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Martin O'Brien
April 22nd 07, 05:12 PM
Hi all,

First of all, we screwed up!

We have a 9 month old male cat, which we've had for 5 months.
Yesterday, we brought home a 9 week old female cat.

When we got home, we thought we'd let the new kitten out for a few
minutes before putting her in our small office, where we would be
isloating her during the introduction process. Surprisingly, the
kitten started running around and making herself at home!

Before we had a chance to put her away in the office, the male cat
noticed her and freaked out. He wasn't very happy at all!

Now that we've had the kitten hidden away for almost a day, our cat is
still pretty freaked out!

We do plan on going through the suggested method of slowly introducing
scents, sounds, etc, until we get to the point of trying to get them
together in the same space. What we're afraid of is that we seriously
screwed up our chances of getting our current cat to accept the
kitten, since we messed up the introduction process so badly.

Is there a way to fix it? Can we still get our current cat to accept
the kitten? Will going through the suggested steps of introduction
still work, now that we botched the beginning and they've already
encountered each other face to face?

Thanks!
Martin O'B

MaryL
April 22nd 07, 06:58 PM
"Martin O'Brien" > wrote in message
...
> Hi all,
>
> First of all, we screwed up!
>
> We have a 9 month old male cat, which we've had for 5 months.
> Yesterday, we brought home a 9 week old female cat.
>
> When we got home, we thought we'd let the new kitten out for a few
> minutes before putting her in our small office, where we would be
> isloating her during the introduction process. Surprisingly, the
> kitten started running around and making herself at home!
>
> Before we had a chance to put her away in the office, the male cat
> noticed her and freaked out. He wasn't very happy at all!
>
> Now that we've had the kitten hidden away for almost a day, our cat is
> still pretty freaked out!
>
> We do plan on going through the suggested method of slowly introducing
> scents, sounds, etc, until we get to the point of trying to get them
> together in the same space. What we're afraid of is that we seriously
> screwed up our chances of getting our current cat to accept the
> kitten, since we messed up the introduction process so badly.
>
> Is there a way to fix it? Can we still get our current cat to accept
> the kitten? Will going through the suggested steps of introduction
> still work, now that we botched the beginning and they've already
> encountered each other face to face?
>
> Thanks!
> Martin O'B

Yes, it will still work, although it may take a little extra time. I would
suggest that you get a few Feliway dispensers (the plug-in type) and put
them in rooms that are most-frequently used by your new kitten and your
resident cat. I'll include links under my sig to a "pictorial history" of
when I brought a new cat (Duffy) into my home. Look for pictures of the
temporary door that we made. That was put up only after Duffy had been in
the house for some time, but it enabled the two to be in close proximity
without actually being together. It was one of the most helpful steps in
the process and was very inexpensive. We found an unfinished door that was
very cheap because it had been damaged, but an inexpensive screen door would
also work. A friend cut out a square at the bottom and covered the hole
with the type of metal mesh that is often used as a "kick plate" on doors.
Cut off the bottom of the door so there is enough space to slide a platter
with cat food under it -- and that way both cats will be eating "together"
with no danger of a fight breaking out. Again, this came about several
weeks into the process because it's important to take things slow and easy
(especially since you have already seen this problem). After the two are
acclimated and you no longer need the door, just remove it and replace with
your original door. Use the same hardware so you don't need to buy extra or
drill more holes in your framework. Be sure to spend lots of time with your
new kitten, but also lavish lots of praise on your original cat every time
you leave the kitten's room -- you don't want him to feel displaced or
threatened by the new kitten.

MaryL
Photos of Duffy and Holly: >'o'<
http://tinyurl.com/8y54 (Introducing Duffy to Holly)
http://tinyurl.com/8y56 (Duffy and Holly "settle in")

Lynne
April 22nd 07, 09:21 PM
on Sun, 22 Apr 2007 16:12:26 GMT, Martin O'Brien
> wrote:

> Before we had a chance to put her away in the office, the male cat
> noticed her and freaked out. He wasn't very happy at all!
>
> Now that we've had the kitten hidden away for almost a day, our cat is
> still pretty freaked out!

What do you mean when you say he freaked out? What did he do and what is
he still doing?

The reason I ask is because he is still a kitten and, quite frankly,
unless the new kitten might have contagious health problems, I wouldn't
keep them seperated. I have never had a problem instroducing new pets to
each other, with lots of supervision. I have brought kittens home to
cats who were around 2-3 years old and who were also only cats and it's
just never been an issue.

