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RPSinha
October 23rd 07, 10:04 AM
I have informally referred to "my cat" in a few post, but she belongs
to friends who are out of the country for several months and have asked
us to care for her. If they had lived in another city or even part of
town I would have officially brought her to my home. But they live two
houses down with connected yards and the cat, being indoor-outdoor, has
always gone back and forth. That has made the transition very smooth
for her.

I tried to feed her at "her " house but I would seldom find her when I
went and didn't want to leave kibble. So with some effort, I have
taught her to come to me for food. This is working smoothly: she is
outside all day, comes to my house in the evening to eat and sleep (she
has slowly started spending the night in our living room), wakes me up
at 5AM to eat, and then she goes out. Great, except for 5AM.

The funny part is, she is very dry and business like.

If she is still hungry, she just looks at me like "more".

When she is satisfied, she walks past like I was transparent and goes
straight to her chosen couch in my living room.

When she shows up to wake me up at 5AM, there is no other interaction
besides "give me food and open the door".

She is ok to touch but won't let us pick her up for more than a second.

My friends had adopted her recently and told me she was very friendly.
Well, not to me in the sense I understand the term!

Maybe she is missing them...but...is there anything I can do to make
her like me? :)

Oh, and she doesn't drink water as far as I can see. I hope that's ok
because I am feeding her 100% canned diet.

Thanks for any thoughts!

studio
October 23rd 07, 11:48 AM
On Oct 23, 5:04 am, RPSinha > wrote:
> When she is satisfied, she walks past like I was transparent and goes
> straight to her chosen couch in my living room.

Uh.... yeah.

> When she shows up to wake me up at 5AM, there is no other interaction
> besides "give me food and open the door".

My Big Mama is the same way.
She has her breakfast, then she wants to go out to use the bathroom.
The nature of cats domestication is to keep a "buffer zone" between
human
and cat...they stay close, but not too close.

Read my post on domestication of the cat for further understanding:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.pets.cats/browse_thread/thread/59973965327af635/70970309b1fb8dd7?hl=en#70970309b1fb8dd7

> Maybe she is missing them...but...is there anything I can do to make
> her like me? :)

Be very gentle with her, pet her softly, whisper to her, play with
her,
brush her, protect her...and she will like you.
You have to be patient and build trust first...this can take time, but
you
are on your way.

> Oh, and she doesn't drink water as far as I can see. I hope that's ok
> because I am feeding her 100% canned diet.

Make sure she has clean fresh water and some kibble daily anyway.

RPSinha
October 23rd 07, 11:59 AM
studio > wrote:

: Make sure she has clean fresh water and some kibble daily anyway.

She always has water, and she might even be taking a few sips, what I
meant was that I haven't seen her drink.

But why kibble? From all I have read, it is bad for cats and should be
avoided.

honeybunch
October 23rd 07, 02:10 PM
On Oct 23, 6:59 am, RPSinha > wrote:
> studio > wrote:
>
> : Make sure she has clean fresh water and some kibble daily anyway.
>
> She always has water, and she might even be taking a few sips, what I
> meant was that I haven't seen her drink.
>
> But why kibble? From all I have read, it is bad for cats and should be
> avoided.

You are very sweet to want affection from a cat. I dont think the
kibble is a good idea healthwise. But the other ideas people have
given are good ones. You must appeal to her pleasure centers of
course, selfish as cats are. Daily brushing with a rubber brush is
one good way. Play toys for the evening and catnip are other ways.
Plopping her on your lap at night while youre reading or watching tv
and then scratching her ears and neck are pretty good too. You also
could sing to her close up when she is trying to sleep while your
scratching her ears.

Dan Espen
October 23rd 07, 03:50 PM
RPSinha > writes:

> I have informally referred to "my cat" in a few post, but she belongs
> to friends who are out of the country for several months and have asked
> us to care for her. If they had lived in another city or even part of
> town I would have officially brought her to my home. But they live two
> houses down with connected yards and the cat, being indoor-outdoor, has
> always gone back and forth. That has made the transition very smooth
> for her.
>
> I tried to feed her at "her " house but I would seldom find her when I
> went and didn't want to leave kibble. So with some effort, I have
> taught her to come to me for food. This is working smoothly: she is
> outside all day, comes to my house in the evening to eat and sleep (she
> has slowly started spending the night in our living room), wakes me up
> at 5AM to eat, and then she goes out. Great, except for 5AM.
>
> The funny part is, she is very dry and business like.

I think that's about all you're going to get out of an outdoor cat.
She has a very interesting world outside. You're just an easy
source of food.

At least that's my experience.

RPSinha
October 23rd 07, 07:19 PM
honeybunch > wrote:

: You are very sweet to want affection from a cat. I dont think the
: kibble is a good idea healthwise.

Everything I have read says to avoid kibble, except maybe rarely, just
to keep her used to accepting kibble for those times when she may have
to. I was thinking one meal every two weeks or so.

Another idea, thanks to a friend, was that bad as kibble is, it is
probably better but certainly no worse than "treats"! So if it is not
part of her regular diet, it could function as "treat" for her. Haven't
tried that yet. :)

: But the other ideas people have
: given are good ones. You must appeal to her pleasure centers of
: course, selfish as cats are. Daily brushing with a rubber brush is
: one good way. Play toys for the evening and catnip are other ways.
: Plopping her on your lap at night while youre reading or watching tv
: and then scratching her ears and neck are pretty good too. You also
: could sing to her close up when she is trying to sleep while your
: scratching her ears.

Thanks. I am also trying to see it from her view point. If she was
indoor only, she would want/need to play. However, she comes exhausted
after a whole day's of running around, wants to eat and falls sleep.
Then she does sleep soundly all night until 5AM.

So I should think in terms peaceful interactions while she is going to
sleep, or when she wakes up...

