Feeding questions

"Joe Canuck" wrote in message
. ..

I'd tend to agree with this considering all life stages will contain a
minimum of 0.8 % DMB phosphorous... if an older cat does have
undiagnosed CRF the phosphorous will speed the disease along.


Phosphorous? (Human ears perk up) We lost our 8 year old cat last week. He
went from *appearing* to be fine (eating, drinking, using the box, acting
normal) to being on deaths doorstep in 12 hours. He was in total kidney
failure, liver failure you name it. One of the test results that was through
the roof was phosphorous. Our vet thought he must have ingested something he
shouldn't have but for the life of me I can't figure out what. The vet
suggested laundry soap, Tylenol/aspirin/Aleve. My laundry detergent is
phosphate free, nobody uses aspirin around here, I guess someone could have
accidentally dropped a Tylenol or Aleve but nobody was aware of doing so.
It's driving me nuts. I would very much like to track down what he got into
so that none of the others get into it too.

Wendy

Boots ended up in the bathroom this morning to allow the other two to eat.
He is a bold little bugger and doesn't hesitate to shove his way in to the
food bowls while the big girls are trying to eat. I think Tiggy is totally
traumatized as she took to pooping in various location around the house this
morning - on purpose. I've been keeping the kitten food in the "box" the
kittens were in when they were smaller. The top is open so Boots can jump in
himself to eat. As long as Isabel doesn't see anyone put food in there she's
leaving it alone and poor Tiggy couldn't jump in there to save her soul with
her arthritis.

I'm beginning to think that having cats of such different ages and
requirements may have been a big mistake.

W

"PawsForThought" wrote in message
...
From: "Wendy"



You could feed the kitten separately and usually kitten food is fed until
the
cat is 1 year old. Or, you could feed an "all life stages" food for all the
cats. Canned is definitely better for them than dry food which tends to be
more cereal than meat.

Lauren
________
See my cats: http://community.webshots.com/album/56955940rWhxAe
Raw Diet Info: http://www.holisticat.com/drjletter.html
http://www.geocities.com/rawfeeders/ForCatsOnly.html
Declawing Info: http://www.wholecat.com/articles/claws.htm

Boots ended up in the bathroom this morning to allow the other two to eat.
He is a bold little bugger and doesn't hesitate to shove his way in to the
food bowls while the big girls are trying to eat. I think Tiggy is totally
traumatized as she took to pooping in various location around the house this
morning - on purpose. I've been keeping the kitten food in the "box" the
kittens were in when they were smaller. The top is open so Boots can jump in
himself to eat. As long as Isabel doesn't see anyone put food in there she's
leaving it alone and poor Tiggy couldn't jump in there to save her soul with
her arthritis.

I'm beginning to think that having cats of such different ages and
requirements may have been a big mistake.

W

"PawsForThought" wrote in message
...
From: "Wendy"



You could feed the kitten separately and usually kitten food is fed until
the
cat is 1 year old. Or, you could feed an "all life stages" food for all the
cats. Canned is definitely better for them than dry food which tends to be
more cereal than meat.

Lauren
________
See my cats: http://community.webshots.com/album/56955940rWhxAe
Raw Diet Info: http://www.holisticat.com/drjletter.html
http://www.geocities.com/rawfeeders/ForCatsOnly.html
Declawing Info: http://www.wholecat.com/articles/claws.htm

From: "Wendy"

Boots ended up in the bathroom this morning to allow the other two to eat.
He is a bold little bugger and doesn't hesitate to shove his way in to the
food bowls while the big girls are trying to eat.

But it's good he has a healthy appetite

I think Tiggy is totally
traumatized as she took to pooping in various location around the house this
morning - on purpose.

Is this the first time this has happened? How many litter boxes do you have?


I'm beginning to think that having cats of such different ages and
requirements may have been a big mistake.

Yeah but before you know it, the kitten will be full grown

Lauren
________
See my cats: http://community.webshots.com/album/56955940rWhxAe
Raw Diet Info: http://www.holisticat.com/drjletter.html
http://www.geocities.com/rawfeeders/ForCatsOnly.html
Declawing Info: http://www.wholecat.com/articles/claws.htm

From: "Wendy"

Boots ended up in the bathroom this morning to allow the other two to eat.
He is a bold little bugger and doesn't hesitate to shove his way in to the
food bowls while the big girls are trying to eat.

But it's good he has a healthy appetite

I think Tiggy is totally
traumatized as she took to pooping in various location around the house this
morning - on purpose.

Is this the first time this has happened? How many litter boxes do you have?


I'm beginning to think that having cats of such different ages and
requirements may have been a big mistake.

Yeah but before you know it, the kitten will be full grown

Lauren
________
See my cats: http://community.webshots.com/album/56955940rWhxAe
Raw Diet Info: http://www.holisticat.com/drjletter.html
http://www.geocities.com/rawfeeders/ForCatsOnly.html
Declawing Info: http://www.wholecat.com/articles/claws.htm

In article ,
(GAUBSTER2) wrote:

Dear Chris.

You are wrong.

Very, very wrong. And it's getting on my nerves. No emoticons here.

In fact, post proof or retract your statement that ""All life stage"
foods have to contain nutrient levels appropriate for kittens, not adult
or senior animals."


What's getting on my nerves is that this is SO easy to understand. ANY food
that is labelled "all life stages" (according to the AAFCO statement) has
passed the minimum requirements to sustain the most demanding stage of
life--the growth (kitten) stage. An "all life stage" food may contain levels
of nutrients that are more appropriate for a kitten and not appropriate
(excesses of nutrients) for an adult or senior cat (which may require lower
levels of certain nutrients, not higher).

