[OT] OMG - Part Deux!

Jeanne Hedge wrote:
On Fri, 05 Jan 2007 21:35:28 -0600, Victor Martinez
wrote:

wrote:
Not really, not in all states. I think TX is also an "at will" state
(is that right term?) You can be fired for any reason, or no reason
at all.

You are correct. In order for an ex-employee to win a lawsuit in
Texas, he/she would have to *prove* that he/she was fired in
violation of federal law. That is, that he/she was fired for being
male/female, young/old, religious/non-religious, vet/non-vet or for
his/her national origin or for having a disability.

The "Big Six" in Indiana (another right to work state) is age, sex,
race, religion, national origin and sexual orientation. If you can't
prove you were fired for one of those reasons, you're S.O.L.
Otherwise, they can fire you for having a hot dog instead of a burger
for lunch.

That is just so WRONG! I don't understand how any state can allow employers
to do such a thing if the employee is doing their job.

Lord knows it took *years* for my former employer to get rid of some folks.
One guy spent 85% of his time schmoozing in the breakroom or seeking out
which department (in the entire building) might have doughnuts in the
morning or a pot luck at lunch. Okay, he was just lazy. But another woman
deleted an entire dataset from the Columbus office's database; they were
down for an entire day. She didn't get fired for another year although she
continued to make stupid mistakes time and time again. They had to build a
case against these people; they couldn't just boot them out the door.

Jill

"Victor Martinez" wrote in message
...
gracecat wrote:
state. If Lori refuses to sign the written reprimand she can be fired on
the spot. As long as the employer has an honest grievance then he cannot
be held accountable. And it seems using company equipment (computers) to
send

In Texas you don't need a grievance at all. You can fire at will.


--
Victor M. Martinez
Owned and operated by the Fantastic Seven (TM)
Send your spam he
Email me he

Yup, sounds the same as Louisiana. I say honest grievance because I still
don't think they can fire you due to personal and private issues (first
amendment stuff). Can they fire you because you're gay Victor? Disagreeing
on a personal basis on something like that, is that considered at will or an
unfair/nonhonest grievance.

Grace

Stormmee wrote:
sounds to me like she rally is jealous of you and you are so bad that
this is all she can find to fault, I think you should be proud of
yourself for committing such a hideous sin, Lee, raised a Baptist,
and I missed that gift part in my bible also... "bring him incense,
and moor... ???"

Frankincense and myrhh

Jill
CatNipped wrote in message
...
I was just called "on the carpet" into the HR Director's office
again. It seems the President/CEO/Owner's wife (the CFO) was
complaining about me to the HR director again.

What did I do this time that was so awful as to warrant a dressing
down (although the HR Director had the grace to look shame-faced
about having to do it)?

I sent a note out to everyone (this being about 10 people, since
we're such a small company) to remind people that the company's vice
president has a birthday this Saturday.

OMG, Katy bar the door!!!! She thinks this was "unprofessional" of
me and that I was mis-using the company's resources by sending an
email that was not about company business. The HR Director tried to
excuse it again by saying that she is a *very* religious catholic
and didn't believe in giving Christmas or birthday gifts (I was
raised a catholic but I somehow missed the part about gift-giving
being a sin). I didn't suggest a party or that people buy him
something, I simply stated the fact that Saturday was his birthday
in case anyone wanted to wish him happy birthday (most executives
*WANT* to be reminded about things like this since it makes them
seem more caring to their employees!!!)

Geez, folks, what the heck am I going to do? I'm still looking for
other employment, but the pickings are *really* slim here in Houston.

Hugs,

CatNipped

"Victor Martinez" wrote in message
...
wrote:
Not really, not in all states. I think TX is also an "at will" state
(is that right term?) You can be fired for any reason, or no reason at
all. Somebody correct me if my understanding of this is wrong. It
doesn't affect your right to draw unemployment, but you can't really
sue for being wrongfully fired. I'm sure there are extreme exceptions
to this.

You are correct. In order for an ex-employee to win a lawsuit in Texas,
he/she would have to *prove* that he/she was fired in violation of federal
law. That is, that he/she was fired for being male/female, young/old,
religious/non-religious, vet/non-vet or for his/her national origin or for
having a disability.

--
Victor M. Martinez
Owned and operated by the Fantastic Seven (TM)
Send your spam he
Email me he ee, to me those are not
honest grievances... Anything else is discrimination.

But I didn't realize just how it worked. I thought the boss could walk in
and say "look, you're not working out, our personalities clash, I'd like to
hire someone else. Sorry it didn't work." To my understanding that was
acceptable in the "at will" states. I still thought "ick, your skirt's ugly
you're fired" could still find the employer in trouble. Jody has educated
me otherwise.

Gracie
who kind-of knew what "at will" meant but learned it's a bit more to it

"CatNipped" wrote in message
...
I was just called "on the carpet" into the HR Director's office again. It
seems the President/CEO/Owner's wife (the CFO) was complaining about me to
the HR director again.

What did I do this time that was so awful as to warrant a dressing down
(although the HR Director had the grace to look shame-faced about having
to do it)?

I sent a note out to everyone (this being about 10 people, since we're
such a small company) to remind people that the company's vice president
has a birthday this Saturday.


Shortly after I read this, I was watching television with Charlie. Michael
Reagan was on, and one of the news anchors as he was finishing up said, oh,
and please wish your mother a happy birthday. Now I know darn good and well
the guy doesn't just know when Nancy Reagan's birthday is. Someone who's
job it is to make everyone look good told him. I'm sure they didn't get in
trouble for it.

Jo

wrote in message
oups.com...

jmcquown wrote:


Document, document, document. And if they reprimand you in writing,
refuse
to sign anything until you can mull it over and add your two cents if you
want to. They have to allow you to rebut/refute the "charges" (so to
speak). Purrs for your nerves and keep on looking, my dear!