She would certainly be ok with me sitting next to her and interact
gently while she is going to sleep. In the morning she is more rushed
because she wants to eat and run out (maybe has to go to bathroom, I
don't know, but she has never used the litter-box we put here); I am
also barely sleepwalking at 5AM. So some lullaby and brushing in the
evening would seem to be the best start!

Thanks.

CatNipped[_2_]
October 23rd 07, 07:41 PM
"RPSinha" > wrote in message
...
> honeybunch > wrote:
>
> : You are very sweet to want affection from a cat. I dont think the
> : kibble is a good idea healthwise.
>
> Everything I have read says to avoid kibble, except maybe rarely, just
> to keep her used to accepting kibble for those times when she may have
> to. I was thinking one meal every two weeks or so.
>
> Another idea, thanks to a friend, was that bad as kibble is, it is
> probably better but certainly no worse than "treats"! So if it is not
> part of her regular diet, it could function as "treat" for her. Haven't
> tried that yet. :)

I use the Purina Fancy Feast Gourmet Gold dry food as treats - the stuff is
like kitty crack, Ozzy has even leared how to open the can to get at them:
http://www.PossiblePlaces.com/CatNipped/Treats.mpg!

Hugs,

CatNipped

>
> : But the other ideas people have
> : given are good ones. You must appeal to her pleasure centers of
> : course, selfish as cats are. Daily brushing with a rubber brush is
> : one good way. Play toys for the evening and catnip are other ways.
> : Plopping her on your lap at night while youre reading or watching tv
> : and then scratching her ears and neck are pretty good too. You also
> : could sing to her close up when she is trying to sleep while your
> : scratching her ears.
>
> Thanks. I am also trying to see it from her view point. If she was
> indoor only, she would want/need to play. However, she comes exhausted
> after a whole day's of running around, wants to eat and falls sleep.
> Then she does sleep soundly all night until 5AM.
>
> So I should think in terms peaceful interactions while she is going to
> sleep, or when she wakes up...
>
> She would certainly be ok with me sitting next to her and interact
> gently while she is going to sleep. In the morning she is more rushed
> because she wants to eat and run out (maybe has to go to bathroom, I
> don't know, but she has never used the litter-box we put here); I am
> also barely sleepwalking at 5AM. So some lullaby and brushing in the
> evening would seem to be the best start!
>
> Thanks.

studio
October 23rd 07, 08:32 PM
On Oct 23, 6:59 am, RPSinha > wrote:
> But why kibble? From all I have read, it is bad for cats and should be
> avoided.

That's news to me, I've never heard of such a thing.
It is true some types of kibble are like junk food, but
good types of kibble isn't bad for them...
some cats live (and thrive) on nothing but kibble.

Kibble has a certain amount of dietary fiber, introduces crude
forms of vegetables and vitamins into their diet that is beneficial
IMHO.
It also serves as something hard for them to chew on
and can help keep their teeth clean.

supercat
October 23rd 07, 08:35 PM
On Oct 23, 10:04 am, RPSinha > wrote:
> I have informally referred to "my cat" in a few post, but she belongs
> to friends who are out of the country for several months and have asked
> us to care for her. If they had lived in another city or even part of
> town I would have officially brought her to my home. But they live two
> houses down with connected yards and the cat, being indoor-outdoor, has
> always gone back and forth. That has made the transition very smooth
> for her.
>
> I tried to feed her at "her " house but I would seldom find her when I
> went and didn't want to leave kibble. So with some effort, I have
> taught her to come to me for food. This is working smoothly: she is
> outside all day, comes to my house in the evening to eat and sleep (she
> has slowly started spending the night in our living room), wakes me up
> at 5AM to eat, and then she goes out. Great, except for 5AM.
>
> The funny part is, she is very dry and business like.
>
> If she is still hungry, she just looks at me like "more".
>
> When she is satisfied, she walks past like I was transparent and goes
> straight to her chosen couch in my living room.
>
> When she shows up to wake me up at 5AM, there is no other interaction
> besides "give me food and open the door".
>
> She is ok to touch but won't let us pick her up for more than a second.
>
> My friends had adopted her recently and told me she was very friendly.
> Well, not to me in the sense I understand the term!
>
> Maybe she is missing them...but...is there anything I can do to make
> her like me? :)
>
> Oh, and she doesn't drink water as far as I can see. I hope that's ok
> because I am feeding her 100% canned diet.
>
> Thanks for any thoughts!

OOOOOH,
There is a chance that she isn't one of those kissy-kissy cats,
maybe you are lookin for too much from her.
Up to now you are just a place of food and shelter.
If its gonna come..... it'll come.
Male's are a lot easier, they are like putty in your hands as they are
programmed to enjoy,
whereas females are hardwired to "set a scene" for the best
reproductive wealth. If you get my drift.
Some are real lovey, but most have that home-maker/mother-protect
mechanism at full stretch.
Advice- dont take it personal........ its not.
She will get to like you.... but its on her terms.
Tim.

RPSinha
October 23rd 07, 09:03 PM
CatNipped > wrote:

: I use the Purina Fancy Feast Gourmet Gold dry food as treats - the stuff is
: like kitty crack, Ozzy has even leared how to open the can to get at them:
: http://www.PossiblePlaces.com/CatNipped/Treats.mpg!

Do you keep it refrigerated? I'd imagine a bag lasts much longer if
used as treat rather than food. Does Qzzy like it cold or room temp?

