Crane, Gaubster, PhilP

"Ann Martin" wrote in message
om...


I've quote from letter received from the FDA/CVM as to
their knowledge that pets ARE used in commercial pet foods

According to the official FDA website,Miss-Leading Martin is stating *false*
information.

"CVM scientists, as part of their investigation, developed a test to detect
dog and cat DNA in the protein of the dog food. All samples from the most
recent dog food survey (2000) that tested positive for pentobarbital, as
well as a subset of samples that tested negative, were examined for the
presence of remains derived from dogs or cats. The results demonstrated a
complete absence of material that would have been derived from euthanized
dogs or cats. The sensitivity of this method is 0.005% on a weight/weight
basis; that is, the method can detect a minimum of 5 pounds of rendered
remains in 50 tons of finished feed. Presently, it is assumed that the
pentobarbital residues are entering pet foods from euthanized, rendered
cattle or even horses."
http://www.fda.gov/cvm/efoi/DFreport.htm

Is it really true that you keep rephrasing a question until you get the
answer you want???

I suggest that you get your story straight the next time you post such
inaccurate information.

Good idea... You should follow your own advice.. but then you wouldn't sell
many books...



These three also continue to insist that the pentobarbital in pet food
poses no danger.

So does the FDA/CVM!

"Thus, the results of the assessment led CVM to conclude that it is highly
unlikely a dog consuming dry dog food will experience any adverse effects
from exposures to the low levels of pentobarbital found in CVM's dog food
surveys."

FDA/CVM Report on the risk from pentobarbital in dog food
http://www.fda.gov/cvm/efoi/DFreport.htm




They measured ONE liver enzyme

More innuenso! You're implying the test wasn't valid because the FDA tested
one enzyme. But you *failed* to mention is that the enzyme that was tested
is the *most sensitive" enzyme to pentobarbital!

"In dogs, the most sensitive biological response to pentobarbital is an
increase in the production of cytochrome P450 enzymes, which is why the
scientists chose that as the best indicator of biological effect. If a low
level of pentobarbital did not cause a dog to produce additional cytochrome
P450 enzymes, then scientists could assume that the pentobarbital at that
low level had no significant effect on the dog."



I don't have the time to spend with people like
you

...who you can't bullsh!t and don't fall for your innuendo!

I'm *very* happy you posted to this group because now people can see your
books are largely based on *your* conclusions, innuendo, conjecture and
scare tactics which the real facts *do not* support

You're a manipulator of the worst kind! You play and profit on peoples'
fear!

So does the FDA/CVM!

You are so innocent! I wonder why documents in the FDA are NOT
accessible to YOU, an American citizen, the one who they are supposed
to protect. It´s all about money Phil. Pharmaceutical and chemical
industry will have the FDA approve whatever they want approved. That
holds for any such agency in the world, not just the FDA.

So does the FDA/CVM!

You are so innocent! I wonder why documents in the FDA are NOT
accessible to YOU, an American citizen, the one who they are supposed
to protect. It´s all about money Phil. Pharmaceutical and chemical
industry will have the FDA approve whatever they want approved. That
holds for any such agency in the world, not just the FDA.

From: (Liz)
Date: 9/4/03 9:41 PM Pacific Daylight Time
Message-id:

So does the FDA/CVM!

You are so innocent! I wonder why documents in the FDA are NOT
accessible to YOU, an American citizen, the one who they are supposed
to protect. It´s all about money Phil. Pharmaceutical and chemical
industry will have the FDA approve whatever they want approved. That
holds for any such agency in the world, not just the FDA.

Liz, don't be paranoid. There is no big conspiracy. If you let yourself be
duped by people like Ann Martin, then you're setting yourself up to be taken
advantage of for the rest of your life.

Btw, that doesn't explain why the FDA doesn't approve some drugs. Why would
pharmaceutical companies spend all the $$ only to have a developing drug not
get approved? Beware those black helipcopters spying on you!

From: (Liz)
Date: 9/4/03 9:41 PM Pacific Daylight Time
Message-id:

So does the FDA/CVM!

You are so innocent! I wonder why documents in the FDA are NOT
accessible to YOU, an American citizen, the one who they are supposed
to protect. It´s all about money Phil. Pharmaceutical and chemical
industry will have the FDA approve whatever they want approved. That
holds for any such agency in the world, not just the FDA.

Liz, don't be paranoid. There is no big conspiracy. If you let yourself be
duped by people like Ann Martin, then you're setting yourself up to be taken
advantage of for the rest of your life.

Btw, that doesn't explain why the FDA doesn't approve some drugs. Why would
pharmaceutical companies spend all the $$ only to have a developing drug not
get approved? Beware those black helipcopters spying on you!

(Liz) wrote in message . com...
So does the FDA/CVM!

