[Way OT] - JUST ONCE - VT Shootings

"Will in New Haven" wrote

| Gun-control laws disarm legally-armed citizens,
| who are rarely involved in gun-related crimes.
| They are a touchy-feely feelgood solution that
| does not do any good.

Oh, but they do... They're oh-so-good for those who believe they own us, and
who want to be the only ones with guns.

On Apr 16, 10:16 pm, "Pat"
wrote:
"Will in New Haven" wrote

| Gun-control laws disarm legally-armed citizens,
| who are rarely involved in gun-related crimes.
| They are a touchy-feely feelgood solution that
| does not do any good.

Oh, but they do... They're oh-so-good for those who believe they own us, and
who want to be the only ones with guns.


Be fair. Most of them have _bodyguards_ with guns. They wouldn't touch
the things themselves.

Will in New Haven

--

"Good intentions will always be pleaded for every assumption of
authority. It is hardly too strong to say that the Constitution was
made to guard the people against the dangers of good intentions. There
are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern.
They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."
Daniel Webster

I am going to state something that the facts are verifiable. Will is right.
With this day and age I am proud to be a NRA golden family member. I am
proud to be a NRA for life member even if I don't agree with every thing
they stand for.

A recent report was handed out about Florida and concealed weapon license
holders. Since 1986 1.2 million license have been issued since 1986 only
158 people have been charged with a crime involving a gun. The report was
issued last year that is 20 years with 1.2 million people only 158 that
is less than what less than .0001% in 20 years.

It is not legal law abiding citizen that cause the crimes and should not be
punished for it. Even if you take away the guns it would be done with
knives, if you take away the knives, it would be done with bats, if you take
away the bats it would be done with bare hands. The crimes would be just as
bad if not even worse.

No matter what gun laws are in place criminals will get them some how some
way. Even over seas where armed crime has been on the rise for many years.
They have strict gun laws all over but the criminals still get them and use
them. Heck England they are not even allowed to carry pepper spray for self
defense and violent crime is on a major rise over there

I am armed at all times and it has saved my life for being armed. I have
friends that are armed and it has saved their life and the lives around
them. Anyone that tries and takes my protection away will have a fight on
their hands. There is nothing that anyone can say or show that will change
my mind on this.

Florida has the toughest gun laws around 10 20 life
If you have a gun 10 years no parole automatically
Use a gun 20 years no parole automatically
Fire the gun automatic life

But the criminals still get them and use them no matter what the law is.
People use the idea of only police and security officials having them. That
would be great but life has a strange part to play in this. Hell police
cars are robbed every week. We just had in the last two weeks two patrol
cars stolen while the deputy was chasing another suspect.


GUNS DON'T KILL PEOPLE KILL

I won't even start listing that facts about armed citizens stopping crime
from happening. This post would not be allowed it would be over 10 megs
just in listing for the last year alone.

More focus needs to be brought about starting at the family level going
into the schools all the way to the people around them. Since we know this
will never happen all I can say is people do suck sometimes.


"Will in New Haven" wrote in message
oups.com...
On Apr 16, 3:12 pm, "Shiral" wrote:
On Apr 16, 11:59 am, "EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque)"



wrote:
Pat wrote:
"Mark Edwards" wrote

| Just once. JUST ONCE, I would like to hear that the gunman was
taken out
| by a couple of dozen fatal wounds from ****ed off, heavily armed
fellow
| students who were in harm's way.

AMEN. But VT has a zero-tolerance, no-guns-on-campus rule. Hopefully
that
will be changed, as the incident will be used by the
anti-2nd-Amendment
socialists like Hillary trying to advance the cause of disarming all
who
resist this country's descent into tyranny.

We live under the Bush autocracy, and you accuse HILLARY of
not resisting our descent into tyranny?????? GWB throws a
temper tantrum whenever anyone questions his "divinely
inspired" alleged "leadership", he and his cronies are still
doing their best to ignore citizens' Constitutional rights,
and you think that's okay? (God help our country if there
are still people as misguided as you appear to be!)

Good on you, Evelyn! Frankly, after the Columbine High tragedy, I'm
not surprised at any school having a no-guns on campus rule. This
tragedy didn't happen because the STUDENTS were unarmed. It happened
because a troubled, angry person WAS.

Melissa


I hate to get into this on this NG but people who are willing, even
eager, to disobey the law are NOT stopped by fireamrs regulations.
Blinking my eyes and making all firearms disappear would certainly
prevent this sort of tragedy, although it would cause other problems,
but that is not what gun-contol laws do. Gun-control laws disarm
legally-armed citizens, who are rarely involved in gun-related crimes.
They are a touchy-feely feelgood solution that does not do any good.


