Fences - Cats - DIY?
A friend of mine has one of these fences that's about 178cm (5'10")
tall: http://stratco.com.au/products/fenci..._neighbour.asp She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. I know full well that there are numerous commercially available products that will stop cats (along with other animals) climbing fences. I'm sure they do work, but they're all fairly pricey, particularly if attempting to cover a significant length of fencing. I'm now thinking about trying a home-rigged set up. I'm considering getting a whole heap of empty 2 Litre plastic softdrink bottles (Soda bottles to any USA readers), then cutting off the base and neck of the bottles, then cutting them lengthwise, then siliconing them to the tops of the fence so the sides of the bottles "curve downwards" from the top of the fence. I'm thinking this curved plastic will be too smooth and slippery for a cat to get any grip with it's claws. I have no problem with spending some time getting this to work, but I want to keep the cost down, so spending lots of $$$ isn't happening. I was wondering if anyone has attempted anything like this, and if they can offer any advice. Thanks. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
Gas Bag wrote:
A friend of mine has one of these fences that's about 178cm (5'10") tall: http://stratco.com.au/products/fenci..._neighbour.asp She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. I know full well that there are numerous commercially available products that will stop cats (along with other animals) climbing fences. I'm sure they do work, but they're all fairly pricey, particularly if attempting to cover a significant length of fencing. I'm now thinking about trying a home-rigged set up. I'm considering getting a whole heap of empty 2 Litre plastic softdrink bottles (Soda bottles to any USA readers), then cutting off the base and neck of the bottles, then cutting them lengthwise, then siliconing them to the tops of the fence so the sides of the bottles "curve downwards" from the top of the fence. I'm thinking this curved plastic will be too smooth and slippery for a cat to get any grip with it's claws. I have no problem with spending some time getting this to work, but I want to keep the cost down, so spending lots of $$$ isn't happening. I was wondering if anyone has attempted anything like this, and if they can offer any advice. Thanks. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. I have a friend who built a, "cateo" for his cats, and covered it with chicken wire fencing, which lets in the fresh air and sunshine, but keeps the cats from getting out. This was fairly easy and inexpensive for him to do. and his cats love spending time out there. He can also grow flowers out there..... |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
On 8/15/2012 2:01 PM, Bill Graham wrote:
Gas Bag wrote: A friend of mine has one of these fences that's about 178cm (5'10") tall: http://stratco.com.au/products/fenci..._neighbour.asp She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. I know full well that there are numerous commercially available products that will stop cats (along with other animals) climbing fences. I'm sure they do work, but they're all fairly pricey, particularly if attempting to cover a significant length of fencing. I'm now thinking about trying a home-rigged set up. I'm considering getting a whole heap of empty 2 Litre plastic softdrink bottles (Soda bottles to any USA readers), then cutting off the base and neck of the bottles, then cutting them lengthwise, then siliconing them to the tops of the fence so the sides of the bottles "curve downwards" from the top of the fence. I'm thinking this curved plastic will be too smooth and slippery for a cat to get any grip with it's claws. I have no problem with spending some time getting this to work, but I want to keep the cost down, so spending lots of $$$ isn't happening. I was wondering if anyone has attempted anything like this, and if they can offer any advice. Thanks. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. I have a friend who built a, "cateo" for his cats, and covered it with chicken wire fencing, which lets in the fresh air and sunshine, but keeps the cats from getting out. This was fairly easy and inexpensive for him to do. and his cats love spending time out there. He can also grow flowers out there..... i built one of these too. 12x12x8' with lots of internal ramps. i had to use thin plywood for the first couple of feet to keep the rattlesnakes and coyote's out, and it had a chickenwire roof to keep the owls and hawks out too. |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
Gas Bag wrote:
She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
On Thu, 16 Aug 2012 20:59:00 -0400, Brooklyn1 Gravesend1 wrote:
Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. Sometimes there is no option, like when you live in an apartment in a city. But I rigged the fence in my little backyard so the cats can't get out and I let them out whenever I'm able to - of course I must be home. Sure there is some risk. Maybe some critter left a hole in the fence - raccoons and possums can do that. Maybe one will climb a tree and jump into the next yard. I try to minimize that risk by putting Loc8tor tags on their collars. But like any knowlegable cat owner I use breakaway collars so even that isn't foolproof. But they love lying on the cool earth under the evergreens, or eating the grass or some bug. Or they just hang out on the deck and sniff the air. Of course I don't use any pesticides or other poisons. Once or twice a year one will catch a bird. Sometimes I'm quick enough to save the bird. They are just so proud when they get one though. I make it up to the birds by feeding them all winter and even putting up a heated birdbath. For me, the small risk that something will happen to them is more than offset by the enjoyment they get by being "free" outside. I've had eight cats during the 16 years that I've had this fenced in yard. Four have died, but none because they were allowed to go out. Four are still enjoying the yard and will do so today when I get home. |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
On Aug 17, 7:08*am, dgk wrote:
On Thu, 16 Aug 2012 20:59:00 -0400, Brooklyn1 Gravesend1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. Sometimes there is no option, like when you live in an apartment in a city. But I rigged the fence in my little backyard so the cats can't get out and I let them out whenever I'm able to - of course I must be home. Sure there is some risk. Maybe some critter left a hole in the fence - raccoons and possums can do that. Maybe one will climb a tree and jump into the next yard. I try to minimize that risk by putting Loc8tor tags on their collars. But like any knowlegable cat owner I use breakaway collars so even that isn't foolproof. ***My cat specializes in losing breakaway collars with the name tags I paid to have made. I finally gave up. He's chipped, so if he's found and the finders have enough sense to call the local shelter, he could potentially be located. One thing: I was warned a few years ago to KEEP HIM INDOORS on Halloween; black cat. So I bring him in during the day, set up food and toilet, and don't let him out till next day.- But they love lying on the cool earth under the evergreens, or eating the grass or some bug. Or they just hang out on the deck and sniff the air. Of course I don't use any pesticides or other poisons. Once or twice a year one will catch a bird. Sometimes I'm quick enough to save the bird. They are just so proud when they get one though. I make it up to the birds by feeding them all winter and even putting up a heated birdbath. ***Hah! Me too! I saved a bird just the other day and confined it briefly until it settled down enough to fly away. [Censored] generations of mocking-birds have been teasing the cats all these years, and some of them go too far! For me, the small risk that something will happen to them is more than offset by the enjoyment they get by being "free" outside. I've had eight cats during the 16 years that I've had this fenced in yard. Four have died, but none because they were allowed to go out. Four are still enjoying the yard and will do so today when I get home. FOUR CHEERS! I view with dismay the idea of cooping up an animal in an unnatural environment just for the selfish enjoyment of the owner! If that goes for cats, which I've had all my life, imagine how much more it goes for dogs, especially HUGE dogs shut up in a small apartment, and afforded only a daily walk by the perhaps conscientious but normally busy owner, employed or not. HB |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
dgk wrote:
Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
"Brooklyn1" Gravesend1 wrote in message ... Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. I agree there. It saddens me to get the mail now. Every few days there is a new poster of a missing cat on the mailbox. I constantly see cats roaming the neighborhood and frequently we see them in our backyard at night. I don't know who owned the black one with white paws but I saw it at the side of the road. Looked pretty dead. Not only do we have some wild drivers on this street but I think there are also coyotes. Some were spotted not far from here. |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
"dgk" wrote in message ... On Thu, 16 Aug 2012 20:59:00 -0400, Brooklyn1 Gravesend1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. Sometimes there is no option, like when you live in an apartment in a city. But I rigged the fence in my little backyard so the cats can't get out and I let them out whenever I'm able to - of course I must be home. Sure there is some risk. Maybe some critter left a hole in the fence - raccoons and possums can do that. Maybe one will climb a tree and jump into the next yard. I try to minimize that risk by putting Loc8tor tags on their collars. But like any knowlegable cat owner I use breakaway collars so even that isn't foolproof. But they love lying on the cool earth under the evergreens, or eating the grass or some bug. Or they just hang out on the deck and sniff the air. Of course I don't use any pesticides or other poisons. Once or twice a year one will catch a bird. Sometimes I'm quick enough to save the bird. They are just so proud when they get one though. I make it up to the birds by feeding them all winter and even putting up a heated birdbath. For me, the small risk that something will happen to them is more than offset by the enjoyment they get by being "free" outside. I've had eight cats during the 16 years that I've had this fenced in yard. Four have died, but none because they were allowed to go out. Four are still enjoying the yard and will do so today when I get home. Cats do love that but... Unless I had the money to build a very specific type of cat enclosure, I wouldn't let my cats outside. Would have to be something to keep them very safe. But even with something like that, the cat could get fleas or maybe eat a bird or a rodent and then maybe get worms. Our baby cat has had two kinds of worms now. I don't know how she got them. She lives indoors. She did have the lung worms when we got her. Not sure about the round worms unless perhaps she got them from eating a bug. She and mom did get a moth in here just prior. |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
