Is it wrong to want another purebred?

Meghan Noecker wrote:

Mine was, and I didn't even know I wanted another cat yet - I already
had 3.


Just wanted to say, the cat sounds gorgeous. Have you posted any pics?

-L.

On Sat, 26 Mar 2005 20:39:50 -0700, "Monique Y. Mudama"
wrote:

On 2005-03-27, Brian Link penned:
Going through old photos today, and came across a directory filled with pics
from when we were thinking about buying a Bengal (which we did, and he's
wonderful). Most are from this site:
http://www.tibcs.com/petcorner/photos.php

After having been through an ordeal with a stray, and knowing the incredible
number of discarded cats available for adoption, is it morally wrong to
think of adopting another purebred?

We've adopted six strays over the last ten years. We bought our Bengal
primarily because we wanted a cat whose personality could be determined
before hand, so it would keep our playful, energetic Tiger company. This was
a specific case that's worked out fantastically..
http://www.discant.com/Cat/Henry%20001.jpg

But I really love this breed - and if we can get ahold of a kitten, there's
a better chance that Louis won't go nuts.

Just a thought. Breeders will continue to breed no matter what we do, and
poor strays will get euthanized no matter what we do. But is this just
rationalizing?

Eh.. I'm not totally driven to take in another cat, but I keep wondering
what Louis will do when Tiger finally dies.. it would be so nice for him to
have another friend around. Also I'd be happy to hear others' thoughts about
adopting from a shelter vs adopting a purebred.

BLink

You're asking a tough question here. For me, cats are cats regardless of
breed, so I have to put the question to myself in terms of dogs, where
variations are more significant to me. There are most certainly breeds of
dogs that I like much better than others.

I believe in the principle of generalization (kind of like the golden rule):
this is one way that Kant proposed to evaluate whether or not something is
moral. You simply pose yourself the question, if everyone were to do what I
am considering, would I find the world to be a better or a worse place?

This is a somewhat rarified philosophical question, which has limited
use in real-world situations. At least this one.

If everyone bought purebreds, who were spayed/neutered unless the
buyer was a certified breeder themselves, then there would be no
strays.

However, in the real world, some buy purebreds, others let their pets
breed willy-nilly. Worse yet, others let their unfixed cats go wild.
Result = more strays than purebreds.

It's a toughie. If no one bought cats and dogs from breeders, then breeders
would go out of business, and there would just be moggies.

This is also a tough issue which brings into focus one's worldview. If
you feel cats are basically vermin (gak - that's too strong a word, at
least you feel that cats are short-lived animals which can also be
companion animals), then the fate of coyote-culled feral colonies can
be chalked up to the cruelty of the wilderness.. the same way
beautiful animals such as deer are piled up by the dozen along rural
highways. Or bunnies. Or squirrels (which my mother despises, but I
personally love seeing loping in our front yard).

Just playing devil's advocate here.. you all know I love all cats...

Personally, I think purebreeds play a useful role for a number of
reasons. An owner unfamiliar with cats adopts a purebred on
well-advertised temperament, appearance and behavior - if they form a
relationship they have a new respect for the animal and may choose to
adopt a stray the next time. An owner (like myself) who needs a
particular personality which inbreeding can assure buys a purebred
with such a personality. That owner may also take in strays or adopt
as well.

My own issues have stemmed from the fact that all my cats have been
adoptees who would otherwise have died or been shelter-bound (seven
over the last ten years), and the one exception was chosen based on
the suitability of the breed's advertised personality as a companion
for our one remaining mutt, a playful, energetic and social beast.
Louis the Bengal and Tiger the Maine-Coonish mutt are an utter success
story.

Megan has helped me see that there exist such things as foster-rescue
homes, where people live with their cats and are reliable to judge
their personalities. Tiger is 9 years senior to Louis, and when he
dies, I know Louis will be lonely. The bond they've formed is a unique
thing for me in my years of living with a houseful of cats. I have a
hint now that although a well-established breed may have
characteristics tailor-made to Louis (i.e., another bengal or a Maine
Coon), that it's possible to pick an fostercat with those same
personality traits.

But is this
ultimately my better world? I mean, right now, it's easy enough to find a
black lab mix at the shelter, but if no one were breeding them, would they
still be around? Then again, with all the hip problems to which retrievers
are prone, might it not be better to give up the breed entirely rather than
allow these diseases to continue?