Jill

Not really, not in all states. I think TX is also an "at will" state
(is that right term?) You can be fired for any reason, or no reason at
all. Somebody correct me if my understanding of this is wrong. It
doesn't affect your right to draw unemployment, but you can't really
sue for being wrongfully fired. I'm sure there are extreme exceptions
to this.

Sherry


That is where it gets tricky. You can be fired for no reason at all. But
not "for any reason". It is just very hard for an individual employee to
prove they were fired for a prohibited reason when the employer didn't need
a reason.

Of course in Lori's case it seems to be the company is persecuting her for
religious reasons. (Yes I know that's silly. But in effect that is what
the HR person seems to be saying)

Jo

Yowie wrote:

My goodnesss! We get e-mails to the whole department like "has
anyone found my glasses?", "There's some leftover birthday
goodies in the tea room, help yourselves"

I've always enjoyed working at places that have that kind of
atmosphere. At my last job, a small group of us cat-lovers would send
each other cat (and other animal) pictures all the time. And group
emails would often turn into absurd and hilarious exchanges. I'm glad
upper management never clamped down on that kind of thing - I always
thought it helped foster a fun atmosphere and friendliness among
employees.

Where I work now, we aren't allowed to send non-work related email to
each other. It's not that big a deal, but I think it's too bad.
People are very pleasant where I work, so it's not like we have an
unfriendly atmosphere, but it's pretty businesslike most of the time.
I'm just not sure whether people are more productive, in the long
run, when they're focused all the time on work, or when they can have
a little fun together from time to time. I like my job, but it would
be nice to joke around a bit, too.

Joyce

gracecat wrote:
amendment stuff). Can they fire you because you're gay Victor? Disagreeing

It is perfectly legal in most states (close to 40 I think) to fire
someone because of their sexual orientation.
Hopefully the new Congress will be able to add sexual orientation (and
perhaps even gender identity) to the federal non-discrimination regulations.

--
Victor M. Martinez
Owned and operated by the Fantastic Seven (TM)
Send your spam he
Email me he

wrote in message
ups.com...

CatNipped wrote:
I was just called "on the carpet" into the HR Director's office again.
It
seems the President/CEO/Owner's wife (the CFO) was complaining about me
to
the HR director again.

What did I do this time that was so awful as to warrant a dressing down
(although the HR Director had the grace to look shame-faced about having
to
do it)?

I sent a note out to everyone (this being about 10 people, since we're
such
a small company) to remind people that the company's vice president has a
birthday this Saturday.

OMG, Katy bar the door!!!! She thinks this was "unprofessional" of me
and
that I was mis-using the company's resources by sending an email that was
not about company business. The HR Director tried to excuse it again by
saying that she is a *very* religious catholic and didn't believe in
giving
Christmas or birthday gifts (I was raised a catholic but I somehow missed
the part about gift-giving being a sin). I didn't suggest a party or
that
people buy him something, I simply stated the fact that Saturday was his
birthday in case anyone wanted to wish him happy birthday (most
executives
*WANT* to be reminded about things like this since it makes them seem
more
caring to their employees!!!)

Geez, folks, what the heck am I going to do? I'm still looking for other
employment, but the pickings are *really* slim here in Houston.

Hugs,

CatNipped

Lori, that is just crazy. Every place I ever worked, there was someone
(usually the most organized person in the office)....who kind of took
it on herself to manage birthday memos, office parties, etc. I have
never, EVER heard of an employer taking offense to it.
You gotta get yourself outta there. Good luck. Hang in there the best
you can, and above all, don't take that garbage home with you. (easier
said than done)

Sherry

Thanks! I think with this job I'm finally accomplishing that. I've vowed
that this time I would not take any personal stuff into the office and not
take office stuff home and I'm doing just that. I keep my office "persona"
strictly professional, don't mention moods or illness or talk about anything
more personal than the weather (although I *have* been mentioning more often
my very successful marriage to my life-long love and soul mate, and my
grandchildren, but that doesn't seem to be helping), and I don't portray any
emotions except interest in the job and "can do" energy.

It's just that all this pettiness is so aggravating. I can ignore it as
long as it doesn't affect my paycheck - but I'm just blown away by what
happened because it is *SO* outrageous. The President/Owner/CEO keeps
singing my praises and telling me my job performance is so over the top good
that he can't believe his luck in finding me, so unless she cuts off his
bedroom privileges until he does, I don't see him firing me. And that right
there could be the problem. If his wife can't separate an enthusiastic
liking of my job performance from an enthusiastic liking of me then her
jealousy will keep causing her to nitpick and try to find fault where there
really isn't any.

The HR director saying that her devout Catholicism is the reason for her
behavior is just totally off base. The *truly* devout Catholics (or
devoutly religious persons of any denomination) that I've known have been
kind and forgiving (and *giving*) people, not people who try to hurt others
for no apparent reason or use their religion to dominate others and as an
excuse to be cheap!

Hugs,

CatNipped

Victor Martinez wrote:

gracecat wrote:

state. If Lori refuses to sign the written reprimand she can be fired
on the spot. As long as the employer has an honest grievance then he
cannot be held accountable. And it seems using company equipment
(computers) to send


In Texas you don't need a grievance at all. You can fire at will.


Texas isn't part of the USA? Seems to me we have something
called "Fair Employment Practices" laws that are supposed to
PROTECT employees from being fired for such frivolous
reasons! (Or have we ceded those "benefits" along with the
expectation of adequate employer-paid medical insurance, et
al?) I guess I was lucky to be thrown on the job market
back in the 1950's, when the average working person could
expect a living wage and decent benefits - even the ability
to buy a home and send their kids to college.