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bluedove
April 25th 07, 01:43 AM
Hello,

I haven't posted here for several years since my Blue boy passed
away in late 2004. But now I am brought back to ponder (and I know that I
can't be the only* one out there wondering) if I can trust the Nutro brand
for any of their cat foods? Or, if I can trust any* of the cat food brands
out there?

I'd bought the Nutro Gourmet wet cat food in
the pouches only a few times, and fortunately, my 2 cats
hated it, and wouldn't touch, even as seemingly healthy and 'natural' the
ingredients appeared to be. I have been feeding them, primarily, (roasted)
Fancy Feast, as they like the gooey, gravy types. But, for 3 years I have
been
buying (in large amts) Nutro Gourmet Chicken dry* cat food (in the orange
bag). I was lead to believe that it
was a mid to high grade quality, and my two guys, Dove + Gabe really love
it. I have never met any cat didn't love it.

Yet, now with the pet food recall, I noticed that the 4th or 5th
ingredient listed in the Nutro Gourmet brand is 'Wheat gluten'. Now I'm
totally afraid to
buy it, ever again. I feel duped by the company, but mainly, IMO,
the company' reputation has been damaged. I just don't trust them
any more. IMO, the company charged a high cost, materially and literally,
for so-called 'high quality' ingredients. Yet, many 'cheaper' brands like
Authority and Special Kitty used the same exact source for the wheat gluten.

Now I am left wondering why* would the Nutro company use a separate* source
for their wheat gluten to put in their Dry food?! I haven't heard or seen
a peep of a comment from the company or media about this obvious question.

Do anyone have any holistic, good quality brands they are now using and
would recommend buying?

Comments, thoughts?

ML

oldhickory
April 25th 07, 02:27 AM
I've been feeding Nutro kibble to my 3 since 2004. I've also been feeding
them Nutro gourmet (canned, on the recall list). Obviously, I quit feeding
the canned since the recall, though the canned varieties I feed them were
not in the initial recall--they were not recalled until the second wave.

On the other hand, I had a siamese
http://www.davidandmollie.com/kitties/twinkle/twinknew.htm that passed away
in summer 2003, from kidney failure, and we thought it was very strange but
since my father was in the hospital on a ventilator at the time we didn't
have the bandwidth to look into it. She was only 11.

We feed her a variety of kibbles and cans all of her life---from Meow Mix to
Iams. We never served Nutro products until after she passed away, when a
rescue person suggested we use their canned kitten food to get a new adoptee
to take her meds. She said she'd never had a kitten turn down their canned
chicken and liver kitten food.

I don't know that Nutro is worth singling out. I think it's the lax
enforcement of import regs, and the way we've taught emerging countries to
lie cheat and steal to get ahead that's to blame.

Why, with all the crops we have here, are we importing FOOD products from
countries with no safety controls???

Lastly, using one source for our foods --whatever the source--is risky. If
there's a problem it's a problem for all. Diversity is a good thing, just
careful and well-planned. Just like planting all of one kind of crop or tree
is dangerous. If we wipe it out--we have nothing to fall back on...but
don't get me started....

--
ie
ride fast, take chances.


"bluedove" > wrote in message
...
> Hello,
>
> I haven't posted here for several years since my Blue boy passed
> away in late 2004. But now I am brought back to ponder (and I know that I
> can't be the only* one out there wondering) if I can trust the Nutro brand
> for any of their cat foods? Or, if I can trust any* of the cat food
> brands
> out there?
>
> I'd bought the Nutro Gourmet wet cat food in
> the pouches only a few times, and fortunately, my 2 cats
> hated it, and wouldn't touch, even as seemingly healthy and 'natural' the
> ingredients appeared to be. I have been feeding them, primarily,
> (roasted)
> Fancy Feast, as they like the gooey, gravy types. But, for 3 years I have
> been
> buying (in large amts) Nutro Gourmet Chicken dry* cat food (in the orange
> bag). I was lead to believe that it
> was a mid to high grade quality, and my two guys, Dove + Gabe really love
> it. I have never met any cat didn't love it.
>
> Yet, now with the pet food recall, I noticed that the 4th or 5th
> ingredient listed in the Nutro Gourmet brand is 'Wheat gluten'. Now I'm
> totally afraid to
> buy it, ever again. I feel duped by the company, but mainly, IMO,
> the company' reputation has been damaged. I just don't trust them
> any more. IMO, the company charged a high cost, materially and literally,
> for so-called 'high quality' ingredients. Yet, many 'cheaper' brands like
> Authority and Special Kitty used the same exact source for the wheat
> gluten.
>
> Now I am left wondering why* would the Nutro company use a separate*
> source
> for their wheat gluten to put in their Dry food?! I haven't heard or
> seen
> a peep of a comment from the company or media about this obvious question.
>
> Do anyone have any holistic, good quality brands they are now using and
> would recommend buying?
>
> Comments, thoughts?
>
> ML
>
>
>
>
>

cindys
April 25th 07, 02:52 AM
"bluedove" > wrote in message
...

I am currently using canned Wellness (finally!) which is human grade food
and contains no grains! I had previously used Pet Promise, which is also
human grade. The main reason I switched to Wellness was that the Pet Promise
contained too many carbohydrates for my formerly diabetic cat, but the
carbohydrates are in the form of brown rice and potatoes, no glutens of any
sort. For dry food, I have been using Purina OM (overweight management)
which does contain wheat gluten and corn gluten. I was at the veterinary
office yesterday. The tech told me that the Purina company had reassured
them that the OM does not contain any contaminated gluten. The tech further
stated that many of their clients feed their animals Purina OM and there has
not been one single client who has experienced any problem. FWIW. The vast
majority of the Science Diet dry foods do not contain any wheat, wheat
gluten, or other wheat products, but they do contain corn gluten.
Best regards,
---Cindy S.


> Hello,
>
> I haven't posted here for several years since my Blue boy passed
> away in late 2004. But now I am brought back to ponder (and I know that I
> can't be the only* one out there wondering) if I can trust the Nutro brand
> for any of their cat foods? Or, if I can trust any* of the cat food
> brands
> out there?
>
> I'd bought the Nutro Gourmet wet cat food in
> the pouches only a few times, and fortunately, my 2 cats
> hated it, and wouldn't touch, even as seemingly healthy and 'natural' the
> ingredients appeared to be. I have been feeding them, primarily,
> (roasted)
> Fancy Feast, as they like the gooey, gravy types. But, for 3 years I have
> been
> buying (in large amts) Nutro Gourmet Chicken dry* cat food (in the orange
> bag). I was lead to believe that it
> was a mid to high grade quality, and my two guys, Dove + Gabe really love
> it. I have never met any cat didn't love it.
>
> Yet, now with the pet food recall, I noticed that the 4th or 5th
> ingredient listed in the Nutro Gourmet brand is 'Wheat gluten'. Now I'm
> totally afraid to
> buy it, ever again. I feel duped by the company, but mainly, IMO,
> the company' reputation has been damaged. I just don't trust them
> any more. IMO, the company charged a high cost, materially and literally,
> for so-called 'high quality' ingredients. Yet, many 'cheaper' brands like
> Authority and Special Kitty used the same exact source for the wheat
> gluten.
>
> Now I am left wondering why* would the Nutro company use a separate*
> source
> for their wheat gluten to put in their Dry food?! I haven't heard or
> seen
> a peep of a comment from the company or media about this obvious question.
>
> Do anyone have any holistic, good quality brands they are now using and
> would recommend buying?
>
> Comments, thoughts?
>
> ML
>
>
>
>
>