A very good point. The same might be said for any large-breed dog.
There are two absolutely gorgeous Great Danes which I see being walked
around our neighborhood. Yes they're beautiful animals, but they're
also walking time-bombs for their owners.

My decision is to avoid buying an animal from a breeder. If I really wanted a
purebred (I personally don't, though, because in my experience mutts and
moggies tend to be healthier), I would go through a rescue organization.

Again, I agree that mutts seem to be hardier beasts. Kinda QED unless
you're a Creationist...

There's a strain of DSH (if one can talk of a strain of mutts) which
seems quite similar to Maine Coons, which I'd heard at one time were
the original mousers brought to the New World. These cats so
infiltrated themselves into the gene pool that their qualities are
constantly expressed even through seemingly unrelated parents. Tiger
is Maine-Coonish in his markings, ear-tufts, mane and high-pitched
voice, as well as his predilection for hanging out near you, but never
"on" you. However, he's small, and his parents were a DSH white-cat
and DSH orange tabby. Except for his recent bout of conjunctivitis,
he's thriving, healthy and ornery as an 11 yr old.

I haven't formed an opinion on this yet. Megan talked my ear off about
the plight of the stray, and I have a lot of sympathy with her
position. On the other hand, a purebreed is a known quantity. And they
will indeed continue to be produced.

It's a difficult question, and I'm grateful for all you folks who've
weighed in.

BLink
Brian Link, Minnesota Countertenor
----------------------------------
"The chimpanzee wore a little blue blazer with brass buttons, and with
the seal of the President of the United States sewed to the breast
pocket....Everywhere he went, bands would play 'Hail to the Chief.'
The chimpanzee loved it. He would bounce up and down." - Kurt Vonnegut

Breeders suck and people who support breeders suck.
It's in the Bible, the Koran, the Talmud and tatooed
on my own sweet ass.

Then wouldn't buying a cat from a breeder means rescuing that cat from
the evil breeder?

"Bolo" wrote in message
news:3WK1e.817220$Xk.34378@pd7tw3no...
I think buying a purebred is the smart thing to do,for starters you know
what kind of cat you are getting unlike adopted cats some of them have
been
in half a dozen homes.I have heard some real horror stories about adopted
cats but have never heard a bad thing about buying a purebred.



Have you never heard about some of the physical problems that are common
with certain breeds? If not, you haven't done much reading.

MaryL

MaryL wrote:

"Bolo" wrote in message
news:3WK1e.817220$Xk.34378@pd7tw3no...

I think buying a purebred is the smart thing to do,for starters you know
what kind of cat you are getting unlike adopted cats some of them have
been
in half a dozen homes.I have heard some real horror stories about adopted
cats but have never heard a bad thing about buying a purebred.




Have you never heard about some of the physical problems that are common
with certain breeds? If not, you haven't done much reading.

MaryL



Every cat can have physical problems. With purebred, it is easier to
track within the breed therefore we hear about it. With moggies, it
cannot be tracked within lines because there are no records... so we
don't hear about it. That doesn't mean there are no problems.

I have a Ragdoll. There have been instances of HCM in the Ragdoll, but
it is not widespread.

Brian,

Don't let people put a guilt trip on you! If you want to get another
Bengal, do so! If it really isn't important for it to be a kitten,
then do ask your breeder about retired adults and any possible rescues.
Things happen and people who do buy kittens are not always able to
keep them and most often return them to the breeder. If your breeder
doesn't have one, they may know of another breeder who does. It might
be worthwhile to check it out.

I, on the other hand, will be buying a kitten, the first purebred I
have bought in nearly 40 years. All of my other feline friends have
been strays or someone else's unwanted kittens. I have an 12-14 year
old shelter cat now that my daughter adopted and after two years had to
give up due to pet restrictions where she was moving to. I was
supposed to keep 'Baby' for a year; that was a good 10 years ago. (And
I already had two older felines at the time).

A couple of years ago I rescued a kitten and developed a very close
bond with it. He mysteriously disappeared last summer. Although I
looked for him, I never found my companion. I did come across one that
looked a lot like him, unfortunately it had been hit and killed. I
brought it home and buried it, cursed it's owners, etc.

