just answer one question

Maybe she's Billy's imaginary sister.....

Nanny

"~*LiveLoveLaugh*~" schreef in bericht
...
Round two of troll seeking attention from this sop. PLEASE do not answer
it!!!

--

·.·´¨ ¨)) -:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
Laurie
((¸¸.·´ ..·´
-:¦:- ((¸¸ ·.·

*~*LiveLoveLaugh*~*

All that I am or hope to be, I owe to my angel mother.
~Abraham Lincoln


"Annie" wrote in message
...

....cackled and choked.

On Mar 30, 9:56*pm, "Nanny" wrote:
Maybe she's Billy's imaginary sister.....

Nanny

Probably his mother, cousin and Aunt aswell!

Helen M

Sorry but I do not feel this person is a troll. Not sure why.....
She is just asking a question about a sensitive subject.

heres my question

what is the moral difference between spaying an indoor cat
and declawing?

i dont see any difference

spaying an indoor cat is unnecessary if there are no other
cats in the house

it is done to elimate the cats sex drive because that is
inconvenient for the cat owner to deal with

removing a cats sex organs is no better or worse than
clipping off the last joints of their fingers

Actually there several differences.

Spaying a cat:
You are Removing their ability to procreate and possibly add to the
already excessive stray cat population. Doesn't matter if they are
strictly indoor, all it takes is for the ONE time they get out. Can a
person saw that they were able to keep their cat indoors at ALL times
for a cat's entire lifespan? Just a thought....

Not to mention if the cat DOES get pregnant could medical
complications occur during the gestation or birthing process

You are also preventing the possibly occurrences of medical
conditions, Possible infections of the urinary tract or vulva (slim
but possible), or more severe cases such as pyometra, uterine or
mammary cancer. (


spaying an indoor cat is an invasive operation with a painful
recovery period

Invasive, yes. Painful, I beg to differ. Depending on how the
surgery is done, and what medications are given the recovery period
can be less painful.

Using a surgical laser to cauterize the blood vessels and nerve
endings, using absorbable sutures and distributing pain medications
will result in quicker recovery period as opposed to a scalpel blade,
steel sutures and no medication.

spaying an indoor cat sometimes results in bad outcomes

Haven't seen any bad outcomes as the result of spaying since i've been
in this field. and that goes for dogs AND cats.

if you dont want to keep the cat the way god intended when
there are other alternatives to spaying then maybe you
shouldnt own a cat???

i could cite numerous other parallels between declawing and
spaying an indoor cat to show that they are essentially
morally equivalent

Declawing you are removing the digits from the first knuckle. For
this there IS a painful recovery period, much more than with a spay.
Then if the cat does get out that one time, now he has less to defend
himself with. There are some cases in which the cat adapts and
accepts what has happened. But there are also cases in which there is
a change in the cats personality.

Spaying a cat is for the greater good of the cat from a medical
standpoint. Declawing is done for the owner's benefit and I do not
feel it does anything beneficial to the cat.

You are entitled to your opinion and personally I'm not going to spend
time trying to force you to change.

I disagree with your statement that they are morally equivalent, but
i'm not going to declare you are a bad person. I'm disappointed that
you feel this way, but shouting at you via a newsgroup really doesn't
solve anything.

If this is what you want to do with your cat, then I hope your cat
lives a long happy life and you manage to avoid the medical
pitfalls.

Kristi

Mischief wrote:
Sorry but I do not feel this person is a troll. Not sure why.....
She is just asking a question about a sensitive subject.

he/she/it is *definately* a troll.
--
Adrian (Owned by Snoopy & Bagheera)
Cats leave pawprints on your heart
http://community.webshots.com/user/clowderuk

wrote in message
...
On Mar 30, 9:56 pm, "Nanny" wrote:
Maybe she's Billy's imaginary sister.....

Nanny

Probably his mother, cousin and Aunt aswell!

