A cat forum. CatBanter

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Go Back   Home » CatBanter forum » Cat Newsgroups » Cat health & behaviour
Site Map Home Register Authors List Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Web Partners

Another diabetic cat!



 
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old October 15th 03, 12:09 AM
Jennifer Thompson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default Another diabetic cat!

Hi all,

After my noticing increased urination, my 15 year old male
DSH was just diagnosed with diabetes this morning (after
blood and urine tests).

He is still a healthy cat, so I guess he can't have had it
for long. His coat is shiny, he is not underweight, and he
is lively and playful. So, at least I caught it early.

I have an appointment this Friday to start him on PZI
insulin, and to get educated on the disease and how to give
injections, etc. I've learned a lot here, just from reading
the other threads on diabetes. I didn't realize so many
cats got this disease!

I've been reading the information on what is the best diet
and was wondering how good/bad the food I've been feeding
may be for his condition.

I might also mention that this cat also has two other
ailments. The first is an enlarged heart. It was diagnosed
as hypertrophic cardiomyopathy close to 10 years ago and he
was given 1-3 years to live, but the weird thing is that it
has never progressed since the time of diagnosis. All
ultrasounds have shown that his condition has remained
static. While he still has a murmur, he is no longer on
heart meds, as he is doing fine without them, and they were
aggravating his other ailment, which is inflammatory bowel
disease. This was diagnosed through biopsies of his liver,
intestines, and some other places, when he was suffering
chronic projectile diahhrea and constant vomiting starting
at about 2 years of age.

The point to all this is that the ONLY food that this cat
does well on is Science Diet Sensitive Stomach. Anything
else makes the diahhrea and vomiting start up again. I have
tried z/d, w/d (he did marginally okay on the w/d with just
occasional bouts the IBD), natural foods, you name it. At
this point, I'm afraid to change to anything else!

I cannot use steriod treatment to control the IBD because
steroids send him into congestive heart failure, because of
his enlarged heart. So, I'm in a catch 22.

He gets NOTHING to eat except free-fed dry Hill's Sensitive
Stomach. That's it.

Is this a bad diet for a diabetic cat? I'm afraid the vet
is going to tell me to switch, and I'm going to open up a
whole other can of worms. Once his IBD flares up, it takes
a really long time for him to recuperate and get back to
normal, which if he is put on another food, he may never do.

Thanks,
Jennifer and Sylvester (the four-legged train wreck)

  #2  
Old October 15th 03, 05:16 AM
Marek Williams
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Tue, 14 Oct 2003 23:09:45 GMT, Jennifer Thompson
dijo:

I cannot use steriod treatment to control the IBD because
steroids send him into congestive heart failure, because of
his enlarged heart. So, I'm in a catch 22.


Most steroids will send blood sugar levels sky high. Non-diabetics
just produce more insulin to keep their blood sugar level normal.
Diabetics have to compensate by using more insulin. So you have two
reasons not to use steroids.

As for the diet, my immediate reaction would be to leave it alone, and
adjust the insulin to match what the cat eats. The exception would be
if a change of diet could allow the cat to get along normally without
insulin. Then it might be worth it to change.

--
Bogus e-mail address, but I read this newsgroup regularly, so reply here.
  #3  
Old October 15th 03, 05:16 AM
Marek Williams
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Tue, 14 Oct 2003 23:09:45 GMT, Jennifer Thompson
dijo:

I cannot use steriod treatment to control the IBD because
steroids send him into congestive heart failure, because of
his enlarged heart. So, I'm in a catch 22.


Most steroids will send blood sugar levels sky high. Non-diabetics
just produce more insulin to keep their blood sugar level normal.
Diabetics have to compensate by using more insulin. So you have two
reasons not to use steroids.

As for the diet, my immediate reaction would be to leave it alone, and
adjust the insulin to match what the cat eats. The exception would be
if a change of diet could allow the cat to get along normally without
insulin. Then it might be worth it to change.

--
Bogus e-mail address, but I read this newsgroup regularly, so reply here.
  #4  
Old October 15th 03, 04:22 PM
Liz
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

He gets NOTHING to eat except free-fed dry Hill's Sensitive
Stomach. That's it.


Is there a canned version of that same food? Canned foods have much
less carbs than dry foods. You could give that a try and then match
insulin accordingly. Let your vet know everything you told us and see
if canned works for him.
  #5  
Old October 15th 03, 04:22 PM
Liz
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

He gets NOTHING to eat except free-fed dry Hill's Sensitive
Stomach. That's it.