William Graham
October 23rd 07, 09:04 PM
"RPSinha" > wrote in message
...
>I have informally referred to "my cat" in a few post, but she belongs
> to friends who are out of the country for several months and have asked
> us to care for her. If they had lived in another city or even part of
> town I would have officially brought her to my home. But they live two
> houses down with connected yards and the cat, being indoor-outdoor, has
> always gone back and forth. That has made the transition very smooth
> for her.
>
> I tried to feed her at "her " house but I would seldom find her when I
> went and didn't want to leave kibble. So with some effort, I have
> taught her to come to me for food. This is working smoothly: she is
> outside all day, comes to my house in the evening to eat and sleep (she
> has slowly started spending the night in our living room), wakes me up
> at 5AM to eat, and then she goes out. Great, except for 5AM.
>
> The funny part is, she is very dry and business like.
>
> If she is still hungry, she just looks at me like "more".
>
> When she is satisfied, she walks past like I was transparent and goes
> straight to her chosen couch in my living room.
>
> When she shows up to wake me up at 5AM, there is no other interaction
> besides "give me food and open the door".
>
> She is ok to touch but won't let us pick her up for more than a second.
>
> My friends had adopted her recently and told me she was very friendly.
> Well, not to me in the sense I understand the term!
>
> Maybe she is missing them...but...is there anything I can do to make
> her like me? :)
>
> Oh, and she doesn't drink water as far as I can see. I hope that's ok
> because I am feeding her 100% canned diet.
>
> Thanks for any thoughts!

LOL! - Congratulations....You have a typical cat on your hands! The mere
fact that she spends the nights sleeping at your pad is a major
accomplishment. This means she trusts you to protect her from danger. Cats
rather like being around human beings (even when we don't feed them) but
they don't like letting us know this.
Just keep being nice to her, and pick he up and carry her around a lot,
and feed her whatever she likes whenever she likes it, and pretty soon she
will start returning some love to you.....It takes time to win over a
cat....Any cat........

William Graham
October 23rd 07, 09:07 PM
"RPSinha" > wrote in message
...
> studio > wrote:
>
> : Make sure she has clean fresh water and some kibble daily anyway.
>
> She always has water, and she might even be taking a few sips, what I
> meant was that I haven't seen her drink.
>
> But why kibble? From all I have read, it is bad for cats and should be
> avoided.

Kibble isn't "bad for cats". It should be supplemented with wet food and/or
fresh meat like chicken and fish. It's chief advantage is that being dry, it
doesn't go bad, so if you are hurt or dead, the cats will have a supply of
food that will last for a couple of weeks or more.....

RPSinha
October 23rd 07, 09:09 PM
CatNipped > wrote:

: I use the Purina Fancy Feast Gourmet Gold dry food as treats - the stuff is
: like kitty crack, Ozzy has even leared how to open the can to get at them:
: http://www.PossiblePlaces.com/CatNipped/Treats.mpg !

By the way, great movie!

: Hugs,
:
: CatNipped

William Graham
October 23rd 07, 09:16 PM
"studio" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> On Oct 23, 6:59 am, RPSinha > wrote:
>> But why kibble? From all I have read, it is bad for cats and should be
>> avoided.
>
> That's news to me, I've never heard of such a thing.
> It is true some types of kibble are like junk food, but
> good types of kibble isn't bad for them...
> some cats live (and thrive) on nothing but kibble.
>
> Kibble has a certain amount of dietary fiber, introduces crude
> forms of vegetables and vitamins into their diet that is beneficial
> IMHO.
> It also serves as something hard for them to chew on
> and can help keep their teeth clean.
>
>
My B-K, spent several months during his first year of life living in a
Burger King parking lot, off of French fries, onion rings, and anything that
people threw at him. When I first saw him, it was just before they closed
for the night, and he stood on his hind legs and put one paw on my knee and
scratched at my bag with the other paw and said, "Can I have some of your
burgers, dad?" I picked him up, threw him in the back seat of my car and
said, "You're never gonna have to eat another French fry again for the rest
of your life, fella."

Today, he refuses to eat any human food, and rarely even touches canned cat
food.....He loves kibbles, and eats them almost exclusively. (He does catch
a mouse once in a while.) He can eat anything he wants, but kibbles are his
fare of choice, and he is as healthy as a horse.......

CatNipped[_2_]
October 23rd 07, 09:29 PM
"RPSinha" > wrote in message
...
> CatNipped > wrote:
>
> : I use the Purina Fancy Feast Gourmet Gold dry food as treats - the stuff
> is
> : like kitty crack, Ozzy has even leared how to open the can to get at
> them:
> : http://www.PossiblePlaces.com/CatNipped/Treats.mpg !
>
> By the way, great movie!

Thanks! No, it comes in a zip-lock type bag and I keep a small amount in
the can you saw in the movie (it has a plastic top that snaps on) - that's
enough to keep it fresh enough for them to want to figure out how to open
the can! ;> The can originally came sealed up in plastic in a 35lb.
container of Tidy Cat litter. My cats eat Fancy Feast canned, so I figured
I'd try giving them a few kibbles of this stuff as a treat - they went wild
over it, like I said, "kitty crack"! ;>

>
> : Hugs,
> :
> : CatNipped

CatNipped[_2_]
October 23rd 07, 09:31 PM
"William Graham" > wrote in message
. ..
>
> "RPSinha" > wrote in message
> ...
>> studio > wrote:
>>
>> : Make sure she has clean fresh water and some kibble daily anyway.
>>
>> She always has water, and she might even be taking a few sips, what I
>> meant was that I haven't seen her drink.
>>
>> But why kibble? From all I have read, it is bad for cats and should be
>> avoided.
>
> Kibble isn't "bad for cats". It should be supplemented with wet food
> and/or fresh meat like chicken and fish. It's chief advantage is that
> being dry, it doesn't go bad, so if you are hurt or dead, the cats will
> have a supply of food that will last for a couple of weeks or more.....

LOL! If you die and your body remains in the house, they'll have more than
kibble to dine off of! <ducking and running> ;>

Hugs,

CatNipped

William Graham
October 23rd 07, 09:46 PM
"CatNipped" > wrote in message
...
> "William Graham" > wrote in message
> . ..
>>
>> "RPSinha" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> studio > wrote:
>>>
>>> : Make sure she has clean fresh water and some kibble daily anyway.
>>>
>>> She always has water, and she might even be taking a few sips, what I
>>> meant was that I haven't seen her drink.
>>>
>>> But why kibble? From all I have read, it is bad for cats and should be
>>> avoided.
>>
>> Kibble isn't "bad for cats". It should be supplemented with wet food
>> and/or fresh meat like chicken and fish. It's chief advantage is that
>> being dry, it doesn't go bad, so if you are hurt or dead, the cats will
>> have a supply of food that will last for a couple of weeks or more.....
>
> LOL! If you die and your body remains in the house, they'll have more
> than kibble to dine off of! <ducking and running> ;>
>
> Hugs,
>
> CatNipped
>
That may be true, but I always worry about getting in an auto accident or
something like that, and just never returning to the house.......My cats do
have cat doors so they can enter and exit the house at any time, and most of
them know the neighbors too, but I still keep a "never ending" supply of
kibbles available to them all the time.......