"Brooklyn1" Gravesend1 wrote in message ... dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Yes. I saw a bumper sticker online that said, "I'd rather be inside and fat than outside and flat." I am sure that my momma cat was probably outside at some point in her life. She and her babies were found in an abandoned house and they had to get food from somewhere. But now she never tries to get out. Never. She is perfectly happy as a house cat. Now the baby? Well she isn't actually a baby any more since she is over a year old but... She is the one they named that phrase after about how curiosity killed the cat. She is very interested in the garage for some reason. I don't want her out there because there are all sorts of little hidey holes and some are up high. She can jump up high. We did once have a rat get in there during the winter and it died somewhere in the wall. Would be horrible if she were to suffer the same fate. So I will walk her out there in my arms and show her around. Nothing of interest to her, I wouldn't think. Just some canned goods, soda pop, Christmas lights, a few tools... But one day she came very close to getting to the outside! Apparently I did not shut the door from the laundry room fully and she pushed it open. She was walking very slowly and cautiously towards the opening of the garage. Mom was in the laundry room looking very worried and calling to her. Luckily I was able to pick her up and bring her back inside. |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
On Sat, 18 Aug 2012 00:21:27 -0700, "Julie Bove"
wrote: "Brooklyn1" Gravesend1 wrote in message .. . dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Yes. I saw a bumper sticker online that said, "I'd rather be inside and fat than outside and flat." I am sure that my momma cat was probably outside at some point in her life. She and her babies were found in an abandoned house and they had to get food from somewhere. But now she never tries to get out. Never. She is perfectly happy as a house cat. Now the baby? Well she isn't actually a baby any more since she is over a year old but... She is the one they named that phrase after about how curiosity killed the cat. She is very interested in the garage for some reason. I don't want her out there because there are all sorts of little hidey holes and some are up high. She can jump up high. We did once have a rat get in there during the winter and it died somewhere in the wall. Would be horrible if she were to suffer the same fate. So I will walk her out there in my arms and show her around. Nothing of interest to her, I wouldn't think. Just some canned goods, soda pop, Christmas lights, a few tools... But one day she came very close to getting to the outside! Apparently I did not shut the door from the laundry room fully and she pushed it open. She was walking very slowly and cautiously towards the opening of the garage. Mom was in the laundry room looking very worried and calling to her. Luckily I was able to pick her up and bring her back inside. Domestic cats live happily indoors, they do fine with a window but mostly they need cat companionship so always have at least two, preferably from the same litter. Contrary to what many believe cats are not loners, they are very social, moreso then dogs. Cats live a shortened life outdoors, they are more likely to become road kill than wild animals as domestic cats don't possess nearly the same level of survival skills. Feral cats have excellent survival skills outdoors but they don't live long due to poor diet and disease. There are many types of outdoor cat enclosures but none protect against deadly parasites and poisonings (cats will catch and eat insects that contain insectide), and outdoor animals of all kinds are very susceptible to overspray from thoughtless gardeners, you won't know until it's too late. I can go on but bottom line is giving a cat a good home means keeping it indoors. The pinheads who put cats outdoors are simply too lazy and cheap to deal with cat litter, with the low IQ rationalizing about cats are happier outdoors, BULL****, the morons are happier with cats outdoors because the cheap lazy *******s don't need to buy and deal with cat litter. Cats are very happy indoors, even in a small apartment, again all they need is a window and a playmate. Many of my neighbors let their cats out, invaribly I'll see them flattened on the road. My cats never go out... however I do have a feral cat living in my barn, can't get close enough to know if Newt is a boy or a girl, I bring it food and water every day and eventually plan on capturing and bringing it to a Vet. This is Newt heading back home to his barn a few minutes ago for breakfast, Newt runs off when I approach to put out food, photographed at 600', a very good looking cat: http://i48.tinypic.com/nwzmf9.jpg http://i49.tinypic.com/o074ub.jpg Earlier this morning, the twins: http://i46.tinypic.com/zmqf4.jpg http://www.vetinfo.com/indoor-outdoo...xpectancy.html |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
dgk wrote:
On Thu, 16 Aug 2012 20:59:00 -0400, Brooklyn1 Gravesend1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. Sometimes there is no option, like when you live in an apartment in a city. But I rigged the fence in my little backyard so the cats can't get out and I let them out whenever I'm able to - of course I must be home. Sure there is some risk. Maybe some critter left a hole in the fence - raccoons and possums can do that. Maybe one will climb a tree and jump into the next yard. I try to minimize that risk by putting Loc8tor tags on their collars. But like any knowlegable cat owner I use breakaway collars so even that isn't foolproof. But they love lying on the cool earth under the evergreens, or eating the grass or some bug. Or they just hang out on the deck and sniff the air. Of course I don't use any pesticides or other poisons. Once or twice a year one will catch a bird. Sometimes I'm quick enough to save the bird. They are just so proud when they get one though. I make it up to the birds by feeding them all winter and even putting up a heated birdbath. For me, the small risk that something will happen to them is more than offset by the enjoyment they get by being "free" outside. I've had eight cats during the 16 years that I've had this fenced in yard. Four have died, but none because they were allowed to go out. Four are still enjoying the yard and will do so today when I get home. Hear, hear! I agree with you 100%. I lost one outside cat in my entire life, and even he enjoyed being outsidfe in the neighborhood so much, that if I had to do it all over again, I wouldn't change a thing. Some cats are just naturally gregarious, and keeping them locked up inside a house would be a crime. There is more to life than just breathing, as Patrick Henry would tell you. The joy and friendship my B-K gave to others in the neighborhood, (even the dogs) made his freedom mandatory.... |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
Brooklyn1 wrote:
dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Everyone, and everything, dies., What's important is enjoying what little time you have. This is true for me, and also true for my cats. Only a stupid liberal would trade freedom for a longer life, and then have the gall to impose their poor choice on the rest of the world...... |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
Brooklyn1 wrote:
On Sat, 18 Aug 2012 00:21:27 -0700, "Julie Bove" wrote: "Brooklyn1" Gravesend1 wrote in message ... dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Yes. I saw a bumper sticker online that said, "I'd rather be inside and fat than outside and flat." I am sure that my momma cat was probably outside at some point in her life. She and her babies were found in an abandoned house and they had to get food from somewhere. But now she never tries to get out. Never. She is perfectly happy as a house cat. Now the baby? Well she isn't actually a baby any more since she is over a year old but... She is the one they named that phrase after about how curiosity killed the cat. She is very interested in the garage for some reason. I don't want her out there because there are all sorts of little hidey holes and some are up high. She can jump up high. We did once have a rat get in there during the winter and it died somewhere in the wall. Would be horrible if she were to suffer the same fate. So I will walk her out there in my arms and show her around. Nothing of interest to her, I wouldn't think. Just some canned goods, soda pop, Christmas lights, a few tools... But one day she came very close to getting to the outside! Apparently I did not shut the door from the laundry room fully and she pushed it open. She was walking very slowly and cautiously towards the opening of the garage. Mom was in the laundry room looking very worried and calling to her. Luckily I was able to pick her up and bring her back inside. Domestic cats live happily indoors, they do fine with a window but mostly they need cat companionship so always have at least two, preferably from the same litter. Contrary to what many believe cats are not loners, they are very social, moreso then dogs. Cats live a shortened life outdoors, they are more likely to become road kill than wild animals as domestic cats don't possess nearly the same level of survival skills. Feral cats have excellent survival skills outdoors but they don't live long due to poor diet and disease. There are many types of outdoor cat enclosures but none protect against deadly parasites and poisonings (cats will catch and eat insects that contain insectide), and outdoor animals of all kinds are very susceptible to overspray from thoughtless gardeners, you won't know until it's too late. I can go on but bottom line is giving a cat a good home means keeping it indoors. The pinheads who put cats outdoors are simply too lazy and cheap to deal with cat litter, with the low IQ rationalizing about cats are happier outdoors, BULL****, the morons are happier with cats outdoors because the cheap lazy *******s don't need to buy and deal with cat litter. Cats are very happy indoors, even in a small apartment, again all they need is a window and a playmate. Many of my neighbors let their cats out, invaribly I'll see them flattened on the road. My cats never go out... however I do have a feral cat living in my barn, can't get close enough to know if Newt is a boy or a girl, I bring it food and water every day and eventually plan on capturing and bringing it to a Vet. This is Newt heading back home to his barn a few minutes ago for breakfast, Newt runs off when I approach to put out food, photographed at 600', a very good looking cat: http://i48.tinypic.com/nwzmf9.jpg http://i49.tinypic.com/o074ub.jpg Earlier this morning, the twins: http://i46.tinypic.com/zmqf4.jpg http://www.vetinfo.com/indoor-outdoo...xpectancy.html If you live in a dangerous environment for cats, then either keep them indoors, or don't keep them at all. But there are some other people in the world (like me)that live in a very safe environment for cats, And these people keep outside cats. I wouldn't presume to tell others how to keep their cats, and I resent it when others tell me how to keep mine. All of my cats were aquired by me as grown cats, who just wandered onto my property and liked the cut of my jib, and decided to stay. I wouldn't lock them up any more than our local police station makes a habit of apprehending people on the street and locking them up. I don't force feed my cats either. I offer them something to eat. They have the option of eating it, or not..... |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