Is there a canned version of that same food? Canned foods have much
less carbs than dry foods. You could give that a try and then match
insulin accordingly. Let your vet know everything you told us and see
if canned works for him.
  #6  
Old October 15th 03, 04:35 PM
Phil P.
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Jennifer Thompson" wrote in message
...
Hi all,

After my noticing increased urination, my 15 year old male
DSH was just diagnosed with diabetes this morning (after
blood and urine tests).

He is still a healthy cat, so I guess he can't have had it
for long. His coat is shiny, he is not underweight, and he
is lively and playful. So, at least I caught it early.

I have an appointment this Friday to start him on PZI
insulin, and to get educated on the disease and how to give
injections, etc. I've learned a lot here, just from reading
the other threads on diabetes. I didn't realize so many
cats got this disease!

I've been reading the information on what is the best diet
and was wondering how good/bad the food I've been feeding
may be for his condition.

I might also mention that this cat also has two other
ailments. The first is an enlarged heart. It was diagnosed
as hypertrophic cardiomyopathy close to 10 years ago and he
was given 1-3 years to live, but the weird thing is that it
has never progressed since the time of diagnosis. All
ultrasounds have shown that his condition has remained
static. While he still has a murmur, he is no longer on
heart meds, as he is doing fine without them, and they were
aggravating his other ailment, which is inflammatory bowel
disease. This was diagnosed through biopsies of his liver,
intestines, and some other places, when he was suffering
chronic projectile diahhrea and constant vomiting starting
at about 2 years of age.

The point to all this is that the ONLY food that this cat
does well on is Science Diet Sensitive Stomach. Anything
else makes the diahhrea and vomiting start up again. I have
tried z/d, w/d (he did marginally okay on the w/d with just
occasional bouts the IBD), natural foods, you name it. At
this point, I'm afraid to change to anything else!

I cannot use steriod treatment to control the IBD because
steroids send him into congestive heart failure, because of
his enlarged heart. So, I'm in a catch 22.

He gets NOTHING to eat except free-fed dry Hill's Sensitive
Stomach. That's it.

Is this a bad diet for a diabetic cat? I'm afraid the vet
is going to tell me to switch, and I'm going to open up a
whole other can of worms. Once his IBD flares up, it takes
a really long time for him to recuperate and get back to
normal, which if he is put on another food, he may never do.



Jennifer,

Considering your cat's concurrent illnesses and the fact you have them under
control with his present diet, I would be very reluctant to make any dietary
changes. I would speak to your vet about the feasibility of tailoring your
cat's insulin therapy to his present diet.

In my experience, the keys to successful diabetic management and regulation
are *consistency* and the least amount of stress as possible. It doesn't
matter how perfectly formulated a diabetic diet (or any other type of diet)
is if the cat won't eat it consistently and in consistent amounts and at
consistent times - since the insulin dose and intervals are established
based on diet and feeding schedule.

The most common causes of regulation failure are 1- failure to perform a
glucose curve to determine how the cat metabolizes insulin, 2- inconsistent
feeding (times and amounts), and 3- different or variation in feeding
protocol at home than during the glucose curve. The latter is the most
common because most cat's are reluctant to eat at the clinic.

After your vet instructs you how to monitor your cat's blood glucose, you
can plot a glucose curve at home - which involves checking blood glucose
every two hours for a day. Home glucose curves are much more accurate than
curves run at the clinic because the cat is not under stress - stress can
significantly affect the curve, and the cat eats normally.

I'll send some information regarding home monitoring and insulin handling
and administration later this evening when I get home.

Good luck.

Phil.





  #7  
Old October 15th 03, 04:35 PM
Phil P.
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Jennifer Thompson" wrote in message
...
Hi all,

After my noticing increased urination, my 15 year old male
DSH was just diagnosed with diabetes this morning (after
blood and urine tests).

He is still a healthy cat, so I guess he can't have had it
for long. His coat is shiny, he is not underweight, and he
is lively and playful. So, at least I caught it early.

I have an appointment this Friday to start him on PZI
insulin, and to get educated on the disease and how to give
injections, etc. I've learned a lot here, just from reading
the other threads on diabetes. I didn't realize so many
cats got this disease!

I've been reading the information on what is the best diet
and was wondering how good/bad the food I've been feeding
may be for his condition.

