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  #71  
Old November 19th 04, 03:43 PM
Kreisleriana
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On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 02:53:25 GMT, Victor Martinez
yodeled:

Christina Websell wrote:
It will be painful for me to fall out with her, but I cannot tolerate a
racist and bigot. She thinks she is right, and I think I am right.


Racism and bigotry are never right. Never. They have always been used as
an excuse to opress the minority (and sometimes even a weak majority) by
those in power.
I just told Tom that if his sister and her husband voted for the
anti-gay ammendment in their state's election, then they are not welcome
in our house. I'm sorry, but if you find my relationship so repugnant,
that you would vote to inscribe discrimination in your state's
constitution, then I do not want to welcome you into my house.
As an aside, the bible has been used throughout history to justify and
defend many horrible things, from the crusades to slavery in the US and
the oppresion of women.



Did it ever occur to these people that the Biblical model for marriage
is NOT, as they claim, "One Man, One Woman"? It is One Man, Several
Women.


Theresa
Stinky Pictures: http://community.webshots.com/album/125591586JWEFwh
My Blog: http://www.humanitas.blogspot.com
  #72  
Old November 19th 04, 03:45 PM
Kreisleriana
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On Thu, 18 Nov 2004 23:13:39 -0600, Jeanne Hedge
yodeled:

On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 04:15:41 GMT, wrote:

Christina Websell wrote:



I can't see that being a racist and a bigot is right in any country. She
quotes the Bible at me. I told her that I didn't think God was a bigot.


Jesus was an open-minded, radical thinker who believed society should help
sick and poor people. He died for those opinions, which were threatening
to the powers of the time. And now there are people who, in his name, are
committing (or approving of) the very same atrocities he preached against.

It might be the end of our friendship.


How long were you friends, before all this started coming up? Did you ever
have disagreements before? Any sign that she was going to start trying to
convert you? Or is this a sudden change on her part?

Things have gotten very tense - and intense - around here. Bush's win has
emboldened the bigots - racists, but especially homophobics - to crawl
out from their slimy rocks and assert their "right" to deprive other people
of living their lives how they want to. They cram their religious agenda
down everyone's throat, and then whine that people make fun of them. How
would they like it if Islamic fundamentalists took over this country and
made all the women wear veils? It's not OK to use the political apparatus
to preach your gospel. Go to your place of worship for that.

Come to think of it, I had a nightmare last night that I'd gone away to
a school, and it turned out to be some sort of Christian fundamentalist
school. At some point, they were badgering the non-Christians to convert,
or be killed - and they had locked the place up so nobody could leave, kind
of like the Roach Motel. They hadn't gotten to me yet, and I was trying to
figure out a way of slipping under their radar. It was creepy!


Look what's been happening since the elections to Senator Specter of
Pennsylvania, and he's a moderate Republican!


Fortunately, his fellow Senators went right ahead and supported him.


Theresa
Stinky Pictures:
http://community.webshots.com/album/125591586JWEFwh
My Blog: http://www.humanitas.blogspot.com
  #73  
Old November 19th 04, 03:45 PM
Kreisleriana
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On Thu, 18 Nov 2004 23:13:39 -0600, Jeanne Hedge
yodeled:

On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 04:15:41 GMT, wrote:

Christina Websell wrote:



I can't see that being a racist and a bigot is right in any country. She
quotes the Bible at me. I told her that I didn't think God was a bigot.


Jesus was an open-minded, radical thinker who believed society should help
sick and poor people. He died for those opinions, which were threatening
to the powers of the time. And now there are people who, in his name, are
committing (or approving of) the very same atrocities he preached against.

It might be the end of our friendship.


How long were you friends, before all this started coming up? Did you ever
have disagreements before? Any sign that she was going to start trying to
convert you? Or is this a sudden change on her part?

