Liz's Food recommendations

From: Alison Perera lid

In
a growth/ALS feed trial, the product must be the only source of food for
8 or more kittens for a span of 10 weeks. If they make it through
without nutritionally induced disease and without signs of deficiency in
certain blood chemistry parameters, and if they gain weight at a certain
dictated rate, the food passes.

Wouldn't it take longer than 10 weeks for some nutritionally induced diseases
to show up?
________
See my cats: http://community.webshots.com/album/56955940rWhxAe
Raw Diet Info: http://www.holisticat.com/drjletter.html
http://www.geocities.com/rawfeeders/ForCatsOnly.html
Declawing Info: http://www.wholecat.com/articles/claws.htm

In article ,
olitter (PawsForThought) wrote:

From: Alison Perera lid

In
a growth/ALS feed trial, the product must be the only source of food for
8 or more kittens for a span of 10 weeks. If they make it through
without nutritionally induced disease and without signs of deficiency in
certain blood chemistry parameters, and if they gain weight at a certain
dictated rate, the food passes.

Wouldn't it take longer than 10 weeks for some nutritionally induced diseases
to show up?

Well, they test adults for 26 weeks. Maybe they think that kittens,
since they are growing fast and really need certain nutrients, will show
problems faster than adults.

Of course, all they check at the end is packed cell volume/hematocrit,
hemoglobin, serum albumin, and whole blood taurine. Badda-boom.
Acceptable values for those parameters, plus acceptable weight gain, and
you're in.

The pregnancy/lactation test ends when the kittens are 4 weeks. Does
that mean that kittens only need kitten food from 4 to 14 weeks?
Inquiring minds want to know...

-Alison in OH

In article ,
olitter (PawsForThought) wrote:

From: Alison Perera lid

In
a growth/ALS feed trial, the product must be the only source of food for
8 or more kittens for a span of 10 weeks. If they make it through
without nutritionally induced disease and without signs of deficiency in
certain blood chemistry parameters, and if they gain weight at a certain
dictated rate, the food passes.

Wouldn't it take longer than 10 weeks for some nutritionally induced diseases
to show up?

Well, they test adults for 26 weeks. Maybe they think that kittens,
since they are growing fast and really need certain nutrients, will show
problems faster than adults.

Of course, all they check at the end is packed cell volume/hematocrit,
hemoglobin, serum albumin, and whole blood taurine. Badda-boom.
Acceptable values for those parameters, plus acceptable weight gain, and
you're in.

The pregnancy/lactation test ends when the kittens are 4 weeks. Does
that mean that kittens only need kitten food from 4 to 14 weeks?
Inquiring minds want to know...

-Alison in OH

No, they're being formulated for two different purposes. Go back and
re-read what I'm saying.

Jon C wrote:

The point is that's not true. Steve is saying that ALS foods are
re-labelled kitten foods.

If Science Diet called their kitten foods All Life Stages, which they
certainly can, would it make you feel better?

"Karen M." wrote in message
...

Once again, comparing "all stages" to "kitten" food. While an ALS food
will be formulated to *meet* growth needs *and* accomodate maintenance,
a specifically *kitten* food will be formulated specifically for
*kittens*, and therefore contain higher protein. Once again, they are
*not* the same. So keep waiting for that apology. I stand by what I
stated previously.

Steve Crane wrote:


(Karen M.) wrote in message

. com...

(Steve Crane) wrote in message

. com...


No, it is *not*. Go back and read the information in your *own* post,
and re-read my reply. You obviously aren't reading it correctly. And
regardless of this entire argument,



Karen, here are the original numbers posted.
As you can see the Science Diet products are indeed lower in carbs.
I'll accept you apology anytime for not reading the numbers correctly.
Clearly the Felidae and Wellness products are HIGHER carbs than
equivalent Science Diet products and thus contain more of that dreaded
evil grain.

Felidae Dry: protein 32.0%, fat 20.0%, fiber 2.5%,
moisture 9.0%, ash 5.5% Total 69% 100-69 = 31% carbohydrates

Wellness Dry: Protein 33.0%, fat 19.0%, fiber 5.0%, Moisture 10.0%,
Ash 6.0% Total 73% 100-73 = 27% carbohydrates

Science Diet Feline Kitten Protein 33%, fat 23%, fiber 3%, moisture
10%, ash 7% Total = 76% thus this food is 24% carbs.

Science Diet Nature's Best Feline Kitten Protein 35%, fat 22%, fiber
2%, moisture 10%, ash 6% Total = 75% thus this food is 25% carbs.

No, they're being formulated for two different purposes. Go back and
re-read what I'm saying.

Jon C wrote:

The point is that's not true. Steve is saying that ALS foods are
re-labelled kitten foods.

If Science Diet called their kitten foods All Life Stages, which they
certainly can, would it make you feel better?

"Karen M." wrote in message
...

