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CatNipped[_2_]
May 13th 08, 02:17 PM
I don't know if you remember, but about 6 months ago I decided to switch my
cats to an all canned food diet (they were on a canned food diet, but had
some dry Science Diet to snack on). I was worried about struvite crystals
in my boys (this is the first time I've had boy cats). This worked out OK
until they started losing WAY too much weight (especially the smaller
cats) - even though they would leave quite a bit of left overs. I started
giving them the SD dry again (about 1 cup for all 5 cats) and their weight
loss stopped and they have gained back most of what they lost, so all are at
their ideal weights, or a little less, right now.

Lately, though, Sammy has been worrying me because she is drinking lots and
lots of water and I'm worried about diabetes. She doesn't have any other
signs of diabetes (inappropriate elimination, change in appetite, change in
gait, decreased activity, weakness, depression, or vomiting - she did lose
weight, but that was because of the change in diet).

Questions....

Do you think this food switch could trigger diabetes? Is just that small
amount of dry food enough to make her drink tons of water (I don't remember
her drinking this much last time she had dry food in her diet)? I've read
online that laboratory tests for diabetes are not conclusive because other
problems show the same results - what tests should I ask a vet to run? Do
you think switching back to all canned would help? If so, how can I keep
the cats from losing a dangerous amount of weight again?

Thanks, Phil, for any help you can give me.

--
Hugs,

CatNipped

See all my masters here: http://www.PossiblePlaces.com/CatNipped/

cybercat
May 13th 08, 11:13 PM
"CatNipped" > wrote in message
...
>I don't know if you remember, but about 6 months ago I decided to switch my
>cats to an all canned food diet (they were on a canned food diet, but had
>some dry Science Diet to snack on). I was worried about struvite crystals
>in my boys (this is the first time I've had boy cats). This worked out OK
>until they started losing WAY too much weight (especially the smaller
>cats) - even though they would leave quite a bit of left overs. I started
>giving them the SD dry again (about 1 cup for all 5 cats) and their weight
>loss stopped and they have gained back most of what they lost, so all are
>at their ideal weights, or a little less, right now.
>

It sounds to me like you were not feeding them enough of the canned food.

CatNipped[_2_]
May 13th 08, 11:31 PM
"cybercat" > wrote in message
. com...
>
> "CatNipped" > wrote in message
> ...
>>I don't know if you remember, but about 6 months ago I decided to switch
>>my cats to an all canned food diet (they were on a canned food diet, but
>>had some dry Science Diet to snack on). I was worried about struvite
>>crystals in my boys (this is the first time I've had boy cats). This
>>worked out OK until they started losing WAY too much weight (especially
>>the smaller cats) - even though they would leave quite a bit of left
>>overs. I started giving them the SD dry again (about 1 cup for all 5
>>cats) and their weight loss stopped and they have gained back most of what
>>they lost, so all are at their ideal weights, or a little less, right now.
>>
>
> It sounds to me like you were not feeding them enough of the canned food.

I don't think so - they weren't eating all of it, there was always
left-overs. They may not have been eating as much as they should have, but
I think I was feeding them enough. the little bit of dry food, added to the
canned, has helped them regain the weight they lost.

However, I have something else to worry about. Ben came home and found
Hunter, the cat we found and brought in from outside about 3 months ago,
dead on the bathroom floor. He wasn't in physical contact with our other
cats (he was still "quarantined" in his own section of the house since he
wasn't due for his "final" FIV/FeLV test until the 31st), but I'm still
worried that he had an airborne virus that could have been transmitted to
our other cats (this is only a remote possibility, but I still worry - it's
my nature).

We just got finished, a few minutes ago, burying him. We couldn't afford a
necropsy, and it wouldn't really make a difference except to let us know for
sure how he died, but we think it may have been heart problems since he was
such a young cat and he had no other symptoms up until the time he died. He
"coughed" when he got excited or upset, but we thought he was trying to
cough up a hairball (heart problems didn't enter our minds since he seemed
very hale and hearty and played boisterously). My friend, who's a nurse,
says it sounds like he may have "thrown an embolism" - and died when the
blood clot got to his lungs. He did have a bit of blood next to his mouth
when Ben found him.

When we first brought him in he was tested for FIV/FeLV (he was negative)
and had a thorough physical exam along with a feline distemper shot, rabies
shot and worming, and he was pronounced healthy. We then had him neutered
and he did just fine through that - healed up very nicely. Then we brought
him back for his follow-up visit (second feline distemper shot and worming)
and the vet didn't find anything wrong then either.

I'm just really devastated about this, he was such a sweet tempered and
gentle cat and he died WAY too young, his life was just really starting.
The most comfort I can take from this is that 3 months ago he was on the
street and starving, and when he died today at least he was in a safe home
and well fed and loved.