Helen M

*******************

Billy is probably a trans sexual and she is his inner woman.

Pam S. giggling

if you can do it without being nasty. im not the one creating
a problem here by asking a question. people who are
intolerant are the ones who are creating a problem. people
have said some very nasty things to me but im not attacking
anyone or calling them names.

heres my question

what is the moral difference between spaying an indoor cat
and declawing?

i dont see any difference

spaying an indoor cat is unnecessary if there are no other
cats in the house

it is done to elimate the cats sex drive because that is
inconvenient for the cat owner to deal with

removing a cats sex organs is no better or worse than
clipping off the last joints of their fingers

spaying an indoor cat is an invasive operation with a painful
recovery period

spaying an indoor cat sometimes results in bad outcomes

if you dont want to keep the cat the way god intended when
there are other alternatives to spaying then maybe you
shouldnt own a cat???

i could cite numerous other parallels between declawing and
spaying an indoor cat to show that they are essentially
morally equivalent

Mischief wrote in news:e94e1d98-13c3-
:

Sorry but I do not feel this person is a troll. Not sure
why.....
She is just asking a question about a sensitive subject.

heres my question

what is the moral difference between spaying an indoor cat
and declawing?

i dont see any difference

spaying an indoor cat is unnecessary if there are no other
cats in the house

it is done to elimate the cats sex drive because that is
inconvenient for the cat owner to deal with

removing a cats sex organs is no better or worse than
clipping off the last joints of their fingers

Actually there several differences.

Spaying a cat:
You are Removing their ability to procreate and possibly
add to the
already excessive stray cat population. Doesn't matter if
they are
strictly indoor, all it takes is for the ONE time they get
out. Can a
person saw that they were able to keep their cat indoors at
ALL times
for a cat's entire lifespan? Just a thought....

Not to mention if the cat DOES get pregnant could medical
complications occur during the gestation or birthing
process

You are also preventing the possibly occurrences of medical
conditions, Possible infections of the urinary tract or
vulva (slim
but possible), or more severe cases such as pyometra,
uterine or
mammary cancer. (


spaying an indoor cat is an invasive operation with a
painful
recovery period

Invasive, yes. Painful, I beg to differ. Depending on how
the
surgery is done, and what medications are given the
recovery period
can be less painful.

Using a surgical laser to cauterize the blood vessels and
nerve
endings, using absorbable sutures and distributing pain
medications
will result in quicker recovery period as opposed to a
scalpel blade,
steel sutures and no medication.

spaying an indoor cat sometimes results in bad outcomes

Haven't seen any bad outcomes as the result of spaying
since i've been
in this field. and that goes for dogs AND cats.

if you dont want to keep the cat the way god intended when
there are other alternatives to spaying then maybe you
shouldnt own a cat???

i could cite numerous other parallels between declawing
and
spaying an indoor cat to show that they are essentially
morally equivalent

Declawing you are removing the digits from the first
knuckle. For
this there IS a painful recovery period, much more than
with a spay.
Then if the cat does get out that one time, now he has less
to defend
himself with. There are some cases in which the cat adapts
and
accepts what has happened. But there are also cases in
which there is
a change in the cats personality.

Spaying a cat is for the greater good of the cat from a
medical
standpoint. Declawing is done for the owner's benefit and
I do not
feel it does anything beneficial to the cat.

You are entitled to your opinion and personally I'm not
going to spend
time trying to force you to change.

I disagree with your statement that they are morally
equivalent, but
i'm not going to declare you are a bad person. I'm
disappointed that
you feel this way, but shouting at you via a newsgroup
really doesn't
solve anything.

If this is what you want to do with your cat, then I hope
your cat
lives a long happy life and you manage to avoid the medical
pitfalls.

