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Need advice cleaning older cat's teeth
Hello all,
I haven't posted here in quite a few years. I have two cats, Sylvester and Bonnie, ages 17 and 18 - the same two I used to post here about. I've had them since they were kittens. My 17 year old, a very large DSH male, is my concern at the moment. His teeth are VERY dirty - his back molars are covered in tartar and his breath his horrible. However, he eats his dry food just fine and is of good weight so I don't think they are bothering him - yet. I want to get his teeth cleaned, but he has some health issues that make it very risky. My previous vet (I recently moved) was always of the opinion that health issues made it too risky to warrant cleaning his teeth - but the teeth are much worse now. His health issues a 1) He has heart disease. Hypertrophic cardiomyopathy. Over 10 years ago, he was given 1-3 years to live. He is still very much alive, active and happy. He has a moderate murmur. I had him ultrasounded yearly for several years and his heart disease had stopped progressing and he was doing fine. We took him off his heart meds because they were causing daily vomiting (see below under IBD)and he continued to do fine without them. But his heart is still enlarged, and he does have a murmur. This concerns me in regards to putting him under for the teeth cleaning. 2) He has IBD. Inflammatory Bowel Disease. He has had it since he was about 2 years old. If he eats anything besides his special food, he gets very bad, bloody diarreah and vomits. As long as he stays on the one food that has worked all this time, he is fine and has normal digestion (my carpets are very relieved). Oral medication also triggers his IBD - and for a dental, they will want him on antibiotics. I'm afraid this will trigger the IBD and we will begin that horrible process all over again. I guess I can ask about an injectable antibiotic..? 3) He has diabetes and gets insulin twice a day for it (I swear I'm not a troll - this cat actually has all three of these diseases!). I'm not sure though that this is of concern when it comes to anesthesia or teeth cleaning, other than if his IBD flares up and he starts vomiting up his food, it will make regulating his blood sugar a nightmare. So....here is this beautiful 17 year old cat that should be dead by now. Instead, all of his conditions are well controlled, he is sleek, shiny, fat, active and an affectionate goofball. He looks and acts in much better shape than Bonnie, who is a year older and has no real issues except for low thyroid (she takes meds for that). He runs around the house at night, still chases things, is a huge pest for attention, etc. Basically a happy cat. I'm am SO afraid to rock the boat, so to speak, by putting him through the trauma of a teeth cleaning. His heart could fail, his IBD could flare up, etc. I'm really in limbo over whether it's worth it. But then I look at his teeth....and..YUCK. I'm worried that he might develop some infection and at his age, it could be serious. My vet is pretty torn also....he said he'd do the cleaning but I have to understand that he might not do well, could even die if his heart fails. Any advice for someone in my shoes? Thx, Jennifer Sylvester and Bonnie |
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Need advice cleaning older cat's teeth
"Jennifer Thompson-Fleet" wrote in message ... snip for brevity So....here is this beautiful 17 year old cat that should be dead by now. Instead, all of his conditions are well controlled, he is sleek, shiny, fat, active and an affectionate goofball. He looks and acts in much better shape than Bonnie, who is a year older and has no real issues except for low thyroid (she takes meds for that). He runs around the house at night, still chases things, is a huge pest for attention, etc. Basically a happy cat. I'm am SO afraid to rock the boat, so to speak, by putting him through the trauma of a teeth cleaning. His heart could fail, his IBD could flare up, etc. I'm really in limbo over whether it's worth it. But then I look at his teeth....and..YUCK. I'm worried that he might develop some infection and at his age, it could be serious. My vet is pretty torn also....he said he'd do the cleaning but I have to understand that he might not do well, could even die if his heart fails. Any advice for someone in my shoes? ----------- Since you asked...look at the thread about Madeleine. She was a presumably healthy, happy, bouncy 14-year-old cat. There was ostensibly no medical condition that contraindicated [went against] doing the dental in her case (unlike your cat's case), at least not that her owner mentioned. Madeleine had a bad reaction to the anesthesia or some other issue (the doctor wasn't sure), but after the dental, she was barely eating, stopped using her litterbox, and was unable to stand up. Despite pain meds and