RPSinha
October 23rd 07, 09:46 PM
studio > wrote:

: That's news to me, I've never heard of such a thing.
: It is true some types of kibble are like junk food, but
: good types of kibble isn't bad for them...
: some cats live (and thrive) on nothing but kibble.

Here are some of the links I read:

<http://www.catinfo.org/index.htm>

<http://www.littlebigcat.com/index.php?action=library&act=show&item=004>

<http://www.maxshouse.com/feline_nutrition.htm>

<http://www.maxshouse.com/feline_nutrition.htm#Dry_Food_vs_Canned_Food._
_Which_is_reall>

---MIKE---
October 23rd 07, 11:18 PM
William Graham wrote:

>>It's chief advantage is that being dry, it
>>doesn't go bad, (referring to kibble).

This is not completely true. I had some Friskies Dental Diet get moldy
(turned green). Tiger, who loves this as a treat, wouldn't eat it -
which caused me to look at it very closely.


---MIKE---
>>In the White Mountains of New Hampshire
>> (44 15' N - Elevation 1580')

Upscale
October 23rd 07, 11:53 PM
"studio" > wrote in message
> That's news to me, I've never heard of such a thing.
> It is true some types of kibble are like junk food, but
> good types of kibble isn't bad for them...
> some cats live (and thrive) on nothing but kibble.

I agree with that. When I got my six month old sweetie from the animal
shelter, they were feeding her Performatrim. I weaned her off that and
started feeding her Iams kibble. In fact, that's all she will eat. I can
cook some fish or shrimp or other seafood and she will go nuts with the
smell and be all over me, but if I actually give her some, she won't eat it.
Same with all the cat treats on the market. I've tried several varieties of
canned cat food and she is just not interested. It's Iams Multicat kibble
and water all the way. In one sense it makes her really easy to feed, but I
can't come home with some special treat for her because she just won't eat
it. The best I can do is on occasion she will eat a dime sized piece of
process cheese and maybe take a few licks of ice cream, but that's about it.
Oh yeah, she will eat a small amount of carrot bran muffin, but everything
else I've tried, nadda.

studio
October 24th 07, 03:36 AM
On Oct 23, 6:53 pm, "Upscale" > wrote:
> "studio" > wrote in message
> > That's news to me, I've never heard of such a thing.
> > It is true some types of kibble are like junk food, but
> > good types of kibble isn't bad for them...
> > some cats live (and thrive) on nothing but kibble.
>
> I agree with that. When I got my six month old sweetie from the animal
> shelter, they were feeding her Performatrim. I weaned her off that and
> started feeding her Iams kibble. In fact, that's all she will eat.

Keep offering other foods anyway, at the very least, it satisfies
their
curiousity.

It's somewhat the same with my Big Mama, she will rarely eat
anything humans eat...but I always offer her a piece anyway.
Every once in awhile she will eat 1 or 2 Cherrios, 1 or 2 very small
pieces of cheese, 2-3 very small pieces of fresh cooked chicken,
or 5 or 6 small pieces of wheat bread.
Wheat bread being her favorite...not rye, not white, she won't eat
them.

Not enough to stay alive on, but as more of a small snack.

studio
October 24th 07, 03:41 AM
On Oct 23, 4:16 pm, "William Graham" > wrote:
> My B-K, spent several months during his first year of life living in a
> Burger King parking lot, off of French fries, onion rings, and anything that
> people threw at him. When I first saw him, it was just before they closed
> for the night, and he stood on his hind legs and put one paw on my knee and
> scratched at my bag with the other paw and said, "Can I have some of your
> burgers, dad?" I picked him up, threw him in the back seat of my car and
> said, "You're never gonna have to eat another French fry again for the rest
> of your life, fella."

Good for you Bill.
B-K was obviously a friendly cat and quite possibly abandoned.
He certainly wouldn't have lived long on his previous diet.
But now he has a good life.

studio
October 24th 07, 04:21 AM
On Oct 23, 4:46 pm, RPSinha > wrote:
> Here are some of the links I read:
> _Which_is_reall>

They are all valid...but so are the responses you've read in this
thread.
There is no such thing as "perfection in eating or nutrition", but
only
the best you can do under circumstances you find yourself.

Cats in the wild tend to eat big meals, then go without for days.
Modern domesticated cats tend to eat smaller meals multiple times per
day, and rarely go without.

As long as you are feeding kitty the best you can, with quality food,
to kibble or not to kibble is not so important.

My kitty gets both, and thrives just fine...never any
health problems, happy and content and is 14 years old.

studio
October 24th 07, 04:41 AM
On Oct 23, 2:41 pm, "CatNipped" > wrote:
> I use the Purina Fancy Feast Gourmet Gold dry food as treats - the stuff is
> like kitty crack, Ozzy has even leared how to open the can to get at them:
http://www.PossiblePlaces.com/CatNipped/Treats.mpg!

Big Mama likes those also...Fancy Feast likes Big Mama, they send her
free samples of their food all the time.

The dark grey cat you have is beautiful.

studio
October 24th 07, 04:53 AM
On Oct 23, 6:53 pm, "Upscale" > wrote:
> Oh yeah, she will eat a small amount of carrot bran muffin, but everything
> else I've tried, nadda.

lol...I've never heard of cats liking carrot-bran muffins...but there
are cats out there that will eat almost anything.
I have seen pics of a cat eating raw carrots!...amongst other veggies.