"Brooklyn1" Gravesend1 wrote in message ... On Sat, 18 Aug 2012 00:21:27 -0700, "Julie Bove" wrote: "Brooklyn1" Gravesend1 wrote in message . .. dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Yes. I saw a bumper sticker online that said, "I'd rather be inside and fat than outside and flat." I am sure that my momma cat was probably outside at some point in her life. She and her babies were found in an abandoned house and they had to get food from somewhere. But now she never tries to get out. Never. She is perfectly happy as a house cat. Now the baby? Well she isn't actually a baby any more since she is over a year old but... She is the one they named that phrase after about how curiosity killed the cat. She is very interested in the garage for some reason. I don't want her out there because there are all sorts of little hidey holes and some are up high. She can jump up high. We did once have a rat get in there during the winter and it died somewhere in the wall. Would be horrible if she were to suffer the same fate. So I will walk her out there in my arms and show her around. Nothing of interest to her, I wouldn't think. Just some canned goods, soda pop, Christmas lights, a few tools... But one day she came very close to getting to the outside! Apparently I did not shut the door from the laundry room fully and she pushed it open. She was walking very slowly and cautiously towards the opening of the garage. Mom was in the laundry room looking very worried and calling to her. Luckily I was able to pick her up and bring her back inside. Domestic cats live happily indoors, they do fine with a window but mostly they need cat companionship so always have at least two, preferably from the same litter. Contrary to what many believe cats are not loners, they are very social, moreso then dogs. Cats live a shortened life outdoors, they are more likely to become road kill than wild animals as domestic cats don't possess nearly the same level of survival skills. Feral cats have excellent survival skills outdoors but they don't live long due to poor diet and disease. There are many types of outdoor cat enclosures but none protect against deadly parasites and poisonings (cats will catch and eat insects that contain insectide), and outdoor animals of all kinds are very susceptible to overspray from thoughtless gardeners, you won't know until it's too late. I can go on but bottom line is giving a cat a good home means keeping it indoors. The pinheads who put cats outdoors are simply too lazy and cheap to deal with cat litter, with the low IQ rationalizing about cats are happier outdoors, BULL****, the morons are happier with cats outdoors because the cheap lazy *******s don't need to buy and deal with cat litter. Cats are very happy indoors, even in a small apartment, again all they need is a window and a playmate. Many of my neighbors let their cats out, invaribly I'll see them flattened on the road. My cats never go out... however I do have a feral cat living in my barn, can't get close enough to know if Newt is a boy or a girl, I bring it food and water every day and eventually plan on capturing and bringing it to a Vet. This is Newt heading back home to his barn a few minutes ago for breakfast, Newt runs off when I approach to put out food, photographed at 600', a very good looking cat: http://i48.tinypic.com/nwzmf9.jpg http://i49.tinypic.com/o074ub.jpg Earlier this morning, the twins: http://i46.tinypic.com/zmqf4.jpg http://www.vetinfo.com/indoor-outdoo...xpectancy.html That is why we got two. When I had Maui, she would not tolerate any other cats and really most other humans. She was taken from her mom at too young of an age but I didn't know this until I took her to the vet. The person who sold her to me said she was older than she was. So she became overly fond of me and also my husband and then to my daughter once she was born. But she wasn't very kind to most other humans. |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
On Aug 18, 5:27*pm, "Bill Graham" wrote:
Brooklyn1 wrote: dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Everyone, and everything, dies., What's important is enjoying what little time you have. This is true for me, and also true for my cats. Only a stupid liberal would trade freedom for a longer life, and then have the gall to impose their poor choice on the rest of the world...... Amazing how they can drag their Neanderthal politics into everything-- even a discussion about cats. HB |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
On Sat, 18 Aug 2012 17:27:30 -0700, "Bill Graham"
wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Everyone, and everything, dies., What's important is enjoying what little time you have. This is true for me, and also true for my cats. Only a stupid liberal would trade freedom for a longer life, and then have the gall to impose their poor choice on the rest of the world...... Hey, I'm a liberal and I let my cats out. |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
Higgs Boson wrote:
On Aug 18, 5:27 pm, "Bill Graham" wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Everyone, and everything, dies., What's important is enjoying what little time you have. This is true for me, and also true for my cats. Only a stupid liberal would trade freedom for a longer life, and then have the gall to impose their poor choice on the rest of the world...... Amazing how they can drag their Neanderthal politics into everything-- even a discussion about cats. Both cats and people (including Neanderthals) deserve freedom.... Or, at least, the choice.... |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
dgk wrote:
On Sat, 18 Aug 2012 17:27:30 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Everyone, and everything, dies., What's important is enjoying what little time you have. This is true for me, and also true for my cats. Only a stupid liberal would trade freedom for a longer life, and then have the gall to impose their poor choice on the rest of the world...... Hey, I'm a liberal and I let my cats out. Well, perhaps you are the exception... Most of the liberals I know have the following attitude: I wouldn't do it, and if I wouldn't do it, then nobody should do it, so we should make a law that forbids anyone from doing it. |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
On Mon, 20 Aug 2012 20:12:52 -0700, "Bill Graham"
wrote: dgk wrote: On Sat, 18 Aug 2012 17:27:30 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Everyone, and everything, dies., What's important is enjoying what little time you have. This is true for me, and also true for my cats. Only a stupid liberal would trade freedom for a longer life, and then have the gall to impose their poor choice on the rest of the world...... Hey, I'm a liberal and I let my cats out. Well, perhaps you are the exception... Most of the liberals I know have the following attitude: I wouldn't do it, and if I wouldn't do it, then nobody should do it, so we should make a law that forbids anyone from doing it. I don't think that has even a hint of truth to it though. Most liberals I know want people to do what they want. Get married to someone of the same sex? Fine by me. Get a tattoo, it's your body. You want to smoke pot? No problem to me. In fact, if you want to use cocaine and you're an adult, fine by me. Just collect some tax on it. No, most liberals are pretty libertarian. But there are limits and problems once things affect someone else. I prefer government to control those things rather than corporate power. And I see the attack on government as increasing corporate power. |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
In article ,
dgk wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2012 20:12:52 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: dgk wrote: On Sat, 18 Aug 2012 17:27:30 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Everyone, and everything, dies., What's important is enjoying what little time you have. This is true for me, and also true for my cats. Only a stupid liberal would trade freedom for a longer life, and then have the gall to impose their poor choice on the rest of the world...... Hey, I'm a liberal and I let my cats out. Well, perhaps you are the exception... Most of the liberals I know have the following attitude: I wouldn't do it, and if I wouldn't do it, then nobody should do it, so we should make a law that forbids anyone from doing it. I don't think that has even a hint of truth to it though. Most liberals I know want people to do what they want. Get married to someone of the same sex? Fine by me. Get a tattoo, it's your body. You want to smoke pot? No problem to me. In fact, if you want to use cocaine and you're an adult, fine by me. Just collect some tax on it. No, most liberals are pretty libertarian. But there are limits and problems once things affect someone else. I prefer government to control those things rather than corporate power. And I see the attack on government as increasing corporate power. http://cpc.grijalva.house.gov/the-pe...build-the-amer ican-dream/ -- Welcome to the New America. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hA736oK9FPg or E Pluribus Unum Green Party Nominee Jill Stein & Running Mate, Cheri Honkala http://www.democracynow.org/2012/7/13/green_party_nominee_jill_stein_running |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
On Aug 24, 5:51*am, dgk wrote:
On Mon, 20 Aug 2012 20:12:52 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: dgk wrote: On Sat, 18 Aug 2012 17:27:30 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Everyone, and everything, dies., What's important is enjoying what little time you have. This is true for me, and also true for my cats. Only a stupid liberal would trade freedom for a longer life, and then have the gall to impose their poor choice on the rest of the world...... Hey, I'm a liberal and I let my cats out. Well, perhaps you are the exception... Most of the liberals I know have the following attitude: I wouldn't do it, and if I wouldn't do it, then nobody should do it, so we should make a law that forbids anyone from doing it. I don't think that has even a hint of truth to it though. Most liberals I know want people to do what they want. Get married to someone of the same sex? Fine by me. Get a tattoo, it's your body. You want to smoke pot? No problem to me. In fact, if you want to use cocaine and you're an adult, fine by me. Just collect some tax on it. No, most liberals are pretty libertarian. ****In the immortal words of Samuel Goldwyn: INCLUDE ME OUT!!! (apocriphyl - apocryphil - apocryphal) I am a thinking adult, not a whining overgrown child. At the slightest whiff of Libertarianism, I take a long hot shower. But there are limits and problems once things affect someone else. I prefer government to control those things rather than corporate power. And I see the attack on government as increasing corporate power. ****Uh...since the government is pretty much sold out to Our Corporate Masters anyway, the only ones getting hurt are the most vulnerable. You know who they are...unless you exist in a separate universe like Mitt. |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
