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#11
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Did diabetes treatment do this to him?
"Charles Packer" wrote in message ... On Apr 10, 2:40 am, "Phil P." wrote: I've treated many diabetic cats- at least a few dozen over the years- and I can say, based on actual experience, Glipizide does not work, over the long run, in the vast majority of diabetic cats. The failure rate in cats is ~75-80%. The most serious- and potentially life-threatening side effect of Glipizide in cats is loss of appetite and nausea. Loss of appetite in a diabetic cat that's receiving Glipizide can result in *profound* hypoglycemia. The higher the dose the greater the chance- and severity of adverse effects. The dose your cat has been prescribed is *twice* the normal initial dose. I strongly suggest you seek a second opinion from a vet who is current in treating diabetic cats. My wife read all the postings in this thread and then spoke to an acquaintance who's a vet tech. Pretty much confirmed what was recommended here. The PetSmart vet she was going to had been leading her astray. So she'll take the cat to a vet who will endorse the insulin + no-carb diet, probably. Life will become more complicated, not to mention more constrained for our dear companion animal. Sigh...on the other hand, if we'd all grown up on farms, we'd have a different perspective -- more balanced, perhaps -- on the relative value of human and animal lives... -- Charles Packer http://cpacker.org/whatnews mailboxATcpacker.org This is *great* news. I'm so glad to hear that your wife is going to see another vet. Incidentally, I would never use the PetSmart vets for anything, so I think this will be much better all around. Please suggest that your wife make the change ASAP. This is one of those times when delay in effective treatment can have very serious consequences. Thank you!! And please thank your wife.!! MaryL MaryL |
#12
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Did diabetes treatment do this to him?
On Apr 11, 9:15*am, "cindys" wrote:
I just love a happy ending! May you and your wife and your cat have many long, happy, healthy years together. Please keep us updated on how your cat is doing. Sorry, no happy ending. The new vet found a liver problem as well. The word came back that the animal would have to be fed a truckload of pills as well as endure the insulin shots. We had the cat euthanized and buried him in our back yard. So this was the outcome of plan A, which gutted my wife's bank account. Plan B, which I had favored, would have been to not treat the condition at all. At the time it appeared, the cat simply drank a lot of water and peed a lot, but was otherwise normal. I would have waited until he seemed to be in pain or became obviously sickly and weak, at which time I would have had him euthanized. Hence my question earlier in the thread, never answered, as to what actually would have happened if the condition were not treated. -- Charles Packer http://cpacker.org/whatnews mailboxATcpacker.org |
#13
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Did diabetes treatment do this to him?
On Mon, 14 Apr 2008 04:21:53 -0700 (PDT), Charles Packer
wrote: On Apr 11, 9:15*am, "cindys" wrote: I just love a happy ending! May you and your wife and your cat have many long, happy, healthy years together. Please keep us updated on how your cat is doing. Sorry, no happy ending. The new vet found a liver problem as well. The word came back that the animal would have to be fed a truckload of pills as well as endure the insulin shots. We had the cat euthanized and buried him in our back yard. So this was the outcome of plan A, which gutted my wife's bank account. Plan B, which I had favored, would have been to not treat the condition at all. At the time it appeared, the cat simply drank a lot of water and peed a lot, but was otherwise normal. I would have waited until he seemed to be in pain or became obviously sickly and weak, at which time I would have had him euthanized. Hence my question earlier in the thread, never answered, as to what actually would have happened if the condition were not treated. Oh, sorry to hear that. Sometimes it costs a lot of money to find out that there is nothing we can do, but because I love my cats I spend the money; they are part of the family after all. Deciding whether to treat and quality of life is a very difficult decision for most of us. Not for you though. Healthcare costs money, whether it's for people or for animals. Keeping a cat in distress until it falls over isn't an option for me. I'm glad "the animal" had your wife to look after it because you apparently don't count. I guess no one answered your earlier question because, well, without spending some money to find out what is wrong, no one can answer the question. |
#14
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Did diabetes treatment do this to him?