Luna's Mom[_2_]
April 25th 07, 03:30 AM
bluedove wrote:
> Hello,
>
> I haven't posted here for several years since my Blue boy passed
> away in late 2004. But now I am brought back to ponder (and I know that I
> can't be the only* one out there wondering) if I can trust the Nutro brand
> for any of their cat foods? Or, if I can trust any* of the cat food brands
> out there?
>
> I'd bought the Nutro Gourmet wet cat food in
> the pouches only a few times, and fortunately, my 2 cats
> hated it, and wouldn't touch, even as seemingly healthy and 'natural' the
> ingredients appeared to be. I have been feeding them, primarily, (roasted)
> Fancy Feast, as they like the gooey, gravy types. But, for 3 years I have
> been
> buying (in large amts) Nutro Gourmet Chicken dry* cat food (in the orange
> bag). I was lead to believe that it
> was a mid to high grade quality, and my two guys, Dove + Gabe really love
> it. I have never met any cat didn't love it.
>
> Yet, now with the pet food recall, I noticed that the 4th or 5th
> ingredient listed in the Nutro Gourmet brand is 'Wheat gluten'. Now I'm
> totally afraid to
> buy it, ever again. I feel duped by the company, but mainly, IMO,
> the company' reputation has been damaged. I just don't trust them
> any more. IMO, the company charged a high cost, materially and literally,
> for so-called 'high quality' ingredients. Yet, many 'cheaper' brands like
> Authority and Special Kitty used the same exact source for the wheat gluten.
>
> Now I am left wondering why* would the Nutro company use a separate* source
> for their wheat gluten to put in their Dry food?! I haven't heard or seen
> a peep of a comment from the company or media about this obvious question.
>
> Do anyone have any holistic, good quality brands they are now using and
> would recommend buying?
>
> Comments, thoughts?
>
> ML

I feed Luna the Nutro dry hairball management chicken flavor. It has NO
wheat gluten but it does have corn gluten, so I started to freak out a
bit with word of more contaminations. I think it is worth noting that
NONE of their dry foods have been recalled, though I have been feeling
like you do and wondering if they are to be trusted. FWIW, here is what
I got from them by email just yesterday:

__________________________________________________ ______________________
April 23, 2007


Dear Nutro Customers,

We know many of you have questions about the FDA's latest reports that
melamine was found in rice protein concentrate (also referred to as rice
gluten). We want to address those concerns as well as provide you with
information on our use of corn gluten, which we include in some of our
pet foods as an ingredient in the form of corn gluten meal.

Our customers have also brought to our attention confusion that has been
caused by the media in reporting the new recall of some Natural Balance
pet foods. Natural Balance Pet Foods, Inc. is not in any way affiliated
with Nutro Products nor Nutro's Natural Choice®, MAX® or Ultra™ brands.

I hope the following information is helpful in clearing up any confusion
you may have.

Regarding Rice Protein Concentrate:

(1) Nutro uses rice protein concentrate in some of its products because
it provides an important source of protein for pets, especially for
those with digestive sensitivities and allergies.

(2) Independent laboratory tests have confirmed that the rice protein
concentrate (also known as rice gluten) used in Nutro's pet foods does
not contain melamine.

(3) It has been reported that the Natural Balance recall is focused on
products containing rice protein concentrate provided by Wilbur-Ellis
Company. Nutro has NEVER purchased or used rice protein concentrate
from Wilbur-Ellis Company in any of our pet foods.

Regarding Corn Gluten:

(1) Nutro uses corn gluten meal in some of its pet foods because it is a
source of sulfur amino acids, which are important for skin and coat
health. Corn gluten meal also helps as a natural urine acidifier that
is important for both cats and dogs.

(2) All of the corn gluten meal that Nutro uses in its products is
produced in the United States.

Nutro customers may check Nutro's website
(http://www.nutroproducts.com/) or contact our Consumer Hotline -- (800)
833-5330 -- for further information about our products. We will
continue to post updated information on our website and our customer
service representatives are working diligently to respond to each and
every call and email personally.

We understand that the pet food recall has caused continued confusion
and frustration and we are doing everything we can to provide you with
the information you need about our products. We will continue to keep
you updated.

Sincerely,

Dave Kravis
President & CEO
Nutro Products
__________________________________________________ _______________________________

I'm not sure what to make of this and Luna will simply not tolerate a
wet diet, so I am at a loss as to what is the right course of action in
terms of feeding her. I've still been feeding her the nutro dry,
nervously, which is a ****ty way to feel, but again, not sure what to do
or where to turn for now.

Pam

Meghan Noecker
April 25th 07, 04:38 AM
On Tue, 24 Apr 2007 21:30:58 -0500, Luna's Mom > wrote:


>
>I'm not sure what to make of this and Luna will simply not tolerate a
>wet diet, so I am at a loss as to what is the right course of action in
>terms of feeding her. I've still been feeding her the nutro dry,
>nervously, which is a ****ty way to feel, but again, not sure what to do
>or where to turn for now.
>


Royal Canin's website also explained a bit about using glutens. This
is from their website:



Why is rice gluten even used in pet food?

Effective immediately, Royal Canin USA does not source any of its
vegetable proteins—including rice gluten—from China.

Also, Royal Canin USA is reviewing all of its supplier relationships
to ensure that we continue to provide your pets with the highest
quality ingredients available.

Prior to the recent issue with rice gluten from China, rice gluten
(rice protein concentrate) has been a well-trusted and safe ingredient
used by many responsible pet food manufacturers for decades.

Overall, rice gluten provides a highly-digestible and very useful form
of protein. When compared with other grain-based ingredients,
high-quality rice gluten has many positive attributes as a pet food
ingredient because it is highly digestible, high in protein, and a
good energy source that helps pets with their digestion and immune
systems.

In addition to being an excellent protein source and having
exceptional digestibility, high-quality rice gluten helps pets control
gas (flatulence), reduce litter box odors, and improve their stool
quality when compared with other grain-based ingredients.



So rice gluten is a good pet food ingredient, but why use rice gluten
from China?

China is the world’s largest rice producer, and therefore, the largest
exporter of rice gluten. Prior to this issue, rice gluten from China
was considered very high quality because of its nutritional value.

Due to that earlier quality rating, Chinese rice gluten was actually
one of the more expensive pet food ingredients, costing more than most
meat proteins.



__________________________________________________ __________________

They also stated that their corn gluten is from USA sources, none from
overseas. I was getting really worried about that. I was planning to
get bloodwork done to make sure he is okay. But I think the company
has made sure their corn gluten is not contaminated. I would like to
see it worded just a little bit clearer, but I decided to wait on
bloodwork.

blkcatgal
April 25th 07, 04:38 AM
You could try Innova or Felidae. Neither uses wheat gluten, corn gluten or
rice gluten.

Sue

"bluedove" > wrote in message
...
> Hello,
>
> I haven't posted here for several years since my Blue boy passed
> away in late 2004. But now I am brought back to ponder (and I know that I
> can't be the only* one out there wondering) if I can trust the Nutro brand
> for any of their cat foods? Or, if I can trust any* of the cat food
> brands
> out there?
>
> I'd bought the Nutro Gourmet wet cat food in
> the pouches only a few times, and fortunately, my 2 cats
> hated it, and wouldn't touch, even as seemingly healthy and 'natural' the
> ingredients appeared to be. I have been feeding them, primarily,
> (roasted)
> Fancy Feast, as they like the gooey, gravy types. But, for 3 years I have
> been
> buying (in large amts) Nutro Gourmet Chicken dry* cat food (in the orange
> bag). I was lead to believe that it
> was a mid to high grade quality, and my two guys, Dove + Gabe really love
> it. I have never met any cat didn't love it.
>
> Yet, now with the pet food recall, I noticed that the 4th or 5th
> ingredient listed in the Nutro Gourmet brand is 'Wheat gluten'. Now I'm
> totally afraid to
> buy it, ever again. I feel duped by the company, but mainly, IMO,
> the company' reputation has been damaged. I just don't trust them
> any more. IMO, the company charged a high cost, materially and literally,
> for so-called 'high quality' ingredients. Yet, many 'cheaper' brands like
> Authority and Special Kitty used the same exact source for the wheat
> gluten.
>
> Now I am left wondering why* would the Nutro company use a separate*
> source
> for their wheat gluten to put in their Dry food?! I haven't heard or
> seen
> a peep of a comment from the company or media about this obvious question.
>
> Do anyone have any holistic, good quality brands they are now using and
> would recommend buying?
>
> Comments, thoughts?
>
> ML
>
>
>
>
>

NedF
April 26th 07, 05:26 AM
In regards to imported wheat gluten, I was reading this guy's blog -
http://evansmediausa.blog.com/1709130/
and I found this bit really disturbing:

"****According to an AP news release on April 20, the Chinese
authorities had told the FDA that the wheat gluten was an industrial
product not meant for pet food.****

This is the pivotal point. Was there any deliberate contamination by
the Chinese, and if so, why? Melamine is more costly than gluten.

