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#21
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grasshopper wrote:
That's absolutely incorrect. In this case, no it's not. I'm tallking about a behavior created by circumstance, which is exactly what is going on with your cat. Change the circumstances and you can modify the behavior. You have not read my entire post because if you did you would have realized that I stated "I have a responsibility to this animal and I can't just thow it away," that's not what I want to teach my daughter. Your statement is biased and not based on facts. We are doing the best we can with the situation at hand. I did read your entire post and you are indeed throwing her away and by no means doing what's best for her, as you state clearly below. I will NOT sacrifice my family's welfare for this animal. This is an animal, not a human. Willow is dangerous. Because of circumstances you created and have the power to change. We have to let Willow outside or she will attack Lilly or one of us. Letting a Willow outside 75% of the time is ok...yet as I said she will get into fights. She starts them too. Recently I've seen cats I have never seen before...there coming from all over..it's the Ultimate fighting championship in my back yard. The only way to stop this is to remove her form the house. That's not true. You can cat proof your yard or keep Willow inside and allow her out on supervised outings. Don't blame Willow for your laziness and unwillingness to do anything for her that requires effort. We do not meet her with dislike..she doesn't want anything to do with us..you can't give a cat attention if it doesn't want it. Willow has made her bed, and this is what she prefers. She can be nice, but she chooses not to be. No, she's so stressed out from the trauma she constantly endures that it doesn't leave room for anything else. And don't think she doesn't pick up on your true feelings about her. You've already discussed killing her and plan to abandon her. You've written her off and she can sense it. 1) WE are looking out for Willow's best interest, your just so caught up in your own BS you CAN'T SEE IT. Willow is not happy..we have tried medicine, You're not using the right one. Elavil is a poor choice for treating aggression and the drugs I mentioned in my previous post work better. As to your claim she can't be on much because of some liver/kidney issue, don't assume we're stupid here. Elavil is also contraindicated, but it didn't stop you from using it. If you are telling the truth (and I don't believe you are) and you're using meds anyway, for god's sake try using one that will actually help. letting her do what ever she wants...but she has not turned around. She has not turned around because of your failure to change the circumstances so she isn't in a position to suffer so much stress and chaos in her life. I gave you steps to a soution. If you choose to ignore them it just proves my assertion that you would rather be lazy and cause your daughter and Willow to suffer. The best solution is to remove her form the situation so she can be happy. you also forget Willow is a danger and I can not have a dangerous animal in our house. I not throwing her away or showing my daughter this... I don't believe that she's so "dangerous." If she was your daughter wouldn't be in the emotional state she is in and begging you to keep Willow. You're lying and it comes across loud and clear. what I'm teaching my daughter and showing her is that my daughter means much more then this animal and my families welfare is important..even if it takes removing a loved animal. No you're not. I wonder how your daughter would feel if she saw how you're ignoring valuable and experienced advice that could modify Willow's behavior and help her to stay in the home? She'd know exactly where you stand and see the ugly truth that this IS a matter of convenience for you and you don't give a damn about breaking your daughter's heart. You forget we have another cat that is suffering because of willow. Not at all, and changing the circumstances that are causing Willow to behave the way she is will improve her behavior and be good for the other cat. How is spending hundreds of dollars on medicines, blood tests, vet appointments neglecting her. Because you're ignoring basic principles of cat behavior, and behavior is the issue here. Because you have the solution staring you in the face and you refuse to acknowledge it because it would take effort. I will not let this animal rule our life and turn our house upside down so she won't see another cat outside. So, it IS about convenience. Your exaggeration is noted. Theres a point that we draw the line, and we have drawn it. You also forget this animal is a danger and all it takes is willow biting a child and we are sued for everything we have. As you should be if you left a child unsupervised with a dangerous cat. Yet your daughter loves her and can handle her. You're lying. You stated I started and created this problem and again your insane