Getting ready for a new aby kitten in Chicago-advice on vets and preparations needed

"Arjun Ray" wrote in message
...

Because if we thought of the problem as merely one of scale, we'd
have
no option but to throw up our hands in despair.

You want to know about drops in the bucket? Consider me. I've lost
count of the number of cats I've participated in the TNR of. The
number
of times I've baited a trap is now in the thousands. The number of
times I've carted a trap away from a trapping ground to a holding
area,
or brought one up into a mobile S/N van, or transported to a clinic,
is
in the hundreds.

And you can never consider that even those who trap and neuter only in
the handfuls is not making a difference. Every *little* thing anyone
can do makes a difference.

In , "Cheryl" wrote:
| "Arjun Ray" wrote in message
| ...

| Because if we thought of the problem as merely one of scale, we'd
| have no option but to throw up our hands in despair.

| And you can never consider that even those who trap and neuter only in
| the handfuls is not making a difference. Every *little* thing anyone
| can do makes a difference.

Absolutely. I don't hold my efforts as anything special. Some do less,
others do more. We each do what we can.

There are no buckets, never mind industrial strngth pumps. Only
eyedroppers - and that's the way it's got to be done if it's to be done
at all.

The "leave the purebreds alone" argument is just a lame plea for elitist
exemption.

In , "Cheryl" wrote:
| "Arjun Ray" wrote in message
| ...

| Because if we thought of the problem as merely one of scale, we'd
| have no option but to throw up our hands in despair.

| And you can never consider that even those who trap and neuter only in
| the handfuls is not making a difference. Every *little* thing anyone
| can do makes a difference.

Absolutely. I don't hold my efforts as anything special. Some do less,
others do more. We each do what we can.

There are no buckets, never mind industrial strngth pumps. Only
eyedroppers - and that's the way it's got to be done if it's to be done
at all.

The "leave the purebreds alone" argument is just a lame plea for elitist
exemption.

In , "Cheryl" wrote:
| "Arjun Ray" wrote in message
| ...

| I'm hoping it won't take much more than a week or so to get her used
| to be outside the cage in a closed room without the other cats but
| I'm prepared to let her go on her terms.

Can you pick her up yet? Or at least touch her without her shying away?
With Lucas, I had got to the point where he would gladly come to the
long handled brush, and at any rate wouldn't swat at my hand. I focused
on the contact aspect at that point, and he took to it readily.

| It might be really interesting if she had a good buddy among her
| former mates.
|
| I am not sure but I know she got chased away from the food if she got
| to it first.

Okay, not likely then. The buddy would have been with her.

| But she did react strange to Shamrock the first time she saw him. I
| had moved the cage to the living room with only part of it uncovered
| and Shamrock being the friendly guy he is went to investigate and
| she bolted toward him chirping and reaching through the bars at him
| sort of startling him.

This is not unusual. Ferals can be very feline friendly. She might
have been reacting, "Oh thank goodness, another *cat*!"

| Maybe she just reacted because he was simply a cat (one of her own. )

Yup :-) Lucas was in a profound funk until he saw Phoenix - he perked
up immediately. About time too, he hadn't eaten in five days and I was
getting very worried.

| [The kittens] knew exactly where they were.
|
| That is amazing! And probably way less stressful. Good for them and
| Marie.

Well, poor Marie was a bit put out. Who were these strangers promptly
making themselves at home? It didn't help that they were in the pen,
which she was still treating as her "home base". But I guess she was
too new herself to make a big deal about it. Over the course of the
weekend, the boy tried very hard to make friends with her, but she just
avoided them both.

Lucas, of course, loved the extra company. :-)

In , "Cheryl" wrote:
| "Arjun Ray" wrote in message
| ...

| I'm hoping it won't take much more than a week or so to get her used
| to be outside the cage in a closed room without the other cats but
| I'm prepared to let her go on her terms.