My latest kitten had to be isolated because his health status was very
poor, but once he was better, he met the resident cat and dog under my
supervision and there were absolutely no problems. I'm very suprised
that a 9 month old kitten would have any long term problems with another
kitten, unless the younger kitten smells like the vet, in which case that
smell should be gone in a few days. I would go ahead and let them get to
know each other right away. I wouldn't worry about the older kitten
unless they start fighting.

--
Lynne


"We are strong enough to stand tall tearlessly
We are brave enough to bend to cry
And sad enough to know
We must laugh again"

~ Nikki Giovanni, 4/17/2007, Virginia Tech

Lynne
April 22nd 07, 09:24 PM
By the way, is the 9 month old kitten neutered? If he's not, do it as soon
as they are comfortable with each other. If he is still in tact,
undesireable behaviors will start soon, if they haven't already.

--
Lynne


"We are strong enough to stand tall tearlessly
We are brave enough to bend to cry
And sad enough to know
We must laugh again"

~ Nikki Giovanni, 4/17/2007, Virginia Tech

keepyourdistance (headstart)
April 22nd 07, 10:50 PM
On Apr 22, 11:12 am, Martin O'Brien > wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> First of all, we screwed up!
>
> We have a 9 month old male cat, which we've had for 5 months.
> Yesterday, we brought home a 9 week old female cat.
>
> When we got home, we thought we'd let the new kitten out for a few
> minutes before putting her in our small office, where we would be
> isloating her during the introduction process. Surprisingly, the
> kitten started running around and making herself at home!
>
> Before we had a chance to put her away in the office, the male cat
> noticed her and freaked out. He wasn't very happy at all!
>
> Now that we've had the kitten hidden away for almost a day, our cat is
> still pretty freaked out!
>
> We do plan on going through the suggested method of slowly introducing
> scents, sounds, etc, until we get to the point of trying to get them
> together in the same space. What we're afraid of is that we seriously
> screwed up our chances of getting our current cat to accept the
> kitten, since we messed up the introduction process so badly.
>
> Is there a way to fix it? Can we still get our current cat to accept
> the kitten? Will going through the suggested steps of introduction
> still work, now that we botched the beginning and they've already
> encountered each other face to face?
>
> Thanks!
> Martin O'B

Um.. I don't really understand animals, but, I wouldn't worry too much
beeecause roles have been established! Big brother now has
responsibility of securing the instinct within itself. They will both
be happy :) Kitty is already learning to explore and run around in
free space :) Big brother will always look out for her too :)

It's ok! once we're well grounded all is good to go :)

Matthew
April 22nd 07, 11:14 PM
"keepyourdistance (headstart)" > wrote in
message oups.com...
> On Apr 22, 11:12 am, Martin O'Brien > wrote:
>> Hi all,
>>
>> First of all, we screwed up!
>>
>> We have a 9 month old male cat, which we've had for 5 months.
>> Yesterday, we brought home a 9 week old female cat.
>>
>> When we got home, we thought we'd let the new kitten out for a few
>> minutes before putting her in our small office, where we would be
>> isloating her during the introduction process. Surprisingly, the
>> kitten started running around and making herself at home!
>>
>> Before we had a chance to put her away in the office, the male cat
>> noticed her and freaked out. He wasn't very happy at all!
>>
>> Now that we've had the kitten hidden away for almost a day, our cat is
>> still pretty freaked out!
>>
>> We do plan on going through the suggested method of slowly introducing
>> scents, sounds, etc, until we get to the point of trying to get them
>> together in the same space. What we're afraid of is that we seriously
>> screwed up our chances of getting our current cat to accept the
>> kitten, since we messed up the introduction process so badly.
>>
>> Is there a way to fix it? Can we still get our current cat to accept
>> the kitten? Will going through the suggested steps of introduction
>> still work, now that we botched the beginning and they've already
>> encountered each other face to face?
>>
>> Thanks!
>> Martin O'B
>
> Um.. I don't really understand animals, but, I wouldn't worry too much
> beeecause roles have been established! Big brother now has
> responsibility of securing the instinct within itself. They will both
> be happy :) Kitty is already learning to explore and run around in
> free space :) Big brother will always look out for her too :)
>
> It's ok! once we're well grounded all is good to go :)
>

I hate to tell you "keepyourdistance (headstart)" you have to worry about
it. If introductions do not go well territorial aggression could occur and
roles then will occur in the bad way.