I might also mention that this cat also has two other
ailments. The first is an enlarged heart. It was diagnosed
as hypertrophic cardiomyopathy close to 10 years ago and he
was given 1-3 years to live, but the weird thing is that it
has never progressed since the time of diagnosis. All
ultrasounds have shown that his condition has remained
static. While he still has a murmur, he is no longer on
heart meds, as he is doing fine without them, and they were
aggravating his other ailment, which is inflammatory bowel
disease. This was diagnosed through biopsies of his liver,
intestines, and some other places, when he was suffering
chronic projectile diahhrea and constant vomiting starting
at about 2 years of age.

The point to all this is that the ONLY food that this cat
does well on is Science Diet Sensitive Stomach. Anything
else makes the diahhrea and vomiting start up again. I have
tried z/d, w/d (he did marginally okay on the w/d with just
occasional bouts the IBD), natural foods, you name it. At
this point, I'm afraid to change to anything else!

I cannot use steriod treatment to control the IBD because
steroids send him into congestive heart failure, because of
his enlarged heart. So, I'm in a catch 22.

He gets NOTHING to eat except free-fed dry Hill's Sensitive
Stomach. That's it.

Is this a bad diet for a diabetic cat? I'm afraid the vet
is going to tell me to switch, and I'm going to open up a
whole other can of worms. Once his IBD flares up, it takes
a really long time for him to recuperate and get back to
normal, which if he is put on another food, he may never do.



Jennifer,

Considering your cat's concurrent illnesses and the fact you have them under
control with his present diet, I would be very reluctant to make any dietary
changes. I would speak to your vet about the feasibility of tailoring your
cat's insulin therapy to his present diet.

In my experience, the keys to successful diabetic management and regulation
are *consistency* and the least amount of stress as possible. It doesn't
matter how perfectly formulated a diabetic diet (or any other type of diet)
is if the cat won't eat it consistently and in consistent amounts and at
consistent times - since the insulin dose and intervals are established
based on diet and feeding schedule.

The most common causes of regulation failure are 1- failure to perform a
glucose curve to determine how the cat metabolizes insulin, 2- inconsistent
feeding (times and amounts), and 3- different or variation in feeding
protocol at home than during the glucose curve. The latter is the most
common because most cat's are reluctant to eat at the clinic.

After your vet instructs you how to monitor your cat's blood glucose, you
can plot a glucose curve at home - which involves checking blood glucose
every two hours for a day. Home glucose curves are much more accurate than
curves run at the clinic because the cat is not under stress - stress can
significantly affect the curve, and the cat eats normally.

I'll send some information regarding home monitoring and insulin handling
and administration later this evening when I get home.

Good luck.

Phil.





  #8  
Old October 15th 03, 05:09 PM
Jennifer Thompson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Thank you everybody, for your replies. I will check into the canned version of
the Sensitive Stomach food.

I am gathering that free-feeding is not a good way to go, since it appears that
I need to know exactly when he is eating and how much. Is that correct?

I think right now, he mainly just nibbles a bit here and there, throughout the
day and night (his feeder is in my computer room, so I know his eating pattern).

I re-read my original post, and laughed out loud when I started off saying he is
still a healthy cat, and then went on to say he now has diabetes, an enlarged
heart, and IBD. LOL The amazing thing is, he really does look and act like
a healthy cat! He is robust and sleek, bright-eyed, and very lively. Go
figure.

Thanks again everyone!

Jennifer

"Phil P." wrote:

"Jennifer Thompson" wrote in message
...
Hi all,

After my noticing increased urination, my 15 year old male
DSH was just diagnosed with diabetes this morning (after
blood and urine tests).

He is still a healthy cat, so I guess he can't have had it
for long. His coat is shiny, he is not underweight, and he
is lively and playful. So, at least I caught it early.

I have an appointment this Friday to start him on PZI
insulin, and to get educated on the disease and how to give
injections, etc. I've learned a lot here, just from reading
the other threads on diabetes. I didn't realize so many
cats got this disease!

I've been reading the information on what is the best diet
and was wondering how good/bad the food I've been feeding
may be for his condition.

I might also mention that this cat also has two other
ailments. The first is an enlarged heart. It was diagnosed
as hypertrophic cardiomyopathy close to 10 years ago and he
was given 1-3 years to live, but the weird thing is that it
has never progressed since the time of diagnosis. All
ultrasounds have shown that his condition has remained
static. While he still has a murmur, he is no longer on
heart meds, as he is doing fine without them, and they were
aggravating his other ailment, which is inflammatory bowel
disease. This was diagnosed through biopsies of his liver,
intestines, and some other places, when he was suffering
chronic projectile diahhrea and constant vomiting starting
at about 2 years of age.