dgk wrote:
On Mon, 20 Aug 2012 20:12:52 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: dgk wrote: On Sat, 18 Aug 2012 17:27:30 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Everyone, and everything, dies., What's important is enjoying what little time you have. This is true for me, and also true for my cats. Only a stupid liberal would trade freedom for a longer life, and then have the gall to impose their poor choice on the rest of the world...... Hey, I'm a liberal and I let my cats out. Well, perhaps you are the exception... Most of the liberals I know have the following attitude: I wouldn't do it, and if I wouldn't do it, then nobody should do it, so we should make a law that forbids anyone from doing it. I don't think that has even a hint of truth to it though. Most liberals I know want people to do what they want. Get married to someone of the same sex? Fine by me. Get a tattoo, it's your body. You want to smoke pot? No problem to me. In fact, if you want to use cocaine and you're an adult, fine by me. Just collect some tax on it. No, most liberals are pretty libertarian. But there are limits and problems once things affect someone else. I prefer government to control those things rather than corporate power. And I see the attack on government as increasing corporate power. In my experience, I find that liberals will choose government over individuals or corporate entities. For example, if a corporate entity bribes a government official, the liberal is most likely to immediately blame the corporate entity, whereas, I will find the government official to be most despicable. After all, corporations have to compete, and if they suspect their competition of bribing the government, then they are forced to do likewise. But our representatives are expected (by me) to be not corrupted. They have the public's trust, and are most culpable in my mind... |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
Billy wrote:
In article , dgk wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2012 20:12:52 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: dgk wrote: On Sat, 18 Aug 2012 17:27:30 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Everyone, and everything, dies., What's important is enjoying what little time you have. This is true for me, and also true for my cats. Only a stupid liberal would trade freedom for a longer life, and then have the gall to impose their poor choice on the rest of the world...... Hey, I'm a liberal and I let my cats out. Well, perhaps you are the exception... Most of the liberals I know have the following attitude: I wouldn't do it, and if I wouldn't do it, then nobody should do it, so we should make a law that forbids anyone from doing it. I don't think that has even a hint of truth to it though. Most liberals I know want people to do what they want. Get married to someone of the same sex? Fine by me. Get a tattoo, it's your body. You want to smoke pot? No problem to me. In fact, if you want to use cocaine and you're an adult, fine by me. Just collect some tax on it. No, most liberals are pretty libertarian. But there are limits and problems once things affect someone else. I prefer government to control those things rather than corporate power. And I see the attack on government as increasing corporate power. Well, what do you think about the following: The government socializes medicine, and makes laws forcing hospitals to take care of anyone whether they are insured or not. - Then after a while, they say, "Since we are giving medical care at the taxpayer's expense to all who need it, we insist that you don't enguage in any activities that are dangerous to your health, such as driving without a seat belt, riding your cycle without a helmit, or smoking/eating the wrong foods that may incur health problems that we will have to take care of." IOW, they first socialize something, and then use their socialization as an excuse to control it. Suppose, for example they were to finance eternary clinics with the taxpayers money. Then, after letting that saettle in for a while, they say, "You may no longer let your cats roam free, because they may become injured by the dangers of freedom and this will impoact the tax funds. Therefore we are drafting a law that demands that everyone keep their cats locked up at all times." I think that if you could poll people on this, all the one3s who agreed with such a law would be liberals. (At least, that's where my money would go.) |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
"dgk" wrote in message ... On Mon, 20 Aug 2012 20:12:52 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: dgk wrote: On Sat, 18 Aug 2012 17:27:30 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Everyone, and everything, dies., What's important is enjoying what little time you have. This is true for me, and also true for my cats. Only a stupid liberal would trade freedom for a longer life, and then have the gall to impose their poor choice on the rest of the world...... Hey, I'm a liberal and I let my cats out. Well, perhaps you are the exception... Most of the liberals I know have the following attitude: I wouldn't do it, and if I wouldn't do it, then nobody should do it, so we should make a law that forbids anyone from doing it. I don't think that has even a hint of truth to it though. Most liberals I know want people to do what they want. Get married to someone of the same sex? Fine by me. Get a tattoo, it's your body. You want to smoke pot? No problem to me. In fact, if you want to use cocaine and you're an adult, fine by me. Just collect some tax on it. No, most liberals are pretty libertarian. But there are limits and problems once things affect someone else. I prefer government to control those things rather than corporate power. And I see the attack on government as increasing corporate power. I am a liberal and although I dislike politics, if I had to choose a party I guess libertarian would be the one I would identify with the most. There are some things that they are for that I am not although what it is now escapes me. I think for the most part people should be allowed to do what they want to do provided they are not hurting anyone, including themselves. I do dislike guns. I personally know too many people who have been permanently injured or even killed by them. Yes, stupid accidents. But accidents that wouldn't have happened if there were no gun. I do know some people are into hunting. I am not. I guess that is their right. And I guess an exception would have to be made there. Obviously police and military need weapons. I guess I really just don't want to think about it. Things like this make my brain hurt. |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
"Bill Graham" wrote in message ... Billy wrote: In article , dgk wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2012 20:12:52 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: dgk wrote: On Sat, 18 Aug 2012 17:27:30 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Everyone, and everything, dies., What's important is enjoying what little time you have. This is true for me, and also true for my cats. Only a stupid liberal would trade freedom for a longer life, and then have the gall to impose their poor choice on the rest of the world...... Hey, I'm a liberal and I let my cats out. Well, perhaps you are the exception... Most of the liberals I know have the following attitude: I wouldn't do it, and if I wouldn't do it, then nobody should do it, so we should make a law that forbids anyone from doing it. I don't think that has even a hint of truth to it though. Most liberals I know want people to do what they want. Get married to someone of the same sex? Fine by me. Get a tattoo, it's your body. You want to smoke pot? No problem to me. In fact, if you want to use cocaine and you're an adult, fine by me. Just collect some tax on it. No, most liberals are pretty libertarian. But there are limits and problems once things affect someone else. I prefer government to control those things rather than corporate power. And I see the attack on government as increasing corporate power. Well, what do you think about the following: The government socializes medicine, and makes laws forcing hospitals to take care of anyone whether they are insured or not. - Then after a while, they say, "Since we are giving medical care at the taxpayer's expense to all who need it, we insist that you don't enguage in any activities that are dangerous to your health, such as driving without a seat belt, riding your cycle without a helmit, or smoking/eating the wrong foods that may incur health problems that we will have to take care of." IOW, they first socialize something, and then use their socialization as an excuse to control it. Suppose, for example they were to finance eternary clinics with the taxpayers money. Then, after letting that saettle in for a while, they say, "You may no longer let your cats roam free, because they may become injured by the dangers of freedom and this will impoact the tax funds. Therefore we are drafting a law that demands that everyone keep their cats locked up at all times." I think that if you could poll people on this, all the one3s who agreed with such a law would be liberals. (At least, that's where my money would go.) I am against socialized medicine because I know people who live in countries that have it and I do not think and they do not think they are getting good care. Yes, some have no problems. But I have one friend who has had such problems that she could write a novel on it. Of course one doesn't have to have socialized medicine to have problems. I have had enough here in the USA. My same friend who has the medical problems lives in a rural area and there is no other house for miles around. She lets her cats and her dog run free. The only car they might get hit by is by her, her mom or a visitor. But there are wild animals out there. So if you're going to let your cat run free and it gets hit by a car or killed or injured by some other cat who is also running free or some wild animal... I just don't want to hear about it! It would be a different story if a house cat got loose and out of the house on its own. I do know this happens. But for a person to let it out loose? And then come whining to me because it was flattened by a car? Or eaten by a coyote? And yeah, that has happened. That then is your own fault, IMO. |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