And just like Bill Graham said, his B-K was eating onion rings from
Burger King out of desperation.

In some of the premium cat foods, it's not uncommon to find peas
and other small bits of vegetables.

William Graham
October 24th 07, 05:40 AM
"studio" > wrote in message
ps.com...
> On Oct 23, 6:53 pm, "Upscale" > wrote:
>> "studio" > wrote in message
>> > That's news to me, I've never heard of such a thing.
>> > It is true some types of kibble are like junk food, but
>> > good types of kibble isn't bad for them...
>> > some cats live (and thrive) on nothing but kibble.
>>
>> I agree with that. When I got my six month old sweetie from the animal
>> shelter, they were feeding her Performatrim. I weaned her off that and
>> started feeding her Iams kibble. In fact, that's all she will eat.
>
> Keep offering other foods anyway, at the very least, it satisfies
> their
> curiousity.
>
> It's somewhat the same with my Big Mama, she will rarely eat
> anything humans eat...but I always offer her a piece anyway.
> Every once in awhile she will eat 1 or 2 Cherrios, 1 or 2 very small
> pieces of cheese, 2-3 very small pieces of fresh cooked chicken,
> or 5 or 6 small pieces of wheat bread.
> Wheat bread being her favorite...not rye, not white, she won't eat
> them.
>
> Not enough to stay alive on, but as more of a small snack.

I have one that will eat small pieces of cake or donuts, but never enough to
make me worry about her nutrition......I think she eats it just to be
polite......
>

RPSinha
October 24th 07, 06:28 AM
studio > wrote:

: In some of the premium cat foods, it's not uncommon to find peas
: and other small bits of vegetables.

I believe they are meant to appeal not to the cats but to their owners.
It's the market place, whatever works. :)

RPSinha
October 24th 07, 06:31 AM
William Graham > wrote:

: My B-K, spent several months during his first year of life living in a
: Burger King parking lot, off of French fries, onion rings, and anything that
: people threw at him. When I first saw him, it was just before they closed
: for the night, and he stood on his hind legs and put one paw on my knee and
: scratched at my bag with the other paw and said, "Can I have some of your
: burgers, dad?" I picked him up, threw him in the back seat of my car and
: said, "You're never gonna have to eat another French fry again for the rest
: of your life, fella."

Great heartwarming story. I wish we could say the same to every human
who visits those places too. Now, you don't go there often, do you?
:-)

RPSinha
October 24th 07, 06:38 AM
Great stories and discussions. Some of you have misunderstood me: I am
really enjoying this cat, it's all fun.

Anyway, today the ice melted just a little.

Everyday, after she finishes eating, she quietly--and rather
majesticlly--marches towards her chosen "bed", ie, our softest and most
expensive comforter, ignoring me totally.

Today, however, she said a faint friendly meow just as she passed me,
as she kept walking. The tone sounded like "hello". I was delighted. :)

RPSinha
October 24th 07, 06:56 AM
William Graham > wrote:

: LOL! - Congratulations....You have a typical cat on your hands! The mere
: fact that she spends the nights sleeping at your pad is a major
: accomplishment. This means she trusts you to protect her from danger.

Yes I realize and appreciate that. It is also extremely convenient and
practical for both of us. She takes care of both meals, one long sleep,
safety and comfort during the night, all in one visit.

It's good that she knew us, our yard, and our home before we had to
care for her; that made the transition very smooth.

Her home has a cat door, but obviously she doesn't like being alone at
night. She does visit there everyday, at least the yard. Sometimes I
can see her there from my yard. She is also keeping up her social life
with other cats.

I also make it a point to visit her home every few days for a while
(read a paper or watch news there). This is just to keep an eye on
things, and take care of mail etc, but probably also makes her feel
that her home is alive, because she keeps an eye and notices such
activity even if she is outside somewhere.

All in all, a really smart and graceful cat. Before we just found her
cute but paid no attention beyond that. Now, we are really impressed
and appreciative.

William Graham
October 24th 07, 07:09 AM
"RPSinha" > wrote in message
...
> William Graham > wrote:
>
> : My B-K, spent several months during his first year of life living in a
> : Burger King parking lot, off of French fries, onion rings, and anything
> that
> : people threw at him. When I first saw him, it was just before they
> closed
> : for the night, and he stood on his hind legs and put one paw on my knee
> and
> : scratched at my bag with the other paw and said, "Can I have some of
> your
> : burgers, dad?" I picked him up, threw him in the back seat of my car and
> : said, "You're never gonna have to eat another French fry again for the
> rest
> : of your life, fella."
>
> Great heartwarming story. I wish we could say the same to every human
> who visits those places too. Now, you don't go there often, do you?
> :-)
No, not really.....I have band practice every Wednesday night during the
school year.....It is over at 9:30 PM. I usually stop at some fast food
place or other on my way home and get something to go for my wife and
myself....We would eat better, but there aren't many decent places open at
that hour here in the "sticks"..... We don't want to cook that late, either,
so buying fast food on Wednesdays is a tradition.....Sometimes it's Pizza,
sometimes it's Mexican (there's an all night Mexican place open that's
pretty good) On the Wednesday before Thanksgiving 2004, I decided to stop at
Burger King and get us a couple of, "Whoppers".....I'm very glad I did,
because I met B-K, and he is a great cat.....