Can you pick her up yet? Or at least touch her without her shying away?
With Lucas, I had got to the point where he would gladly come to the
long handled brush, and at any rate wouldn't swat at my hand. I focused
on the contact aspect at that point, and he took to it readily.

| It might be really interesting if she had a good buddy among her
| former mates.
|
| I am not sure but I know she got chased away from the food if she got
| to it first.

Okay, not likely then. The buddy would have been with her.

| But she did react strange to Shamrock the first time she saw him. I
| had moved the cage to the living room with only part of it uncovered
| and Shamrock being the friendly guy he is went to investigate and
| she bolted toward him chirping and reaching through the bars at him
| sort of startling him.

This is not unusual. Ferals can be very feline friendly. She might
have been reacting, "Oh thank goodness, another *cat*!"

| Maybe she just reacted because he was simply a cat (one of her own. )

Yup :-) Lucas was in a profound funk until he saw Phoenix - he perked
up immediately. About time too, he hadn't eaten in five days and I was
getting very worried.

| [The kittens] knew exactly where they were.
|
| That is amazing! And probably way less stressful. Good for them and
| Marie.

Well, poor Marie was a bit put out. Who were these strangers promptly
making themselves at home? It didn't help that they were in the pen,
which she was still treating as her "home base". But I guess she was
too new herself to make a big deal about it. Over the course of the
weekend, the boy tried very hard to make friends with her, but she just
avoided them both.

Lucas, of course, loved the extra company. :-)

"MaryL" wrote

Yes, this is the definition I use. Unfortunately, many abnormalities have
now been instilled in a number of breeds -- even though the original
purpose
may have been to "improve" a breed. Look what has happened to persians
(which were originally beautiful cats and which now have what I consider
to
be an ugly scrunched-in face -- almost a perpetually angry look). Their
short noses have led to many breathing problems.

And as an ad on, a lot of those cats in the
newspaper will become shelter cats when they can't find a home. Or
worse,
dumped cats.


Yes, unfortunately true. This is why I suggested in an earlier message
that
a person who wants a particular "look" can probably find it at a shelter
or
through a rescue group.

Some of those in the paper are breeders, sure, but I'm pretty sur
they wouldn't constitute "responsible" breeders in my opinion (takes
more
than just breeding a certain breed). And yet most people get their cats
as
strays, from friends who had the accidental litter, or from the shelter
(believe it or not).

What I think seems to be a big problem is no one wants anything but a
kitten.

Agreed. Another big problem, so I am always pleased when someone adopts
an
adult cat.

MaryL


De-lurking for a moment...

This is not meant to disagree with anything people have said about
cat breeders or people who buy breeds, I think the situation in the
UK is mostly how it's meant to be. Though I do know it doesn't
always work out this way.

The breeders I know are extremly interested in producing good
lines, have a lot of knowledge of genetics and will bring in a
cat from outside the UK to widen the gene pool and strengthen
the breed if it's needed. They socialise the kittens, have them
vaccinated before they go to their new homes, the breed papers
are registered as neutered so the new owners can't breed from
them within the official organisations. They vet prospective
buyers extensively and make sure they understand about neutering
and insurance. They also undertake to reclaim the cat if at any
time the new owners can't keep them. These kittens move on at
14 weeks old. 'Mistakes' are treated with the same care but move
on at 12 weeks old.

There are unofficial breeders, there is one locally to me who
breeds Ragdolls, but this breeder takes the utmost care with
the kittens and undertakes to rehome them if necessary.

When my kittens were really ill last year I got a lot of help
from people here and other places. I made contact with
a superb vet who was also a rescuer. Sadly, the minute
she found out one of my cats was a breed cat, she became
very rude to me and I had to block her emails. I felt very
unhappy that there could be such antagonism towards
breed cats and their owners, especially when we all needed
as much help as we did :-(

*******
Barbara
Pick out the stones to email me
*******

"MaryL" wrote

Yes, this is the definition I use. Unfortunately, many abnormalities have
now been instilled in a number of breeds -- even though the original
purpose
may have been to "improve" a breed. Look what has happened to persians
(which were originally beautiful cats and which now have what I consider
to
be an ugly scrunched-in face -- almost a perpetually angry look). Their
short noses have led to many breathing problems.