Charles Packer wrote in
: On Apr 11, 9:15*am, "cindys" wrote: I just love a happy ending! May you and your wife and your cat have many long, happy, healthy years together. Please keep us updated on how your ca t is doing. Sorry, no happy ending. The new vet found a liver problem as well. The word came back that the animal would have to be fed a truckload of pills as well as endure the insulin shots. We had the cat euthanized and buried him in our back yard. So this was the outcome of plan A, which gutted my wife's bank account. Plan B, which I had favored, would have been to not treat the condition at all. At the time it appeared, the cat simply drank a lot of water and peed a lot, but was otherwise normal. I would have waited until he seemed to be in pain or became obviously sickly and weak, at which time I would have had him euthanized. Hence my question earlier in the thread, never answered, as to what actually would have happened if the condition were not treated. -- Charles Packer http://cpacker.org/whatnews mailboxATcpacker.org So the entire point of your post was to be able to show your wife that you were right and she was wrong? Well, you win! |
#15
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Did diabetes treatment do this to him?
"cindys" wrote in message ... "Charles Packer" wrote in message ... On Apr 11, 9:15 am, "cindys" wrote: I just love a happy ending! May you and your wife and your cat have many long, happy, healthy years together. Please keep us updated on how your cat is doing. Sorry, no happy ending. The new vet found a liver problem as well. The word came back that the animal would have to be fed a truckload of pills as well as endure the insulin shots. We had the cat euthanized and buried him in our back yard. I am so sorry to hear that. So this was the outcome of plan A, which gutted my wife's bank account. Plan B, which I had favored, would have been to not treat the condition at all. The condition you were talking about was *diabetes* NOT a liver problem. It is extremely unfortunate that your cat had more than one thing going on, but that doesn't mean that the advice we gave you about the *diabetes* was incorrect. At the time it appeared, the cat simply drank a lot of water and peed a lot, but was otherwise normal. Drinking a lot of water and peeing a lot can be a symptom of many things, many of which are treatable. Thyroid disease is another easily treatable condition which can manifest this way. Thyroid disease is easy and cheap to treat. You presented us with a *diagnosis* from a veterinarian. If you had presented only the symptoms, we would have advised you to have the cat tested to find out what was the diagnosis. I would have waited until he seemed to be in pain or became obviously sickly and weak, at which time I would have had him euthanized. With untreated diabetes, the cat was already sickly and suffering. Cats hide their pain very well. If the cat had had only diabetes, he would have been feeling much better by now from the insulin shots, and your wife would have been so happy. And if the cat had had thyroid disease, he would have been feeling much better right now from (inexpensive) medication. This was a very sad outcome, but our advice was still on-target for a cat with diabetes. Hence my question earlier in the thread, never answered, as to what actually would have happened if the condition were not treated. We did answer you. We told you that a cat with untreated *diabetes* would have a short and sickly life. To elaborate, the glucose would have clogged up his organs and he could have lost his eyesight, had organ failure, and nerve damage. Except the reality is that the cat also had a liver problem, which the first vet (who was clearly incompetent) failed to diagnose. So, your wife took the cat to a competent vet and got an accurate diagnosis. We have all lost animals that we love, and grieving takes a while. You told us your cat had *diabetes,* and we advised you that the veterinarian was treating it incorrectly and to see another vet about giving insulin shots. That advice still stands with a cat with diabetes. There was never any discussion of liver disease in any of your earlier posts. There was discussion of seeing another vet, which your wife did, and the new vet made an accurate diagnosis. The fact of the matter is that your cat had liver disease, and that would have been true whether you had seen the second vet or not. That is a sad outcome, but we gave you good advice. The bottom line is that when the cat got sick, what you really wanted to do was nothing. You wanted to let the cat die and not treat him. You're angry with us because we advised you to go to a competent vet and have him treated. And that cost money. And as an unfortunate twist of fate, he had an incurable disease in addition to the diabetes, which no one knew about until the new vet diagnosed it, and now you're angry that your wife spent money on the Lantus insulin, and we all should have been mind-readers and known that the cat had liver disease and/or we should have told you to leave the cat untreated and let him die. The people on this group are focused on helping cats to live, and no one here would ever advise someone to leave an easily treatable medical condition like *diabetes* untreated. So, now, you are berating us for not keeping out mouths shut rather than telling you how to cure your cat's diabetes? If you are looking for someone to blame, look to the incompetent veterinarian who missed the liver disease diagnosis (didn't s/he run blood work and see that the liver enzymes were all messed up? Doesn't take a rocket scientist). And for the record, many of us would have spent the money on all the pills for the liver disease, even if it meant eating beans for dinner for a month. If that wasn't your choice, it wasn't, but stop berating us as if your cat's liver disease is all our fault. Condolences to you and your wife on the loss of your kitty. Best regards, ---Cindy S. -- Charles Packer http://cpacker.org/whatnews mailboxATcpacker.org This is an excellent post with good explanations of these medical conditions. People on this group *did* answer the question (several times) because the question related only to diabetes. We were never told about liver disease. The OP is just looking for a way to tell his wife, "They wouldn't help." One of my cats had liver disease. It was diagnosed with her routine blood tests. With aggressive treatment, she lived for another three years. When it finally became clear that we could no longer sustain a quality of life and that we would be prolonging her life only to cause pain, I made the very difficult decision to have her euthanized. I do offer my sympathies to the OP's wife. It sounds like she truly loved this cat. MaryL |
#16
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Did diabetes treatment do this to him?
