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#11
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#12
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"Sherry " wrote in message ... OK, cat people, I ... well actually we, i.e. Mother, the cats, and I, need some guidance from the best cat thinkers on the planet. (snipped) I know you think your mom is doing the cats a kindess by feeding them; but think about this. She is simply attracting them to her property, where they can continue to breed, and risk exposure to antifreeze poisoning, (one of the most horrible deaths you can imagine),) and cause problems to your neighbors. Please do the right thing. Trap the remaining cats. Take them for spay/neuter and find someone in the country to adopt them, or someone who is willing to spend time taming them enough to be house cats. You're just setting them up for suffering. Your cats don't have a right to roam all over the neighbor's property. Your continued defiance is only going to cause the neighbors to take out their frustrations *on the cats*. Sherry I know you mean well, Sherry, but it ain't your problem and I'm not stupid. Some of the things you envision are easy--so long as you are not the one having to find the way to do it. As for the behavior of the neighbor, poisoning animals is against the law, Sherry. He's killed about a dozen neighborhood cats, many pets, and a couple of dogs. As far as I'm concerned, such people are the scum of the earth and, in the absence of the law taking action, any aggrivation I can cause him is warranted. I'm doing nothing illegal, he has and continues to do so. When he captures a cat on the weekend, when the shelter is closed, he takes the animal on a oneway ride. Think he's turning them lose somewhere, or drowning them? His trap is rusty, if that helps you figure it out. Cheers, Jack |
#13
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"Sherry " wrote in message ... OK, cat people, I ... well actually we, i.e. Mother, the cats, and I, need some guidance from the best cat thinkers on the planet. (snipped) I know you think your mom is doing the cats a kindess by feeding them; but think about this. She is simply attracting them to her property, where they can continue to breed, and risk exposure to antifreeze poisoning, (one of the most horrible deaths you can imagine),) and cause problems to your neighbors. Please do the right thing. Trap the remaining cats. Take them for spay/neuter and find someone in the country to adopt them, or someone who is willing to spend time taming them enough to be house cats. You're just setting them up for suffering. Your cats don't have a right to roam all over the neighbor's property. Your continued defiance is only going to cause the neighbors to take out their frustrations *on the cats*. Sherry I know you mean well, Sherry, but it ain't your problem and I'm not stupid. Some of the things you envision are easy--so long as you are not the one having to find the way to do it. As for the behavior of the neighbor, poisoning animals is against the law, Sherry. He's killed about a dozen neighborhood cats, many pets, and a couple of dogs. As far as I'm concerned, such people are the scum of the earth and, in the absence of the law taking action, any aggrivation I can cause him is warranted. I'm doing nothing illegal, he has and continues to do so. When he captures a cat on the weekend, when the shelter is closed, he takes the animal on a oneway ride. Think he's turning them lose somewhere, or drowning them? His trap is rusty, if that helps you figure it out. Cheers, Jack |
#14
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"-L." wrote in message m... (Sherry ) wrote in message ... OK, cat people, I ... well actually we, i.e. Mother, the cats, and I, need some guidance from the best cat thinkers on the planet. (snipped) I know you think your mom is doing the cats a kindess by feeding them; but think about this. She is simply attracting them to her property, where they can continue to breed, and risk exposure to antifreeze poisoning, (one of the most horrible deaths you can imagine),) and cause problems to your neighbors. Please do the right thing. Trap the remaining cats. Take them for spay/neuter and find someone in the country to adopt them, or someone who is willing to spend time taming them enough to be house cats. You're just setting them up for suffering. Your cats don't have a right to roam all over the neighbor's property. Your continued defiance is only going to cause the neighbors to take out their frustrations *on the cats*. Sherry I couldn't agree more. I hate to think of cats being poisoned, but rouge cats *are* a nuisance, and this neighbor has every right to trap them and take them to the humane society or animal control. And, on the weekend, when the shelter is closed, he takes them out and drowns them. Also, we're not talking about a few feral cats being killed. As I've mentioned elsewhere, the count, as far as I can tell, is two dogs and at least a dozen cats. All but about half a dozen were pets. --JB As for the poisoning, you need to take photographs of the cans of poisoned food and take them to the police station or your local animal welfare agency. Poisoning cats is a crime in most jurisdictions - animal cruelty - and the guy should be arrested. also, any poisoned cats should be put into the freezer as evidence, and then