I also care for a small colony of feral cats; ones that I started to
feed back when they were kittens. I didn't have the resources or
connections when they were young enough to be able to tame them and be
able to adopt them out as pets, so I have done what I could for them by
providing a somewhat crude shelter and food and have recently gone
through with the first T/N/R session. Four of the five were caught,
neutered and released. In another month or so, my coordinator and I
will attempt to trap the remaining 'kitten' plus two adults that have
been seen coming around for food. So far all of my colony have been
males, although the gender of the remaining kitten isn't known - it
sure won't let me touch it!

I have done and will continue to do what I can for the unloved,
unwanted felines I come in contact with and feel zero amount of "guilt"
about getting a purebred.


Hemma

On 2005-03-28, Bolo penned:
I think buying a purebred is the smart thing to do,for starters you know
what kind of cat you are getting unlike adopted cats some of them have been
in half a dozen homes.I have heard some real horror stories about adopted
cats but have never heard a bad thing about buying a purebred.And like
someone already said you are giving a cat a good home ,but by buying
purebred you know what you are getting into.I have 2 cats, a maine coon and
a ragdoll,and would never trade them for anything.

I've heard plenty of horror stories about buying a purebred (did you happen to
read the thread a few months ago where a lady bought a purebred kitten who
turned out to be very, very ill?). I don't think your assumption that a
purebred will automatically have had a better history than a moggie holds any
water, either. You're assuming a conscientious breeder, and many breeders
aren't.

As for knowing what you're getting into ... you might know statistics, but you
don't know about their individual traits just by reading the breed
description. I'm thinking this is especially true when you buy a "pet
quality" as opposed to "show quality" pet.

I have one cat, born to a feral mom, and would never trade her for anything.
It was great fun watching her grow up and seeing her personality develop.

--
monique, who spoils Oscar unmercifully

pictures: http://www.bounceswoosh.org/rpca

Joe.Canuck(at)gmail.com wrote:
Every cat can have physical problems. With purebred, it is easier to
track within the breed therefore we hear about it. With moggies, it
cannot be tracked within lines because there are no records... so we
don't hear about it. That doesn't mean there are no problems.

I have a Ragdoll. There have been instances of HCM in the Ragdoll,
but
it is not widespread.

Moggies don't have the problems associated with inbreeding that
purbreds do. Moggies in general are more healthy due to hybrid vigor.

-L.

"Bolo" wrote in message
news:3WK1e.817220$Xk.34378@pd7tw3no...
I think buying a purebred is the smart thing to do,for starters you know
what kind of cat you are getting


Yeah, you can always look up the list of all the genetic defects of each
breed caused by selective breeding to "improve the breed" and pick the
defects you like the best.



unlike adopted cats some of them have been
in half a dozen homes.I have heard some real horror stories about adopted
cats but have never heard a bad thing about buying a purebred.

You need to get out more. Purebreds are more susceptible to genetic defects
and certainly disease due to reduced disease resistance. As the gene pool
decreases, so does *immunity*.

"Joe.Canuck(at)gmail.com" "Joe.Canuck(at)gmail.com" wrote in message
...
MaryL wrote:

"Bolo" wrote in message
news:3WK1e.817220$Xk.34378@pd7tw3no...

I think buying a purebred is the smart thing to do,for starters you know
what kind of cat you are getting unlike adopted cats some of them have
been
in half a dozen homes.I have heard some real horror stories about
adopted
cats but have never heard a bad thing about buying a purebred.




Have you never heard about some of the physical problems that are common
with certain breeds? If not, you haven't done much reading.

MaryL



Every cat can have physical problems. With purebred, it is easier to
track within the breed therefore we hear about it. With moggies, it
cannot be tracked within lines because there are no records...

Not so Joe. The most widely used list of genetic defects in cats by Johnny
Hoskins of LA State *includes* moggies. The list was compiled from all the
26 veterinary university hospitals in North America over 20 years.

'Purebreds' unequivocally have more genetic defects than moggies. In fact,
the Siamese in particular, has more documented genetic defects than all the
purebred breeds and moggies combined! The Persian breeds are a close
second. Even the natural breeds such as the beautiful Turkish Angora -
aren't natural anymore unless you go to Anatolia to get one.

As the gene pool decreases, so does immunity and the ability to fight off
disease. Think of 'selective breeding' like playing poker with the same
five cards over and over - but moggies are dealt fresh cards every hand.
After a few hands, the moggie was exposed to many more cards than the
'purebred'. Sure, the purebred might be able to fight off a very limited
number diseases much better than the moggie - but the moggie can fight off
many, many more.

Moggies have hybrid vigor - 'purebreds' have inbreeding depression.

Phil