forced feeding, and the veterinarian's best efforts, he was unable to save her, and she died in her sleep at her owner's side a few days later. I vote no dental for Sylvester. While it is true that the bacteria teeming in his mouth could put him at risk for making his heart condition worse or bacteria invading his bloodstream and affecting other organs, you could consider on-again-off-again antibiotics (i.e. ask your vet about giving him antibiotics for one week out of each month to keep down the bacterial count). This is what I did for the last few months of my cat's life (she was dying from CRF, her teeth were a mess, and she was obviously not a candidate for a dental). If you go ahead with the dental and your cat dies, you will never forgive yourself. Good luck. Best regards, ---Cindy S. |
#3
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Need advice cleaning older cat's teeth
cindys wrote: (snip) I vote no dental for Sylvester. While it is true that the bacteria teeming in his mouth could put him at risk for making his heart condition worse or bacteria invading his bloodstream and affecting other organs, you could consider on-again-off-again antibiotics (i.e. ask your vet about giving him antibiotics for one week out of each month to keep down the bacterial count). This is what I did for the last few months of my cat's life (she was dying from CRF, her teeth were a mess, and she was obviously not a candidate for a dental). If you go ahead with the dental and your cat dies, you will never forgive yourself. Good luck. Best regards, ---Cindy S. Thanks Cindy. I've been leaning that way...in fact for the last few years....I've kept putting it off, perhaps forever...but the fact that his teeth are so bad keeps bugging me...but you're right - I'd never forgive myself if he died on the table, or shortly thereafter, when he's been doing so wonderfully for all this time, depsite his various maladies. My old vet used to call him the miracle cat. My new vet can't even believe he's 17, let alone a 17 year old with three major diseases. I'll ask about the antibiotics - maybe I can inject them on some sort of schedule...oral won't work - his digestive tract will go crazy. Thanks again, Jennifer |
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Need advice cleaning older cat's teeth
I also wanted to add how sorry I am to read about Madeline.
You just never know, even with so-called routine stuff. You try to do what's best and this kind of thing happens. It's just heartbreaking. -Jennifer |
#5
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Need advice cleaning older cat's teeth
My vet is pretty torn also....he said he'd do the cleaning but I have to
understand that he might not do well, could even die if his heart fails. Any advice for someone in my shoes? Wow, what a tough decision. Is it possible to give him a mild sedative and do a quick cleaning vs. putting him out? (I don't know if this is done, but it might be worth asking about in your case.) I'd opt for no, and see if you can brush his teeth once per day instead. It won't remove plaque, but it will help with his breath a little. |
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Need advice cleaning older cat's teeth
on Thu, 08 Feb 2007 21:45:36 GMT, "Rene S."
wrote: Wow, what a tough decision. Is it possible to give him a mild sedative and do a quick cleaning vs. putting him out? (I don't know if this is done, but it might be worth asking about in your case.) I'd opt for no, and see if you can brush his teeth once per day instead. It won't remove plaque, but it will help with his breath a little. I don't know... I think brushing at this point would be risky. Dislodging some of that bacteria incorrectly could send it directly to his heart. He already has a murmur, so that puts him at an even greater risk for bacterial endocarditis. I wouldn't risk ANY dental care at this point. Not under anesthesia, and not brushing at home. -- Lynne |
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Need advice cleaning older cat's teeth
"Lynne" wrote in message m... on Thu, 08 Feb 2007 21:45:36 GMT, "Rene S." wrote: Wow, what a tough decision. Is it possible to give him a mild sedative and do a quick cleaning vs. putting him out? (I don't know if this is done, but it might be worth asking about in your case.) I'd opt for no, and see if you can brush his teeth once per day instead. It won't remove plaque, but it will help with his breath a little. I don't know... I think brushing at this point would be risky. Dislodging some of that bacteria incorrectly could send it directly to his heart. He already has a murmur, so that puts him at an even greater risk for bacterial endocarditis. I wouldn't risk ANY dental care at this point. Not under anesthesia, and not brushing at home. -------- Lynne, what do you think about my idea about the antibiotics? Best regards, ---Cindy S. |