turned over to animal control authorities. Maybe in your end of the world. In Illinois, poisoning domestic animals carries a fine of $1,500 and a year in jail, for the first offence. I have witnesses who heard them discussing poisoning, before the fact. A witness, other than myself, who saw the cans of poisoned food on his property, and I even have the cans of poisoned food WITH their fu*king fingerprints on them. The police will not even investigate. The police have, however, allowed themselves to be used by him to harass my mother and myself, with bogus complaints about me trespassing on his property... I've been threatened with arrest three times, without any justification what-so-ever. You essentially contend he has every right to do as he sees fit on his property, RIGHT? I happen to agree--we got a speach about that from the police as well. However, the vital omission from the story, as he tells it, is his breaking the law by poisoning animals. That, the law says, he has no right to do anywhere. But, as long as we're in the neighborhood of people doing what they want on their property, so long as it's legal, the police showed up demanding to know why I had put up a bird feeder on "the property line." Strange how suddenly I was called upon to defend a legal act, don't you think? Also, the feeder was well within my property line, by about 3 feet. Didn't matter as the following morning, it was stolen. The police will not even ask him about that. So, the situation is he's managed to sell some lies about the situation to the local police, and they seem to have bought his story completely. Given the inaction of the officials, I have adopted the policy that any legal act which will cause him a problem is desirable. As far as I'm concerned, anyone who will poison animals is the scum of the earth. --JB The cats are likely to return to their former territory if moved - first and foremost, they must be spayed or neutered, and then contained in a yard with a 6-ft fence with a cat guard on the top, minimally. If you are unable to contain the cats, they need to be rehomed. As for the neighbor, poisoning and/or shooting birds isn't out of his realm of activity either, so I would remove the bird feeders and bath ASAP. Enough animals have suffered at the hands of this freak. Best of luck to you, -L. I know, I know, I know......... Thanks, Jack |
#15
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"-L." wrote in message m... (Sherry ) wrote in message ... OK, cat people, I ... well actually we, i.e. Mother, the cats, and I, need some guidance from the best cat thinkers on the planet. (snipped) I know you think your mom is doing the cats a kindess by feeding them; but think about this. She is simply attracting them to her property, where they can continue to breed, and risk exposure to antifreeze poisoning, (one of the most horrible deaths you can imagine),) and cause problems to your neighbors. Please do the right thing. Trap the remaining cats. Take them for spay/neuter and find someone in the country to adopt them, or someone who is willing to spend time taming them enough to be house cats. You're just setting them up for suffering. Your cats don't have a right to roam all over the neighbor's property. Your continued defiance is only going to cause the neighbors to take out their frustrations *on the cats*. Sherry I couldn't agree more. I hate to think of cats being poisoned, but rouge cats *are* a nuisance, and this neighbor has every right to trap them and take them to the humane society or animal control. And, on the weekend, when the shelter is closed, he takes them out and drowns them. Also, we're not talking about a few feral cats being killed. As I've mentioned elsewhere, the count, as far as I can tell, is two dogs and at least a dozen cats. All but about half a dozen were pets. --JB As for the poisoning, you need to take photographs of the cans of poisoned food and take them to the police station or your local animal welfare agency. Poisoning cats is a crime in most jurisdictions - animal cruelty - and the guy should be arrested. also, any poisoned cats should be put into the freezer as evidence, and then turned over to animal control authorities. Maybe in your end of the world. In Illinois, poisoning domestic animals carries a fine of $1,500 and a year in jail, for the first offence. I have witnesses who heard them discussing poisoning, before the fact. A witness, other than myself, who saw the cans of poisoned food on his property, and I even have the cans of poisoned food WITH their fu*king fingerprints on them. The police will not even investigate. The police have, however, allowed themselves to be used by him to harass my mother and myself, with bogus complaints about me trespassing on his property... I've been threatened with arrest three times, without any justification what-so-ever. You essentially contend he has every right to do as he sees fit on his property, RIGHT? I happen to agree--we got a speach about that from the police as well. However, the vital omission from the story, as he tells it, is his breaking the law by poisoning animals. That, the law says, he has no right to do anywhere. But, as long as we're in the neighborhood of people doing what they want on their property, so long as it's legal, the police showed up demanding to know why I had put up a bird feeder on "the property line." Strange how