The FDA's Dr. Sundlof stated at the onset of this debacle that
melamine is used in the manufacture of plastics and may have been
deliberately added as a cheap fake protein supplement to inflate the
protein content. But gluten, be it of corn, wheat or rice origin, is
used in the manufacture of new generation biodegradable plastic
utensils, grocery bags etc.

This leaves me with the terrible thought that the multinational pet
food industry, following the economistic mandate of lowest-cost feed
formulation based on simplistic nitrogen/protein and other ingredient
assays in their 'scientific' formulation of 'balanced' diets for pets,
thought they could get a good deal by incorporating industrial grade
product gluten in pet foods. But what they actually purchased on the
world market was never intended for human or animal consumption, but
for the manufacture of biodegradable food containers, utensils and
plastic shopping bags. This is essentially what went into pet foods,
causing untold numbers to suffer, and many to die. May be industrial
grade soy with melamine, imported from China, is also in some
manufactured pet foods, and these will be on recall next.

The high morbidity and mortality rate in dogs and cats associated with
this largest pet food recall ever could well have been aggravated by
other chemical contaminants in pet foods that can harm the kidneys,
liver, digestive, endocrine, immune and other systems of our animal
companions. And the industrial crops of corn, wheat and rice, and
possibly soy, grown in China for biodegradable plastic manufacture,
could well have been genetically engineered, raising additional health
and environmental concerns. But the details of this may never be fully
unraveled."

I think I'll just start growing my own food!

blkcatgal
April 27th 07, 12:29 AM
The Chinese have admitted that there was melamine in the wheat and rice
glutens but that's not what is killing the dogs and cats. Check out
www.itchmo.com.

Sue

"NedF" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> In regards to imported wheat gluten, I was reading this guy's blog -
> http://evansmediausa.blog.com/1709130/
> and I found this bit really disturbing:
>
> "****According to an AP news release on April 20, the Chinese
> authorities had told the FDA that the wheat gluten was an industrial
> product not meant for pet food.****
>
> This is the pivotal point. Was there any deliberate contamination by
> the Chinese, and if so, why? Melamine is more costly than gluten.
>
> The FDA's Dr. Sundlof stated at the onset of this debacle that
> melamine is used in the manufacture of plastics and may have been
> deliberately added as a cheap fake protein supplement to inflate the
> protein content. But gluten, be it of corn, wheat or rice origin, is
> used in the manufacture of new generation biodegradable plastic
> utensils, grocery bags etc.
>
> This leaves me with the terrible thought that the multinational pet
> food industry, following the economistic mandate of lowest-cost feed
> formulation based on simplistic nitrogen/protein and other ingredient
> assays in their 'scientific' formulation of 'balanced' diets for pets,
> thought they could get a good deal by incorporating industrial grade
> product gluten in pet foods. But what they actually purchased on the
> world market was never intended for human or animal consumption, but
> for the manufacture of biodegradable food containers, utensils and
> plastic shopping bags. This is essentially what went into pet foods,
> causing untold numbers to suffer, and many to die. May be industrial
> grade soy with melamine, imported from China, is also in some
> manufactured pet foods, and these will be on recall next.
>
> The high morbidity and mortality rate in dogs and cats associated with
> this largest pet food recall ever could well have been aggravated by
> other chemical contaminants in pet foods that can harm the kidneys,
> liver, digestive, endocrine, immune and other systems of our animal
> companions. And the industrial crops of corn, wheat and rice, and
> possibly soy, grown in China for biodegradable plastic manufacture,
> could well have been genetically engineered, raising additional health
> and environmental concerns. But the details of this may never be fully
> unraveled."
>
> I think I'll just start growing my own food!
>

Bluedove
April 27th 07, 01:42 AM
Ned,

All I can say is... Wow! I am with you as far as just simply cooking for my
guys. Or, since I am far too busy to do this everyday, more realistically,
I guess I can buy Gerber baby food jars of a huge variety and feed them
that, but I know that it would not* meet all of their different nutritional
needs. but thanks for sending this interesting article/blog.

I finally called a vet here in Tally that I trust and went by yesterday
after I got off work & bought an 8 LB bag of (chicken and rice) "California
Natural" dry. Anybody have comments on this brand? If so, pleease let me
know what your thoughts and experience is with this brand. My guys really
like it alot when I bought it in the past before all this recall nightmare,
and I was very impressed with all of the ingredients. I drilled the poor
vet techs behind the desk before I bought it and finally was assured it is
'safe', but my thoughts are, honestly, do we really* know what brand is*
safe now, and what isn't safe, since there is a new darn list that seems to
come out everyday now. I digress.

BTW, thanks to all who have responded to my post, I've read them all and
appreciate your comments!


ML



"NedF" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> In regards to imported wheat gluten, I was reading this guy's blog -
> http://evansmediausa.blog.com/1709130/
> and I found this bit really disturbing:
>
> "****According to an AP news release on April 20, the Chinese
> authorities had told the FDA that the wheat gluten was an industrial
> product not meant for pet food.****
>
> This is the pivotal point. Was there any deliberate contamination by
> the Chinese, and if so, why? Melamine is more costly than gluten.
>
> The FDA's Dr. Sundlof stated at the onset of this debacle that
> melamine is used in the manufacture of plastics and may have been
> deliberately added as a cheap fake protein supplement to inflate the
> protein content. But gluten, be it of corn, wheat or rice origin, is
> used in the manufacture of new generation biodegradable plastic
> utensils, grocery bags etc.
>
> This leaves me with the terrible thought that the multinational pet
> food industry, following the economistic mandate of lowest-cost feed
> formulation based on simplistic nitrogen/protein and other ingredient
> assays in their 'scientific' formulation of 'balanced' diets for pets,
> thought they could get a good deal by incorporating industrial grade
> product gluten in pet foods. But what they actually purchased on the
> world market was never intended for human or animal consumption, but
> for the manufacture of biodegradable food containers, utensils and
> plastic shopping bags. This is essentially what went into pet foods,
> causing untold numbers to suffer, and many to die. May be industrial
> grade soy with melamine, imported from China, is also in some
> manufactured pet foods, and these will be on recall next.
>
> The high morbidity and mortality rate in dogs and cats associated with
> this largest pet food recall ever could well have been aggravated by
> other chemical contaminants in pet foods that can harm the kidneys,
> liver, digestive, endocrine, immune and other systems of our animal
> companions. And the industrial crops of corn, wheat and rice, and
> possibly soy, grown in China for biodegradable plastic manufacture,
> could well have been genetically engineered, raising additional health
> and environmental concerns. But the details of this may never be fully
> unraveled."
>
> I think I'll just start growing my own food!
>