Will in New Haven

--

"Just when you thought you would NEVER cross any items off your list
of things Keith Richards probably wouldn't do"

On Apr 16, 6:13 pm, "EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque)"
wrote:
Nomen Nescio wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

From: "Shiral"

This
tragedy didn't happen because the STUDENTS were unarmed. It happened
because a troubled, angry person WAS.

Actually, both.
If EVERY student had been armed, the two nutcases probably wouldn't
have even tried. It was a power trip for them.
And keep in mind that Columbine would have been much worse if there
had not, to the surprise of the 2 wackos, been someone else in the school
who was armed. He exchanged fire with them and pinned them down in the library.
Otherwise, they would have been free to move around, at will, and many more
people would have died.
And, BTW, there WAS a no guns policy for students at Columbine. Funny thing
about criminals, school policy does not seem to matter much to them.

Given the often hair-trigger nature of adolescent emotions,
I should think the last thing ANYONE would want would be a
high school or college campus where every student carried a
gun! It's regrettable that there should NEED to be a rule
against gun-toting students, and metal-detector screening to
enforce the rule, but I'm sure a great many parents find it
reassuring (even though it sometimes proves ineffective).

Oddly enough, we had a great deal of interpersonal violence at Walker
County High School in the eary Sixties but firearms were never
involved and there were never any fatalities. This despite the fact
that at least seventy-five hunting rufles in various lockers all
through the long Alabama deer season. I can't tell you how many
handguns were around and they were NOT, unlike the deer rifles, in
accordance with school policy, but I had one in my locker for some
weeks and so did my brother. I would estimate that about six or eight
boys and at least one, but probably only one, girl had a handgun in a
locker at any one time. About the only reason I would have gone to my
locker for a weapon would have been if I heard shooting. That would be
true of anyone else. Since we all shot targets and most of us had shot
a deer, I think we might have been able to help keep those Columbine
kids from doing as much harm as they did.

Will in New Haven

--

"Just when you thought you would NEVER cross any items off your list
of things Keith Richards probably wouldn't do"

It reached the news here in the UK. It was an incident like this
http://tinyurl.com/5r259 that caused a complete overhaul of our gun laws
in the UK.

Tweed


The news has also hit our shores here down-under in NZ.

My thoughts go out to all families who have suffered a loss, so, so very sad
and such a waste of life.

Purrs

Lois

On Apr 17, 1:20 am, Nomen Nescio wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

In every tragedy, one should seek comedy.
- -----------------------------------------------------------------------
A Virginia Tech official, in 2006, praised the defeat of a proposal to allow
students with state-issued concealed handgun permits to carry their handguns
on college campuses in Virginia.

A Republican legislator had proposed a bill to prohibit state universities from
prohibiting owners of concealed-carry permits from bringing their guns on campus.
When the bill was killed in committee, Virginia Tech spokesman Larry Hinckler
was quoted as follows:

"I'm sure the university community is appreciative of the General Assembly's actions
because this will help parents, students, faculty and visitors feel safe on our campus."

But that's what firearms control legislation is about: FEELING save.
It isn't about greater safety. It is about turning your safety over to
the police.

Which brings up another question. There was a shooting in a dorm and
the campus was not crawling with police two hours later? The students
were going to class as if all were normal and the campus was not
crawling with police two hours later? Was it just tragically
unfortunate, and this is possible, that a massive police presence was
in place and this guy just happened to hit a buildng where no police
officer happened to be around.

To a very great extent, having a police force is about FEELING safe as
well. Their existance undoubtedly cuts down on the number of people
willing to try something but doesn't do a whole lot about the ones who
do, not until after the fact.

The night before New Years Eve, 1976, I stood, and then sat, with a
bullet in my collarbone for fifteen minutes after the police were
called from a headquarters a few blocks away and told that shooting
was going on. The ambulence arrived before they did. Two of my fellow
employees who lived a few miles away arrived before they did. My
mother, who lived in Baltimore at the time, heard about it and CALLED
before the police arrived. My lawyer and my bail--bondsman arrived
before they did. I never worked at that job unarmed again. I was
never injured again and I held several people for the police to
arrest, although I am glad I never had to shoot anybody.

The cops will tell you themselves that there job is not to protect you
or to prevent crime. With the best will in the world, which some of
them have, they cannot do much more than they do without creating a
police state. And they are human. Arriving at a crime scene while
there is still gunfire going on is exceptional and many of them are
not willing to be that exceptional.

