Crane, Gaubster, PhilP

From: (Liz)
Date: 9/19/03 10:08 PM Pacific Daylight Time
Message-id:

Thanks Steve!

Gaubster, Cuba is communist, not socialist.


You were discussing free health care and education being superior to what we
have in the US. I was listing Cuba as an example of what you were touting. By
the way, you get what you pay for!

From: (GAUBSTER2)

The cat that is obese
has different nutritional requirements than the feral cat "scraping out
his
existence on the streets".

No...no he doesn't. If you feed both cats the proper number of calories
in the form of a species-appropriate diet, both will thrive.

We'll have to agree to disagree on this one. You take 2 cats. One is
healthy,
the other is not. They have 2 different nutritional requirments at that
time.
Same for people.

Do you have different nutritional requirements than a homeless person?

Depends if one of us is a diabetic or not (for example).


Besides, adult-onset diabetes is a diet-related disorder is it not? If
the body's physiologic needs were met with a proper, healthy diet then
generally speaking the risk of diabetes is almost nil.


Yes, but again the nutritional needs are different from person to person. If
everybody was healthy, then maybe it would be different.

You didn't answer my question about the captive-bred Bengal tiger vs.
the wild one. That's a better analogy for the feral cat vs. the housecat.

I don't know enought about that breed to make an argument one way or the
other,
however, I suppose you could (and did) make your argument based off of that
case. But that's not reality for domesticated cats--some that are "dumped"
and
have to struggle to survive. The nutrient needs are different at that point.

To take your argument a little further, from what you are saying, it would seem
that every cat has their own unique and specific nutritional needs. So, since
cat food seems to be a one size fits all product, what do you do? I know in my
case, feeding a homemade diet, if one of my cats needs more of a certain
nutrient, I can just adjust the diet accordingly.

But I think what the person you are discussing this with (sorry, I can't
remember who that is) was saying is that cats have basic nutritional
requirements. For instance, they are all carnivores, whether they are a stray
or not, and therefore have a nutritional requirement of meat. Also, in cats,
they all have a specific need for certain amino acids, vitamins and minerals.
That does not change whether or not the cat is a feral or not. Here is some
more information on the needs of cats:

http://www.homevet.com/petcare/feedingyourcat.html

Lauren
________
See my cats: http://community.webshots.com/album/56955940rWhxAe
Raw Diet Info: http://www.holisticat.com/drjletter.html
http://www.geocities.com/rawfeeders/ForCatsOnly.html
Declawing Info: http://www.wholecat.com/articles/claws.htm

From: (GAUBSTER2)

The cat that is obese
has different nutritional requirements than the feral cat "scraping out
his
existence on the streets".

No...no he doesn't. If you feed both cats the proper number of calories
in the form of a species-appropriate diet, both will thrive.

We'll have to agree to disagree on this one. You take 2 cats. One is
healthy,
the other is not. They have 2 different nutritional requirments at that
time.
Same for people.

Do you have different nutritional requirements than a homeless person?

Depends if one of us is a diabetic or not (for example).


Besides, adult-onset diabetes is a diet-related disorder is it not? If
the body's physiologic needs were met with a proper, healthy diet then
generally speaking the risk of diabetes is almost nil.


Yes, but again the nutritional needs are different from person to person. If
everybody was healthy, then maybe it would be different.

You didn't answer my question about the captive-bred Bengal tiger vs.
the wild one. That's a better analogy for the feral cat vs. the housecat.

I don't know enought about that breed to make an argument one way or the
other,
however, I suppose you could (and did) make your argument based off of that
case. But that's not reality for domesticated cats--some that are "dumped"
and
have to struggle to survive. The nutrient needs are different at that point.

To take your argument a little further, from what you are saying, it would seem
that every cat has their own unique and specific nutritional needs. So, since
cat food seems to be a one size fits all product, what do you do? I know in my
case, feeding a homemade diet, if one of my cats needs more of a certain
nutrient, I can just adjust the diet accordingly.

But I think what the person you are discussing this with (sorry, I can't
remember who that is) was saying is that cats have basic nutritional
requirements. For instance, they are all carnivores, whether they are a stray
or not, and therefore have a nutritional requirement of meat. Also, in cats,
they all have a specific need for certain amino acids, vitamins and minerals.
That does not change whether or not the cat is a feral or not. Here is some
more information on the needs of cats:

http://www.homevet.com/petcare/feedingyourcat.html

Lauren
________
See my cats: http://community.webshots.com/album/56955940rWhxAe
Raw Diet Info: http://www.holisticat.com/drjletter.html
http://www.geocities.com/rawfeeders/ForCatsOnly.html
Declawing Info: http://www.wholecat.com/articles/claws.htm

From: (GAUBSTER2)

The cat that is obese
has different nutritional requirements than the feral cat "scraping out
his
existence on the streets".

No...no he doesn't. If you feed both cats the proper number of calories
in the form of a species-appropriate diet, both will thrive.

We'll have to agree to disagree on this one. You take 2 cats. One is
healthy,
the other is not. They have 2 different nutritional requirments at that
time.
Same for people.