Things have gotten very tense - and intense - around here. Bush's win has
emboldened the bigots - racists, but especially homophobics - to crawl
out from their slimy rocks and assert their "right" to deprive other people
of living their lives how they want to. They cram their religious agenda
down everyone's throat, and then whine that people make fun of them. How
would they like it if Islamic fundamentalists took over this country and
made all the women wear veils? It's not OK to use the political apparatus
to preach your gospel. Go to your place of worship for that.

Come to think of it, I had a nightmare last night that I'd gone away to
a school, and it turned out to be some sort of Christian fundamentalist
school. At some point, they were badgering the non-Christians to convert,
or be killed - and they had locked the place up so nobody could leave, kind
of like the Roach Motel. They hadn't gotten to me yet, and I was trying to
figure out a way of slipping under their radar. It was creepy!


Look what's been happening since the elections to Senator Specter of
Pennsylvania, and he's a moderate Republican!


Fortunately, his fellow Senators went right ahead and supported him.


Theresa
Stinky Pictures:
http://community.webshots.com/album/125591586JWEFwh
My Blog: http://www.humanitas.blogspot.com
  #74  
Old November 19th 04, 03:47 PM
Kreisleriana
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Default

On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 07:28:07 +0200, Marina
yodeled:

Jeanne Hedge wrote:

Look what's been happening since the elections to Senator Specter of
Pennsylvania, and he's a moderate Republican!

I've been trying to find the quote online and can't so I'll have to
paraphrase. The leader of one of the fundamentalist conservative
religious organizations said that Specter had to be gotten rid of (and
they *did* use the words "get rid of") because he was in the way of
their agenda. And Senator Frist (the Senate majority leader) is
listening to this guy, and others like him! (Bush has been listening
to them for years)

And then when Senator Santorum (Pennsylvania's quite *conservative*
Republican senator) publically supported Specter's right to be his own
guy, they started going after him too!

These people won't stop until everyone does what they want how they
want when they want because obviously they know what's best for
everyone.


That sounds really scary and totalitarian. Purrs that you all survive to
the next election!



Marina, the Senators didn't listen. They know Spector is a perfectly
qualified guy in all the ways that count, and they supported him.


Theresa
Stinky Pictures: http://community.webshots.com/album/125591586JWEFwh
My Blog: http://www.humanitas.blogspot.com
  #75  
Old November 19th 04, 03:47 PM
Kreisleriana
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 07:28:07 +0200, Marina
yodeled:

Jeanne Hedge wrote:

Look what's been happening since the elections to Senator Specter of
Pennsylvania, and he's a moderate Republican!

I've been trying to find the quote online and can't so I'll have to
paraphrase. The leader of one of the fundamentalist conservative
religious organizations said that Specter had to be gotten rid of (and
they *did* use the words "get rid of") because he was in the way of
their agenda. And Senator Frist (the Senate majority leader) is
listening to this guy, and others like him! (Bush has been listening
to them for years)

And then when Senator Santorum (Pennsylvania's quite *conservative*
Republican senator) publically supported Specter's right to be his own
guy, they started going after him too!

These people won't stop until everyone does what they want how they
want when they want because obviously they know what's best for
everyone.


That sounds really scary and totalitarian. Purrs that you all survive to
the next election!



Marina, the Senators didn't listen. They know Spector is a perfectly
qualified guy in all the ways that count, and they supported him.


Theresa
Stinky Pictures: http://community.webshots.com/album/125591586JWEFwh
My Blog: http://www.humanitas.blogspot.com
  #76  
Old November 19th 04, 04:30 PM
Jeanne Hedge
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On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 09:45:55 -0500, Kreisleriana
wrote:

On Thu, 18 Nov 2004 23:13:39 -0600, Jeanne Hedge
yodeled:



Look what's been happening since the elections to Senator Specter of
Pennsylvania, and he's a moderate Republican!


Fortunately, his fellow Senators went right ahead and supported him.


That's new news for me today. There isn't an official vote on the
appointment until January, and I suspect the pressure on Senate
Republicans from the religious conservative groups (including the
"pray-ins") will continue. I found this quote in the paper
interesting:

***

Anti-abortion activists said they were disappointed that Senate
Republicans had decided not to block Specter.