So don't rely on them to do what they will not do.

Will in New Haven

--



- ------------------------------------------------------------------
The following is fake news and did not really happen
- ------------------------------------------------------------------
4/16/07
Virginia Tech spokesman Larry Hinckler revised his 2006 quote to read:
"OOPS!"

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"Matthew" wrote in message
...

"Mark Edwards" wrote in message
...
Concerning the shooting at VT today (pardon my language):

Just once. JUST ONCE, I would like to hear that the gunman was taken out
by a couple of dozen fatal wounds from ****ed off, heavily armed fellow
students who were in harm's way.

I would PAY to see that the gunman was killed by ninjas and/or pirate
hooks and/or a large stick of dynamite inserted into the gunman's rectum.

Mother ****ing jackass idiots who think a shooting rampage solves
anything...!!!


very sad Hugs and Purrs,
Mark Edwards
--
Proof of Sanity Forged Upon Request

I agree with you Mark What I also have a problem with is someone was
stupid enought instead of going for cover they were recording the shootout
with a cell phone. Talk about stupid morbid sense and all the news
channel got the video and keep showing it every couple minutes

And people wonder why I am armed at all times and have all of my family
trained to deal with situations as they come up.

Hey, he probably made/will make a fortune with that snippet of video!

Hugs,

CatNipped

Thanks for the wisdom from the past.

--

Christopher A. Young
You can't shout down a troll.
You have to starve them.
..

"Will in New Haven" wrote in
message
ups.com...
:
: Oddly enough, we had a great deal of interpersonal violence at
Walker
: County High School in the eary Sixties but firearms were never
: involved and there were never any fatalities. This despite the
fact
: that at least seventy-five hunting rufles in various lockers
all
: through the long Alabama deer season. I can't tell you how many
: handguns were around and they were NOT, unlike the deer rifles,
in
: accordance with school policy, but I had one in my locker for
some
: weeks and so did my brother. I would estimate that about six or
eight
: boys and at least one, but probably only one, girl had a
handgun in a
: locker at any one time. About the only reason I would have gone
to my
: locker for a weapon would have been if I heard shooting. That
would be
: true of anyone else. Since we all shot targets and most of us
had shot
: a deer, I think we might have been able to help keep those
Columbine
: kids from doing as much harm as they did.
:
: Will in New Haven
:
: --
:
: "Just when you thought you would NEVER cross any items off your
list
: of things Keith Richards probably wouldn't do"
:

Will in New Haven wrote:
Blinking my eyes and making all firearms disappear would certainly
prevent this sort of tragedy, although it would cause other problems,
but that is not what gun-contol laws do. Gun-control laws disarm
legally-armed citizens, who are rarely involved in gun-related crimes.

HOW? I have yet to encounter any legislation that would
"disarm legally-armed citizens". It might extend the
waiting period for gun purchase so the purchaser's bona
fides can be confirmed before he/she is handed a weapon. It
might even tighten the licensing laws a bit - perhaps
requiring the applicant to complete a course in the proper
handling and use of firearms before he/she is turned loose
with one. (These are BAD things?) On the other hand, since
"gun control" legislation might make gun manufacturers and
importers more responsible for how and to whom THEY sell
their products, it should cut down on some of the illegal
weapons flooding the market.

Will in New Haven wrote:

On Apr 16, 7:19 pm, "Pat"
wrote:

"EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque)" wrote

| Pat wrote:

|
| "EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque)" wrote
|
| | what viable (meaning electable) choice do the Democrats
| | have?
|
| Crossing over to get Ron Paul the Republican nomination, that's what.
|
| Another reign of the religious right? God help us all!!!!

Whatever gives you this idea?

I'd suggest informing yourself because this kind of statement makes you look
like an idiot.



Helping Ron Paul get nominated would be a bad idea for the Democrats
because he _isn't_ part of the religious right and would, win or lose
the election, help the Republican Party get away from that faction. I
would certainly rather the RP nominated him, and I would vote for
him, but I am a Libertarian and not a Democrat or a Republican. I
think Barry Goldwater would puke if he were around to see this
administration.

I think that statement would probably hold true for ANY
presidential candidate prior to the Nixon administration!
There was a time when politicians at least BELIEVED in
"government by the people". Getting elected was always
foremost to some extent, but nowadays it seems to be a
matter of "say whatever will bring in the votes - then
ignore any promises that don't please your financial
backers" (or simply deny you ever SAID it).