Do you have different nutritional requirements than a homeless person?

Depends if one of us is a diabetic or not (for example).


Besides, adult-onset diabetes is a diet-related disorder is it not? If
the body's physiologic needs were met with a proper, healthy diet then
generally speaking the risk of diabetes is almost nil.


Yes, but again the nutritional needs are different from person to person. If
everybody was healthy, then maybe it would be different.

You didn't answer my question about the captive-bred Bengal tiger vs.
the wild one. That's a better analogy for the feral cat vs. the housecat.

I don't know enought about that breed to make an argument one way or the
other,
however, I suppose you could (and did) make your argument based off of that
case. But that's not reality for domesticated cats--some that are "dumped"
and
have to struggle to survive. The nutrient needs are different at that point.

To take your argument a little further, from what you are saying, it would seem
that every cat has their own unique and specific nutritional needs. So, since
cat food seems to be a one size fits all product, what do you do? I know in my
case, feeding a homemade diet, if one of my cats needs more of a certain
nutrient, I can just adjust the diet accordingly.

But I think what the person you are discussing this with (sorry, I can't
remember who that is) was saying is that cats have basic nutritional
requirements. For instance, they are all carnivores, whether they are a stray
or not, and therefore have a nutritional requirement of meat. Also, in cats,
they all have a specific need for certain amino acids, vitamins and minerals.
That does not change whether or not the cat is a feral or not. Here is some
more information on the needs of cats:

http://www.homevet.com/petcare/feedingyourcat.html

Lauren
________
See my cats: http://community.webshots.com/album/56955940rWhxAe
Raw Diet Info: http://www.holisticat.com/drjletter.html
http://www.geocities.com/rawfeeders/ForCatsOnly.html
Declawing Info: http://www.wholecat.com/articles/claws.htm

From: Alison Perera lid


In article ,
olitter (PawsForThought) wrote:

From: Alison Perera lid

Hey, guess what! Mazuri Primate Maintenance now has DentaGuard? - Proven
in research trials to reduce the formation of dental calculi.

Who needs pesky tooth-brushing?

ROFL!!!! Wouldn't that be nice though? Maybe they'll invent a food that
does
flossing too.

Lauren

Can't you just imagine it? You've just adopted a pet human. Hmmm...what
to feed it? Well, obviously home-preparing its food is out. That's too
much trouble, and too hard to figure out what the proper nutrition for a
human is. Better stick with complete and balanced kibble. OK, that
decision's made...Oh, man! There's such a wide variety of kibbles
available! How to choose? Well, Purina has a good solid reputation of
doing top-notch nutrition research. AND they have DentaGuard! Maybe I
can reduce the number of times my human has to get dental treatment! I
mean, how often do YOU really open your human's mouth and get in there
with a toothbrush? It's a huge hassle, I bet you don't do it more than
once a week IF that.

BTW, in case you did think DentaGuard is a joke, check out the primate
diets at mazuri.purinamills.com...

-Alison in OH

It looks like the DentaGuard is for gorillas, etc. Wonder why they don't have
it in human food?
________
See my cats: http://community.webshots.com/album/56955940rWhxAe
Raw Diet Info: http://www.holisticat.com/drjletter.html
http://www.geocities.com/rawfeeders/ForCatsOnly.html
Declawing Info: http://www.wholecat.com/articles/claws.htm

From: Alison Perera lid


In article ,
olitter (PawsForThought) wrote:

From: Alison Perera lid

Hey, guess what! Mazuri Primate Maintenance now has DentaGuard? - Proven
in research trials to reduce the formation of dental calculi.

Who needs pesky tooth-brushing?

ROFL!!!! Wouldn't that be nice though? Maybe they'll invent a food that
does
flossing too.

Lauren

Can't you just imagine it? You've just adopted a pet human. Hmmm...what
to feed it? Well, obviously home-preparing its food is out. That's too
much trouble, and too hard to figure out what the proper nutrition for a
human is. Better stick with complete and balanced kibble. OK, that
decision's made...Oh, man! There's such a wide variety of kibbles
available! How to choose? Well, Purina has a good solid reputation of
doing top-notch nutrition research. AND they have DentaGuard! Maybe I
can reduce the number of times my human has to get dental treatment! I
mean, how often do YOU really open your human's mouth and get in there
with a toothbrush? It's a huge hassle, I bet you don't do it more than
once a week IF that.

BTW, in case you did think DentaGuard is a joke, check out the primate
diets at mazuri.purinamills.com...

-Alison in OH

It looks like the DentaGuard is for gorillas, etc. Wonder why they don't have
it in human food?
________
See my cats: http://community.webshots.com/album/56955940rWhxAe
Raw Diet Info: http://www.holisticat.com/drjletter.html
http://www.geocities.com/rawfeeders/ForCatsOnly.html
Declawing Info: http://www.wholecat.com/articles/claws.htm

From: Alison Perera lid


In article ,
olitter (PawsForThought) wrote:

From: Alison Perera lid

Hey, guess what! Mazuri Primate Maintenance now has DentaGuard? - Proven
in research trials to reduce the formation of dental calculi.

Who needs pesky tooth-brushing?