This *may* be true. IT IS NOT NECESSARILY SO. If you would like to
maintain that ""All life stage" foods **have to contain** nutrient
levels appropriate for kittens, not adult or senior animals" you are
going to have to post hard proof.

A product bearing the label, "Animal feeding tests per AAFCO's feeding
procedures substantiate that this product provides complete and balanced
nutrition for growth", has been fed to 8 or more kittens for 10 weeks.

It didn't cause anemia.

It didn't cause decreased blood taurine levels.

It allowed the kittens to grow at a rate deemed acceptable to the AAFCO.

Ten measly weeks of not stunting kittens.

And from that, you extrapolate that it's inappropriate for an adult or
senior cat?

Ridiculous.

-Alison in OH

In article ,
(GAUBSTER2) wrote:

Dear Chris.

You are wrong.

Very, very wrong. And it's getting on my nerves. No emoticons here.

In fact, post proof or retract your statement that ""All life stage"
foods have to contain nutrient levels appropriate for kittens, not adult
or senior animals."


What's getting on my nerves is that this is SO easy to understand. ANY food
that is labelled "all life stages" (according to the AAFCO statement) has
passed the minimum requirements to sustain the most demanding stage of
life--the growth (kitten) stage. An "all life stage" food may contain levels
of nutrients that are more appropriate for a kitten and not appropriate
(excesses of nutrients) for an adult or senior cat (which may require lower
levels of certain nutrients, not higher).

This *may* be true. IT IS NOT NECESSARILY SO. If you would like to
maintain that ""All life stage" foods **have to contain** nutrient
levels appropriate for kittens, not adult or senior animals" you are
going to have to post hard proof.

A product bearing the label, "Animal feeding tests per AAFCO's feeding
procedures substantiate that this product provides complete and balanced
nutrition for growth", has been fed to 8 or more kittens for 10 weeks.

It didn't cause anemia.

It didn't cause decreased blood taurine levels.

It allowed the kittens to grow at a rate deemed acceptable to the AAFCO.

Ten measly weeks of not stunting kittens.

And from that, you extrapolate that it's inappropriate for an adult or
senior cat?

Ridiculous.

-Alison in OH

Perhaps the
arguments I make are persuasive and true (although not politically correct!)

Quaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!! ROFL

I checked that page and some of the information is wrong. I wonder what else
is wrong? Just one example is the "unnatural preservative" column....Science
Diet uses natural preservatives in all of their foods now...they have for .
about a year

Great. Perhaps if we keep complaining about the order of ingredients
and switching to other foods, they will fix that too.

Regarding ALS foods, '...the higher levels of nutrients would not be
harmful to the healthy adult animal...'

What nutrients? You wanna convince me that a higher level of carbs is
good for an older cat?

Maybe not, but why feed higher levels of nutrients to an animal that doesn't
require them?

Exactly! Why feed carbohydrates to cats????? Hmmm?

But after many years of those "higher nutrient
levels", would there not be some problems that would develop? Hmmm?

Sure there would, like obesity and diabetes.

Perhaps the
arguments I make are persuasive and true (although not politically correct!)

Quaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!! ROFL

I checked that page and some of the information is wrong. I wonder what else
is wrong? Just one example is the "unnatural preservative" column....Science
Diet uses natural preservatives in all of their foods now...they have for .
about a year

Great. Perhaps if we keep complaining about the order of ingredients
and switching to other foods, they will fix that too.

Regarding ALS foods, '...the higher levels of nutrients would not be
harmful to the healthy adult animal...'

What nutrients? You wanna convince me that a higher level of carbs is
good for an older cat?

Maybe not, but why feed higher levels of nutrients to an animal that doesn't
require them?

Exactly! Why feed carbohydrates to cats????? Hmmm?

But after many years of those "higher nutrient
levels", would there not be some problems that would develop? Hmmm?

Sure there would, like obesity and diabetes.

Wendy wrote:
"Joe Canuck" wrote in message
. ..

I'd tend to agree with this considering all life stages will contain a
minimum of 0.8 % DMB phosphorous... if an older cat does have
undiagnosed CRF the phosphorous will speed the disease along.


Phosphorous? (Human ears perk up) We lost our 8 year old cat last week. He
went from *appearing* to be fine (eating, drinking, using the box, acting
normal) to being on deaths doorstep in 12 hours. He was in total kidney
failure, liver failure you name it. One of the test results that was through
the roof was phosphorous. Our vet thought he must have ingested something he
shouldn't have but for the life of me I can't figure out what. The vet
suggested laundry soap, Tylenol/aspirin/Aleve. My laundry detergent is
phosphate free, nobody uses aspirin around here, I guess someone could have
accidentally dropped a Tylenol or Aleve but nobody was aware of doing so.
It's driving me nuts. I would very much like to track down what he got into
so that none of the others get into it too.

Wendy



I am sorry to hear about your sudden lose. :-(

Total kidney failure and a very high phosphorous level after testing by
the vet?

Kidneys lose their ability to get rid of excessive phosphorous from the
blood when they start to malfunction. The kidneys end up working
overtime to get rid of the phosphorous which they won't be able to do...
becomes a vicious circle and the phosphorous builds and builds which in
turn accelerates the progression of kidney failure.

What food were you feeding, that may or may not shed some clues.

--
"Its the bugs that keep it running."
-Joe Canuck