Bluedove
April 27th 07, 01:58 AM
"Luna's Mom" > wrote in message
.. .
> bluedove wrote:
> > Hello,
> >
> > I haven't posted here for several years since my Blue boy passed
> > away in late 2004. But now I am brought back to ponder (and I know that
I
> > can't be the only* one out there wondering) if I can trust the Nutro
brand
> > for any of their cat foods? Or, if I can trust any* of the cat food
brands
> > out there?
> >
> > I'd bought the Nutro Gourmet wet cat food in
> > the pouches only a few times, and fortunately, my 2 cats
> > hated it, and wouldn't touch, even as seemingly healthy and 'natural'
the
> > ingredients appeared to be. I have been feeding them, primarily,
(roasted)
> > Fancy Feast, as they like the gooey, gravy types. But, for 3 years I
have
> > been
> > buying (in large amts) Nutro Gourmet Chicken dry* cat food (in the
orange
> > bag). I was lead to believe that it
> > was a mid to high grade quality, and my two guys, Dove + Gabe really
love
> > it. I have never met any cat didn't love it.
> >
> > Yet, now with the pet food recall, I noticed that the 4th or 5th
> > ingredient listed in the Nutro Gourmet brand is 'Wheat gluten'. Now I'm
> > totally afraid to
> > buy it, ever again. I feel duped by the company, but mainly, IMO,
> > the company' reputation has been damaged. I just don't trust them
> > any more. IMO, the company charged a high cost, materially and
literally,
> > for so-called 'high quality' ingredients. Yet, many 'cheaper' brands
like
> > Authority and Special Kitty used the same exact source for the wheat
gluten.
> >
> > Now I am left wondering why* would the Nutro company use a separate*
source
> > for their wheat gluten to put in their Dry food?! I haven't heard or
seen
> > a peep of a comment from the company or media about this obvious
question.
> >
> > Do anyone have any holistic, good quality brands they are now using and
> > would recommend buying?
> >
> > Comments, thoughts?
> >
> > ML
>
> I feed Luna the Nutro dry hairball management chicken flavor. It has NO
> wheat gluten but it does have corn gluten, so I started to freak out a
> bit with word of more contaminations. I think it is worth noting that
> NONE of their dry foods have been recalled, though I have been feeling
> like you do and wondering if they are to be trusted. FWIW, here is what
> I got from them by email just yesterday:
>
> __________________________________________________ ______________________
> April 23, 2007
>
>
> Dear Nutro Customers,
>
> We know many of you have questions about the FDA's latest reports that
> melamine was found in rice protein concentrate (also referred to as rice
> gluten). We want to address those concerns as well as provide you with
> information on our use of corn gluten, which we include in some of our
> pet foods as an ingredient in the form of corn gluten meal.
>
> Our customers have also brought to our attention confusion that has been
> caused by the media in reporting the new recall of some Natural Balance
> pet foods. Natural Balance Pet Foods, Inc. is not in any way affiliated
> with Nutro Products nor Nutro's Natural Choice®, MAX® or Ultra™ brands.
>
> I hope the following information is helpful in clearing up any confusion
> you may have.
>
> Regarding Rice Protein Concentrate:
>
> (1) Nutro uses rice protein concentrate in some of its products because
> it provides an important source of protein for pets, especially for
> those with digestive sensitivities and allergies.
>
> (2) Independent laboratory tests have confirmed that the rice protein
> concentrate (also known as rice gluten) used in Nutro's pet foods does
> not contain melamine.
>
> (3) It has been reported that the Natural Balance recall is focused on
> products containing rice protein concentrate provided by Wilbur-Ellis
> Company. Nutro has NEVER purchased or used rice protein concentrate
> from Wilbur-Ellis Company in any of our pet foods.
>
> Regarding Corn Gluten:
>
> (1) Nutro uses corn gluten meal in some of its pet foods because it is a
> source of sulfur amino acids, which are important for skin and coat
> health. Corn gluten meal also helps as a natural urine acidifier that
> is important for both cats and dogs.
>
> (2) All of the corn gluten meal that Nutro uses in its products is
> produced in the United States.
>
> Nutro customers may check Nutro's website
> (http://www.nutroproducts.com/) or contact our Consumer Hotline -- (800)
> 833-5330 -- for further information about our products. We will
> continue to post updated information on our website and our customer
> service representatives are working diligently to respond to each and
> every call and email personally.
>
> We understand that the pet food recall has caused continued confusion
> and frustration and we are doing everything we can to provide you with
> the information you need about our products. We will continue to keep
> you updated.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Dave Kravis
> President & CEO
> Nutro Products
>
__________________________________________________ __________________________
_____
>
> I'm not sure what to make of this and Luna will simply not tolerate a
> wet diet, so I am at a loss as to what is the right course of action in
> terms of feeding her. I've still been feeding her the nutro dry,
> nervously, which is a ****ty way to feel, but again, not sure what to do
> or where to turn for now.
>
> Pam




***Thanks Pam.

I feel the same way. I am now trying holistic brand called, "California
Natural" Chicken and Rice--( I know, I know, now when I see the word 'rice'
mentioned in any form as an ingrediant, I just want to drop the darn bag
and run out the store!). I hope it will be healthy and good for them. Has
anyone else heard of this brand? Anyone vouch for it? It wasn't cheap, the
8 LB bag cost me almost $17.00.

Thanks for passing along the letter. Did you catch how they first pointed
the finger at Natural Balance to try to deflect from the point that yes,
they too have had a big recall. For some reason, to me, the letter seemed
canned and ever so formal. I felt like I was reading a letter from the fox
guarding the chicken coop or something, or maybe, I've become just too
cynical..?


ML

Luna's Mom[_2_]
April 27th 07, 03:22 AM
> ***Thanks Pam.
>
> I feel the same way. I am now trying holistic brand called, "California
> Natural" Chicken and Rice--( I know, I know, now when I see the word 'rice'
> mentioned in any form as an ingrediant, I just want to drop the darn bag
> and run out the store!). I hope it will be healthy and good for them. Has
> anyone else heard of this brand? Anyone vouch for it? It wasn't cheap, the
> 8 LB bag cost me almost $17.00.
>
> Thanks for passing along the letter. Did you catch how they first pointed
> the finger at Natural Balance to try to deflect from the point that yes,
> they too have had a big recall. For some reason, to me, the letter seemed
> canned and ever so formal. I felt like I was reading a letter from the fox
> guarding the chicken coop or something, or maybe, I've become just too
> cynical..?
>
>
> ML

It is hard NOT to be cynical right now. Every time I get a new update
from itchmo.com about another recall, I shiver at the thought that
Luna's food could be next. I keep a close eye on her and will call the
vet at the first sign of something seeming wrong. But, I know that is
NOT a fool-proof method of keeping her safe.

I need to get her some more food. I am thinking of trying the California
Naturalor maybe the Innova or Felidae.

Ugh. What a M E S S!

NedF
April 27th 07, 03:55 AM
Actually, the chinese said "The ministry said the contaminated
vegetable protein managed to get past customs without inspection
because it had not been declared for use in pet food." according to
ichmo. I would not find it a big stretch that the American supplier
bought the low grade industrial stuff thinking they could get away
with it. The only way to know would be to see what the invoice says.
It's easy to blame the Chinese though, since they have a well known
corruption problem at all levels of government.

On Apr 26, 4:29 pm, "blkcatgal" > wrote:
> The Chinese have admitted that there was melamine in the wheat and rice
> glutens but that's not what is killing the dogs and cats. Check outwww.itchmo.com.
>
> Sue
>
> "NedF" > wrote in message
>
> ups.com...
>
> > In regards to imported wheat gluten, I was reading this guy's blog -
> >http://evansmediausa.blog.com/1709130/
> > and I found this bit really disturbing:
>
> > "****According to an AP news release on April 20, the Chinese
> > authorities had told the FDA that the wheat gluten was an industrial
> > product not meant for pet food.****
>
> > This is the pivotal point. Was there any deliberate contamination by
> > the Chinese, and if so, why? Melamine is more costly than gluten.
>
> > The FDA's Dr. Sundlof stated at the onset of this debacle that
> > melamine is used in the manufacture of plastics and may have been
> > deliberately added as a cheap fake protein supplement to inflate the
> > protein content. But gluten, be it of corn, wheat or rice origin, is
> > used in the manufacture of new generation biodegradable plastic
> > utensils, grocery bags etc.
>
> > This leaves me with the terrible thought that the multinational pet
> > food industry, following the economistic mandate of lowest-cost feed
> > formulation based on simplistic nitrogen/protein and other ingredient
> > assays in their 'scientific' formulation of 'balanced' diets for pets,
> > thought they could get a good deal by incorporating industrial grade
> > product gluten in pet foods. But what they actually purchased on the
> > world market was never intended for human or animal consumption, but
> > for the manufacture of biodegradable food containers, utensils and
> > plastic shopping bags. This is essentially what went into pet foods,
> > causing untold numbers to suffer, and many to die. May be industrial
> > grade soy with melamine, imported from China, is also in some
> > manufactured pet foods, and these will be on recall next.
>
> > The high morbidity and mortality rate in dogs and cats associated with
> > this largest pet food recall ever could well have been aggravated by
> > other chemical contaminants in pet foods that can harm the kidneys,
> > liver, digestive, endocrine, immune and other systems of our animal
> > companions. And the industrial crops of corn, wheat and rice, and
> > possibly soy, grown in China for biodegradable plastic manufacture,
> > could well have been genetically engineered, raising additional health
> > and environmental concerns. But the details of this may never be fully
> > unraveled."
>
> > I think I'll just start growing my own food!