and an idiot!!! Not at all. I'm correct and anyone with knowledge of cat behavior and intercat dynamics would agree with me. ....I'm going to do what's best for my family and if moving into a nice neighborhood which offers my child a wonderful neighborhood to play in that safe, as well as provide my wife with a home she's happy with....and if my cat doesn't like who give a F**K. It's an animal and my life isn't ruled by this animal. So the truth comes out. Willow is disposable. I was right all along and you are victimizing Willow and your daughter for no other reason than that you are selfish and lazy. I certainly hope that the ethics you practice in medicine are nothing like those you practice at home. If they are you can kiss your daughter's college education (and any hope of continuing to be a doctor) goodbye. Megan "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." -Edmund Burke Learn The TRUTH About Declawing http://www.stopdeclaw.com Zuzu's Cats Photo Album: http://www.PictureTrail.com/zuzu22 "Concerning all acts of initiative (and creation), there is one elementary truth the ignorance of which kills countless ideas and splendid plans: that the moment one definitely commits oneself, then providence moves too. A whole stream of events issues from the decision, raising in one's favor all manner of unforeseen incidents, meetings and material assistance, which no man could have dreamt would have come his way." - W.H. Murray |
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wrote: I don't believe that she's so "dangerous." If she was your daughter wouldn't be in the emotional state she is in and begging you to keep Willow. You're lying and it comes across loud and clear. what I'm teaching my daughter and showing her is that my daughter means much more then this animal and my families welfare is important..even if it takes removing a loved animal. No you're not. I wonder how your daughter would feel if she saw how you're ignoring valuable and experienced advice that could modify Willow's behavior and help her to stay in the home? She'd know exactly where you stand and see the ugly truth that this IS a matter of convenience for you and you don't give a damn about breaking your daughter's heart. You forget we have another cat that is suffering because of willow. Not at all, and changing the circumstances that are causing Willow to behave the way she is will improve her behavior and be good for the other cat. How is spending hundreds of dollars on medicines, blood tests, vet appointments neglecting her. Because you're ignoring basic principles of cat behavior, and behavior is the issue here. Because you have the solution staring you in the face and you refuse to acknowledge it because it would take effort. I will not let this animal rule our life and turn our house upside down so she won't see another cat outside. So, it IS about convenience. Your exaggeration is noted. Theres a point that we draw the line, and we have drawn it. You also forget this animal is a danger and all it takes is willow biting a child and we are sued for everything we have. As you should be if you left a child unsupervised with a dangerous cat. Yet your daughter loves her and can handle her. You're lying. You stated I started and created this problem and again your insane and an idiot!!! Not at all. I'm correct and anyone with knowledge of cat behavior and intercat dynamics would agree with me. ....I'm going to do what's best for my family and if moving into a nice neighborhood which offers my child a wonderful neighborhood to play in that safe, as well as provide my wife with a home she's happy with....and if my cat doesn't like who give a F**K. It's an animal and my life isn't ruled by this animal. So the truth comes out. Willow is disposable. I was right all along and you are victimizing Willow and your daughter for no other reason than that you are selfish and lazy. I certainly hope that the ethics you practice in medicine are nothing like those you practice at home. If they are you can kiss your daughter's college education (and any hope of continuing to be a doctor) goodbye. Megan Is this supposed to be persuasion? The OP originally planned to put the cat down. A no-kill shelter is a better option. Or, perhaps someone with some actual persuasive skills might try to talk to her. But you are not doing a bit of good with your rabid dog routine. Of course you know that. |
#23
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Megan,