Once again, comparing "all stages" to "kitten" food. While an ALS food
will be formulated to *meet* growth needs *and* accomodate maintenance,
a specifically *kitten* food will be formulated specifically for
*kittens*, and therefore contain higher protein. Once again, they are
*not* the same. So keep waiting for that apology. I stand by what I
stated previously.

Steve Crane wrote:


(Karen M.) wrote in message

. com...

(Steve Crane) wrote in message

. com...


No, it is *not*. Go back and read the information in your *own* post,
and re-read my reply. You obviously aren't reading it correctly. And
regardless of this entire argument,



Karen, here are the original numbers posted.
As you can see the Science Diet products are indeed lower in carbs.
I'll accept you apology anytime for not reading the numbers correctly.
Clearly the Felidae and Wellness products are HIGHER carbs than
equivalent Science Diet products and thus contain more of that dreaded
evil grain.

Felidae Dry: protein 32.0%, fat 20.0%, fiber 2.5%,
moisture 9.0%, ash 5.5% Total 69% 100-69 = 31% carbohydrates

Wellness Dry: Protein 33.0%, fat 19.0%, fiber 5.0%, Moisture 10.0%,
Ash 6.0% Total 73% 100-73 = 27% carbohydrates

Science Diet Feline Kitten Protein 33%, fat 23%, fiber 3%, moisture
10%, ash 7% Total = 76% thus this food is 24% carbs.

Science Diet Nature's Best Feline Kitten Protein 35%, fat 22%, fiber
2%, moisture 10%, ash 6% Total = 75% thus this food is 25% carbs.

Jon C wrote:

"Karen M." wrote in message
...

Go wank yourself. There's obviously a *big* difference of opinion here,
I don't consider "all life stages" to be kitten food, *exclusively*
kitten foods have more protein, therefore they are not comparable.
Period. Now, go back and re-read my first sentence.



Funny that the Felidae and Wellness have more protein than the Science Diet
then, right?


Huh?

Jon C wrote:

"Karen M." wrote in message
...

Go wank yourself. There's obviously a *big* difference of opinion here,
I don't consider "all life stages" to be kitten food, *exclusively*
kitten foods have more protein, therefore they are not comparable.
Period. Now, go back and re-read my first sentence.



Funny that the Felidae and Wellness have more protein than the Science Diet
then, right?


Huh?

GAUBSTER2 wrote:

Once again, comparing "all stages" to "kitten" food. While an ALS food
will be formulated to *meet* growth needs *and* accomodate maintenance,
a specifically *kitten* food will be formulated specifically for
*kittens*, and therefore contain higher protein. Once again, they are
*not* the same. So keep waiting for that apology. I stand by what I
stated previously.


Karen, you're spinning. You're trying to find shades of grey that don't exist.
Why? Because you've been shown to be wrong on this particular subject,
perhaps? Foods that contain nutrient profiles established for growth can also
be labeled "all life stages". Foods that have nutrient profiles established
for growth aren't neccessarily appropriate for adult and senior cats. Senior
cats (especially) don't have the same nutrient requirements as kittens. The
concept is pretty simple, really.

Why are you still responding to me? We're obviously not going to agree,
and I'm apparently "uncouth", so....

GAUBSTER2 wrote:

Once again, comparing "all stages" to "kitten" food. While an ALS food
will be formulated to *meet* growth needs *and* accomodate maintenance,
a specifically *kitten* food will be formulated specifically for
*kittens*, and therefore contain higher protein. Once again, they are
*not* the same. So keep waiting for that apology. I stand by what I
stated previously.


Karen, you're spinning. You're trying to find shades of grey that don't exist.
Why? Because you've been shown to be wrong on this particular subject,
perhaps? Foods that contain nutrient profiles established for growth can also
be labeled "all life stages". Foods that have nutrient profiles established
for growth aren't neccessarily appropriate for adult and senior cats. Senior
cats (especially) don't have the same nutrient requirements as kittens. The
concept is pretty simple, really.

Why are you still responding to me? We're obviously not going to agree,
and I'm apparently "uncouth", so....

Lauren, don't bother. Just drink your coffee and feed your cats their
*very* "unhealthy" food and be done with it...

PawsForThought wrote:

From: (GAUBSTER2)


Foods that contain nutrient profiles established for growth can also
be labeled "all life stages". Foods that have nutrient profiles established
for growth aren't neccessarily appropriate for adult and senior cats.


Maybe I'm missing something, but you're saying in the first sentence "nutrient
profiles established for growth can also
be labeled "all life stages" Then, in the second sentence, you're saying that
foods established for growth (according to you that means it can be labeled
"all life stages") aren't approrpriate for adult and senior cats. Wouldn't all
life stages be for "all life stages", i.e. *all* cats?

It's too early for this. I need some coffee.
________
See my cats: http://community.webshots.com/album/56955940rWhxAe
Raw Diet Info: http://www.holisticat.com/drjletter.html
http://www.geocities.com/rawfeeders/ForCatsOnly.html
Declawing Info: http://www.wholecat.com/articles/claws.htm