And as an ad on, a lot of those cats in the
newspaper will become shelter cats when they can't find a home. Or
worse,
dumped cats.


Yes, unfortunately true. This is why I suggested in an earlier message
that
a person who wants a particular "look" can probably find it at a shelter
or
through a rescue group.

Some of those in the paper are breeders, sure, but I'm pretty sur
they wouldn't constitute "responsible" breeders in my opinion (takes
more
than just breeding a certain breed). And yet most people get their cats
as
strays, from friends who had the accidental litter, or from the shelter
(believe it or not).

What I think seems to be a big problem is no one wants anything but a
kitten.

Agreed. Another big problem, so I am always pleased when someone adopts
an
adult cat.

MaryL


De-lurking for a moment...

This is not meant to disagree with anything people have said about
cat breeders or people who buy breeds, I think the situation in the
UK is mostly how it's meant to be. Though I do know it doesn't
always work out this way.

The breeders I know are extremly interested in producing good
lines, have a lot of knowledge of genetics and will bring in a
cat from outside the UK to widen the gene pool and strengthen
the breed if it's needed. They socialise the kittens, have them
vaccinated before they go to their new homes, the breed papers
are registered as neutered so the new owners can't breed from
them within the official organisations. They vet prospective
buyers extensively and make sure they understand about neutering
and insurance. They also undertake to reclaim the cat if at any
time the new owners can't keep them. These kittens move on at
14 weeks old. 'Mistakes' are treated with the same care but move
on at 12 weeks old.

There are unofficial breeders, there is one locally to me who
breeds Ragdolls, but this breeder takes the utmost care with
the kittens and undertakes to rehome them if necessary.

When my kittens were really ill last year I got a lot of help
from people here and other places. I made contact with
a superb vet who was also a rescuer. Sadly, the minute
she found out one of my cats was a breed cat, she became
very rude to me and I had to block her emails. I felt very
unhappy that there could be such antagonism towards
breed cats and their owners, especially when we all needed
as much help as we did :-(

*******
Barbara
Pick out the stones to email me
*******

"rainyseason" wrote:

De-lurking for a moment...

This is not meant to disagree with anything people have said about
cat breeders or people who buy breeds, I think the situation in the
UK is mostly how it's meant to be. Though I do know it doesn't
always work out this way.

The breeders I know are extremly interested in producing good
lines, have a lot of knowledge of genetics and will bring in a
cat from outside the UK to widen the gene pool and strengthen
the breed if it's needed. They socialise the kittens, have them
vaccinated before they go to their new homes, the breed papers
are registered as neutered so the new owners can't breed from
them within the official organisations. They vet prospective
buyers extensively and make sure they understand about neutering
and insurance. They also undertake to reclaim the cat if at any
time the new owners can't keep them. These kittens move on at
14 weeks old. 'Mistakes' are treated with the same care but move
on at 12 weeks old.

There are unofficial breeders, there is one locally to me who
breeds Ragdolls, but this breeder takes the utmost care with
the kittens and undertakes to rehome them if necessary.

Yes, I agree with you. What you describe is how it's supposed to be. And I do
know many breeders in the U.S. who fit your description.

When my kittens were really ill last year I got a lot of help
from people here and other places. I made contact with
a superb vet who was also a rescuer. Sadly, the minute
she found out one of my cats was a breed cat, she became
very rude to me and I had to block her emails. I felt very
unhappy that there could be such antagonism towards
breed cats and their owners, especially when we all needed
as much help as we did :-(

I'm sorry you encountered such hostility. I've always thought it somewhat
peculiar that some cat lovers express such vitriole towards breed cats, their
owners and good breeders. As someone else pointed out, you don't seem to find
that kind of unreasoning hostility towards the breeding of other kinds of
animals. Maybe it's just a cat-person thing. Nevertheless, I do not believe
that U.S. cat fancies will ever be in danger of disappearing, and IMO that's a
good thing.