NedF
April 27th 07, 04:00 AM
I don't know about California Natural quality but their website is
excellent as far as information about what's in their food and why
it's there. Check out the ingredients section at the bottom of this
page: http://www.californianaturalpet.com/products/default.asp?id=1007
You can click on each ingredient and it says what it is and why it's
there! I'd try that food if my cat wasn't allergic to fish!

On Apr 26, 5:42 pm, "Bluedove" <[email protected] home.com> wrote:
> Ned,
>
> All I can say is... Wow! I am with you as far as just simply cooking for my
> guys. Or, since I am far too busy to do this everyday, more realistically,
> I guess I can buy Gerber baby food jars of a huge variety and feed them
> that, but I know that it would not* meet all of their different nutritional
> needs. but thanks for sending this interesting article/blog.
>
> I finally called a vet here in Tally that I trust and went by yesterday
> after I got off work & bought an 8 LB bag of (chicken and rice) "California
> Natural" dry. Anybody have comments on this brand? If so, pleease let me
> know what your thoughts and experience is with this brand. My guys really
> like it alot when I bought it in the past before all this recall nightmare,
> and I was very impressed with all of the ingredients. I drilled the poor
> vet techs behind the desk before I bought it and finally was assured it is
> 'safe', but my thoughts are, honestly, do we really* know what brand is*
> safe now, and what isn't safe, since there is a new darn list that seems to
> come out everyday now. I digress.
>
> BTW, thanks to all who have responded to my post, I've read them all and
> appreciate your comments!
>
> ML
>
> "NedF" > wrote in message
>
> ups.com...
>
> > In regards to imported wheat gluten, I was reading this guy's blog -
> >http://evansmediausa.blog.com/1709130/
> > and I found this bit really disturbing:
>
> > "****According to an AP news release on April 20, the Chinese
> > authorities had told the FDA that the wheat gluten was an industrial
> > product not meant for pet food.****
>
> > This is the pivotal point. Was there any deliberate contamination by
> > the Chinese, and if so, why? Melamine is more costly than gluten.
>
> > The FDA's Dr. Sundlof stated at the onset of this debacle that
> > melamine is used in the manufacture of plastics and may have been
> > deliberately added as a cheap fake protein supplement to inflate the
> > protein content. But gluten, be it of corn, wheat or rice origin, is
> > used in the manufacture of new generation biodegradable plastic
> > utensils, grocery bags etc.
>
> > This leaves me with the terrible thought that the multinational pet
> > food industry, following the economistic mandate of lowest-cost feed
> > formulation based on simplistic nitrogen/protein and other ingredient
> > assays in their 'scientific' formulation of 'balanced' diets for pets,
> > thought they could get a good deal by incorporating industrial grade
> > product gluten in pet foods. But what they actually purchased on the
> > world market was never intended for human or animal consumption, but
> > for the manufacture of biodegradable food containers, utensils and
> > plastic shopping bags. This is essentially what went into pet foods,
> > causing untold numbers to suffer, and many to die. May be industrial
> > grade soy with melamine, imported from China, is also in some
> > manufactured pet foods, and these will be on recall next.
>
> > The high morbidity and mortality rate in dogs and cats associated with
> > this largest pet food recall ever could well have been aggravated by
> > other chemical contaminants in pet foods that can harm the kidneys,
> > liver, digestive, endocrine, immune and other systems of our animal
> > companions. And the industrial crops of corn, wheat and rice, and
> > possibly soy, grown in China for biodegradable plastic manufacture,
> > could well have been genetically engineered, raising additional health
> > and environmental concerns. But the details of this may never be fully
> > unraveled."
>
> > I think I'll just start growing my own food!

NedF
April 27th 07, 04:16 AM
On Apr 26, 7:22 pm, Luna's Mom > wrote:

>
> It is hard NOT to be cynical right now. Every time I get a new update
> from itchmo.com about another recall, I shiver at the thought that
> Luna's food could be next. I keep a close eye on her and will call the
> vet at the first sign of something seeming wrong. But, I know that is
> NOT a fool-proof method of keeping her safe.
>
> I need to get her some more food. I am thinking of trying the California
> Naturalor maybe the Innova or Felidae.
>
> Ugh. What a M E S S!

I just tried the Felidae for my cat and she vomited it up right back
into her bowl. :(
Luckily, Trader Joe's is selling their canned cat food again so it's
back to that and I hope it will continue to be safe. My cat is so old
I'm afraid any little thing is going to do her in! She's been
surviving mostly on Beechnut baby food for the past 2 weeks and I know
it's not good to feed her that for very long.

Here is a pic of my kitty:

http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t314/fatmohawk/printythun.jpg

Meghan Noecker
April 27th 07, 06:56 AM
On 26 Apr 2007 19:55:47 -0700, NedF > wrote:

>Actually, the chinese said "The ministry said the contaminated
>vegetable protein managed to get past customs without inspection
>because it had not been declared for use in pet food." according to
>ichmo. I would not find it a big stretch that the American supplier
>bought the low grade industrial stuff thinking they could get away
>with it. The only way to know would be to see what the invoice says.
>It's easy to blame the Chinese though, since they have a well known
>corruption problem at all levels of government.
>

What other purpose would there be for the wheat and rice gluten? Other
than people or pet food?

Are they claiming they sold it as melamine that was laced with wheat
gluten?

It doesn't make any sense for a food product to not be intended for
food. And for that food product to have something in that just happens
to help it test out as a higher quality food product.

Personally, I think they are just trying to cover up the intentional
contamination. And I really think we need to do something to punish
them financially, especially since they are refusing to cooperate.

NedF
April 27th 07, 07:38 AM
On Apr 26, 10:56 pm, Meghan Noecker > wrote:
> On 26 Apr 2007 19:55:47 -0700, NedF > wrote:
>
> >Actually, the chinese said "The ministry said the contaminated
> >vegetable protein managed to get past customs without inspection
> >because it had not been declared for use in pet food." according to
> >ichmo. I would not find it a big stretch that the American supplier
> >bought the low grade industrial stuff thinking they could get away
> >with it. The only way to know would be to see what the invoice says.
> >It's easy to blame the Chinese though, since they have a well known
> >corruption problem at all levels of government.
>
> What other purpose would there be for the wheat and rice gluten? Other
> than people or pet food?

PLASTICS MANUFACTURING

>
> Are they claiming they sold it as melamine that was laced with wheat
> gluten?

NO

>
> It doesn't make any sense for a food product to not be intended for
> food. And for that food product to have something in that just happens
> to help it test out as a higher quality food product.

IT'S
>
> Personally, I think they are just trying to cover up the intentional
> contamination. And I really think we need to do something to punish
> them financially, especially since they are refusing to cooperate.

>From above:

"The FDA's Dr. Sundlof stated at the onset of this debacle that
melamine is used in the manufacture of plastics and may have been
deliberately added as a cheap fake protein supplement to inflate the
protein content. But gluten, be it of corn, wheat or rice origin, is
used in the manufacture of new generation biodegradable plastic
utensils, grocery bags etc."