ROFL!!!! Wouldn't that be nice though? Maybe they'll invent a food that
does
flossing too.

Lauren

Can't you just imagine it? You've just adopted a pet human. Hmmm...what
to feed it? Well, obviously home-preparing its food is out. That's too
much trouble, and too hard to figure out what the proper nutrition for a
human is. Better stick with complete and balanced kibble. OK, that
decision's made...Oh, man! There's such a wide variety of kibbles
available! How to choose? Well, Purina has a good solid reputation of
doing top-notch nutrition research. AND they have DentaGuard! Maybe I
can reduce the number of times my human has to get dental treatment! I
mean, how often do YOU really open your human's mouth and get in there
with a toothbrush? It's a huge hassle, I bet you don't do it more than
once a week IF that.

BTW, in case you did think DentaGuard is a joke, check out the primate
diets at mazuri.purinamills.com...

-Alison in OH

It looks like the DentaGuard is for gorillas, etc. Wonder why they don't have
it in human food?
________
See my cats: http://community.webshots.com/album/56955940rWhxAe
Raw Diet Info: http://www.holisticat.com/drjletter.html
http://www.geocities.com/rawfeeders/ForCatsOnly.html
Declawing Info: http://www.wholecat.com/articles/claws.htm

From: (Liz)

Wrongo. Socialism is not the nirvana you are making it out to be.

Check this out:

Population below poverty line:

USA 12.7%
Norway NA
Belgium 4%
Holland NA
Sweden NA
France NA
Canada NA
Brazil 22%
Switzerland NA
Austria NA
Germany NA
Denmark NA
New Zealand NA
Australia NA
Spain NA
Italy NA
Botswana 47%
Ethiopia 64%

http://www.countryreports.org/alphanationtext.htm#U

Not to change the subject too much, but have you seen the movie Bowling for
Columbine? What I found fascinating is the amount of deaths caused by guns in
the U.S. Norway was something like 68 deaths, Australia was 65, I can't
remember any more numbers but they were all 100 or less, except for the U.S.,
which had something like 112,000 deaths caused by guns each year. Now you
might think it could be attributable to all the violent movies, games, etc.,
but they said other countries have just as many violent movies and video games.
I've only seen about an hour of the movie so far, but it really is
fascinating.

Lauren
________
See my cats: http://community.webshots.com/album/56955940rWhxAe
Raw Diet Info: http://www.holisticat.com/drjletter.html
http://www.geocities.com/rawfeeders/ForCatsOnly.html
Declawing Info: http://www.wholecat.com/articles/claws.htm

From: (Liz)

Wrongo. Socialism is not the nirvana you are making it out to be.

Check this out:

Population below poverty line:

USA 12.7%
Norway NA
Belgium 4%
Holland NA
Sweden NA
France NA
Canada NA
Brazil 22%
Switzerland NA
Austria NA
Germany NA
Denmark NA
New Zealand NA
Australia NA
Spain NA
Italy NA
Botswana 47%
Ethiopia 64%

http://www.countryreports.org/alphanationtext.htm#U

Not to change the subject too much, but have you seen the movie Bowling for
Columbine? What I found fascinating is the amount of deaths caused by guns in
the U.S. Norway was something like 68 deaths, Australia was 65, I can't
remember any more numbers but they were all 100 or less, except for the U.S.,
which had something like 112,000 deaths caused by guns each year. Now you
might think it could be attributable to all the violent movies, games, etc.,
but they said other countries have just as many violent movies and video games.
I've only seen about an hour of the movie so far, but it really is
fascinating.

Lauren
________
See my cats: http://community.webshots.com/album/56955940rWhxAe
Raw Diet Info: http://www.holisticat.com/drjletter.html
http://www.geocities.com/rawfeeders/ForCatsOnly.html
Declawing Info: http://www.wholecat.com/articles/claws.htm

From: (Liz)

Wrongo. Socialism is not the nirvana you are making it out to be.

Check this out:

Population below poverty line:

USA 12.7%
Norway NA
Belgium 4%
Holland NA
Sweden NA
France NA
Canada NA
Brazil 22%
Switzerland NA
Austria NA
Germany NA
Denmark NA
New Zealand NA
Australia NA
Spain NA
Italy NA
Botswana 47%
Ethiopia 64%

http://www.countryreports.org/alphanationtext.htm#U

Not to change the subject too much, but have you seen the movie Bowling for
Columbine? What I found fascinating is the amount of deaths caused by guns in
the U.S. Norway was something like 68 deaths, Australia was 65, I can't
remember any more numbers but they were all 100 or less, except for the U.S.,
which had something like 112,000 deaths caused by guns each year. Now you
might think it could be attributable to all the violent movies, games, etc.,
but they said other countries have just as many violent movies and video games.
I've only seen about an hour of the movie so far, but it really is
fascinating.

Lauren
________
See my cats: http://community.webshots.com/album/56955940rWhxAe
Raw Diet Info: http://www.holisticat.com/drjletter.html
http://www.geocities.com/rawfeeders/ForCatsOnly.html
Declawing Info: http://www.wholecat.com/articles/claws.htm