suddenly I was called upon to defend a legal act, don't you think? Also, the feeder was well within my property line, by about 3 feet. Didn't matter as the following morning, it was stolen. The police will not even ask him about that. So, the situation is he's managed to sell some lies about the situation to the local police, and they seem to have bought his story completely. Given the inaction of the officials, I have adopted the policy that any legal act which will cause him a problem is desirable. As far as I'm concerned, anyone who will poison animals is the scum of the earth. --JB The cats are likely to return to their former territory if moved - first and foremost, they must be spayed or neutered, and then contained in a yard with a 6-ft fence with a cat guard on the top, minimally. If you are unable to contain the cats, they need to be rehomed. As for the neighbor, poisoning and/or shooting birds isn't out of his realm of activity either, so I would remove the bird feeders and bath ASAP. Enough animals have suffered at the hands of this freak. Best of luck to you, -L. I know, I know, I know......... Thanks, Jack |
#16
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"JHBennett" wrote in message ...
"-L." wrote in message m... (Sherry ) wrote in message ... OK, cat people, I ... well actually we, i.e. Mother, the cats, and I, need some guidance from the best cat thinkers on the planet. (snipped) I know you think your mom is doing the cats a kindess by feeding them; but think about this. She is simply attracting them to her property, where they can continue to breed, and risk exposure to antifreeze poisoning, (one of the most horrible deaths you can imagine),) and cause problems to your neighbors. Please do the right thing. Trap the remaining cats. Take them for spay/neuter and find someone in the country to adopt them, or someone who is willing to spend time taming them enough to be house cats. You're just setting them up for suffering. Your cats don't have a right to roam all over the neighbor's property. Your continued defiance is only going to cause the neighbors to take out their frustrations *on the cats*. Sherry I couldn't agree more. I hate to think of cats being poisoned, but rouge cats *are* a nuisance, and this neighbor has every right to trap them and take them to the humane society or animal control. And, on the weekend, when the shelter is closed, he takes them out and drowns them. Also, we're not talking about a few feral cats being killed. As I've mentioned elsewhere, the count, as far as I can tell, is two dogs and at least a dozen cats. All but about half a dozen were pets. --JB Well, what he is doing is illegal. As for the poisoning, you need to take photographs of the cans of poisoned food and take them to the police station or your local animal welfare agency. Poisoning cats is a crime in most jurisdictions - animal cruelty - and the guy should be arrested. also, any poisoned cats should be put into the freezer as evidence, and then turned over to animal control authorities. Maybe in your end of the world. In Illinois, poisoning domestic animals carries a fine of $1,500 and a year in jail, for the first offence. I have witnesses who heard them discussing poisoning, before the fact. A witness, other than myself, who saw the cans of poisoned food on his property, and I even have the cans of poisoned food WITH their fu*king fingerprints on them. The police will not even investigate. Why not? The police have, however, allowed themselves to be used by him to harass my mother and myself, with bogus complaints about me trespassing on his property... I've been threatened with arrest three times, without any justification what-so-ever. You essentially contend he has every right to do as he sees fit on his property, RIGHT? no. He has no right to commit acts of animal cruelty. He does, however, have the right to trap the cats and turn them in to the proper authorities. I happen to agree--we got a speach about that from the police as well. However, the vital omission from the story, as he tells it, is his breaking the law by poisoning animals. That, the law says, he has no right to do anywhere. But, as long as we're in the neighborhood of people doing what they want on their property, so long as it's legal, the police showed up demanding to know why I had put up a bird feeder on "the property line." Strange how suddenly I was called upon to defend a legal act, don't you think? Also, the feeder was well within my property line, by about 3 feet. Didn't matter as the following morning, it was stolen. The police will not even ask him about that. So, the situation is he's managed to sell some lies about the situation to the local police, and they seem to have bought his story completely. Given the inaction of the officials, I have adopted the policy that any legal act which will cause him a problem is desirable. As far as I'm concerned, anyone who will poison animals is the scum of the earth. --JB I agree, but he needs to be caught - and howver you can get him caught is the thing to do. Isn't there an animal welfare agency nearby that is sympathetic to your situation? Have you had the cause of death documented by a veterinarian? Vets don't take kindly to animal poisoners, and their testimony is essential to your case. -L. |
#17
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"JHBennett" wrote in message ...