Well how about this..if you feel so strongly and so knowledgeable in animal behavior..you can adopt her. I would be happy to pay for the shipping...and any other costs associated in getting her to you safely. Also..some behavior is not reversible as you stated...a change of circumstances or routine will not make everything ok. I don't know exactly what caused this unfortunate incident but I am almost sure this incident was not only caused by a chemical imbalance of some sort, but also the change of homes and other animals in the neighborhood. These two issues together have created an uncontrollable cat. You stated we are utilizing the wrong drug, and in my post I stated Willows Kidney function would not allow a medicine such as Prozac or other chemicals. To put her on a drug like this would cause her kidneys to quite and possibly her liver. So putting her on a drug like this would kill her. So now what....you can't medicate the animal to control it's behavior, it's behavior is not only disturbing our family but our other cat as well..which I have an update below...and all you can do is remove this animal from the residence and hope for a better life for her and us. AS far as lilly...since we have not allow Willow in the house the past few days (3 to be exact) and lilly has not come into contact with Willow she has stopped licking and has returned to her normal self. She's a sweet as pie. I didn't think it would happen this quick and have her come around like this. This it's a great example how willow's mean spirit has hurt us all, and how removing her from the house has created a better environment for our other animal. She is the problem not us as you state Just look at the statistics...4 to 1. Last edited by grasshopper : September 23rd 05 at 06:56 PM. |
#24
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"grasshopper" wrote in message ... Megan, Well how about this..if you feel so strongly and so knowledgeable in animal behavior..you can adopt her. I would be happy to pay for the shipping...and any other costs associated in getting her to you safely. Also..some behavior is not reversible as you stated...a change of circumstances or routine will not make everything ok. I don't know exactly what caused this unfortunate incident but I am almost sure this incident was not only caused by a chemical imbalance of some sort, but also the change of homes and other animals in the neighborhood. These two issues together have created an uncontrollable cat. You stated we are utilizing the wrong drug, and in my post I stated Willows Kidney function would not allow a medicine such as Prozac or other chemicals. To put her on a drug like this would cause her kidneys to quite and possibly her liver. So putting her on a drug like this would kill her. So now what....you can't medicate the animal to control it's behavior, it's behavior is not only disturbing our family but our other cat as well..which I have an update below...and all you can do is remove this animal from the residence and hope for a better life for her and us. AS far as lilly...since we have not allow Willow in the house the past few days (3 to be exact) and lilly has not come into contact with Willow she has stopped licking and has returned to her normal self. She's a sweet as pie. I didn't think it would happen this quick and have her come around like this. This it's a great example how willow's mean spirit has hurt us all, and how removing her from the house has created a better environment for our other animal. She is the problem not us as you state Just look at the statistics...4 to 1. And here we have it--exactly what I new from your first post. You do not care about this cat, and neither Megan's browbeating nor anything else can MAKE you care about Willow. That's just the way it is--it is the same with people, we care enough to help some but not others. Just please don't have her euthanized, take her to a no-kill shelter with a full explanation of'what has been done to her to make her aggressive. Perhaps someone there will care enough to try to undo the damage you have done to her--albeit without meaning to. She deserves a chance to live. The circumstances of her birth and upbringing were not her fault, after all. |
#25
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grasshopper wrote:
Megan, Well how about this..if you feel so strongly and so knowledgeable in animal behavior..you can adopt her. I would be happy to pay for the shipping...and any other costs associated in getting her to you safely. Here you are again expecting someone else to fix the mess you made. It's so much easier for you than taking responsibility... Also..some behavior is not reversible as you stated...a change of circumstances or routine will not make everything ok. I don't know exactly what caused this unfortunate incident You know exactly what caused it and it was spelled out to you in a previous post. Backpedaling at this point doesn't buy you any credibility. but I am almost sure this incident was not only caused by a chemical imbalance of some sort, but also the change of homes and other animals in the neighborhood. These two issues together have created an uncontrollable cat. And I gave you the means to correct the problem. You stated we are utilizing the wrong drug, and in my post I stated Willows Kidney function would not allow a medicine such as Prozac or other chemicals. To put her on a drug like this would cause her kidneys to quite and possibly her liver. So putting her on a drug like this would kill her. B.S. You're lying and it's oh-so-convenient for you to claim supposed liver/kidney issue