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Need advice cleaning older cat's teeth
on Thu, 08 Feb 2007 22:47:56 GMT, "cindys"
wrote: Lynne, what do you think about my idea about the antibiotics? I meant to say that I think it's a very good idea to give him antibiotics, assuming the vet agrees. And via injection, given the existing IBS. What I don't know, though, is if injected antibiotics can still cause gastro problems. This will be key to find out. When humans are at risk of bacterial endocarditis (which is a major risk with the dental issues combined with existing heart murmurs), long term prophylactic antibiotics are frequently prescribed. -- Lynne |
#9
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Need advice cleaning older cat's teeth
"Lynne" wrote in message m... on Thu, 08 Feb 2007 22:47:56 GMT, "cindys" wrote: Lynne, what do you think about my idea about the antibiotics? I meant to say that I think it's a very good idea to give him antibiotics, assuming the vet agrees. And via injection, given the existing IBS. What I don't know, though, is if injected antibiotics can still cause gastro problems. This will be key to find out. In general, they don't AFAIK. When humans are at risk of bacterial endocarditis (which is a major risk with the dental issues combined with existing heart murmurs), long term prophylactic antibiotics are frequently prescribed. My father, of blessed memory, developed emphysema after years of smoking. In his final years, he was landing in the hospital every winter with pneumonia. Finally, the doctor prescribed continuous prophylactic antibiotics for the winter months, and my dad stopped developing pneumonias. Unfortunately, he then started having frequent visits to the hospital emergency room because of severe stomach cramps, which interestingly never occurred in the summer. It took two years for everyone to figure out that the antibiotics were causing the cramps. The doctor switched his antibiotic regimen to a one-week-on, one-week-off regimen (rather than continuous). That seemed to work, as he no longer suffered with stomach cramps and also avoided pneumonias. (Of course, what applied to my father would not necessarily apply to Sylvester. I understand that Sylvester could not handle oral antibiotics at all.) I hope things work out for Sylvester and Jennifer reports back. I noticed that as soon as we started the week of Molly's antibiotics (my baby, now deceased from CRF), her breath would improve considerably within 24 hours. Then, after the week was over, the bad breath would return gradually. Best regards, ---Cindy S. -- Lynne |
#10
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Need advice cleaning older cat's teeth
Funny - having cats for the past 50 some years, and having them live to be 20 - they all had their teeth cleaned every two to three years - until they were 16 and then the vet said no. On Feb 8, 6:29�pm, "cindys" wrote: "Lynne" wrote in message m... on Thu, 08 Feb 2007 22:47:56 GMT, "cindys" wrote: Lynne, what do you think about my idea about the antibiotics? I meant to say that I think it's a very good idea to give him antibiotics, assuming the vet agrees. *And via injection, given the existing IBS. *What I don't know, though, is if injected antibiotics can still cause gastro problems. *This will be key to find out. In general, they don't AFAIK. When humans are at risk of bacterial endocarditis (which is a major risk with the dental issues combined with existing heart murmurs), long term prophylactic antibiotics are frequently prescribed. My father, of blessed memory, developed emphysema after years of smoking. In his final years, he was landing in the hospital every winter with pneumonia. Finally, the doctor prescribed continuous prophylactic antibiotics for the winter months, and my dad stopped developing pneumonias. Unfortunately, he then started having frequent visits to the hospital emergency room because of severe stomach cramps, which interestingly never occurred in the summer. It took two years for everyone to figure out that the antibiotics were causing the cramps. The doctor switched his antibiotic regimen to a one-week-on, one-week-off regimen (rather than continuous). That seemed to work, as he no longer suffered with stomach cramps and also avoided pneumonias. (Of course, what applied to my father would not necessarily apply to Sylvester. I understand that Sylvester could not handle oral antibiotics at all.) I hope things work out for Sylvester and Jennifer reports back. I noticed that as soon as we started the week of Molly's antibiotics (my baby, now deceased from CRF), her breath would improve considerably within 24 hours. Then, after the week was over, the bad breath would return gradually. Best regards, ---Cindy S. -- Lynne- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - |
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