"Bill Graham" wrote in message ... dgk wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2012 20:12:52 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: dgk wrote: On Sat, 18 Aug 2012 17:27:30 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Everyone, and everything, dies., What's important is enjoying what little time you have. This is true for me, and also true for my cats. Only a stupid liberal would trade freedom for a longer life, and then have the gall to impose their poor choice on the rest of the world...... Hey, I'm a liberal and I let my cats out. Well, perhaps you are the exception... Most of the liberals I know have the following attitude: I wouldn't do it, and if I wouldn't do it, then nobody should do it, so we should make a law that forbids anyone from doing it. I don't think that has even a hint of truth to it though. Most liberals I know want people to do what they want. Get married to someone of the same sex? Fine by me. Get a tattoo, it's your body. You want to smoke pot? No problem to me. In fact, if you want to use cocaine and you're an adult, fine by me. Just collect some tax on it. No, most liberals are pretty libertarian. But there are limits and problems once things affect someone else. I prefer government to control those things rather than corporate power. And I see the attack on government as increasing corporate power. In my experience, I find that liberals will choose government over individuals or corporate entities. For example, if a corporate entity bribes a government official, the liberal is most likely to immediately blame the corporate entity, whereas, I will find the government official to be most despicable. After all, corporations have to compete, and if they suspect their competition of bribing the government, then they are forced to do likewise. But our representatives are expected (by me) to be not corrupted. They have the public's trust, and are most culpable in my mind... Oh bah! I don't choose either one. Yes, I know that we need both for various reasons. I know there are corrupt people out there all over the place. I also know there isn't a danged thing I can do about it. So mostly I just stay out of it. I try to take care of myself. |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
On Sat, 25 Aug 2012 00:10:22 -0700, "Julie Bove"
wrote: "Bill Graham" wrote in message ... Billy wrote: In article , dgk wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2012 20:12:52 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: dgk wrote: On Sat, 18 Aug 2012 17:27:30 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Everyone, and everything, dies., What's important is enjoying what little time you have. This is true for me, and also true for my cats. Only a stupid liberal would trade freedom for a longer life, and then have the gall to impose their poor choice on the rest of the world...... Hey, I'm a liberal and I let my cats out. Well, perhaps you are the exception... Most of the liberals I know have the following attitude: I wouldn't do it, and if I wouldn't do it, then nobody should do it, so we should make a law that forbids anyone from doing it. I don't think that has even a hint of truth to it though. Most liberals I know want people to do what they want. Get married to someone of the same sex? Fine by me. Get a tattoo, it's your body. You want to smoke pot? No problem to me. In fact, if you want to use cocaine and you're an adult, fine by me. Just collect some tax on it. No, most liberals are pretty libertarian. But there are limits and problems once things affect someone else. I prefer government to control those things rather than corporate power. And I see the attack on government as increasing corporate power. Well, what do you think about the following: The government socializes medicine, and makes laws forcing hospitals to take care of anyone whether they are insured or not. - Then after a while, they say, "Since we are giving medical care at the taxpayer's expense to all who need it, we insist that you don't enguage in any activities that are dangerous to your health, such as driving without a seat belt, riding your cycle without a helmit, or smoking/eating the wrong foods that may incur health problems that we will have to take care of." IOW, they first socialize something, and then use their socialization as an excuse to control it. Suppose, for example they were to finance eternary clinics with the taxpayers money. Then, after letting that saettle in for a while, they say, "You may no longer let your cats roam free, because they may become injured by the dangers of freedom and this will impoact the tax funds. Therefore we are drafting a law that demands that everyone keep their cats locked up at all times." I think that if you could poll people on this, all the one3s who agreed with such a law would be liberals. (At least, that's where my money would go.) I am against socialized medicine because I know people who live in countries that have it and I do not think and they do not think they are getting good care. Yes, some have no problems. But I have one friend who has had such problems that she could write a novel on it. Of course one doesn't have to have socialized medicine to have problems. I have had enough here in the USA. My same friend who has the medical problems lives in a rural area and there is no other house for miles around. She lets her cats and her dog run free. The only car they might get hit by is by her, her mom or a visitor. But there are wild animals out there. So if you're going to let your cat run free and it gets hit by a car or killed or injured by some other cat who is also running free or some wild animal... I just don't want to hear about it! It would be a different story if a house cat got loose and out of the house on its own. I do know this happens. But for a person to let it out loose? And then come whining to me because it was flattened by a car? Or eaten by a coyote? And yeah, that has happened. That then is your own fault, IMO. Those are the same imbeciles who let their four year old play in the road. |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
Julie Bove wrote:
"dgk" wrote in message ... On Mon, 20 Aug 2012 20:12:52 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: dgk wrote: On Sat, 18 Aug 2012 17:27:30 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Everyone, and everything, dies., What's important is enjoying what little time you have. This is true for me, and also true for my cats. Only a stupid liberal would trade freedom for a longer life, and then have the gall to impose their poor choice on the rest of the world...... Hey, I'm a liberal and I let my cats out. Well, perhaps you are the exception... Most of the liberals I know have the following attitude: I wouldn't do it, and if I wouldn't do it, then nobody should do it, so we should make a law that forbids anyone from doing it. I don't think that has even a hint of truth to it though. Most liberals I know want people to do what they want. Get married to someone of the same sex? Fine by me. Get a tattoo, it's your body. You want to smoke pot? No problem to me. In fact, if you want to use cocaine and you're an adult, fine by me. Just collect some tax on it. No, most liberals are pretty libertarian. But there are limits and problems once things affect someone else. I prefer government to control those things rather than corporate power. And I see the attack on government as increasing corporate power. I am a liberal and although I dislike politics, if I had to choose a party I guess libertarian would be the one I would identify with the most. There are some things that they are for that I am not although what it is now escapes me. I think for the most part people should be allowed to do what they want to do provided they are not hurting anyone, including themselves. I do dislike guns. I personally know too many people who have been permanently injured or even killed by them. Yes, stupid accidents. But accidents that wouldn't have happened if there were no gun. I do know some people are into hunting. I am not. I guess that is their right. And I guess an exception would have to be made there. Obviously police and military need weapons. I guess I really just don't want to think about it. Things like this make my brain hurt. Well, as a libertarian, I have owned and carried a gun most of my life. To be sure, gun accidents wouldn't happen were there no guns, but then, auto accidents wouldn't happen were there no cars, either, and, like cars, guns do have a purpose. I don't hunt, but I don't want to be killed by some mugger or crazy person either, and carrying a gun gave me comfort and the courage to go into some fairly dangerous places. If the world were chock full of policemen so there was one on every corner 24-7, then guns would not be necessary. But, unfortunately, the police can't prevent crime. There aren't nearly enough of them for that. They can only hunt down the criminals after the fact. So, if you want to prevent something bad from happening to you, you have to do it yourself. When a crime is taking place there will, in all likelihood be only two people there. You, and the criminal who is out to harm you. So, you had better be able to defend yourself, and the only way I know how to do this effectively is to carry a gun and know how to use it. |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
Julie Bove wrote:
I am against socialized medicine because I know people who live in countries that have it and I do not think and they do not think they are getting good care. Yes, some have no problems. But I have one friend who has had such problems that she could write a novel on it. Of course one doesn't have to have socialized medicine to have problems. I have had enough here in the USA. My same friend who has the medical problems lives in a rural area and there is no other house for miles around. She lets her cats and her dog run free. The only car they might get hit by is by her, her mom or a visitor. But there are wild animals out there. So if you're going to let your cat run free and it gets hit by a car or killed or injured by some other cat who is also running free or some wild animal... I just don't want to hear about it! It would be a different story if a house cat got loose and out of the house on its own. I do know this happens. But for a person to let it out loose? And then come whining to me because it was flattened by a car? Or eaten by a coyote? And yeah, that has happened. That then is your own fault, IMO. I have lived in both kinds of environments. Ones that are dangerous to outside cats and ones that aren't. Right now, I live on a dead end street, and next to a huge Christmas tree farm, and all of my cats are free to go and come as they please. I wouldn't recommend that everyone do this, but I know that there are some circumstancews where it is OK, so I wouldn't try to tell everyone to do one or the other. If you lived on a farm, I think you would let your cats go free to chase the chickens.... If there were no free cats, then I probably wouldn't own any cats. All of my cats were free roaming animals when I got them. They just happened to wander in one day, liked the cut of my jib, and decided to stay. I never trapped them, and I feel that their freedom isn't my business to prevent. If they want to leave, they can go at any time. But hey! I am a libertarian, so what can you expect? If it makes you feel any better, I have found that almost all of my cats never leave the property. They are quite content to sun themselves out on my rear deck and are quite safe there. I have never seen a coyote or other predatory animal on my property, although there was an incident many years ago where I heard a loud bang, and when I looked outside, there was a large bird of prey, (like an eagle or osprey) out on the deck, and our cat had skeedadled through the cat door into the bedroom... The bird was stunned, but recovered in a few seconds and flew away. I presume that it had seen our cat (Missy) and tried to take her. But this is very unusual, and I haven't heard of any of the neighborhood cats getting into trouble, and the block has about ten of them, and they are all outside cats..... |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