Kristi


thank you for taking the time to answer my questions and for
your kindness

i could quibble over some of what youve said but ill just
point out the most important thing that seems wrong to me

its the part about no bad outcomes. there is a bad outcome
known as spay incontinence that according to what ive read
happens in approximately 10% of all dogs and cats that are
spayed

i know about this because it happened to one of my pets and i
had to put her on medication for the rest of her life to
minimize accidents. and as she got older the problem got worse

With all the links that have been sent should have found an answer by now.
you think!
"Adrian" wrote in message
...
Mischief wrote:
Sorry but I do not feel this person is a troll. Not sure why.....
She is just asking a question about a sensitive subject.

he/she/it is *definately* a troll.
--
Adrian (Owned by Snoopy & Bagheera)
Cats leave pawprints on your heart
http://community.webshots.com/user/clowderuk

Annie wrote:

what is the moral difference between spaying an indoor cat
and declawing?

i dont see any difference

spaying an indoor cat is unnecessary if there are no other
cats in the house

Not true. A cat going through heat and unable to satisfy it is *very*
uncomfortable. In fact, a cat going through repeated heat periods, but
who never mates, can develop health problems over time.

Also, cats can be pretty stealthy and fast. Every time you go in and
out your door, she has a chance to slip out, and it's quite possible
that it will happen no matter how careful you are. When a cat is in
heat, she is *very* determined to mate. So, despite your best intentions,
you could end up with a pregnant cat. Would you be able to find homes
for all the kittens? Maybe you would be. But remember that when you do
find a home for a kitten, that's one less home available for cats and
kittens in shelters - and one more who will end up euthanized. Every time
a cat is allowed to get pregnant, the problem of unwanted cats becomes
a little worse.

it is done to elimate the cats sex drive because that is
inconvenient for the cat owner to deal with

Also because there is a vast overpopulation of cats, who are put to
death by the thousands because there aren't enough homes for them. And
if they're not caught and euthanized, then they live very hard lives
on the street. They're domesticated animals, by which I mean they have
been *bred* over thousands of years, to be dependent on humans. This is
genetic. Domesticated cats might go "feral", but they never do as well
for themselves as a wild animal who has all the genetic traits needed
to survive in their environment.

spaying an indoor cat is an invasive operation with a painful
recovery period

spaying an indoor cat sometimes results in bad outcomes

So are many other procedures that are done for the sake of their
health.

One more thing to think about: a cat *needs* their claws to survive.
You might not think a cat needs claws if they're indoor-only, but as
I pointed out earlier, sometimes indoor-only cats get outside. A cat
going outdoors needs their claws for self-defense. Not just for
scratching other animals that might attack them. But for running up
trees, to get away from dogs, mean kids, etc.

Can you guarantee that your cat will never, ever get outside? This means
you have to guarantee that your house will never catch fire, and in the
chaos of everyone getting out of the house, your cat escapes. Can you
guarantee that nobody will ever break into your home and leave the door
open? Or that a houseguest will never unwittingly let her out?

Once the cat gets outside, she is in danger if she doesn't have her
most important defense.

On the other hand, cats do not need their ability to reproduce in
order to survive. If the species were endangered, then I'd say that
the species as a whole needs fertile members. But cats, at least in the
USA, are so very far from being an endangered species (except that
individual members are greatly endangered by the fact of overpopulation).

i could cite numerous other parallels between declawing and
spaying an indoor cat to show that they are essentially
morally equivalent

And I hope you're rethinking that, given the information that I've
just provided.

Now I have a question for you: if you are so certain that they are
morally equivalent, if you feel so sure that declawing is harmless
and not immoral, then why are you having a hard time making up your
mind about what to do?

Joyce

--
To send email to this address, remove the triple-X from my user name.

"~*LiveLoveLaugh*~" wrote in
:

Round two of troll seeking attention from this sop. PLEASE
do not
answer it!!!


it didnt take long for someone to illustrate what i was
saying about intolerance

according to her im a troll who is only seeking attention

thats a lot easier than answering difficult questions
thoughtfully and without rancor