"rainyseason" wrote:

De-lurking for a moment...

This is not meant to disagree with anything people have said about
cat breeders or people who buy breeds, I think the situation in the
UK is mostly how it's meant to be. Though I do know it doesn't
always work out this way.

The breeders I know are extremly interested in producing good
lines, have a lot of knowledge of genetics and will bring in a
cat from outside the UK to widen the gene pool and strengthen
the breed if it's needed. They socialise the kittens, have them
vaccinated before they go to their new homes, the breed papers
are registered as neutered so the new owners can't breed from
them within the official organisations. They vet prospective
buyers extensively and make sure they understand about neutering
and insurance. They also undertake to reclaim the cat if at any
time the new owners can't keep them. These kittens move on at
14 weeks old. 'Mistakes' are treated with the same care but move
on at 12 weeks old.

There are unofficial breeders, there is one locally to me who
breeds Ragdolls, but this breeder takes the utmost care with
the kittens and undertakes to rehome them if necessary.

Yes, I agree with you. What you describe is how it's supposed to be. And I do
know many breeders in the U.S. who fit your description.

When my kittens were really ill last year I got a lot of help
from people here and other places. I made contact with
a superb vet who was also a rescuer. Sadly, the minute
she found out one of my cats was a breed cat, she became
very rude to me and I had to block her emails. I felt very
unhappy that there could be such antagonism towards
breed cats and their owners, especially when we all needed
as much help as we did :-(

I'm sorry you encountered such hostility. I've always thought it somewhat
peculiar that some cat lovers express such vitriole towards breed cats, their
owners and good breeders. As someone else pointed out, you don't seem to find
that kind of unreasoning hostility towards the breeding of other kinds of
animals. Maybe it's just a cat-person thing. Nevertheless, I do not believe
that U.S. cat fancies will ever be in danger of disappearing, and IMO that's a
good thing.

wrote in message
...
kaeli wrote:
I agree. This is why I adopt from kill shelters, such as the one over on
Western. They aren't so picky.

I adopt from kill shelters because the cats are going to get killed. That
and I despise the attitude that says kill shelters are evil just cause
tehy kill. Some one unfortunately has to do it and the no kill shelters
aren't exactly great on that end, they either refuse the cat cause of no
room, kill ones they find unadoptable before they evne get a chance, or
send them off to the kill shelter themselves. They just don't have the
room to take them all so som eone has to. And since there are so many cats
and not enough room, unfortunately some one has to put them to sleep,
especially when it is mandated they take in every pet surrendered to them.

I work for a kill shelter; I was certified in April to perform euthanasia. I
can tell you from personal experience that we do our damnedest to get every
animal a home, provided they show no serious aggression problems and have no
medical conditions that are outside of what we can afford. If we hit
capacity, it's those animals that are euthanised first. We have cats from
November of last year still on the adoptable floor. We have a purebred Staff
terrier who came in in January, and she has a display room all to herself.
Our shelter, at least, does NOT kill within a time limit. It's sad how many
people (even highly educated people) still believe we do.

I'll give my money to a kill shelter over a no kill because they need it
more. Peopel are less willing to give their money over and the more moeny
they have the more resources they have to take care of pets and may be
able to take in more and give the animals more time.

Alice

--
The root cause of problems is simple overpopulation. People just aren't
worth very much any more, and they know it. Makes 'em testy. ...Bev
|\ _,,,---,,_ Tigress
/,`.-'`' -. ;-;;,_ http://havoc.gtf.gatech.edu/tigress
|,4- ) )-,_..;\ ( `'-'
'---''(_/--' `-'\_) Cat by Felix Lee.