after the fact. It sure didn't stop you from putting her on a medication that is also contraindicated, so stop making a fool of yourself with your lame lies. So now what....you can't medicate the animal to control it's behavior, it's behavior is not only disturbing our family but our other cat as well..which I have an update below...and all you can do is remove this animal from the residence and hope for a better life for her and us. Again, I gave you the means to correct the problem, much of which does not involve medications and only involves simple steps to eliminate the outside influences that created Willow's behavior in the first place. AS far as lilly...since we have not allow Willow in the house the past few days (3 to be exact) and lilly has not come into contact with Willow she has stopped licking and has returned to her normal self. She's a sweet as pie. I didn't think it would happen this quick and have her come around like this. Isn't it funny how a change of circumstances or routine made everything ok? And quickly too. How about that, especially when you said it couldn't be done a few paragraphs ago. The same could be done for Willow if you weren't so lazy and heartless. This it's a great example how willow's mean spirit has hurt us all, and how removing her from the house has created a better environment for our other animal. She is the problem not us as you state You're wrong. YOU are the problem and YOU have forced Willow to become the way she is because of your ignorance and insistence on forcing her to be in a stressful and harmful environment, one that could be modified to eliminate the stress and harm if you had a heart. I bet if your daughter was made aware of what was needed she would try anything and try to do it all herself if she had to, even at 9 years old. She obviously cares deeply about Willow and seems to be the only one in your household with a heart. Hopefully she'll be immune to your unconscionably irresponsible and cold hearted influences and grow up to be a decent human being in spite of you. Just look at the statistics...4 to 1. Gang mentality is not a statistic. Megan "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." -Edmund Burke Learn The TRUTH About Declawing http://www.stopdeclaw.com Zuzu's Cats Photo Album: http://www.PictureTrail.com/zuzu22 "Concerning all acts of initiative (and creation), there is one elementary truth the ignorance of which kills countless ideas and splendid plans: that the moment one definitely commits oneself, then providence moves too. A whole stream of events issues from the decision, raising in one's favor all manner of unforeseen incidents, meetings and material assistance, which no man could have dreamt would have come his way." - W.H. Murray |
#26
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grasshopper wrote: Megan, Well how about this..if you feel so strongly and so knowledgeable in animal behavior..you can adopt her. I would be happy to pay for the shipping...and any other costs associated in getting her to you safely. Also..some behavior is not reversible as you stated...a change of circumstances or routine will not make everything ok. Sometimes it does. I don't know exactly what caused this unfortunate incident Megan spelled it out. YOU created it. YOU just don't want to accept the responsibility. but I am almost sure this incident was not only caused by a chemical imbalance of some sort, but also the change of homes and other animals in the neighborhood. These two issues together have created an uncontrollable cat. You stated we are utilizing the wrong drug, and in my post I stated Willows Kidney function would not allow a medicine such as Prozac or other chemicals. To put her on a drug like this would cause her kidneys to quite and possibly her liver. So putting her on a drug like this would kill her. Prozac isn't know to be excessively hard on organ function - certainly not any more so than Elavil. So now what....you can't medicate the animal to control it's behavior, it's behavior is not only disturbing our family but our other cat as well..which I have an update below...and all you can do is remove this animal from the residence and hope for a better life for her and us. AS far as lilly...since we have not allow Willow in the house the past few days (3 to be exact) and lilly has not come into contact with Willow she has stopped licking and has returned to her normal self. She's a sweet as pie. I didn't think it would happen this quick and have her come around like this. This it's a great example how willow's mean spirit has hurt us all, A cat is incapable of having a "mean spirit". They function on instinct. You have created her behavior. and how removing her from the house has created a better environment for our other animal. She is the problem not us as you state Just look at the statistics...4 to 1. Do the cat a favor and take it to a shelter where it has a chance at a better life. And please do not get any more animals until you understand animal behavior a little better. Your ignorance and inappropriate actions toward and with the cat have created this situation. [Sheesh. It's people like this that make me want to quit rescue, quit working in the field. Mess up an animal's life and then blame the animal. I've seen it far too many times, and it disgusts me every, single time...] -L. |