On Apr 14, 9:58*am, "cindys" wrote:
rocket scientist). And for the record, many of us would have spent the money on all the pills for the liver disease, even if it meant eating beans for Clearly. -- Charles Packer http://cpacker.org/whatnews mailboxATcpacker.org |
#17
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Did diabetes treatment do this to him?
"cindys" wrote in message ... "Matthew" wrote in message ... "cindys" Cindy why waste your time -------- Hoping against hope that he'll do some introspection and rethink the way he treats his wife. But I know it's probably a lost cause. Best regards, ---Cindy S. There's definitely a connection between domestic abuse and animal abuse: *85 % of homes where women are abused, a pet is also abused. *60% of women who are the victims of domestic violence have had a pet killed by violence. *40% of battered women delay going to a shelter for abused women because they're afraid of what will happen to their pet if they leave. Assholes like him are why I'm reluctant to adopt cats to women who are married or have boyfriends but come into our adoption centers alone. I want to meet both parties. I get into a lot arguments over it- but my reasons definitely are not sexist. Phil |
#18
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Did diabetes treatment do this to him?
On Wed, 16 Apr 2008 13:00:44 -0400, "cindys"
wrote: "Phil P." wrote in message news:nEfNj.13886$DD2.2798@trndny04... "cindys" wrote in message ... "Matthew" wrote in message ... "cindys" Cindy why waste your time -------- Hoping against hope that he'll do some introspection and rethink the way he treats his wife. But I know it's probably a lost cause. Best regards, ---Cindy S. There's definitely a connection between domestic abuse and animal abuse: *85 % of homes where women are abused, a pet is also abused. *60% of women who are the victims of domestic violence have had a pet killed by violence. *40% of battered women delay going to a shelter for abused women because they're afraid of what will happen to their pet if they leave. Assholes like him are why I'm reluctant to adopt cats to women who are married or have boyfriends but come into our adoption centers alone. I want to meet both parties. I get into a lot arguments over it- but my reasons definitely are not sexist. ------- My jaw dropped when I saw these statistics, but I don't find them surprising. My heart is bleeding, as I envision a woman who loved her cat desperately and would have treated his/her various illnesses if only she had the money, and a husband who refused to give her the money and forced her to have her beloved pet euthanized. My tears are for the woman more so than for the cat. The cat doesn't know the difference at this point, but the woman will be grieving for months. Best regards, ---Cindy S. Hopefully without living with the asshole. |
#19
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Did diabetes treatment do this to him?
On Apr 8, 7:18 am, Charles Packer wrote:
On Apr 7, 7:35 am, "Spot" wrote: Its very critical that the cat get the correct dosage. Too much or too little can kill the cat you need to work with your vet on this. What would have happened if that cat hadn't been treated at all? Except for a lot of drinking water and peeing, his behavior otherwise was normal. If his condition were fatal, at least we would have a memory of him as normal up to the end. But he's my wife's cat, and she decides what gets done. -- Charles Packerhttp://cpacker.org/whatnews mailboxATcpacker.org You should never ignore a cat's possible condition just because its not "fatal" or they are acting normally. |
#20
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Did diabetes treatment do this to him?
On Apr 18, 9:57*am, wrote:
You should never ignore a cat's possible condition just because its not "fatal" or they are acting normally. Think about your choice of words here. If I had been _ignoring_ the cat's condition, it never would have occurred to me to post a query to this newsgroup, right? Sloppiness like that has derailed many a discussion in newsgroups. To get this one back on a useful track, I'd like to know: Have there been any peer-reviewed studies of the success rate of the diabetes treatment advocated in this thread? -- Charles Packer http://cpacker.org/whatnews mailboxATcpacker.org |
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