Julie Bove wrote:
"Bill Graham" wrote in message ... dgk wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2012 20:12:52 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: dgk wrote: On Sat, 18 Aug 2012 17:27:30 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Everyone, and everything, dies., What's important is enjoying what little time you have. This is true for me, and also true for my cats. Only a stupid liberal would trade freedom for a longer life, and then have the gall to impose their poor choice on the rest of the world...... Hey, I'm a liberal and I let my cats out. Well, perhaps you are the exception... Most of the liberals I know have the following attitude: I wouldn't do it, and if I wouldn't do it, then nobody should do it, so we should make a law that forbids anyone from doing it. I don't think that has even a hint of truth to it though. Most liberals I know want people to do what they want. Get married to someone of the same sex? Fine by me. Get a tattoo, it's your body. You want to smoke pot? No problem to me. In fact, if you want to use cocaine and you're an adult, fine by me. Just collect some tax on it. No, most liberals are pretty libertarian. But there are limits and problems once things affect someone else. I prefer government to control those things rather than corporate power. And I see the attack on government as increasing corporate power. In my experience, I find that liberals will choose government over individuals or corporate entities. For example, if a corporate entity bribes a government official, the liberal is most likely to immediately blame the corporate entity, whereas, I will find the government official to be most despicable. After all, corporations have to compete, and if they suspect their competition of bribing the government, then they are forced to do likewise. But our representatives are expected (by me) to be not corrupted. They have the public's trust, and are most culpable in my mind... Oh bah! I don't choose either one. Yes, I know that we need both for various reasons. I know there are corrupt people out there all over the place. I also know there isn't a danged thing I can do about it. So mostly I just stay out of it. I try to take care of myself. Perhaps, but be aware that what others do can directly affect you. Its kind of like being an isolationist. You can turn your back on the rest of the world, and say. "what they do in other countries just isn't my business." And, in 1912 this might have been a pretty good policy, but today, any two bit dictator could build an atom bomb, and deploy it in the center of New York City, and kill perhaps a million people, so we can no longer turn our backs on the rest of the world. |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
In article ,
"Bill Graham" wrote: Would you two mind awfully deleting rec.gardens from your conversation? Julie Bove wrote: "dgk" wrote in message ... On Mon, 20 Aug 2012 20:12:52 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: dgk wrote: On Sat, 18 Aug 2012 17:27:30 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Everyone, and everything, dies., What's important is enjoying what little time you have. This is true for me, and also true for my cats. Only a stupid liberal would trade freedom for a longer life, and then have the gall to impose their poor choice on the rest of the world...... Hey, I'm a liberal and I let my cats out. Well, perhaps you are the exception... Most of the liberals I know have the following attitude: I wouldn't do it, and if I wouldn't do it, then nobody should do it, so we should make a law that forbids anyone from doing it. I don't think that has even a hint of truth to it though. Most liberals I know want people to do what they want. Get married to someone of the same sex? Fine by me. Get a tattoo, it's your body. You want to smoke pot? No problem to me. In fact, if you want to use cocaine and you're an adult, fine by me. Just collect some tax on it. No, most liberals are pretty libertarian. But there are limits and problems once things affect someone else. I prefer government to control those things rather than corporate power. And I see the attack on government as increasing corporate power. I am a liberal and although I dislike politics, if I had to choose a party I guess libertarian would be the one I would identify with the most. There are some things that they are for that I am not although what it is now escapes me. I think for the most part people should be allowed to do what they want to do provided they are not hurting anyone, including themselves. I do dislike guns. I personally know too many people who have been permanently injured or even killed by them. Yes, stupid accidents. But accidents that wouldn't have happened if there were no gun. I do know some people are into hunting. I am not. I guess that is their right. And I guess an exception would have to be made there. Obviously police and military need weapons. I guess I really just don't want to think about it. Things like this make my brain hurt. Well, as a libertarian, I have owned and carried a gun most of my life. To be sure, gun accidents wouldn't happen were there no guns, but then, auto accidents wouldn't happen were there no cars, either, and, like cars, guns do have a purpose. I don't hunt, but I don't want to be killed by some mugger or crazy person either, and carrying a gun gave me comfort and the courage to go into some fairly dangerous places. If the world were chock full of policemen so there was one on every corner 24-7, then guns would not be necessary. But, unfortunately, the police can't prevent crime. There aren't nearly enough of them for that. They can only hunt down the criminals after the fact. So, if you want to prevent something bad from happening to you, you have to do it yourself. When a crime is taking place there will, in all likelihood be only two people there. You, and the criminal who is out to harm you. So, you had better be able to defend yourself, and the only way I know how to do this effectively is to carry a gun and know how to use it. -- Welcome to the New America. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hA736oK9FPg or E Pluribus Unum Green Party Nominee Jill Stein & Running Mate, Cheri Honkala http://www.democracynow.org/2012/7/13/green_party_nominee_jill_stein_running |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
Brooklyn1 wrote:
On Sat, 25 Aug 2012 00:10:22 -0700, "Julie Bove" wrote: "Bill Graham" wrote in message ... Billy wrote: In article , dgk wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2012 20:12:52 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: dgk wrote: On Sat, 18 Aug 2012 17:27:30 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Everyone, and everything, dies., What's important is enjoying what little time you have. This is true for me, and also true for my cats. Only a stupid liberal would trade freedom for a longer life, and then have the gall to impose their poor choice on the rest of the world...... Hey, I'm a liberal and I let my cats out. Well, perhaps you are the exception... Most of the liberals I know have the following attitude: I wouldn't do it, and if I wouldn't do it, then nobody should do it, so we should make a law that forbids anyone from doing it. I don't think that has even a hint of truth to it though. Most liberals I know want people to do what they want. Get married to someone of the same sex? Fine by me. Get a tattoo, it's your body. You want to smoke pot? No problem to me. In fact, if you want to use cocaine and you're an adult, fine by me. Just collect some tax on it. No, most liberals are pretty libertarian. But there are limits and problems once things affect someone else. I prefer government to control those things rather than corporate power. And I see the attack on government as increasing corporate power. Well, what do you think about the following: The government socializes medicine, and makes laws forcing hospitals to take care of anyone whether they are insured or not. - Then after a while, they say, "Since we are giving medical care at the taxpayer's expense to all who need it, we insist that you don't enguage in any activities that are dangerous to your health, such as driving without a seat belt, riding your cycle without a helmit, or smoking/eating the wrong foods that may incur health problems that we will have to take care of." IOW, they first socialize something, and then use their socialization as an excuse to control it. Suppose, for example they were to finance eternary clinics with the taxpayers money. Then, after letting that saettle in for a while, they say, "You may no longer let your cats roam free, because they may become injured by the dangers of freedom and this will impoact the tax funds. Therefore we are drafting a law that demands that everyone keep their cats locked up at all times." I think that if you could poll people on this, all the one3s who agreed with such a law would be liberals. (At least, that's where my money would go.) I am against socialized medicine because I know people who live in countries that have it and I do not think and they do not think they are getting good care. Yes, some have no problems. But I have one friend who has had such problems that she could write a novel on it. Of course one doesn't have to have socialized medicine to have problems. I have had enough here in the USA. My same friend who has the medical problems lives in a rural area and there is no other house for miles around. She lets her cats and her dog run free. The only car they might get hit by is by her, her mom or a visitor. But there are wild animals out there. So if you're going to let your cat run free and it gets hit by a car or killed or injured by some other cat who is also running free or some wild animal... I just don't want to hear about it! It would be a different story if a house cat got loose and out of the house on its own. I do know this happens. But for a person to let it out loose? And then come whining to me because it was flattened by a car? Or eaten by a coyote? And yeah, that has happened. That then is your own fault, IMO. Those are the same imbeciles who let their four year old play in the road. That's true. |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
In article ,