"However, he will assume his new position on a very short leash," said
James Dobson, founder of the conservative Christian lobbying group
Focus on the Family.

***

He will, will he? Do you hold the leash, Mr Dobson? IIRC, Dobson is
the one who said Specter had to be gotten rid of.

http://www.suntimes.com/output/elect...specter19.html





Jeanne Hedge, as directed by Natasha

============
http://www.jhedge.com
  #77  
Old November 19th 04, 04:30 PM
Jeanne Hedge
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 09:45:55 -0500, Kreisleriana
wrote:

On Thu, 18 Nov 2004 23:13:39 -0600, Jeanne Hedge
yodeled:



Look what's been happening since the elections to Senator Specter of
Pennsylvania, and he's a moderate Republican!


Fortunately, his fellow Senators went right ahead and supported him.


That's new news for me today. There isn't an official vote on the
appointment until January, and I suspect the pressure on Senate
Republicans from the religious conservative groups (including the
"pray-ins") will continue. I found this quote in the paper
interesting:

***

Anti-abortion activists said they were disappointed that Senate
Republicans had decided not to block Specter.

"However, he will assume his new position on a very short leash," said
James Dobson, founder of the conservative Christian lobbying group
Focus on the Family.

***

He will, will he? Do you hold the leash, Mr Dobson? IIRC, Dobson is
the one who said Specter had to be gotten rid of.

http://www.suntimes.com/output/elect...specter19.html





Jeanne Hedge, as directed by Natasha

============
http://www.jhedge.com
  #78  
Old November 19th 04, 05:15 PM
dirtylitterboxofferingstospammers
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


Did it ever occur to these people that the Biblical model for marriage
is NOT, as they claim, "One Man, One Woman"? It is One Man, Several
Women.


Quite - and they had slaves back then, do they think this is still acceptable?
And that a widow has to marry her dead husband's brother and all of that
stuff??

Cheers, helen s


--This is an invalid email address to avoid spam--
to get correct one remove fame & fortune
**$om $

--Due to financial crisis the light at the end of the tunnel is switched off--



  #79  
Old November 19th 04, 05:15 PM
dirtylitterboxofferingstospammers
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


Did it ever occur to these people that the Biblical model for marriage
is NOT, as they claim, "One Man, One Woman"? It is One Man, Several
Women.


Quite - and they had slaves back then, do they think this is still acceptable?
And that a widow has to marry her dead husband's brother and all of that
stuff??

Cheers, helen s


--This is an invalid email address to avoid spam--
to get correct one remove fame & fortune
**$om $

--Due to financial crisis the light at the end of the tunnel is switched off--



  #80  
Old November 19th 04, 05:32 PM
Helen Miles
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Posts: n/a
Default

"Victor Martinez" wrote in message


I just told Tom that if his sister and her husband voted for the
anti-gay ammendment in their state's election, then they are not welcome
in our house. I'm sorry, but if you find my relationship so repugnant,
that you would vote to inscribe discrimination in your state's
constitution, then I do not want to welcome you into my house.


{{{{{BIG HUGS VICTOR}}}}} Whilst I accept it happens and that many
people *are* biggoted numbf*cks (which is what the people on the
anti-gay crusade are)
it saddens me every time I see anything like this. It DOESN'T matter
who you do or don't love, or what your sexual orientation is. It is
irrelevant to
who you are as a person. If it makes any difference Victor, I'm proud
to call you my friend, and I can only ENVY the relationship that you and
Tom have.

As an aside, the bible has been used throughout history to justify and
defend many horrible things, from the crusades to slavery in the US and
the oppresion of women.


Christian fundamentalism is a very scary concept, as is any kind of
fundamentalism, and is a way of oppressing the masses. I respect that
may people here have strong Christian beliefs, but I do often find it
profoundly disturbing the way that certain elements interpret the more
radical elements of (many) different religions interpret theirreligious
teachings for their own ends.

Helen M (stopping now, before she goes off on a rant)


--
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