William Graham
October 24th 07, 07:19 AM
"RPSinha" > wrote in message
...
> William Graham > wrote:
>
> : LOL! - Congratulations....You have a typical cat on your hands! The mere
> : fact that she spends the nights sleeping at your pad is a major
> : accomplishment. This means she trusts you to protect her from danger.
>
> Yes I realize and appreciate that. It is also extremely convenient and
> practical for both of us. She takes care of both meals, one long sleep,
> safety and comfort during the night, all in one visit.
>
> It's good that she knew us, our yard, and our home before we had to
> care for her; that made the transition very smooth.
>
> Her home has a cat door, but obviously she doesn't like being alone at
> night. She does visit there everyday, at least the yard. Sometimes I
> can see her there from my yard. She is also keeping up her social life
> with other cats.
>
> I also make it a point to visit her home every few days for a while
> (read a paper or watch news there). This is just to keep an eye on
> things, and take care of mail etc, but probably also makes her feel
> that her home is alive, because she keeps an eye and notices such
> activity even if she is outside somewhere.
>
> All in all, a really smart and graceful cat. Before we just found her
> cute but paid no attention beyond that. Now, we are really impressed
> and appreciative.

Some cats are very gregarious, and have several homes....We have one,
"Meggie" who rode all the way our West from Connecticut with her owners in
their car. Then, after they bought the house across the street, they got a
dog.....Meggie couldn't stand the dog, so she went to every house on the
block looking for one without a dog. We were the only one, so she moved in
with us.....My wife would take her back across the street, but Meggie would
beat her home. After a bit, the neighbors told us we could have her, and
they got another dog......When I brought B-K home, she took to him right
away, and brought him to all the other houses on the block and introduced
him to them! They are both great cats with lots of personality.......In
spite of the dogs, Meggie still goes back across the street occasionally and
says hi to her old owners. She also likes to wait by the mailboxes (they are
all together here in one spot) and greet all the neighbors when they come to
pick up their mail.

William Graham
October 24th 07, 07:21 AM
"RPSinha" > wrote in message
...
> Great stories and discussions. Some of you have misunderstood me: I am
> really enjoying this cat, it's all fun.
>
> Anyway, today the ice melted just a little.
>
> Everyday, after she finishes eating, she quietly--and rather
> majesticlly--marches towards her chosen "bed", ie, our softest and most
> expensive comforter, ignoring me totally.
>
> Today, however, she said a faint friendly meow just as she passed me,
> as she kept walking. The tone sounded like "hello". I was delighted. :)

Cats usually greet you that way, but their sounds are so quiet and subtle
that I usually don't hear them.

studio
October 24th 07, 07:39 AM
On Oct 24, 1:38 am, RPSinha > wrote:
> Great stories and discussions. Some of you have misunderstood me: I am
> really enjoying this cat, it's all fun.

For the most part, cats are easy to take care of.
You came to the right place, as we all here enjoy our cats
and like to share stories, learn and help if we can.

> Today, however, she said a faint friendly meow just as she passed me,
> as she kept walking. The tone sounded like "hello". I was delighted. :)

I doubt it was a "hello"...most likely something else.
Cat language is another topic of interest here.

Isn't it interesting that people are supposed to be so much smarter,
but yet so many people have trouble understanding what the few
meows cats make, mean?
And yet as people, we expect the animal to understand every word
we utter?

Cats have anywhere between 25-100 vocals, and they all mean
something different. The point is, they have a fair extent of
"language".

> All in all, a really smart and graceful cat. Before we just found her
> cute but paid no attention beyond that. Now, we are really impressed
> and appreciative.

You've done a fair amount of homework for a person that really
doesn't own a cat.
Cats and humans have historically had a very unique and rewarding
relationship with each other...going back 10,000 years.
In ancient Egypt it was punishable by death to kill one, that's how
seriously beneficial they thought they were to humans.


>From my experience, you can use some quick references to help
you understand what kitty my be trying to say.

Just as in human language...
1. "a question" has an upward inflection at the end
2. "a comment or statement" is flat
3. "a exclamation" is forceful and directed

Then further observation is need to what kitty is doing to help
further determine what it is they are trying to say.

There is no exact translation to english, only an approximation.
This is true also of many different human languages.

RPSinha
October 24th 07, 08:21 AM
studio > wrote:

: You've done a fair amount of homework for a person that really
: doesn't own a cat.

Well, it is my nature to "research" everything, but I did grow up with
cats around me. It was less organized "very small town" life in India,
so they weren't my "pets" but let's say we grew up together.

So I have a natural affection for cats and maybe it shows.
Temperamentally, I am not comfortable with the modern culture of one
person owning a "pet". Maybe I just long for my childhood. :-)

: Cats and humans have historically had a very unique and rewarding
: relationship with each other...going back 10,000 years.

Indeed, and I always told my European friends that there's a good
chance they are alive only because of cats: during the centuries when
rodent-spread Black Death (<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Death>)
plagued Europe killing about 2/3 of the population, and humans had no
worthwhile medical defense to speak of, CATS were all that stood
between humanity and plague!

Just imagine the historical debt. Without cats, I very have little
doubt that European races would have been annihilated.

: Just as in human language...
: 1. "a question" has an upward inflection at the end
: 2. "a comment or statement" is flat
: 3. "a exclamation" is forceful and directed
:
: Then further observation is need to what kitty is doing to help
: further determine what it is they are trying to say.
: There is no exact translation to english, only an approximation.
: This is true also of many different human languages.

Usually I give her food and sit nearby. If she is still hungry she
comes to me and looks with those "I want more" eyes. When she is
content, some food is left on the plate and she quietly marches off to
her bed without interacting with me.

Last evening, having just eaten she was content and going to her bed.
She didn't want anything from me. Just as she passed me, she said a
soft meow. I hadn't heard it before. It was a peaceful greeting, even
if there is no exact translation as you say.

studio
October 24th 07, 01:09 PM
On Oct 24, 3:21 am, RPSinha > wrote:
> studio > wrote:
> Well, it is my nature to "research" everything, but I did grow up with
> cats around me. It was less organized "very small town" life in India,
> so they weren't my "pets" but let's say we grew up together.
>
> So I have a natural affection for cats and maybe it shows.
> Temperamentally, I am not comfortable with the modern culture of one
> person owning a "pet". Maybe I just long for my childhood. :-)

What country do you live in now?
I live in US, so here we own animals and do our best to care for them
and protect them as best we can.

An interesting quote from Ghandi says;
"The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by
the way its animals are treated."