You are so innocent! I wonder why documents in the FDA are NOT
accessible to YOU, an American citizen, the one who they are supposed
to protect. It´s all about money Phil. Pharmaceutical and chemical
industry will have the FDA approve whatever they want approved. That
holds for any such agency in the world, not just the FDA.

Liz, there have been a number of documents, under the FOIA, that
various government agencies have refused to release. Legal action has
been taken in a number of cases in order to obtain these records. At
the present time I have retained an attorney in order to get any and
all documentation related to the pentobarbital and DNA study the
FDA/CVM has undertaken. You have to wonder if all is above board what
are they hiding.

Ann

(Liz) wrote in message . com...
So does the FDA/CVM!

You are so innocent! I wonder why documents in the FDA are NOT
accessible to YOU, an American citizen, the one who they are supposed
to protect. It´s all about money Phil. Pharmaceutical and chemical
industry will have the FDA approve whatever they want approved. That
holds for any such agency in the world, not just the FDA.

Liz, there have been a number of documents, under the FOIA, that
various government agencies have refused to release. Legal action has
been taken in a number of cases in order to obtain these records. At
the present time I have retained an attorney in order to get any and
all documentation related to the pentobarbital and DNA study the
FDA/CVM has undertaken. You have to wonder if all is above board what
are they hiding.

Ann

Liz, don't be paranoid. There is no big conspiracy. If you let yourself be
duped by people like Ann Martin, then you're setting yourself up to be taken
advantage of for the rest of your life.

Btw, that doesn't explain why the FDA doesn't approve some drugs. Why would
pharmaceutical companies spend all the $$ only to have a developing drug not
get approved? Beware those black helipcopters spying on you!

There is no conspiracy. There´s making money. There´s public
manipulation for economic reasons. Look at Monsanto. They had the FDA
approve ethoxyquin for pet food. Now most manufacturers are taking it
out of their food. The vet board suggested pet food should have no
more than 75ppm when the FDA approved as much as 150 ppm. The same
Monsanto had the FDA approve genetically modified seeds. NOBODY knows
what environmental or health hazards these genetically engineered
plants will cause in the long run. Then Bush backs up Monsanto saying
that there are too many people starving in the world and this is
reason enough to increase agricultural productivity through GEPs. Yeah
right. As if Bush was going to go around distributing food to those
starving. Growing crops has a cost and nobody is willing to plant for
free. Look at vaccines. All the vaccines the FDA has approved. Many of
them cause ADD (attention deficit disorder) and autism. The percentage
of children with these disorders has risen dramatically over the last
few years. I could give you many more examples but I´m sure with some
reading you can find out what is going on in the world you live in.
And some companies do not have their drugs approved either because
they have a ´no bribe´ policy (yes, these companies exist), or they
are unwilling to pay what it takes or it´s just a little theater: they
ask for review and the FDA approves the product in the second round. I
worked for the pharmaceutical industry for ten years and I sure know
what it´s all about.

Liz, don't be paranoid. There is no big conspiracy. If you let yourself be
duped by people like Ann Martin, then you're setting yourself up to be taken
advantage of for the rest of your life.

Btw, that doesn't explain why the FDA doesn't approve some drugs. Why would
pharmaceutical companies spend all the $$ only to have a developing drug not
get approved? Beware those black helipcopters spying on you!

There is no conspiracy. There´s making money. There´s public
manipulation for economic reasons. Look at Monsanto. They had the FDA
approve ethoxyquin for pet food. Now most manufacturers are taking it
out of their food. The vet board suggested pet food should have no
more than 75ppm when the FDA approved as much as 150 ppm. The same
Monsanto had the FDA approve genetically modified seeds. NOBODY knows
what environmental or health hazards these genetically engineered
plants will cause in the long run. Then Bush backs up Monsanto saying
that there are too many people starving in the world and this is
reason enough to increase agricultural productivity through GEPs. Yeah
right. As if Bush was going to go around distributing food to those
starving. Growing crops has a cost and nobody is willing to plant for
free. Look at vaccines. All the vaccines the FDA has approved. Many of
them cause ADD (attention deficit disorder) and autism. The percentage
of children with these disorders has risen dramatically over the last
few years. I could give you many more examples but I´m sure with some
reading you can find out what is going on in the world you live in.
And some companies do not have their drugs approved either because
they have a ´no bribe´ policy (yes, these companies exist), or they
are unwilling to pay what it takes or it´s just a little theater: they
ask for review and the FDA approves the product in the second round. I
worked for the pharmaceutical industry for ten years and I sure know
what it´s all about.

"Liz" wrote in message
om...

So does the FDA/CVM!

You are so innocent!

You're so paranoid!

Pharmaceutical and chemical
industry will have the FDA approve whatever they want approved.

Is that why the FDA is constantly refusing to approve drugs and why they
pull drugs off the market?


I was wondering when you were going to show up.... It looks like Lauren's
calling in the reinforcements! LOL!