"Julie Bove" wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: On Sat, 25 Aug 2012 00:10:22 -0700, "Julie Bove" wrote: "Bill Graham" wrote in message ... Billy wrote: In article , dgk wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2012 20:12:52 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: dgk wrote: On Sat, 18 Aug 2012 17:27:30 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Everyone, and everything, dies., What's important is enjoying what little time you have. This is true for me, and also true for my cats. Only a stupid liberal would trade freedom for a longer life, and then have the gall to impose their poor choice on the rest of the world...... Hey, I'm a liberal and I let my cats out. Well, perhaps you are the exception... Most of the liberals I know have the following attitude: I wouldn't do it, and if I wouldn't do it, then nobody should do it, so we should make a law that forbids anyone from doing it. I don't think that has even a hint of truth to it though. Most liberals I know want people to do what they want. Get married to someone of the same sex? Fine by me. Get a tattoo, it's your body. You want to smoke pot? No problem to me. In fact, if you want to use cocaine and you're an adult, fine by me. Just collect some tax on it. No, most liberals are pretty libertarian. But there are limits and problems once things affect someone else. I prefer government to control those things rather than corporate power. And I see the attack on government as increasing corporate power. Well, what do you think about the following: The government socializes medicine, and makes laws forcing hospitals to take care of anyone whether they are insured or not. - Then after a while, they say, "Since we are giving medical care at the taxpayer's expense to all who need it, we insist that you don't enguage in any activities that are dangerous to your health, such as driving without a seat belt, riding your cycle without a helmit, or smoking/eating the wrong foods that may incur health problems that we will have to take care of." IOW, they first socialize something, and then use their socialization as an excuse to control it. Suppose, for example they were to finance eternary clinics with the taxpayers money. Then, after letting that saettle in for a while, they say, "You may no longer let your cats roam free, because they may become injured by the dangers of freedom and this will impoact the tax funds. Therefore we are drafting a law that demands that everyone keep their cats locked up at all times." I think that if you could poll people on this, all the one3s who agreed with such a law would be liberals. (At least, that's where my money would go.) I am against socialized medicine because I know people who live in countries that have it and I do not think and they do not think they are getting good care. Yes, some have no problems. But I have one friend who has had such problems that she could write a novel on it. Of course one doesn't have to have socialized medicine to have problems. I have had enough here in the USA. My same friend who has the medical problems lives in a rural area and there is no other house for miles around. She lets her cats and her dog run free. The only car they might get hit by is by her, her mom or a visitor. But there are wild animals out there. So if you're going to let your cat run free and it gets hit by a car or killed or injured by some other cat who is also running free or some wild animal... I just don't want to hear about it! It would be a different story if a house cat got loose and out of the house on its own. I do know this happens. But for a person to let it out loose? And then come whining to me because it was flattened by a car? Or eaten by a coyote? And yeah, that has happened. That then is your own fault, IMO. Those are the same imbeciles who let their four year old play in the road. That's true. So you are talking to the local troll Julie. I asked that this conversation be taken elsewhere, out of rec.gardens, but the troll has brought it back. Be advise that Brooklyn1, aka Sheldon, Shelly is an verified asshole. Keep talking to him until he starts drinking again, and he will tell you what he thinks of Christians, and women's anatomy. -- Welcome to the New America. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hA736oK9FPg or E Pluribus Unum Green Party Nominee Jill Stein & Running Mate, Cheri Honkala http://www.democracynow.org/2012/7/13/green_party_nominee_jill_stein_running |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
"Billy" wrote in message ... In article , "Julie Bove" wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: On Sat, 25 Aug 2012 00:10:22 -0700, "Julie Bove" wrote: "Bill Graham" wrote in message ... Billy wrote: In article , dgk wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2012 20:12:52 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: dgk wrote: On Sat, 18 Aug 2012 17:27:30 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Everyone, and everything, dies., What's important is enjoying what little time you have. This is true for me, and also true for my cats. Only a stupid liberal would trade freedom for a longer life, and then have the gall to impose their poor choice on the rest of the world...... Hey, I'm a liberal and I let my cats out. Well, perhaps you are the exception... Most of the liberals I know have the following attitude: I wouldn't do it, and if I wouldn't do it, then nobody should do it, so we should make a law that forbids anyone from doing it. I don't think that has even a hint of truth to it though. Most liberals I know want people to do what they want. Get married to someone of the same sex? Fine by me. Get a tattoo, it's your body. You want to smoke pot? No problem to me. In fact, if you want to use cocaine and you're an adult, fine by me. Just collect some tax on it. No, most liberals are pretty libertarian. But there are limits and problems once things affect someone else. I prefer government to control those things rather than corporate power. And I see the attack on government as increasing corporate power. Well, what do you think about the following: The government socializes medicine, and makes laws forcing hospitals to take care of anyone whether they are insured or not. - Then after a while, they say, "Since we are giving medical care at the taxpayer's expense to all who need it, we insist that you don't enguage in any activities that are dangerous to your health, such as driving without a seat belt, riding your cycle without a helmit, or smoking/eating the wrong foods that may incur health problems that we will have to take care of." IOW, they first socialize something, and then use their socialization as an excuse to control it. Suppose, for example they were to finance eternary clinics with the taxpayers money. Then, after letting that saettle in for a while, they say, "You may no longer let your cats roam free, because they may become injured by the dangers of freedom and this will impoact the tax funds. Therefore we are drafting a law that demands that everyone keep their cats locked up at all times." I think that if you could poll people on this, all the one3s who agreed with such a law would be liberals. (At least, that's where my money would go.) I am against socialized medicine because I know people who live in countries that have it and I do not think and they do not think they are getting good care. Yes, some have no problems. But I have one friend who has had such problems that she could write a novel on it. Of course one doesn't have to have socialized medicine to have problems. I have had enough here in the USA. My same friend who has the medical problems lives in a rural area and there is no other house for miles around. She lets her cats and her dog run free. The only car they might get hit by is by her, her mom or a visitor. But there are wild animals out there. So if you're going to let your cat run free and it gets hit by a car or killed or injured by some other cat who is also running free or some wild animal... I just don't want to hear about it! It would be a different story if a house cat got loose and out of the house on its own. I do know this happens. But for a person to let it out loose? And then come whining to me because it was flattened by a car? Or eaten by a coyote? And yeah, that has happened. That then is your own fault, IMO. Those are the same imbeciles who let their four year old play in the road. That's true. So you are talking to the local troll Julie. I asked that this conversation be taken elsewhere, out of rec.gardens, but the troll has brought it back. Be advise that Brooklyn1, aka Sheldon, Shelly is an verified asshole. Keep talking to him until he starts drinking again, and he will tell you what he thinks of Christians, and women's anatomy. I do know Sheldon from another group. And I know what he thinks about my hooters. I don't consider him to be a troll but maybe you do. |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
On Aug 25, 12:10*am, "Julie Bove" wrote:
"Bill Graham" wrote in message ... Billy wrote: In article , dgk wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2012 20:12:52 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: dgk wrote: On Sat, 18 Aug 2012 17:27:30 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Everyone, and everything, dies., What's important is enjoying what little time you have. This is true for me, and also true for my cats. Only a stupid liberal would trade freedom for a longer life, and then have the gall to impose their poor choice on the rest of the world...... Hey, I'm a liberal and I let my cats out. Well, perhaps you are the exception... Most of the liberals I know have the following attitude: I wouldn't do it, and if I wouldn't do it, then nobody should do it, so we should make a law that forbids anyone from doing it. I don't think that has even a hint of truth to it though. Most liberals I know want people to do what they want. Get married to someone of the same sex? Fine by me. Get a tattoo, it's your body. You want to smoke pot? No problem to me. In fact, if you want to use cocaine and you're an adult, fine by me. Just collect some tax on it. No, most liberals are pretty libertarian. But there are limits and problems once things affect someone else. I prefer government to control those things rather than corporate power. And I see the attack on government as increasing corporate power. Well, what do you think about the following: The government socializes medicine, and makes laws forcing hospitals to take care of anyone whether they are insured or not. - Then after a while, they say, "Since we are giving medical care at the taxpayer's expense to all who need it, we insist that you don't enguage in any activities that are dangerous to your health, such as driving without a seat belt, riding your cycle without a helmit, or smoking/eating the wrong foods that may incur health problems that we will have to take care of." IOW, they first socialize something, and then use their socialization as an excuse to control it. Suppose, for example they were to finance eternary clinics with the taxpayers money. Then, after letting that saettle in for a while, they say, "You may no longer let your cats roam free, because they may become injured by the dangers of freedom and this will impoact the tax funds. Therefore we are drafting a law that demands that everyone keep their cats locked up at all times." I think that if you could poll people on this, all the one3s who agreed with such a law would be liberals. (At least, that's where my money would go.) I am against socialized medicine because I know people who live in countries that have it and I do not think and they do not think they are getting good care. *Yes, some have no problems. *But I have one friend who has had such problems that she could write a novel on it. *Of course one doesn't have to have socialized medicine to have problems. *I have had enough here in the USA. [...] Your data base is on the smallish side, for a country with over 300,000,000 population. Suggestion -- to you and others (you know who you are). Simply remove the term "socialized medicine" and substitute ""universal health care", and see how much that simple change of words will soothe your savage breasts. To be blunt, I doubt if 99% of the respondents have a CLUE as to the history of socialism. You just ingest and regurgitate the bilge that is fed to you throujgh the corporate media. Their funders -- Koch et al -- poop their pants at the thought that giving workers decent conditions and refraining from manufacturing harmful products could -- heaven forfend -- send the stock price down even a point or two. Yet all objective research shows that treating employees well, thus lessening turnover and concomitant need for re-training, and selling good products actually HELPS the bottom line. This comes from a card-carrying capitalist, who is sure capitalism can be made to work profitably for the sellers and compassionately for the buyers. It's only massive greed, arrogance, and lust for power that screws up a viable system. HB HB |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