#27
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"-L." wrote in message oups.com... grasshopper wrote: Megan, Well how about this..if you feel so strongly and so knowledgeable in animal behavior..you can adopt her. I would be happy to pay for the shipping...and any other costs associated in getting her to you safely. Also..some behavior is not reversible as you stated...a change of circumstances or routine will not make everything ok. Sometimes it does. I don't know exactly what caused this unfortunate incident Megan spelled it out. YOU created it. YOU just don't want to accept the responsibility. but I am almost sure this incident was not only caused by a chemical imbalance of some sort, but also the change of homes and other animals in the neighborhood. These two issues together have created an uncontrollable cat. You stated we are utilizing the wrong drug, and in my post I stated Willows Kidney function would not allow a medicine such as Prozac or other chemicals. To put her on a drug like this would cause her kidneys to quite and possibly her liver. So putting her on a drug like this would kill her. Prozac isn't know to be excessively hard on organ function - certainly not any more so than Elavil. So now what....you can't medicate the animal to control it's behavior, it's behavior is not only disturbing our family but our other cat as well..which I have an update below...and all you can do is remove this animal from the residence and hope for a better life for her and us. AS far as lilly...since we have not allow Willow in the house the past few days (3 to be exact) and lilly has not come into contact with Willow she has stopped licking and has returned to her normal self. She's a sweet as pie. I didn't think it would happen this quick and have her come around like this. This it's a great example how willow's mean spirit has hurt us all, A cat is incapable of having a "mean spirit". They function on instinct. You have created her behavior. and how removing her from the house has created a better environment for our other animal. She is the problem not us as you state Just look at the statistics...4 to 1. Do the cat a favor and take it to a shelter where it has a chance at a better life. And please do not get any more animals until you understand animal behavior a little better. Your ignorance and inappropriate actions toward and with the cat have created this situation. [Sheesh. It's people like this that make me want to quit rescue, quit working in the field. Mess up an animal's life and then blame the animal. I've seen it far too many times, and it disgusts me every, single time...] -L. Nicely put, Lyn. |
#28
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In June when you posted about the problem with Willow, you mentioned the
biting the vet's face incident. The next time you took her to the vet, you said she was purring and was the perfect cat with him. Did Willow go back since then and try to bite his face again? It sounded to me like things were better at the vet's. I think you should try Megan's suggestions, the different drugs that she mentioned to you in June, and now. The behavioral things you can try. It does not sound like this cat is a threat to your daughter. I know you've tried several things already, but try the things Megan mentioned. Show your daughter by your actions that every life is precious. Keeping the cat outside is only avoiding the issue and making her more miserable, and probably more aggressive. Good luck, Rhonda grasshopper wrote: Last time we had the vet look willow over he had to handle her and she disliked this. She tried to bite his face, and he had to restrain her with 2 hands around her neck. |
#29
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cybercat wrote: Nicely put, Lyn. Thank you, Nancy. -L. |
#30
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I wrote:
Fluoxetine -.5 mg per pound, Clomipramine- 5 mg per pound There was a typo wrt the clomipramine dose and it should read: Fluoxetine -.5 mg per pound, Clomipramine- ***.5***mg per pound. Megan "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." -Edmund Burke Learn The TRUTH About Declawing http://www.stopdeclaw.com Zuzu's Cats Photo Album: http://www.PictureTrail.com/zuzu22 "Concerning all acts of initiative (and creation), there is one elementary truth the ignorance of which kills countless ideas and splendid plans: that the moment one definitely commits oneself, then providence moves too. A whole stream of events issues from the decision, raising in one's favor all manner of unforeseen incidents, meetings and material assistance, which no man could have dreamt would have come his way." - W.H. Murray |
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