"-L." wrote in message m... (Sherry ) wrote in message ... OK, cat people, I ... well actually we, i.e. Mother, the cats, and I, need some guidance from the best cat thinkers on the planet. (snipped) I know you think your mom is doing the cats a kindess by feeding them; but think about this. She is simply attracting them to her property, where they can continue to breed, and risk exposure to antifreeze poisoning, (one of the most horrible deaths you can imagine),) and cause problems to your neighbors. Please do the right thing. Trap the remaining cats. Take them for spay/neuter and find someone in the country to adopt them, or someone who is willing to spend time taming them enough to be house cats. You're just setting them up for suffering. Your cats don't have a right to roam all over the neighbor's property. Your continued defiance is only going to cause the neighbors to take out their frustrations *on the cats*. Sherry I couldn't agree more. I hate to think of cats being poisoned, but rouge cats *are* a nuisance, and this neighbor has every right to trap them and take them to the humane society or animal control. And, on the weekend, when the shelter is closed, he takes them out and drowns them. Also, we're not talking about a few feral cats being killed. As I've mentioned elsewhere, the count, as far as I can tell, is two dogs and at least a dozen cats. All but about half a dozen were pets. --JB Well, what he is doing is illegal. As for the poisoning, you need to take photographs of the cans of poisoned food and take them to the police station or your local animal welfare agency. Poisoning cats is a crime in most jurisdictions - animal cruelty - and the guy should be arrested. also, any poisoned cats should be put into the freezer as evidence, and then turned over to animal control authorities. Maybe in your end of the world. In Illinois, poisoning domestic animals carries a fine of $1,500 and a year in jail, for the first offence. I have witnesses who heard them discussing poisoning, before the fact. A witness, other than myself, who saw the cans of poisoned food on his property, and I even have the cans of poisoned food WITH their fu*king fingerprints on them. The police will not even investigate. Why not? The police have, however, allowed themselves to be used by him to harass my mother and myself, with bogus complaints about me trespassing on his property... I've been threatened with arrest three times, without any justification what-so-ever. You essentially contend he has every right to do as he sees fit on his property, RIGHT? no. He has no right to commit acts of animal cruelty. He does, however, have the right to trap the cats and turn them in to the proper authorities. I happen to agree--we got a speach about that from the police as well. However, the vital omission from the story, as he tells it, is his breaking the law by poisoning animals. That, the law says, he has no right to do anywhere. But, as long as we're in the neighborhood of people doing what they want on their property, so long as it's legal, the police showed up demanding to know why I had put up a bird feeder on "the property line." Strange how suddenly I was called upon to defend a legal act, don't you think? Also, the feeder was well within my property line, by about 3 feet. Didn't matter as the following morning, it was stolen. The police will not even ask him about that. So, the situation is he's managed to sell some lies about the situation to the local police, and they seem to have bought his story completely. Given the inaction of the officials, I have adopted the policy that any legal act which will cause him a problem is desirable. As far as I'm concerned, anyone who will poison animals is the scum of the earth. --JB I agree, but he needs to be caught - and howver you can get him caught is the thing to do. Isn't there an animal welfare agency nearby that is sympathetic to your situation? Have you had the cause of death documented by a veterinarian? Vets don't take kindly to animal poisoners, and their testimony is essential to your case. -L. |
#18
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You could report him to PETA..Give them something to do that is worth while.
"you can tell alot about a people or person in how they treat animals" |
#19
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You could report him to PETA..Give them something to do that is worth while.