Just because something is called wheat

NedF
April 27th 07, 07:45 AM
OOPS

On Apr 26, 11:38 pm, NedF > wrote:
> On Apr 26, 10:56 pm, Meghan Noecker > wrote:
>
> > On 26 Apr 2007 19:55:47 -0700, NedF > wrote:
>
> > >Actually, the chinese said "The ministry said the contaminated
> > >vegetable protein managed to get past customs without inspection
> > >because it had not been declared for use in pet food." according to
> > >ichmo. I would not find it a big stretch that the American supplier
> > >bought the low grade industrial stuff thinking they could get away
> > >with it. The only way to know would be to see what the invoice says.
> > >It's easy to blame the Chinese though, since they have a well known
> > >corruption problem at all levels of government.
>
> > What other purpose would there be for the wheat and rice gluten? Other
> > than people or pet food?
>
> PLASTICS MANUFACTURING
>
>
>
> > Are they claiming they sold it as melamine that was laced with wheat
> > gluten?
>
> NO
>
>
>
> > It doesn't make any sense for a food product to not be intended for
> > food. And for that food product to have something in that just happens
> > to help it test out as a higher quality food product.
>
> THE VEGETABLE PROTEIN USED IN PLASTICS MANUFACTURING (WHEAT GLUTEN) IS NOT A FOOD PRODUCT.
>
>
>
> > Personally, I think they are just trying to cover up the intentional
> > contamination. And I really think we need to do something to punish
> > them financially, especially since they are refusing to cooperate.

YOU HAVE TO PROVE THAT BEFORE ANY ACTION CAN BE TAKEN. WOULDN'T YOU
ALSO WANT TO PROVE WHETHER OR NOT THE US MANUFACTURER DELIBERATELY
USED INDUSTRIAL WHEAT GLUTEN AS A FOOD ADDITIVE?

> >From above:
>
> "The FDA's Dr. Sundlof stated at the onset of this debacle that
> melamine is used in the manufacture of plastics and may have been
> deliberately added as a cheap fake protein supplement to inflate the
> protein content. But gluten, be it of corn, wheat or rice origin, is
> used in the manufacture of new generation biodegradable plastic
> utensils, grocery bags etc."

NedF
April 27th 07, 07:47 AM
google groups sucks for posting. If you read the blog I linked to
above, you'd be better informed on this issue.

Meghan Noecker
April 27th 07, 08:13 AM
On 26 Apr 2007 23:38:20 -0700, NedF > wrote:

>On Apr 26, 10:56 pm, Meghan Noecker > wrote:
>> On 26 Apr 2007 19:55:47 -0700, NedF > wrote:
>>
>> >Actually, the chinese said "The ministry said the contaminated
>> >vegetable protein managed to get past customs without inspection
>> >because it had not been declared for use in pet food." according to
>> >ichmo. I would not find it a big stretch that the American supplier
>> >bought the low grade industrial stuff thinking they could get away
>> >with it. The only way to know would be to see what the invoice says.
>> >It's easy to blame the Chinese though, since they have a well known
>> >corruption problem at all levels of government.
>>
>> What other purpose would there be for the wheat and rice gluten? Other
>> than people or pet food?
>
>PLASTICS MANUFACTURING
>

So a companymaking plastic would intentionally buy wheat or rice
gluten?

If so, would it be more or less valuable to them if it had melamine in
it? It seems odd that it would be labeled wheat gluten if the
customer would actually prefer it to have melaine in it. And there
would be reaon to not mention the melamine if it wasn't intended to be
used as food.

Meghan Noecker
April 27th 07, 08:24 AM
On 26 Apr 2007 23:45:47 -0700, NedF > wrote:


>YOU HAVE TO PROVE THAT BEFORE ANY ACTION CAN BE TAKEN. WOULDN'T YOU
>ALSO WANT TO PROVE WHETHER OR NOT THE US MANUFACTURER DELIBERATELY
>USED INDUSTRIAL WHEAT GLUTEN AS A FOOD ADDITIVE?
>


You really think multiple food companies around the world intentionly
chose to import industrial plastic as cat food?

You think they really wanted to risk their repuations and face
lawsuits over this?

And doesn't it seem odd that companies around the world had the same
problem with wheat gluten, rice gluten, AND corn gluten - all at the
same time?

You think it is more likely that China is telling the truth? They are
known for not requiring health and safety rules that we require. Have
you seen how they sell live animals in their markets? Live cats
trapped in tiny cages with dead cats and feces. Being sold for
somebody's dinner? Do you think they care if our cats die?

Are you aware of where a lot of diseases start? Bird flue? SARS? There
are reasons for that - poor hygiene in regard to food.

Meghan Noecker
April 27th 07, 08:29 AM
On 26 Apr 2007 23:47:21 -0700, NedF > wrote:

>google groups sucks for posting. If you read the blog I linked to
>above, you'd be better informed on this issue.


You might quote part of what you are replying to.

Unless the post is download at the same time as the post it is
replying to, there will be no reference in the reader showing who it
is replying to.

I also checked google, and their site doesn't seem to show the tree
format anybody, just a list of posts with no way to see how the posts
relate to each other.

It makes it a lot easier to follow a conversation if you include at
least a little section of what you are replying to.

NedF
April 27th 07, 05:42 PM
You are obviously narrow minded and uninformed. I have neither the
time nor inclination to educate someone too lazy to read the above
posts. But don't let that stop your trolling.

On Apr 27, 12:13 am, Meghan Noecker > wrote:
> On 26 Apr 2007 23:38:20 -0700, NedF > wrote:
>
>
>
> >On Apr 26, 10:56 pm, Meghan Noecker > wrote:
> >> On 26 Apr 2007 19:55:47 -0700, NedF > wrote:
>
> >> >Actually, the chinese said "The ministry said the contaminated
> >> >vegetable protein managed to get past customs without inspection
> >> >because it had not been declared for use in pet food." according to
> >> >ichmo. I would not find it a big stretch that the American supplier
> >> >bought the low grade industrial stuff thinking they could get away
> >> >with it. The only way to know would be to see what the invoice says.
> >> >It's easy to blame the Chinese though, since they have a well known
> >> >corruption problem at all levels of government.
>
> >> What other purpose would there be for the wheat and rice gluten? Other
> >> than people or pet food?
>
> >PLASTICS MANUFACTURING
>
> So a companymaking plastic would intentionally buy wheat or rice
> gluten?
>
> If so, would it be more or less valuable to them if it had melamine in
> it? It seems odd that it would be labeled wheat gluten if the
> customer would actually prefer it to have melaine in it. And there
> would be reaon to not mention the melamine if it wasn't intended to be
> used as food.


On Apr 27, 12:24 am, Meghan Noecker > wrote:
> On 26 Apr 2007 23:45:47 -0700, NedF > wrote:
>
> >YOU HAVE TO PROVE THAT BEFORE ANY ACTION CAN BE TAKEN. WOULDN'T YOU
> >ALSO WANT TO PROVE WHETHER OR NOT THE US MANUFACTURER DELIBERATELY
> >USED INDUSTRIAL WHEAT GLUTEN AS A FOOD ADDITIVE?
>
> You really think multiple food companies around the world intentionly
> chose to import industrial plastic as cat food?
>
> You think they really wanted to risk their repuations and face
> lawsuits over this?
>
> And doesn't it seem odd that companies around the world had the same
> problem with wheat gluten, rice gluten, AND corn gluten - all at the
> same time?
>
> You think it is more likely that China is telling the truth? They are
> known for not requiring health and safety rules that we require. Have
> you seen how they sell live animals in their markets? Live cats
> trapped in tiny cages with dead cats and feces. Being sold for
> somebody's dinner? Do you think they care if our cats die?
>
> Are you aware of where a lot of diseases start? Bird flue? SARS? There
> are reasons for that - poor hygiene in regard to food.

NedF
April 27th 07, 05:43 PM
On Apr 27, 12:29 am, Meghan Noecker > wrote:
> On 26 Apr 2007 23:47:21 -0700, NedF > wrote:
>
> >google groups sucks for posting. If you read the blog I linked to
> >above, you'd be better informed on this issue.
>
> You might quote part of what you are replying to.

Why? You won't read it. Bye troll.