In the US anyway, consumer pet owners spend $40 billion a year,
with many considering their pet a part of their family.

Indeed, I just saw on TV about a woman who has spent $15,000
on her small dog in medical bills, and said she would sell her
house if she had to.

When there is news of any forms of animal abuse, most people
generally get mad and demand action be taken against those
doing the abuse.

> Indeed, and I always told my European friends that there's a good
> chance they are alive only because of cats: during the centuries when
> rodent-spread Black Death (<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Death>)
> plagued Europe killing about 2/3 of the population, and humans had no
> worthwhile medical defense to speak of, CATS were all that stood
> between humanity and plague!
>
> Just imagine the historical debt. Without cats, I very have little
> doubt that European races would have been annihilated.

I have also preached the same thing.

> Last evening, having just eaten she was content and going to her bed.
> She didn't want anything from me. Just as she passed me, she said a
> soft meow. I hadn't heard it before. It was a peaceful greeting, even
> if there is no exact translation as you say.

Or maybe, it was a content "thank you".

CatNipped[_2_]
October 24th 07, 03:34 PM
"studio" > wrote in message
ups.com...
> On Oct 23, 2:41 pm, "CatNipped" > wrote:
>> I use the Purina Fancy Feast Gourmet Gold dry food as treats - the stuff
>> is
>> like kitty crack, Ozzy has even leared how to open the can to get at
>> them:
> http://www.PossiblePlaces.com/CatNipped/Treats.mpg!
>
> Big Mama likes those also...Fancy Feast likes Big Mama, they send her
> free samples of their food all the time.
>
> The dark grey cat you have is beautiful.
>

Yeah, I think so too, thanks! All my cats are rescues, but Sammy (AKA
Samazon) *has* to have 99.99999999999% Maine Coon ancestry. She's 18+
pounds, but, because she's so well proportioned, she doesn't look that big
until you see her next to a "normal" sized cat:
http://www.possibleplaces.com/catnipped/Jessie17/. Her neck is so thick
that it takes two hands to encircle it.

How did you get on Fancy Feast's mailing list - my five want in on that
deal! ;>

Hugs,

CatNipped

CatNipped[_2_]
October 24th 07, 04:03 PM
"RPSinha" > wrote in message
...
> studio > wrote:
>
> : In some of the premium cat foods, it's not uncommon to find peas
> : and other small bits of vegetables.
>
> I believe they are meant to appeal not to the cats but to their owners.
> It's the market place, whatever works. :)

You can deduce the nutritional needs of any animal by looking at how/where
it evolved. Cats evolved in the desert. It's why they are crepuscular, not
nocturnal as is the popular belief. They slept through the too-hot days and
through the too-cold nights (18 hours out of every 24, which they still do
today), conserving energy for the intense bursts of activity needed when
hunting at dawn and dusk (ever see your cat get "the zoomies" at sunset?).
There was no, or very few, open water sources available, so cats
didn't/don't get the bulk of their fluids from free-standing water (and is
one of the reasons that chronic renal failure (CRF) is the most common
killer of domesticated cats*). They obtained their water through their prey
(which are/were composed of about 70% water - and why the ideal canned cat
food is also about 70% water). There was also no, or very little,
vegetation available to browse upon, which is why they evolved to be
obligate carnivores ("obligate" as in obliged, forced, or required - they
*have* to eat meat). What little vegetation they ingested came from the
stomachs and intestinal tracts of their prey and the occasional grasses they
came upon.

This is why cats do best on a canned food diet. Any added fillers (usually
vegetables) only make them eat more of the food in order to get the little
bit they *can* use (often causing cats to be overweight in the bargain), and
end up in the litter box giving you more to scoop. The cost of a "premium"
food evens out when you realize that they'll eat about twice as much of the
cheap food trying to make up for their nutritional needs. If you use the
premium foods you'll only have to buy about half as much and do about half
the scooping.

*One trick to use to get your cats to drink more water if your cat eats only
kibble.... Since open water sources were so rare in the desert where they
evolved, whenever they *did* come across a water source they drank as much
as they could from it, knowing that they might not come across another for
some time. If you move a cat's water bowl around to new spots in your house
every day, they will instinctively take a drink from it every time they pass
it in a different spot.

Hugs,

CatNipped

RPSinha
October 24th 07, 08:06 PM
Very good summary. May I add that carbohydrate-overload caused by dry
food is what requires all that extra water cats don't want to drink and
often don't drink, and contributes to CRF, diabetes etc.

Consider the fact that carbohydrate-overload is now a major cause of
poor health and many diseases among humans, who are designed to eat
some carbs (just not as much as we do). And food meant for human
consumption is better regulated.

Cats are at extreme disadvantage on both counts. Their bodies are ill
suited for the foods our economy wants to push, and the manufacture of
this food is very poorly supervised.

Also of concern should be the tendency of some "premium" cat food
manufactures to load up veggies and fruits in their canned food, and
then charge premium prices for the product because this appeals to the
self-centered cat owners.

As people have wised up to grains like wheat and corn, these clever
manufacturers have moved on to carrots, broccoli, mango and raspberries
and a few dozen other similar ingredients...A cat needs them about as
much as we need a hole in our head! :)

cybercat
October 24th 07, 08:32 PM
"RPSinha" > wrote in message
...
> Great stories and discussions. Some of you have misunderstood me: I am
> really enjoying this cat, it's all fun.
>
> Anyway, today the ice melted just a little.
>
> Everyday, after she finishes eating, she quietly--and rather
> majesticlly--marches towards her chosen "bed", ie, our softest and most
> expensive comforter, ignoring me totally.
>
> Today, however, she said a faint friendly meow just as she passed me,
> as she kept walking. The tone sounded like "hello". I was delighted. :)

The sweetest love is the hardest won! You are so hooked. Girlycats are like
this--they take their time, they let you court them from afar. :)

I love to tell the story of my little shelter cat Gracie, who ran from us
everywhere in the house except the bedroom, which she began to think of as
her territory. She allowed us to pet her up on the bed at first, but was
very reserved, watchful.