"you can tell alot about a people or person in how they treat animals" |
#20
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Anyone who feeds antifreeze to cats would do
it no matter what the neighbor was doing. Getting in touch with the local humane society to find out what financial assistance is available for getting the cats spayed and neutered is mandatory. As you know, there are too many cats who will never have homes, and these additional kittens that come along are just plain sad and needless. Then they have kittens, and on, and on. There will be plenty of cats for you and mom to take care of without that, though if there is an adoption program, a no kill shelter in your area, "extras" beyond what mom really needs to satisfy herself ought to be sent there to have a chance at real care, and a real home. What happens when the existing cats need medical care? The catguard fencing is a very good idea, and something you can do on your own, wherever you live. Do a search on the web, you'll see, it's no more than adding a properly fashioned addition to the top of an existing fence, and you'll see it doesn't have much to do with the height of the fence, it's the construction at the top. The cats might do quite well being kept in the garage for a bit, till they became acclimated, used to the idea of the move. Loose, they may just run/hide/get lost. If the neighbor ever does set out antifreeze again, I'd definitely take pictures, and try to get them in the local newspaper. As well as call the humane society. Call any animal groups in your area for suggestions on what can be done. They can be *very* helpful in situations like that, even when the police aren't, or can force the police to pay attention. I'd definitely see to it he was forced to get his fence back on his property before I gave up the house. Very much serves him right. Be nice if his "traps" disappeared:-) "JHBennett" wrote in message ... OK, cat people, I ... well actually we, i.e. Mother, the cats, and I, need some guidance from the best cat thinkers on the planet. I somehow feel this is the moment to say "your mission, should you choose to accept it........" because the situation is rather daunting, taking on aspects of *Mission Impossible.* I'll begin by telling the whole story, since neither of us were doing anything else anyway;-) About 3+ years ago, my 90 year old Mother opened the kitchen door to let Rattler, our 15 year old arthritic dog, out to answer the call of nature. She found a cat huddled against the door, trying to keep warm. We had 14 inches of snow at the time, and the temperature was well below freezing. Feeling sorry for the poor creature, she set out a can of tuna for it. The cat survived and was named Bootsie by Mother (you have to be a regular to earn a name). The following Spring, Bootsie rewarded us by having two kittens, White Stocking, a Tom, and Miss Kitty. Along in there, somewhere, Mother happened to read the life expectancy of feral cats was about 3 years. Mother is a cat person in good standing, however, and it really is a very large HOWEVER, I am terribly allergic to cats. I can't exactly say I have gone into anaphylactic shock because of them, but once the doctor gave me a shot of adrenalin to keep me going. Naturally, cats love me and will curl up on my coat for a nap, to the exclusion of anywhere else, at any opportunity. Accordingly, Mother has never been able to have a cat for a pet and I must always be mindful of my contacts with them. That means washing my hands immediately after petting one and never letting one get in my lap--unless I intend to change clothes soon. Cleaning and vacuuming a place where a cat has been on a regular basis doesn't work, as, while I was away at school, Mother had a cat which slept on a day bed. Knowing of my allergy, she dilligently cleaned the area for me to sleep there, upon my return from school. Took about 20 minutes before I was struggling to breath. More's the pity as I really do think cats are neat, but, for me, it's about like playing with a live grenade. Back to the cats. Anyway, to give the feral cats a better chance at survival, Mother started putting food out for them. To help them survive the Winter, I built *kitty condo's* for them by cutting openings in ice chests and placing them in sheltered places around the outside of our house. In case you're interested, I also got a car battery warmer which, placed under a pan of water, kept our cats supplied with fresh water through the cold. At one time, we were going through 18 pounds of Meow mix every 10 days, such was the popularity of Mother's Kitty station. Mother doted on the cats, as you might expect, and regular visitors to our back yard would get a name. We had Big Gray, Tough Guy, Yellow Boy. Ring Tail, Little Gray, Tabby Cat, Hobo Cat, and several others who would show up, as well as our resident Bootsie, White Stocking, and Miss Kitty. Everybody's gone now, except for Bootsie, White Stocking, and Miss Kitty, poisoned