PawsForThought
April 27th 07, 05:45 PM
On Apr 26, 11:16 pm, NedF > wrote:
> I just tried the Felidae for my cat and she vomited it up right back
> into her bowl. :(
> Luckily, Trader Joe's is selling their canned cat food again so it's
> back to that and I hope it will continue to be safe. My cat is so old
> I'm afraid any little thing is going to do her in! She's been
> surviving mostly on Beechnut baby food for the past 2 weeks and I know
> it's not good to feed her that for very long.
>
> Here is a pic of my kitty:
>
> http://i163.photobucket.com/albums/t314/fatmohawk/printythun.jpg

Very cute kitty :)
If you have a Whole Foods market near you, they have their own brand
of petfood that is supposed to be safe. There is also another brand,
Petguard, that they carry. As always though, I would always recommend
checking directly with the petfood company to ensure the food is safe
(until they recall it, of course).

I feed my cats a raw homemade diet. Yes it's definitely more work,
but I've never been happier that I feed them that than now with all
these recalls. Very scarey times for our furkids.

Meghan Noecker
April 28th 07, 12:26 AM
On 27 Apr 2007 09:42:27 -0700, NedF > wrote:

>You are obviously narrow minded and uninformed. I have neither the
>time nor inclination to educate someone too lazy to read the above
>posts. But don't let that stop your trolling.


You are obviously new to usenet and do not understand the system. It
is considered netiquette to quote some of what you are replying to.

And anybody with a real newsreader knows that the posts you are gone
once they are deleted off your own server, so I cannot go back and
read the above posts since there are no posts above.

If I go to google's webpage, I can read all previous posts, but they
are not shown in a tree format, so while I can read all of your posts,
there is no clue showing who you are replying to.

If you want to be taken serious, learn about usenet (not google
groups) before you respond to a valid post.

Meghan Noecker
April 28th 07, 12:28 AM
On 27 Apr 2007 09:43:28 -0700, NedF > wrote:

>On Apr 27, 12:29 am, Meghan Noecker > wrote:
>> On 26 Apr 2007 23:47:21 -0700, NedF > wrote:
>>
>> >google groups sucks for posting. If you read the blog I linked to
>> >above, you'd be better informed on this issue.
>>
>> You might quote part of what you are replying to.
>
>Why? You won't read it. Bye troll.


I've been on usenet since 1993. I am not a troll. Just because you are
new to usenet does not mean a person you don't know is a troll.

And if you did quote something, I would have read it, known who you
were replying to, and gone on to the next post without commenting.

Bluedove
April 28th 07, 12:29 AM
Hi Ned,

So far, so good, with the California Natural brand. The "Chicken and Rice"
dry cat food I bought does not* have any fish in it, as far as I could tell
with the ingredients, and believe me, I read them and study them like a
doctoral student under going her thesis these days.

Heck, it took me at least 15 minutes reading all of the by products crap,
etc, that is all of of the ingredients of popular and common cat food that
my Publix grocery carries. I have up, and said to heck with it, I'm calling
my vet and buying that "Califronia Natural" that I was so impressed with
months ago before this %$#& recall stuff happened.

And, as I said in my prior post, I am still left wondering just *why would*
Nutro use a different* wheat gluten source (or whatever* is the toxin is
that they have recalled that is in their products) for their popular Dry
foods!? I think this is the 'tip of the iceberg', so to speak.

Slim/ML





"NedF" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> I don't know about California Natural quality but their website is
> excellent as far as information about what's in their food and why
> it's there. Check out the ingredients section at the bottom of this
> page: http://www.californianaturalpet.com/products/default.asp?id=1007
> You can click on each ingredient and it says what it is and why it's
> there! I'd try that food if my cat wasn't allergic to fish!
>
> On Apr 26, 5:42 pm, "Bluedove" <[email protected] home.com> wrote:
> > Ned,
> >
> > All I can say is... Wow! I am with you as far as just simply cooking
for my
> > guys. Or, since I am far too busy to do this everyday, more
realistically,
> > I guess I can buy Gerber baby food jars of a huge variety and feed them
> > that, but I know that it would not* meet all of their different
nutritional
> > needs. but thanks for sending this interesting article/blog.
> >
> > I finally called a vet here in Tally that I trust and went by yesterday
> > after I got off work & bought an 8 LB bag of (chicken and rice)
"California
> > Natural" dry. Anybody have comments on this brand? If so, pleease let
me
> > know what your thoughts and experience is with this brand. My guys
really
> > like it alot when I bought it in the past before all this recall
nightmare,
> > and I was very impressed with all of the ingredients. I drilled the
poor
> > vet techs behind the desk before I bought it and finally was assured it
is
> > 'safe', but my thoughts are, honestly, do we really* know what brand is*
> > safe now, and what isn't safe, since there is a new darn list that seems
to
> > come out everyday now. I digress.
> >
> > BTW, thanks to all who have responded to my post, I've read them all and
> > appreciate your comments!
> >
> > ML
> >
> > "NedF" > wrote in message
> >
> > ups.com...
> >
> > > In regards to imported wheat gluten, I was reading this guy's blog -
> > >http://evansmediausa.blog.com/1709130/
> > > and I found this bit really disturbing:
> >
> > > "****According to an AP news release on April 20, the Chinese
> > > authorities had told the FDA that the wheat gluten was an industrial
> > > product not meant for pet food.****
> >
> > > This is the pivotal point. Was there any deliberate contamination by
> > > the Chinese, and if so, why? Melamine is more costly than gluten.
> >
> > > The FDA's Dr. Sundlof stated at the onset of this debacle that
> > > melamine is used in the manufacture of plastics and may have been
> > > deliberately added as a cheap fake protein supplement to inflate the
> > > protein content. But gluten, be it of corn, wheat or rice origin, is
> > > used in the manufacture of new generation biodegradable plastic
> > > utensils, grocery bags etc.
> >
> > > This leaves me with the terrible thought that the multinational pet
> > > food industry, following the economistic mandate of lowest-cost feed
> > > formulation based on simplistic nitrogen/protein and other ingredient
> > > assays in their 'scientific' formulation of 'balanced' diets for pets,
> > > thought they could get a good deal by incorporating industrial grade
> > > product gluten in pet foods. But what they actually purchased on the
> > > world market was never intended for human or animal consumption, but
> > > for the manufacture of biodegradable food containers, utensils and
> > > plastic shopping bags. This is essentially what went into pet foods,
> > > causing untold numbers to suffer, and many to die. May be industrial
> > > grade soy with melamine, imported from China, is also in some
> > > manufactured pet foods, and these will be on recall next.
> >
> > > The high morbidity and mortality rate in dogs and cats associated with
> > > this largest pet food recall ever could well have been aggravated by
> > > other chemical contaminants in pet foods that can harm the kidneys,
> > > liver, digestive, endocrine, immune and other systems of our animal
> > > companions. And the industrial crops of corn, wheat and rice, and
> > > possibly soy, grown in China for biodegradable plastic manufacture,
> > > could well have been genetically engineered, raising additional health
> > > and environmental concerns. But the details of this may never be fully
> > > unraveled."
> >
> > > I think I'll just start growing my own food!
>
>

NedF
April 28th 07, 04:41 AM
On Apr 27, 9:45 am, PawsForThought > wrote:

>
> Very cute kitty :)
> If you have a Whole Foods market near you, they have their own brand
> of petfood that is supposed to be safe. There is also another brand,
> Petguard, that they carry. As always though, I would always recommend
> checking directly with the petfood company to ensure the food is safe
> (until they recall it, of course).
>
> I feed my cats a raw homemade diet. Yes it's definitely more work,
> but I've never been happier that I feed them that than now with all
> these recalls. Very scarey times for our furkids.

Hi,
There is a Whole Foods market nearby so I may try that. Thanks for the
suggestion. I tried the raw diet for my cat, and while she would eat
it, I was totally grossed out by it! I just can't stand the smell of
raw meat. Uck! I'm tempted to go back to making it though!