Then, some months after I had her, I was petting her, and she flopped over
onto her side and threw her leg back, like a little strumpet! She wanted her
belly rubbed!

Shortly thereafter, she began calling to me, little plaintive cries, very
soft, very much inquisitory, when I was in bed. She approached cautiously,
meowing every couple of feet, watching me. If I moved or responded, she came
to my side, flopped as though she had no bones at all, and waited to be
petted. If I did not, she would lie very close and peer at me. So when I did
open my eyes there was this giant pale gray tabby face, huge green eyes,
inches from my face.

Now she does not ask, she simply demands. :) Jumps up on the bed, vaults off
of my pillow, lands besideme and waits. She'll headbutt my hand when I stop
petting and start falling back to sleep.

She clearly feels entitled to me now. And I love it.

When I found her she was stuck in a tiny room full of caged and loose cats,
looking miserable as she lay in a "donut" bed which a big Tom had decided he
wanted to lie in too. I saw her little pointy face and it was just like in
the movies. The Angels sang and she was the only cat in the room. I walked
over, put out my hand gently, and she leaned her face into it, closing her
eyes. It was love at first sight. :)

I hope you will continue telling us about your little one as things
progress. She sounds lovely.

studio
October 24th 07, 10:32 PM
On Oct 24, 10:34 am, "CatNipped" > wrote:
> Yeah, I think so too, thanks! All my cats are rescues, but Sammy (AKA
> Samazon) *has* to have 99.99999999999% Maine Coon ancestry.

Oh, she is Maine Coon...she is beautiful.
And 18 pounds for a female...that is pretty big.

> How did you get on Fancy Feast's mailing list - my five want in on that
> deal! ;>

The supermarket I go to must have put me on somehow.
Everything is computerized now days, so they can see
by the data that I buy FF a lot.

Every couple months, FF sends her a gift.

FF does send the most beautiful gift packages to her...
complete with a nice card, coupons and samples of their best foods.
I'm very impressed by the FF marketing.

William Graham
October 24th 07, 10:53 PM
"studio" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> On Oct 24, 3:21 am, RPSinha > wrote:
>> studio > wrote:
>> Well, it is my nature to "research" everything, but I did grow up with
>> cats around me. It was less organized "very small town" life in India,
>> so they weren't my "pets" but let's say we grew up together.
>>
>> So I have a natural affection for cats and maybe it shows.
>> Temperamentally, I am not comfortable with the modern culture of one
>> person owning a "pet". Maybe I just long for my childhood. :-)
>
> What country do you live in now?
> I live in US, so here we own animals and do our best to care for them
> and protect them as best we can.
>
> An interesting quote from Ghandi says;
> "The greatness of a nation and its moral progress can be judged by
> the way its animals are treated."
>
> In the US anyway, consumer pet owners spend $40 billion a year,
> with many considering their pet a part of their family.
>
> Indeed, I just saw on TV about a woman who has spent $15,000
> on her small dog in medical bills, and said she would sell her
> house if she had to.

Some woman just left several million dollars to her dog.....Jay Leno said,
"Now it's so spoiled that it won't drink out of the toilet unless you put as
twist of lemon in it."

studio
October 24th 07, 11:17 PM
On Oct 24, 5:53 pm, "William Graham" > wrote:
> Some woman just left several million dollars to her dog.....Jay Leno said,
> "Now it's so spoiled that it won't drink out of the toilet unless you put as
> twist of lemon in it."

lol...her dog was probably always spoiled that way.

That would be Leona Helmsley in NYC.
She owned the Empire State Building.
Also known as "The Queen of Mean"...her little poodle dog got
$10 or 12 million inhertance after she died recently.
Her kids probably have it in for that dog now.

William Graham
October 24th 07, 11:29 PM
"studio" > wrote in message
ps.com...
> On Oct 24, 5:53 pm, "William Graham" > wrote:
>> Some woman just left several million dollars to her dog.....Jay Leno
>> said,
>> "Now it's so spoiled that it won't drink out of the toilet unless you put
>> as
>> twist of lemon in it."
>
> lol...her dog was probably always spoiled that way.
>
> That would be Leona Helmsley in NYC.
> She owned the Empire State Building.
> Also known as "The Queen of Mean"...her little poodle dog got
> $10 or 12 million inhertance after she died recently.
> Her kids probably have it in for that dog now.
>
Yes.....I wonder who inherits the money when the dog dies.....She
specifically didn't want her kids to get it, so she probably set it up to go
to charity when the dog dies.....I can understand where she's coming from.
There are a lot of people that I wouldn't give any money to, also. (to,
too)? I have known a lot more dogs in my life that I liked better than some
people I've known.

Ivor Jones
October 25th 07, 12:31 AM
"William Graham" > wrote in message


[snip]

: : Yes.....I wonder who inherits the money when the dog
: : dies.....She specifically didn't want her kids to get
: : it, so she probably set it up to go to charity when the
: : dog dies.....I can understand where she's coming from.
: : There are a lot of people that I wouldn't give any
: : money to, also. (to, too)? I have known a lot more dogs
: : in my life that I liked better than some people I've
: : known.

Not really a dog person, but I like any cat better than *any* of the
people I've ever known.

Ivor

mlbriggs
October 27th 07, 06:46 AM
On Wed, 24 Oct 2007 05:38:21 +0000, RPSinha wrote:

> Great stories and discussions. Some of you have misunderstood me: I am
> really enjoying this cat, it's all fun.
>
> Anyway, today the ice melted just a little.
>
> Everyday, after she finishes eating, she quietly--and rather
> majesticlly--marches towards her chosen "bed", ie, our softest and most
> expensive comforter, ignoring me totally.
>
> Today, however, she said a faint friendly meow just as she passed me,
> as she kept walking. The tone sounded like "hello". I was delighted. :)


She probably said "thanks". MLB