The door treatment is the best way let them get used to one another from
under a door. There will be a lot of hissing than the other hopefully will
get used to the other. It will take time don't rush it don't force them or
aggression can occur. It takes time after a little while than you can let
them out supervised and so on. Good luck

Lynne
April 22nd 07, 11:16 PM
on Sun, 22 Apr 2007 21:50:16 GMT, "keepyourdistance (headstart)"
> wrote:

> I don't really understand animals

Then you shouldn't be giving "advice" here.

--
Lynne


"We are strong enough to stand tall tearlessly
We are brave enough to bend to cry
And sad enough to know
We must laugh again"

~ Nikki Giovanni, 4/17/2007, Virginia Tech

Lynne
April 22nd 07, 11:42 PM
on Sun, 22 Apr 2007 22:14:08 GMT, "Matthew"
> wrote:

> I hate to tell you "keepyourdistance (headstart)" you have to worry
> about it. If introductions do not go well territorial aggression
> could occur and roles then will occur in the bad way.

Yes, Matthew is absolutely correct.

FYI, my advice was based on the fact that they are both kittens and the
intro *shouldn't* have to be complicated. Given that the older kitten is
sexually mature, though, it might need to be very gradual. Especially if
the older kitten isn't neutered.

It has been my experience that cats generally accept kittens quite
readily. Even if they don't like them, they usually tolerate them, so
I'm curious what "freaking out" means in this case. At any rate, the
older kitten's behavior will need to dictate how this goes.

--
Lynne


"We are strong enough to stand tall tearlessly
We are brave enough to bend to cry
And sad enough to know
We must laugh again"

~ Nikki Giovanni, 4/17/2007, Virginia Tech

Martin O'Brien
April 23rd 07, 03:04 PM
On Sun, 22 Apr 2007 17:42:43 -0500, Lynne
> wrote:

>on Sun, 22 Apr 2007 22:14:08 GMT, "Matthew"
> wrote:
>
>> I hate to tell you "keepyourdistance (headstart)" you have to worry
>> about it. If introductions do not go well territorial aggression
>> could occur and roles then will occur in the bad way.
>
>Yes, Matthew is absolutely correct.
>
>FYI, my advice was based on the fact that they are both kittens and the
>intro *shouldn't* have to be complicated. Given that the older kitten is
>sexually mature, though, it might need to be very gradual. Especially if
>the older kitten isn't neutered.
>
>It has been my experience that cats generally accept kittens quite
>readily. Even if they don't like them, they usually tolerate them, so
>I'm curious what "freaking out" means in this case. At any rate, the
>older kitten's behavior will need to dictate how this goes.


Thanks for all the advice.

The existing cat was neutered back in December. When I said he was
'freaked out', he was hissing, growling, and swatting at the new
kitten.

We kept the kitten separated since Saturday evening, and the older cat
seems to be doing a bit better. He's only grumpy when he's very close
to the area of the door holding back the kitten, and seems to revert
to normal once he walks away, whereas on Saturday, he was in a ****y,
scratchy mood all the time.

Plus, while the wife & I got ready for work this morning, the cat was
sitting quite close to the door while the kitten meowed and swiped her
paw under the door. The older cat seemed much more relaxed about
seeing/hearing the kitten, although he hissed up a storm when my wife
opened the door to enter that other room, and the 2 cats got sight of
each other.

We're doing our best to use positive reinforcement on the older cat.
Whenever he walks away from the door where the kitten is, we pet him
and offer him a treat. Plus, we're doing our best to pay lots of
attention to him, and not let the kitten seemed favored at all.

I'll hopefully have a happy update this evening!

Thanks again,
Martin O'B

keepyourdistance (headstart)
April 24th 07, 05:43 AM
My thoughts exactly! There are many ways. They're just cats and dogs
and birds. My friend had two cats who never were on the same side
otgether ever. You should hear them, hissing back and forth lol.
But when it rained, they used to cuddle until it was over and then
simply walk away :) All animals are the same to me. I feel like
tarzan! AAAAAOOOAAOAAOOAAAHHHHHHHHH !! lol

Martin O'Brien
April 24th 07, 02:24 PM
On Mon, 23 Apr 2007 10:04:44 -0400, Martin O'Brien
> wrote:

