind of submissive
behavior! They could give him anything once! I never intimidated
Zapata!


of the diltiazem and my
> only experience with an HCM cat is with "TK", but you may want to ask the
> vet about the Diltiazem ER pill. For "TK", it's one pill....once a day.
> "TK" is also getting an aspirin twice a week to help prevent blood clots.
> Although he has improved so much that at the last visit with the cardiologist,
> we were told that the aspirin wasn't really necessary,anymore, but he
> wouldn't want to discontinue it since "TK" has done so well on the current
> regimen.
>
> Again, best of luck.
>
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: N/A

Lynne
January 27th 07, 04:29 AM
on Fri, 26 Jan 2007 21:04:43 GMT, "chatnoir" >
wrote:

> Had tuna - his fav. But he totally spit it up!

Is it liquid? If so, that's the problem. My cat takes pills with no
problem, but will froth if I give him liquid. Phil suggested putting it in
gelcaps. Phil, where can a person purchase those? Pharmacy?

--
Lynne

Lynne
January 27th 07, 04:31 AM
on Fri, 26 Jan 2007 21:02:55 GMT, "chatnoir" >
wrote:

> Well, I talked the Vet into giving me the Intradermal Variety of the
> Medicine! Given Zapatas history in taking oral medicines, I thought
> this route would be best!

I should have read ahead. That sounds like a good decision.

--
Lynne

Phil P.
January 27th 07, 05:24 AM
"Lynne" > wrote in message
...
> on Fri, 26 Jan 2007 21:04:43 GMT, "chatnoir" >
> wrote:
>
> > Had tuna - his fav. But he totally spit it up!
>
> Is it liquid? If so, that's the problem. My cat takes pills with no
> problem, but will froth if I give him liquid. Phil suggested putting it
in
> gelcaps. Phil, where can a person purchase those? Pharmacy?

Online is cheaper. www.capsuline.com #3 and #4 are the best for cats.

Phil

Lynne
January 27th 07, 02:24 PM
on Sat, 27 Jan 2007 05:24:14 GMT, "Phil P." > wrote:

> Online is cheaper. www.capsuline.com #3 and #4 are the best for cats.

Thanks, Phil!

--
Lynne