The point to all this is that the ONLY food that this cat
does well on is Science Diet Sensitive Stomach. Anything
else makes the diahhrea and vomiting start up again. I have
tried z/d, w/d (he did marginally okay on the w/d with just
occasional bouts the IBD), natural foods, you name it. At
this point, I'm afraid to change to anything else!

I cannot use steriod treatment to control the IBD because
steroids send him into congestive heart failure, because of
his enlarged heart. So, I'm in a catch 22.

He gets NOTHING to eat except free-fed dry Hill's Sensitive
Stomach. That's it.

Is this a bad diet for a diabetic cat? I'm afraid the vet
is going to tell me to switch, and I'm going to open up a
whole other can of worms. Once his IBD flares up, it takes
a really long time for him to recuperate and get back to
normal, which if he is put on another food, he may never do.


Jennifer,

Considering your cat's concurrent illnesses and the fact you have them under
control with his present diet, I would be very reluctant to make any dietary
changes. I would speak to your vet about the feasibility of tailoring your
cat's insulin therapy to his present diet.

In my experience, the keys to successful diabetic management and regulation
are *consistency* and the least amount of stress as possible. It doesn't
matter how perfectly formulated a diabetic diet (or any other type of diet)
is if the cat won't eat it consistently and in consistent amounts and at
consistent times - since the insulin dose and intervals are established
based on diet and feeding schedule.

The most common causes of regulation failure are 1- failure to perform a
glucose curve to determine how the cat metabolizes insulin, 2- inconsistent
feeding (times and amounts), and 3- different or variation in feeding
protocol at home than during the glucose curve. The latter is the most
common because most cat's are reluctant to eat at the clinic.

After your vet instructs you how to monitor your cat's blood glucose, you
can plot a glucose curve at home - which involves checking blood glucose
every two hours for a day. Home glucose curves are much more accurate than
curves run at the clinic because the cat is not under stress - stress can
significantly affect the curve, and the cat eats normally.

I'll send some information regarding home monitoring and insulin handling
and administration later this evening when I get home.

Good luck.

Phil.


  #9  
Old October 15th 03, 05:09 PM
Jennifer Thompson
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Thank you everybody, for your replies. I will check into the canned version of
the Sensitive Stomach food.

I am gathering that free-feeding is not a good way to go, since it appears that
I need to know exactly when he is eating and how much. Is that correct?

I think right now, he mainly just nibbles a bit here and there, throughout the
day and night (his feeder is in my computer room, so I know his eating pattern).

I re-read my original post, and laughed out loud when I started off saying he is
still a healthy cat, and then went on to say he now has diabetes, an enlarged
heart, and IBD. LOL The amazing thing is, he really does look and act like
a healthy cat! He is robust and sleek, bright-eyed, and very lively. Go
figure.

Thanks again everyone!

Jennifer

"Phil P." wrote:

"Jennifer Thompson" wrote in message
...
Hi all,

After my noticing increased urination, my 15 year old male
DSH was just diagnosed with diabetes this morning (after
blood and urine tests).

He is still a healthy cat, so I guess he can't have had it
for long. His coat is shiny, he is not underweight, and he
is lively and playful. So, at least I caught it early.

I have an appointment this Friday to start him on PZI
insulin, and to get educated on the disease and how to give
injections, etc. I've learned a lot here, just from reading
the other threads on diabetes. I didn't realize so many
cats got this disease!

I've been reading the information on what is the best diet
and was wondering how good/bad the food I've been feeding
may be for his condition.

I might also mention that this cat also has two other
ailments. The first is an enlarged heart. It was diagnosed
as hypertrophic cardiomyopathy close to 10 years ago and he
was given 1-3 years to live, but the weird thing is that it
has never progressed since the time of diagnosis. All
ultrasounds have shown that his condition has remained
static. While he still has a murmur, he is no longer on
heart meds, as he is doing fine without them, and they were
aggravating his other ailment, which is inflammatory bowel
disease. This was diagnosed through biopsies of his liver,
intestines, and some other places, when he was suffering
chronic projectile diahhrea and constant vomiting starting
at about 2 years of age.

The point to all this is that the ONLY food that this cat
does well on is Science Diet Sensitive Stomach. Anything
else makes the diahhrea and vomiting start up again. I have
tried z/d, w/d (he did marginally okay on the w/d with just
occasional bouts the IBD), natural foods, you name it. At
this point, I'm afraid to change to anything else!