>The existing cat was neutered back in December. When I said he was
>'freaked out', he was hissing, growling, and swatting at the new
>kitten.
>
>We kept the kitten separated since Saturday evening, and the older cat
>seems to be doing a bit better. He's only grumpy when he's very close
>to the area of the door holding back the kitten, and seems to revert
>to normal once he walks away, whereas on Saturday, he was in a ****y,
>scratchy mood all the time.
>
>Plus, while the wife & I got ready for work this morning, the cat was
>sitting quite close to the door while the kitten meowed and swiped her
>paw under the door. The older cat seemed much more relaxed about
>seeing/hearing the kitten, although he hissed up a storm when my wife
>opened the door to enter that other room, and the 2 cats got sight of
>each other.
>
>We're doing our best to use positive reinforcement on the older cat.
>Whenever he walks away from the door where the kitten is, we pet him
>and offer him a treat. Plus, we're doing our best to pay lots of
>attention to him, and not let the kitten seemed favored at all.
>
>I'll hopefully have a happy update this evening!
>
>Thanks again,
>Martin O'B


HI again,

We seemed to have a bit of '1 step forward, 1 step back' overnight.

My wife was going into our office (where the kitten, Bella, is being
kept, when Presley (the older cat) ran up to the open door. Since the
Bella was sitting right by the door at her food dish, Presley sat down
right in the doorway and just looked at her for a minute or two.

Then he slowly began to approach and sniff at her tail and butt. Then
out of nowhere Presley smacked Bella across the back with an open (no
claws) paw! Bella just sat there, motionless, and Presley backed off a
bit, then started to sniff her tail again!

After another minute, Presley slowly walked out of the room. We
thought it was a great show of progress, but Presley ended up in the
same ****y, funky mood he was in when the kitten arrived Saturday.

When I saw it all happen, I interpreted Presley's actions as something
of a "Is she a threat? Let me smack her and see if she fights back!"
type of move. What do you think?

-Martin O'B

P.S. This morning, Presley approached the office door as I was
exiting, and I let him look through a 2-3 inch crack at the kitty. He
was somewhat upset, with hissing and pawing at the air. Geez, I hope
this works out! :-(

Matthew
April 24th 07, 09:51 PM
It was a investigation move

There are several books out there one is cat understanding your cat moods
( IF there is such a thing)

It will tell you what their body language is saying

"Martin O'Brien" > wrote in message
...
> On Mon, 23 Apr 2007 10:04:44 -0400, Martin O'Brien
> > wrote:
>
>>The existing cat was neutered back in December. When I said he was
>>'freaked out', he was hissing, growling, and swatting at the new
>>kitten.
>>
>>We kept the kitten separated since Saturday evening, and the older cat
>>seems to be doing a bit better. He's only grumpy when he's very close
>>to the area of the door holding back the kitten, and seems to revert
>>to normal once he walks away, whereas on Saturday, he was in a ****y,
>>scratchy mood all the time.
>>
>>Plus, while the wife & I got ready for work this morning, the cat was
>>sitting quite close to the door while the kitten meowed and swiped her
>>paw under the door. The older cat seemed much more relaxed about
>>seeing/hearing the kitten, although he hissed up a storm when my wife
>>opened the door to enter that other room, and the 2 cats got sight of
>>each other.
>>
>>We're doing our best to use positive reinforcement on the older cat.
>>Whenever he walks away from the door where the kitten is, we pet him
>>and offer him a treat. Plus, we're doing our best to pay lots of
>>attention to him, and not let the kitten seemed favored at all.
>>
>>I'll hopefully have a happy update this evening!
>>
>>Thanks again,
>>Martin O'B
>
>
> HI again,
>
> We seemed to have a bit of '1 step forward, 1 step back' overnight.
>
> My wife was going into our office (where the kitten, Bella, is being
> kept, when Presley (the older cat) ran up to the open door. Since the
> Bella was sitting right by the door at her food dish, Presley sat down
> right in the doorway and just looked at her for a minute or two.
>
> Then he slowly began to approach and sniff at her tail and butt. Then
> out of nowhere Presley smacked Bella across the back with an open (no
> claws) paw! Bella just sat there, motionless, and Presley backed off a
> bit, then started to sniff her tail again!
>
> After another minute, Presley slowly walked out of the room. We
> thought it was a great show of progress, but Presley ended up in the
> same ****y, funky mood he was in when the kitten arrived Saturday.
>
> When I saw it all happen, I interpreted Presley's actions as something
> of a "Is she a threat? Let me smack her and see if she fights back!"
> type of move. What do you think?
>
> -Martin O'B
>
> P.S. This morning, Presley approached the office door as I was
> exiting, and I let him look through a 2-3 inch crack at the kitty. He
> was somewhat upset, with hissing and pawing at the air. Geez, I hope
> this works out! :-(

Martin O'Brien
April 25th 07, 05:33 PM
On Tue, 24 Apr 2007 16:51:40 -0400, "Matthew"
> wrote:

It looks like Presley's "investigation" bore fruit! The 2 cats began
playing last night and this morning. Although it appeared that the
kitten was either tired or frightened of the playing after a few
minutes, so I pulled them apart. (I think Presley was getting a bit
excited, and was a bit more into the playing/exploration t han the
kitten...)