NedF
April 28th 07, 04:59 AM
Hi,
I wish I could feed my cat that California Natural dry - it looks like
a high quality food. My cat can't chew dry food though, so it's canned
only for her. I'm tempted to try the canned even if it has fish. I did
notice something unusual on their site - the "brown rice" ingredient
is no longer clickable. I really hope they're just updating the
infomation and not something more sinister.

Does Nutro use a different manufacturer for their dry food? I'm not
really clear on who decides (the pet food company or their
manufacturer) where the ingredients come from. It seems like some pet
food companys are letting the manufacturers decide where they get
their ingredients. This situation has become so huge I can't keep
track of all the details anymore!

On Apr 27, 4:29 pm, "Bluedove" <[email protected] home.com> wrote:
> Hi Ned,
>
> So far, so good, with the California Natural brand. The "Chicken and Rice"
> dry cat food I bought does not* have any fish in it, as far as I could tell
> with the ingredients, and believe me, I read them and study them like a
> doctoral student under going her thesis these days.
>
> Heck, it took me at least 15 minutes reading all of the by products crap,
> etc, that is all of of the ingredients of popular and common cat food that
> my Publix grocery carries. I have up, and said to heck with it, I'm calling
> my vet and buying that "Califronia Natural" that I was so impressed with
> months ago before this %$#& recall stuff happened.
>
> And, as I said in my prior post, I am still left wondering just *why would*
> Nutro use a different* wheat gluten source (or whatever* is the toxin is
> that they have recalled that is in their products) for their popular Dry
> foods!? I think this is the 'tip of the iceberg', so to speak.
>
> Slim/ML
>
> "NedF" > wrote in message
>
> oups.com...
>
> > I don't know about California Natural quality but their website is
> > excellent as far as information about what's in their food and why
> > it's there. Check out the ingredients section at the bottom of this
> > page:http://www.californianaturalpet.com/products/default.asp?id=1007
> > You can click on each ingredient and it says what it is and why it's
> > there! I'd try that food if my cat wasn't allergic to fish!
>
> > On Apr 26, 5:42 pm, "Bluedove" <Blued[email protected] home.com> wrote:
> > > Ned,
>
> > > All I can say is... Wow! I am with you as far as just simply cooking
> for my
> > > guys. Or, since I am far too busy to do this everyday, more
> realistically,
> > > I guess I can buy Gerber baby food jars of a huge variety and feed them
> > > that, but I know that it would not* meet all of their different
> nutritional
> > > needs. but thanks for sending this interesting article/blog.
>
> > > I finally called a vet here in Tally that I trust and went by yesterday
> > > after I got off work & bought an 8 LB bag of (chicken and rice)
> "California
> > > Natural" dry. Anybody have comments on this brand? If so, pleease let
> me
> > > know what your thoughts and experience is with this brand. My guys
> really
> > > like it alot when I bought it in the past before all this recall
> nightmare,
> > > and I was very impressed with all of the ingredients. I drilled the
> poor
> > > vet techs behind the desk before I bought it and finally was assured it
> is
> > > 'safe', but my thoughts are, honestly, do we really* know what brand is*
> > > safe now, and what isn't safe, since there is a new darn list that seems
> to
> > > come out everyday now. I digress.
>
> > > BTW, thanks to all who have responded to my post, I've read them all and
> > > appreciate your comments!
>
> > > ML
>
> > > "NedF" > wrote in message
>
> > ups.com...
>
> > > > In regards to imported wheat gluten, I was reading this guy's blog -
> > > >http://evansmediausa.blog.com/1709130/
> > > > and I found this bit really disturbing:
>
> > > > "****According to an AP news release on April 20, the Chinese
> > > > authorities had told the FDA that the wheat gluten was an industrial
> > > > product not meant for pet food.****
>
> > > > This is the pivotal point. Was there any deliberate contamination by
> > > > the Chinese, and if so, why? Melamine is more costly than gluten.
>
> > > > The FDA's Dr. Sundlof stated at the onset of this debacle that
> > > > melamine is used in the manufacture of plastics and may have been
> > > > deliberately added as a cheap fake protein supplement to inflate the
> > > > protein content. But gluten, be it of corn, wheat or rice origin, is
> > > > used in the manufacture of new generation biodegradable plastic
> > > > utensils, grocery bags etc.
>
> > > > This leaves me with the terrible thought that the multinational pet
> > > > food industry, following the economistic mandate of lowest-cost feed
> > > > formulation based on simplistic nitrogen/protein and other ingredient
> > > > assays in their 'scientific' formulation of 'balanced' diets for pets,
> > > > thought they could get a good deal by incorporating industrial grade
> > > > product gluten in pet foods. But what they actually purchased on the
> > > > world market was never intended for human or animal consumption, but
> > > > for the manufacture of biodegradable food containers, utensils and
> > > > plastic shopping bags. This is essentially what went into pet foods,
> > > > causing untold numbers to suffer, and many to die. May be industrial
> > > > grade soy with melamine, imported from China, is also in some
> > > > manufactured pet foods, and these will be on recall next.
>
> > > > The high morbidity and mortality rate in dogs and cats associated with
> > > > this largest pet food recall ever could well have been aggravated by
> > > > other chemical contaminants in pet foods that can harm the kidneys,
> > > > liver, digestive, endocrine, immune and other systems of our animal
> > > > companions. And the industrial crops of corn, wheat and rice, and
> > > > possibly soy, grown in China for biodegradable plastic manufacture,
> > > > could well have been genetically engineered, raising additional health
> > > > and environmental concerns. But the details of this may never be fully
> > > > unraveled."
>
> > > > I think I'll just start growing my own food!

Luna's Mom[_2_]
April 28th 07, 05:12 PM
NedF wrote:

>
> Does Nutro use a different manufacturer for their dry food? I'm not
> really clear on who decides (the pet food company or their
> manufacturer) where the ingredients come from. It seems like some pet
> food companys are letting the manufacturers decide where they get
> their ingredients. This situation has become so huge I can't keep
> track of all the details anymore!

Nutro does claim that they use a different manufacturer for their dry
food and that all of their dry food is made here and from american
companies...if I understood their updates correctly. If you go to their
website, you can read them there. http://www.nutroproducts.com/

Pam

Bluedove
April 28th 07, 08:36 PM
"NedF" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> On Apr 27, 9:45 am, PawsForThought > wrote:
>
> >
> > Very cute kitty :)
> > If you have a Whole Foods market near you, they have their own brand
> > of petfood that is supposed to be safe. There is also another brand,
> > Petguard, that they carry. As always though, I would always recommend
> > checking directly with the petfood company to ensure the food is safe
> > (until they recall it, of course).
> >
> > I feed my cats a raw homemade diet. Yes it's definitely more work,
> > but I've never been happier that I feed them that than now with all
> > these recalls. Very scarey times for our furkids.
>



> Hi,
> There is a Whole Foods market nearby so I may try that. Thanks for the
> suggestion. I tried the raw diet for my cat, and while she would eat
> it, I was totally grossed out by it! I just can't stand the smell of
> raw meat. Uck! I'm tempted to go back to making it though!


**Ned,

You might want to buy Gerber brand jars of baby food and fee this to you
cat. I have done this many times in the past, when Blue was ill or just not
eating. The 'Veal' 'Turkey' and 'Ham' were his favorites. Sometimes, I'd
but the 'carrot' kind and mix that in with the Veal. All my kitties love
it when I buy it for them and now I think that what I will be doing also.
You can 'jazz it up' by either warming it slightly and/or, adding salt on it
which I often did for Blue. If you have never bought Gerber ( that's the
brand I'd personally recommend), I think you and your cat will be very
pleased. I always noticed when Blue was having stomach and many different
health issues, he'd always seem to 'spring back' after eating the baby food.
I would pour the whole jar on a saucer for him and he'd lick away :-). I
figured, if it's safe for babies... well.

Also, if this is a long term type of feeding, then I'd call a good, trusted
Vet and request them to concoct a special cat multi-vitamin with taurine
etc, in compound-( power), especially for your Kitty. And, I would remind
them of your cats exact weight. Then you pick up it at a pharmacy that makes
special request compounds, and you'll be all set to just mix some in with
his food.


Good luck,

ML