I cannot use steriod treatment to control the IBD because
steroids send him into congestive heart failure, because of
his enlarged heart. So, I'm in a catch 22.

He gets NOTHING to eat except free-fed dry Hill's Sensitive
Stomach. That's it.

Is this a bad diet for a diabetic cat? I'm afraid the vet
is going to tell me to switch, and I'm going to open up a
whole other can of worms. Once his IBD flares up, it takes
a really long time for him to recuperate and get back to
normal, which if he is put on another food, he may never do.


Jennifer,

Considering your cat's concurrent illnesses and the fact you have them under
control with his present diet, I would be very reluctant to make any dietary
changes. I would speak to your vet about the feasibility of tailoring your
cat's insulin therapy to his present diet.

In my experience, the keys to successful diabetic management and regulation
are *consistency* and the least amount of stress as possible. It doesn't
matter how perfectly formulated a diabetic diet (or any other type of diet)
is if the cat won't eat it consistently and in consistent amounts and at
consistent times - since the insulin dose and intervals are established
based on diet and feeding schedule.

The most common causes of regulation failure are 1- failure to perform a
glucose curve to determine how the cat metabolizes insulin, 2- inconsistent
feeding (times and amounts), and 3- different or variation in feeding
protocol at home than during the glucose curve. The latter is the most
common because most cat's are reluctant to eat at the clinic.

After your vet instructs you how to monitor your cat's blood glucose, you
can plot a glucose curve at home - which involves checking blood glucose
every two hours for a day. Home glucose curves are much more accurate than
curves run at the clinic because the cat is not under stress - stress can
significantly affect the curve, and the cat eats normally.

I'll send some information regarding home monitoring and insulin handling
and administration later this evening when I get home.

Good luck.

Phil.


  #10  
Old October 17th 03, 05:40 AM
Phil P.
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Jennifer Thompson" wrote in message
...
Thank you everybody, for your replies. I will check into the canned

version of
the Sensitive Stomach food.


I don't think Hill's makes a canned version of Sensitive Stomach (yet).


I am gathering that free-feeding is not a good way to go, since it appears

that
I need to know exactly when he is eating and how much. Is that correct?

I think right now, he mainly just nibbles a bit here and there, throughout

the
day and night (his feeder is in my computer room, so I know his eating

pattern).

There are two camps in this issue - both have their points -- but a lot
depends on the cat.

On the one hand, feeding several small meals or nibbling throughout the day
helps minimize the hyperglycemic effect of each meal - which helps to
control fluctuations (spikes) in blood glucose. If the cat's a nibbler like
yours, the total amount of food put out per 24 hours shouldn't exceed his
calculated daily caloric requirement. However, food should be available
*only* while the insulin is active. (The glucose curve will determine the
duration of insulin activity as well as the onset and peak of action.)

I'm not crazy about this method because you can never tell if the cat will
eat and eat enough throughout the day every time. If the cat doesn't eat or
eat enough, a normal insulin dose can become an overdose.

OTOH, I prefer twice-a-day scheduled dosing and feedings, and administer
insulin immediately *after* the cat has eaten.. I check blood glucose
before feeding and dosing. Many (probably most) people administer insulin
before the cat eats. hoping the insulin will be in the circulation by the
time the cat finishes eating... unlikely... However, I like to be sure the
cat eats and eats enough before dosing her with insulin. If the cat is
dosed before eating, and then decides not to eat or doesn't eat enough, she
can develop insulin-induced hypoglycemia which can trigger rebound
hyperglycemia - a/k/a the infamous "Somogyi Overswing" unless emergency
steps are taken.

The advantage of this method is realized if the cat gets finicky or doesn't
eat or doesn't eat enough. The insulin dose can be either reduced or
skipped. Of course this situation should be discussed thoroughly and well
planned with your vet *beforehand*. Never make changes in insulin doses or
intervals without consulting your vet *first*. After awhile, your vet may
give you a dose chart to follow for different situations and blood glucose
readings.

Many cats do well with either method. However, some nibblers are difficult
to convert to b.i.d. feeding - so as I said before, a lot depends on the
cat. The best method is the method that works the best for your cat under
your circumstances and keeps him well regulated.

Best of luck,

Phil.


 




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Diabetic Cat Stephen Ward Cat health & behaviour 34 October 14th 03 12:44 AM
10 yr old diabetic cat goes into sniffing fit William Kaukler Cat health & behaviour 4 September 5th 03 01:01 PM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 10:04 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004-2024 CatBanter.
The comments are property of their posters.