Thanks for all the advice so far,
Martin O'B



>It was a investigation move
>
>There are several books out there one is cat understanding your cat moods
>( IF there is such a thing)
>
>It will tell you what their body language is saying
>
>"Martin O'Brien" > wrote in message
...
>> On Mon, 23 Apr 2007 10:04:44 -0400, Martin O'Brien
>> > wrote:
>>
>>>The existing cat was neutered back in December. When I said he was
>>>'freaked out', he was hissing, growling, and swatting at the new
>>>kitten.
>>>
>>>We kept the kitten separated since Saturday evening, and the older cat
>>>seems to be doing a bit better. He's only grumpy when he's very close
>>>to the area of the door holding back the kitten, and seems to revert
>>>to normal once he walks away, whereas on Saturday, he was in a ****y,
>>>scratchy mood all the time.
>>>
>>>Plus, while the wife & I got ready for work this morning, the cat was
>>>sitting quite close to the door while the kitten meowed and swiped her
>>>paw under the door. The older cat seemed much more relaxed about
>>>seeing/hearing the kitten, although he hissed up a storm when my wife
>>>opened the door to enter that other room, and the 2 cats got sight of
>>>each other.
>>>
>>>We're doing our best to use positive reinforcement on the older cat.
>>>Whenever he walks away from the door where the kitten is, we pet him
>>>and offer him a treat. Plus, we're doing our best to pay lots of
>>>attention to him, and not let the kitten seemed favored at all.
>>>
>>>I'll hopefully have a happy update this evening!
>>>
>>>Thanks again,
>>>Martin O'B
>>
>>
>> HI again,
>>
>> We seemed to have a bit of '1 step forward, 1 step back' overnight.
>>
>> My wife was going into our office (where the kitten, Bella, is being
>> kept, when Presley (the older cat) ran up to the open door. Since the
>> Bella was sitting right by the door at her food dish, Presley sat down
>> right in the doorway and just looked at her for a minute or two.
>>
>> Then he slowly began to approach and sniff at her tail and butt. Then
>> out of nowhere Presley smacked Bella across the back with an open (no
>> claws) paw! Bella just sat there, motionless, and Presley backed off a
>> bit, then started to sniff her tail again!
>>
>> After another minute, Presley slowly walked out of the room. We
>> thought it was a great show of progress, but Presley ended up in the
>> same ****y, funky mood he was in when the kitten arrived Saturday.
>>
>> When I saw it all happen, I interpreted Presley's actions as something
>> of a "Is she a threat? Let me smack her and see if she fights back!"
>> type of move. What do you think?
>>
>> -Martin O'B
>>
>> P.S. This morning, Presley approached the office door as I was
>> exiting, and I let him look through a 2-3 inch crack at the kitty. He
>> was somewhat upset, with hissing and pawing at the air. Geez, I hope
>> this works out! :-(
>

Lynne
April 25th 07, 09:32 PM
on Wed, 25 Apr 2007 16:33:38 GMT, Martin O'Brien
> wrote:

> It looks like Presley's "investigation" bore fruit! The 2 cats began
> playing last night and this morning. Although it appeared that the
> kitten was either tired or frightened of the playing after a few
> minutes, so I pulled them apart. (I think Presley was getting a bit
> excited, and was a bit more into the playing/exploration t han the
> kitten...)

That's wonderful news!

My mother just brought home an 8 week old kitten from a rescue group the
day before yesterday. He is a great little kitten, very curious and
playful, but he was spitting, hissing and swatting at the other 2 cats
and the dog. One of her cats, who is very skittish and shy normally, was
terrified of the kitten because of his actions. She went into hiding.
The other cat, who is normally very friendly, decided he wasn't worth
getting to know and actively avoided him. The dog is very patient with
cats and she has been keeping an eye on the kitten and waiting for him to
warm up. This was Monday.

We have just been letting everyone do their own thing since the kitten
came home. Today, Wednesday, suddenly everyone is playing and getting
along great. Hopefully that will be the case with your cats very soon,
too!

--
Lynne


"We are strong enough to stand tall tearlessly
We are brave enough to bend to cry
And sad enough to know
We must laugh again"

~ Nikki Giovanni, 4/17/2007, Virginia Tech