Hugs,

CatNipped

-Lost
May 13th 08, 11:46 PM
Response to "CatNipped" >:

> I'm just really devastated about this, he was such a sweet
> tempered and gentle cat and he died WAY too young, his life was
> just really starting. The most comfort I can take from this is
> that 3 months ago he was on the street and starving, and when he
> died today at least he was in a safe home and well fed and loved.

Sorry, kiddo. I'm sure he was much better off having known you (and
your hubby).

--
-Lost
Remove the extra words to reply by e-mail. Don't e-mail me. I am
kidding. No I am not.

cybercat
May 13th 08, 11:53 PM
"CatNipped" > wrote
>>
>> It sounds to me like you were not feeding them enough of the canned food.
>
> I don't think so - they weren't eating all of it, there was always
> left-overs.

Then I'm wrong. Unless something was affecting their appetites?

>They may not have been eating as much as they should have, but
> I think I was feeding them enough. the little bit of dry food, added to
> the canned, has helped them regain the weight they lost.

I feel my cats both, because if I don't, Gracie won't stay above 7 lbs.
>
> However, I have something else to worry about. Ben came home and found
> Hunter, the cat we found and brought in from outside about 3 months ago,
> dead on the bathroom floor. He wasn't in physical contact with our other
> cats (he was still "quarantined" in his own section of the house since he
> wasn't due for his "final" FIV/FeLV test until the 31st), but I'm still
> worried that he had an airborne virus that could have been transmitted to
> our other cats (this is only a remote possibility, but I still worry -
> it's my nature).

You were so smart to keep him quarantined. I would worry too.


>
> We just got finished, a few minutes ago, burying him. We couldn't afford
> a necropsy, and it wouldn't really make a difference except to let us know
> for sure how he died, but we think it may have been heart problems since
> he was such a young cat and he had no other symptoms up until the time he
> died. He "coughed" when he got excited or upset, but we thought he was
> trying to cough up a hairball (heart problems didn't enter our minds since
> he seemed very hale and hearty and played boisterously). My friend, who's
> a nurse, says it sounds like he may have "thrown an embolism" - and died
> when the blood clot got to his lungs. He did have a bit of blood next to
> his mouth when Ben found him.
>
> When we first brought him in he was tested for FIV/FeLV (he was negative)
> and had a thorough physical exam along with a feline distemper shot,
> rabies shot and worming, and he was pronounced healthy. We then had him
> neutered and he did just fine through that - healed up very nicely. Then
> we brought him back for his follow-up visit (second feline distemper shot
> and worming) and the vet didn't find anything wrong then either.
>
> I'm just really devastated about this, he was such a sweet tempered and
> gentle cat and he died WAY too young, his life was just really starting.
> The most comfort I can take from this is that 3 months ago he was on the
> street and starving, and when he died today at least he was in a safe home
> and well fed and loved.
>

I'm so sorry, Lori. I know it must be heartbreaking. Hope the other kids are
okay.

Phil P.
May 14th 08, 08:42 PM
"CatNipped" > wrote in message
...
> I don't know if you remember, but about 6 months ago I decided to switch
my
> cats to an all canned food diet (they were on a canned food diet, but had
> some dry Science Diet to snack on). I was worried about struvite crystals
> in my boys (this is the first time I've had boy cats). This worked out OK
> until they started losing WAY too much weight (especially the smaller
> cats) - even though they would leave quite a bit of left overs. I started
> giving them the SD dry again (about 1 cup for all 5 cats) and their weight
> loss stopped and they have gained back most of what they lost, so all are
at
> their ideal weights, or a little less, right now.


How are you determining their ideal weight? Personal opinion or a Body
Condition Scoring chart?

http://maxshouse.com/nutrition/Body_Scoring_System-Chart.jpg


> Lately, though, Sammy has been worrying me because she is drinking lots
and
> lots of water and I'm worried about diabetes. She doesn't have any other
> signs of diabetes (inappropriate elimination, change in appetite, change
in
> gait, decreased activity, weakness, depression, or vomiting - she did lose
> weight, but that was because of the change in diet).
>
> Questions....
>
> Do you think this food switch could trigger diabetes?

Not unless the cat has some islet pathology and is predisposed to diabetes.


Is just that small
> amount of dry food enough to make her drink tons of water (I don't
remember
> her drinking this much last time she had dry food in her diet)? I've read
> online that laboratory tests for diabetes are not conclusive because other
> problems show the same results - what tests should I ask a vet to run?

A routine serum chemistry and complete blood count should be sufficient.
You could also ask your vet about serum fructosamine + glycosylated
hemoglobin assays. These assays show glycemic control over the past few
weeks to months.


Do
> you think switching back to all canned would help? If so, how can I keep
> the cats from losing a dangerous amount of weight again?
>
> Thanks, Phil, for any help you can give me.

Lori, because so many cats are overweight, cats that are at their ideal
weight (5 on 9 step BCS) look underweight. Some vets even make this mistake
because they see so many overweight cats.