by our neighbor next door. While we were having a new roof put on our house, I happened to walk up my neighbor's drive to see how the work was going. I chanced to look down and discover two cans of cat food, afloat with antifreeze. As I had watched Hobo Cat die 3 days before, I was not pleased and canceled a business deal with the sumbitch. I also reported it to the police, only to discover they could care less. Since then, the neighbor and I have been warring back and forth, he calls the police to complain, I make him get his stuff off my property, etc. I'm ahead in the count, incidentally, as I have put up two bird feeders and a birdbath beside his driveway. The first bird feeder I put up was stolen...the police are completely baffled. Anyway, birds come and feed, then fly into his trees, or perch on the wires over his beloved vehicles;-) I have an ace up my sleeve, his fence is a foot onto our property and, come Winter--'bout Christmas time--I shall have my lawyer demand he move it. Mother says I make a bad enemy. In some cases, I'm inspired. Bootsie, White Stocking, and Miss Kitty, are tamed to the point they will come, when I whistle to announce I have a treat of canned food for them. Depending on their attitude at the moment, they will either remain aloof and stay a few feet away (who would have thought) or, in the alternative, come rub against my legs and--lately--actually seem to seek attention/petting. Haven't heard anybody purr yet. White Stocking can't seem to decide whether and how much he wants to be petted--or when, for that matter. Bootsie doesn't always show up when I whistle, but, when she does, she's quite social. Miss Kitty hangs with White Stocking and follows his lead. Sometimes she'll hang back with him, but, when she does come near, she seems to revel at the human touch. Today, White Stocking rolled over on his back and seemed to like having his stomach scratched. I did manage to get enough official attention that the *******s have apparently stopped poisioning the cars, but now they are trapping them. I've retrieved White Stocking and Bootsie from the local animal shelter. And, my supposition is that one trip through that experience is enough for them. My concern is, if he manages to trap one on the weekend, when the shelter is closed, he drives off with it and we never see it again. Meanwhile, our cats discovered the doggie door--we may have to rename that--in the kitchen, and come to visit every night. They are becoming more bold in their explorations of the house and Mother puts canned food out for them every night. They go through about 2 cans and, on one occasion, Miss Kitty brought all 3 of the kittens (her two and Bootsie's one) into the house. Mother, incidentally, is house bound and has her bed downstairs. Miss Kitty allowed the kittens to have the run of the downstairs for about an hour, while she sat in the kitchen doorway and Mother sat up in bed, watching the whole affair. From time to time, Mother and Miss Kitty would make eye contact. My supposition about it is that she brought the kittens in for show and tell, sort of like introducing them to the rest of the pride...but what do I know. They haven't been back for a return visit, en mass, but there have been kitten sightings inside from time to time. Most recent was about 9 AM today, when the black kitten (Bootsie's) tried to come in the door twice, but declined as Mother was in the kitchen at the time. That pretty well covers everything I can think of to bring you up to speed on our situation. Now for the problem. We've bought a new house to get away from the %#&*(@/%## next door (talk about dedication to cats). Anyway, Mother is now very concerned about how we will go about moving *our* cats away from this unhealthy environment to our new home--about 3 blocks away. Remember, they ain't exactly tame and they absolutely can't be house pets...not while I'm alive, anyway, if I wish to remain alive, that is. Mother thinks the thing to do is take them up to the new place and shut them in the garage, with food and water, in hopes they will acclimate to their new home. I don't think it will work as all they will see is the inside of the garage, and be off like a shot when we let them out. I think our best hope at pulling it off is to wait until Winter, then provide *warm* shelter, food and water, at the new place. In one sense, time is on our side since we will be hanging on to our old house until the Spring. So, should they scoot back to their old home, I can haul them back to the new place. PROVIDING I can catch them...over and over and over. Killing the sumbitch next door, while an attractive notion, is not a viable option (drat). So, anybody got any experience at this sort of thing (sure you do)? In the alternative, what's your best thinking/experience. Now, hasn't this been fun ;-) Cheers, Jack B *USA* PS-- I'll be planting Mulberry trees next to his drive this Fall. |
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