On Sun, 26 Aug 2012 16:28:36 -0700 (PDT), Higgs Boson
wrote: On Aug 25, 12:10*am, "Julie Bove" wrote: "Bill Graham" wrote in message ... Billy wrote: In article , dgk wrote: On Mon, 20 Aug 2012 20:12:52 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: dgk wrote: On Sat, 18 Aug 2012 17:27:30 -0700, "Bill Graham" wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: dgk wrote: Brooklyn1 wrote: Gas Bag wrote: She wants to stop her cats getting out, and other cats getting in. To any cat "lovers" out there, my friend isn't getting rid of her cats, nor is she trapping/baiting any of the cats in her suburb. Anyone who cares about their cats doesn't let them out. Like most absolute statements, that's nonsense. Cats enjoy being outdoors and if we really care about our cats we want them to be happy. Safe counts but so does happy. What good is a "happy" cat flattened with tire tread impressions... cats are happy indoors... you're an imbecile. Everyone, and everything, dies., What's important is enjoying what little time you have. This is true for me, and also true for my cats. Only a stupid liberal would trade freedom for a longer life, and then have the gall to impose their poor choice on the rest of the world...... Hey, I'm a liberal and I let my cats out. Well, perhaps you are the exception... Most of the liberals I know have the following attitude: I wouldn't do it, and if I wouldn't do it, then nobody should do it, so we should make a law that forbids anyone from doing it. I don't think that has even a hint of truth to it though. Most liberals I know want people to do what they want. Get married to someone of the same sex? Fine by me. Get a tattoo, it's your body. You want to smoke pot? No problem to me. In fact, if you want to use cocaine and you're an adult, fine by me. Just collect some tax on it. No, most liberals are pretty libertarian. But there are limits and problems once things affect someone else. I prefer government to control those things rather than corporate power. And I see the attack on government as increasing corporate power. Well, what do you think about the following: The government socializes medicine, and makes laws forcing hospitals to take care of anyone whether they are insured or not. - Then after a while, they say, "Since we are giving medical care at the taxpayer's expense to all who need it, we insist that you don't enguage in any activities that are dangerous to your health, such as driving without a seat belt, riding your cycle without a helmit, or smoking/eating the wrong foods that may incur health problems that we will have to take care of." IOW, they first socialize something, and then use their socialization as an excuse to control it. Suppose, for example they were to finance eternary clinics with the taxpayers money. Then, after letting that saettle in for a while, they say, "You may no longer let your cats roam free, because they may become injured by the dangers of freedom and this will impoact the tax funds. Therefore we are drafting a law that demands that everyone keep their cats locked up at all times." I think that if you could poll people on this, all the one3s who agreed with such a law would be liberals. (At least, that's where my money would go.) I am against socialized medicine because I know people who live in countries that have it and I do not think and they do not think they are getting good care. *Yes, some have no problems. *But I have one friend who has had such problems that she could write a novel on it. *Of course one doesn't have to have socialized medicine to have problems. *I have had enough here in the USA. [...] Your data base is on the smallish side, for a country with over 300,000,000 population. Suggestion -- to you and others (you know who you are). Simply remove the term "socialized medicine" and substitute ""universal health care", and see how much that simple change of words will soothe your savage breasts. To be blunt, I doubt if 99% of the respondents have a CLUE as to the history of socialism. You just ingest and regurgitate the bilge that is fed to you throujgh the corporate media. Their funders -- Koch et al -- poop their pants at the thought that giving workers decent conditions and refraining from manufacturing harmful products could -- heaven forfend -- send the stock price down even a point or two. Yet all objective research shows that treating employees well, thus lessening turnover and concomitant need for re-training, and selling good products actually HELPS the bottom line. This comes from a card-carrying capitalist, who is sure capitalism can be made to work profitably for the sellers and compassionately for the buyers. It's only massive greed, arrogance, and lust for power that screws up a viable system. HB HB HB IS REALLY QUITE MENTALLY ILL... ITS ONLY REASON FOR BEING HERE IS TO PICK ARGUMENTS ABOUT THAT WHICH HE KNOWS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. TO DATE HB HAS POSTED NOTHING OF VALUE... HAS ANYONE SEEN HIS GARDEN, OF COURSE NOT, HB LIVES IN A ONE ROOM CELLAR APARTMENT FOR WHICH IT'S LATE PAYING RENT. HB IS NO KIND OF GARDNER, IT'S HANDS HAVE NEVER TOUCHED DIRT. |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
"Higgs Boson" wrote in message ... Your data base is on the smallish side, for a country with over 300,000,000 population. Suggestion -- to you and others (you know who you are). Simply remove the term "socialized medicine" and substitute ""universal health care", and see how much that simple change of words will soothe your savage breasts. --------- Nope. I don't even like HMO's. After having studied insurance on the brink of my husband getting a new job I can now say that a lot of it truly sucks. To say that we all need health insurance or to make it available to everyone is truly meaningless. As much as I have complained about the medical insurance that I do have, apparently it is quite good. I consider myself lucky. --------- To be blunt, I doubt if 99% of the respondents have a CLUE as to the history of socialism. You just ingest and regurgitate the bilge that is fed to you throujgh the corporate media. Their funders -- Koch et al -- poop their pants at the thought that giving workers decent conditions and refraining from manufacturing harmful products could -- heaven forfend -- send the stock price down even a point or two. Yet all objective research shows that treating employees well, thus lessening turnover and concomitant need for re-training, and selling good products actually HELPS the bottom line. --------- Actually I know pretty much about it seeing as how the brother of one of my best friends was (not sure if he still is) a member of the Socialist Worker's Party. I had to listen to him spout off about it far more than I wanted to. Sounds pretty good on paper but when you think about it, doesn't work out so well for a lot of people. This comes from a card-carrying capitalist, who is sure capitalism can be made to work profitably for the sellers and compassionately for the buyers. It's only massive greed, arrogance, and lust for power that screws up a viable system. ------- Okay... I am one of those people who doesn't really desire to be rich and famous. As long as I have a roof over my head, enough money to get what I need, enough to eat, etc., I'm okay. I do donate food to the food bank when I can and I do give to animal charities when I can. *shrugs* |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
Higgs Boson wrote:
Suggestion -- to you and others (you know who you are). Simply remove the term "socialized medicine" and substitute ""universal health care", and see how much that simple change of words will soothe your savage breasts. Yes. It is possible to put sheep's clothing on the wolf. The Brothers Grimm taught us that many years ago. But that doesn't make it right. It just makes it liberal.... |
Fences - Cats - DIY?
Julie Bove wrote:
"Higgs Boson" wrote in message ... Your data base is on the smallish side, for a country with over 300,000,000 population. Suggestion -- to you and others (you know who you are). Simply remove the term "socialized medicine" and substitute ""universal health care", and see how much that simple change of words will soothe your savage breasts. --------- Nope. I don't even like HMO's. After having studied insurance on the brink of my husband getting a new job I can now say that a lot of it truly sucks. To say that we all need health insurance or to make it available to everyone is truly meaningless. As much as I have complained about the medical insurance that I do have, apparently it is quite good. I consider myself lucky. --------- To be blunt, I doubt if 99% of the respondents have a CLUE as to the history of socialism. You just ingest and regurgitate the bilge that is fed to you throujgh the corporate media. Their funders -- Koch et al -- poop their pants at the thought that giving workers decent conditions and refraining from manufacturing harmful products could -- heaven forfend -- send the stock price down even a point or two. Yet all objective research shows that treating employees well, thus lessening turnover and concomitant need for re-training, and selling good products actually HELPS the bottom line. --------- Actually I know pretty much about it seeing as how the brother of one of my best friends was (not sure if he still is) a member of the Socialist Worker's Party. I had to listen to him spout off about it far more than I wanted to. Sounds pretty good on paper but when you think about it, doesn't work out so well for a lot of people. This comes from a card-carrying capitalist, who is sure capitalism can be made to work profitably for the sellers and compassionately for the buyers. It's only massive greed, arrogance, and lust for power that screws up a viable system. ------- Okay... I am one of those people who doesn't really desire to be rich and famous. As long as I have a roof over my head, enough money to get what I need, enough to eat, etc., I'm okay. I do donate food to the food bank when I can and I do give to animal charities when I can. *shrugs* Capitalism has worked very well for over 250 years. Socialism, on the other hand is definitely not working in Europe (many countries there are going broke) and, it doesn't seem to be working very well here, either. (Those bums who live down under the freeway overpass on welfare checks are increasing in number) I think I'll stick with capitalism and our Constitution, thanks..... |
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