I don't want to make any suggestions because I'm not sure if your cats
actually became underweight from canned food or if it just seemed that way
to you. I will say this, though: if the cats weren't eating about 20
kcals/pound of bodyweight, they weren't eating enough and that you should
try to find a food that they like enough to meet their daily energy
requirement.

Phil

Rene S.
May 14th 08, 09:08 PM
> I don't want to make any suggestions because I'm not sure if your cats
> actually became underweight from canned food or if it just seemed that way
> to you. *I will say this, though: if the cats weren't eating about 20
> kcals/pound of bodyweight, they weren't eating enough and that you should
> try to find a food that they like enough to meet their daily energy
> requirement.

Do you weigh your cats at home? I would suggest weighing them before
starting canned food, then make sure to feed them each *from separate
bowls*. Make note of how much each cat is getting and monitor their
weight once per week or so. I say feed separately so you can closely
monitor their intake vs. their weight. Yes, this is a lot of extra
work, but IMO worth it. If someone if not feeling well and is off
their food, you will know immediately (instead of someone else gulping
down their food).

CatNipped[_2_]
May 14th 08, 09:24 PM
"Phil P." > wrote in message
news:[email protected]
>
> "CatNipped" > wrote in message
> ...
>> I don't know if you remember, but about 6 months ago I decided to switch
> my
>> cats to an all canned food diet (they were on a canned food diet, but had
>> some dry Science Diet to snack on). I was worried about struvite
>> crystals
>> in my boys (this is the first time I've had boy cats). This worked out
>> OK
>> until they started losing WAY too much weight (especially the smaller
>> cats) - even though they would leave quite a bit of left overs. I
>> started
>> giving them the SD dry again (about 1 cup for all 5 cats) and their
>> weight
>> loss stopped and they have gained back most of what they lost, so all are
> at
>> their ideal weights, or a little less, right now.
>
>
> How are you determining their ideal weight? Personal opinion or a Body
> Condition Scoring chart?
>
> http://maxshouse.com/nutrition/Body_Scoring_System-Chart.jpg

The body chart. I am as vigilant about their weight as I am my own, I know
that being overweight can cause all kinds of health problems. Jessie at her
perfect weight at 7 pounds 12 ounces and went down to 6 pounds 10 ounces.
Demi was at her perfect weight at 7 pounds 5 ounces and went down to 6
pounds 7 ounces. Sammy, who I'd wanted to lose one pound, lost two. Even
the boys (less than a year old) started losing weight. I was weighing them
weekly and kept giving them more and more canned as they lost weight but
they didn't eat it. I was hoping I could stop the downward trend, but when
their weight got so low that I was worried about their health, I just gave
up and added their 1 - 2 cups of dry food in addition to the canned.

>
>
>> Lately, though, Sammy has been worrying me because she is drinking lots
> and
>> lots of water and I'm worried about diabetes. She doesn't have any other
>> signs of diabetes (inappropriate elimination, change in appetite, change
> in
>> gait, decreased activity, weakness, depression, or vomiting - she did
>> lose
>> weight, but that was because of the change in diet).
>>
>> Questions....
>>
>> Do you think this food switch could trigger diabetes?
>
> Not unless the cat has some islet pathology and is predisposed to
> diabetes.

Ok, that's good to know - she hasn't been displaying any other symptoms and
she's as lively as ever (the boys give her a good workout). I think it's
probable that she's just a bit thirstier with the addition of dry food to
her diet (after meals is when I notice her drinking now where before she
didn't drink after meals).

>
>
> Is just that small
>> amount of dry food enough to make her drink tons of water (I don't
> remember
>> her drinking this much last time she had dry food in her diet)? I've
>> read
>> online that laboratory tests for diabetes are not conclusive because
>> other
>> problems show the same results - what tests should I ask a vet to run?
>
> A routine serum chemistry and complete blood count should be sufficient.
> You could also ask your vet about serum fructosamine + glycosylated
> hemoglobin assays. These assays show glycemic control over the past few
> weeks to months.

If she shows any other signs of distress I'll take her in immediately and
have the tests done, but for now I think she's OK.

>
>
> Do
>> you think switching back to all canned would help? If so, how can I keep
>> the cats from losing a dangerous amount of weight again?
>>
>> Thanks, Phil, for any help you can give me.
>
> Lori, because so many cats are overweight, cats that are at their ideal
> weight (5 on 9 step BCS) look underweight. Some vets even make this
> mistake
> because they see so many overweight cats.
>
> I don't want to make any suggestions because I'm not sure if your cats
> actually became underweight from canned food or if it just seemed that way
> to you. I will say this, though: if the cats weren't eating about 20
> kcals/pound of bodyweight, they weren't eating enough and that you should
> try to find a food that they like enough to meet their daily energy
> requirement.

They really like the Fancy Feast, and it seemed to fill them up since they
would leave left-overs, but without the addition of that bit of canned food,
they just lose too much weight. They still eat at least 95% canned, but
they just seem to need the extra calories from the dry.

Hugs,

CatNipped

>
> Phil
>
>
>