OT Economics

Being a math geek, I found this site really impressive with all the charts
and explanations of the current crises:

http://www.calculatedriskblog.com/

It seems to have a lot more useful info than the fluff I see in the paper
and certainly much better than TV coverage.

"Nomen Nescio" wrote in message

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From: ScratchMonkey

Being a math geek, I found this site really impressive with all the
charts and explanations of the current crises:

http://www.calculatedriskblog.com/

It seems to have a lot more useful info than the fluff I see in the
paper and certainly much better than TV coverage.

LOL!

How many people, do you think, would have the slightest clue as to
what any of that meant?

I still have very little idea about why the economy of the world suddenly
went to hell in a handbasket, and even less understanding of its long term
repurcussions. From what I can gather, the high falutin' money men entered
into a game of chicken. It worked really well for a while until one person
found the odds too high and demanded something more intrinisically valuable
than just a giant IOU, and thus the house of cards they had built tumbled
down, bring us 'little people' with them. These are the same people who have
the gall to ask the government for financial aid (at a time when so many
other people need it), get it, and then still pay themselves mega$ out of
that government aid as a 'bonus' for buggering everything up with their
greed. Meanwhile, whole economies come crashing down because everything had
its cash value artifically inflated by the money men playing chicken.

What I don't really understand is why a pumpkin (for example) had more value
yesterday than it does today - 1 pumpkin makes 4 bowls of soup no matter
what 'dollar value' it has. Maybe we should measure 'value' in bowls of
pumpkin soup?

This is why I am a scientist and an not an economist or accountant :-)

It makes me think of the time, last October, my ultra-liberal, next
door, neighbor went off the deep end when I told him that half the
voters were "of below average intelligence".

To this day, I don't think he realizes why I had a big grin on my
face as he was telling me that I was an idiot for believing that.

Hehehehehe.

Yowie
--
If you're paddling upstream in a canoe and a wheel falls off, how many
pancakes can you fit in a doghouse? None, icecream doesn't have bones.

"Nomen Nescio" wrote:

It makes me think of the time, last October, my ultra-liberal, next
door, neighbor went off the deep end when I told him that half the
voters were "of below average intelligence".

I can't speak for your neighbor or why he got upset at your statement,
but I agree that a large number of US voters are below average intelligence.
After all, they not only elected Bush, they *re-elected* him. And even if
he won by election fraud, it had to be close enough for them to pull that
off.

--
Joyce ^..^

(To email me, remove the X's from my user name.)

wrote:
"Nomen Nescio" wrote:
It makes me think of the time, last October, my ultra-liberal, next
door, neighbor went off the deep end when I told him that half the
voters were "of below average intelligence".

I can't speak for your neighbor or why he got upset at your statement,

I assume for the same reason that the late statistical quality control
guru W. Edwards Deming castigated Chrysler for their customer
satisfaction surveys - self selected samples tend not to be average.

"Yowie" wrote in message
...
"Nomen Nescio" wrote in message

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From: ScratchMonkey

Being a math geek, I found this site really impressive with all
the
charts and explanations of the current crises:

http://www.calculatedriskblog.com/

It seems to have a lot more useful info than the fluff I see in
the
paper and certainly much better than TV coverage.

LOL!

How many people, do you think, would have the slightest clue as to
what any of that meant?

I still have very little idea about why the economy of the world
suddenly went to hell in a handbasket, and even less understanding
of its long term repurcussions.

You and an awful lot of other people. The thing is, it didn't happen
suddenly. It just became popular with the press suddenly.

Anyone who didn't see the mortgage meltdown coming four or more years
ago, wasn't paying attention or didn't care. To listen to the news,
you would think people just started losing their houses this past
summer.

It will all happen again in another twenty or thirty years or so and
our kids will be just a shocked as we are and as our grandparents
were.

Jo

Takayuki wrote:

wrote:

"Nomen Nescio" wrote:

It makes me think of the time, last October, my ultra-liberal, next
door, neighbor went off the deep end when I told him that half the
voters were "of below average intelligence".

I can't speak for your neighbor or why he got upset at your statement,

I assume for the same reason that the late statistical quality control
guru W. Edwards Deming castigated Chrysler for their customer
satisfaction surveys - self selected samples tend not to be average.


That's assuming that "Nomen Nescio" was including the neighbor in his
assessment of the voters. If I had been speaking to that same
neighbor, it would've been obvious he was *not* included!

But I suspect that NN was not referring to 2000 or 2004 when he talked
about elections and voters.

--
Joyce ^..^

(To email me, remove the X's from my user name.)

Jofirey wrote:
"Yowie" wrote in message
...
"Nomen Nescio" wrote in message

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----

From: ScratchMonkey

Being a math geek, I found this site really impressive with all
the
charts and explanations of the current crises:

http://www.calculatedriskblog.com/

It seems to have a lot more useful info than the fluff I see in
the
paper and certainly much better than TV coverage.
LOL!

How many people, do you think, would have the slightest clue as to
what any of that meant?
I still have very little idea about why the economy of the world
suddenly went to hell in a handbasket, and even less understanding
of its long term repurcussions.

You and an awful lot of other people. The thing is, it didn't happen
suddenly. It just became popular with the press suddenly.

Anyone who didn't see the mortgage meltdown coming four or more years
ago, wasn't paying attention or didn't care. To listen to the news,
you would think people just started losing their houses this past
summer.

It will all happen again in another twenty or thirty years or so and
our kids will be just a shocked as we are and as our grandparents
were.

Jo


Too true, alas! (Sad, isn't it? The human race seems never to learn
from its mistakes!)

Nomen Nescio wrote in
:

Just for future reference, the term "quality control" is considered to
be politically incorrect, now.
In the future, please use the kinder, gentler, term "quality
assurance".

This comes directly from the best Quality Systems Consultant in the
Northeast................my wife.

I briefly worked in the belly of a corporate beast, and now use the term
Quantity Assurance. :P

Nomen Nescio wrote in
:

But I suspect that NN was not referring to 2000 or 2004 when he talked
about elections and voters.

Half the voters were "of below average intelligence" in 2000 and 2004,
also.

The prevalence of innumeracy, even among the well-educated, is appalling.
Seems like only nerds value numeracy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Numeracy

"Yowie" wrote in
:

These are the same people who have the gall to ask the government for
financial aid (at a time when so many other people need it), get it,
and then still pay themselves mega$ out of that government aid as a
'bonus' for buggering everything up with their greed. Meanwhile, whole
economies come crashing down because everything had its cash value
artifically inflated by the money men playing chicken.

The bailout is supposed to be about $700 billion, and we all know that
government programs never cost what they're originally projected to, but
vastly inflate over time. Meanwhile, US personal income taxes account for
about $1 trillion ($1000 billion) of revenue. So instead of giving all that
money to the money men, why not (for the same price tag) just end the
personal income tax (and all its reporting and paperwork) and give that
money directly to taxpayers?

http://www.contracostatimes.com/ci_1...nclick_check=1

The only reason Congress won't go for this is that they would lose control
of how that money is spent. That means they can't funnel it to the people
and the employees of bureacracies who pay for their campaigns and get them
re-elected. It would be money they couldn't hold over the heads of State
governments to say "do our bidding or we won't give you money". (That's how
most Federal laws are enforced, like the old 55 MPH speed limit that was
enforced by withholding highway funds.)

For a funny video on how we got into this mess, check out this Onion
coverage of the stimulus package:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dEDIyztZGBA

What I don't really understand is why a pumpkin (for example) had more
value yesterday than it does today - 1 pumpkin makes 4 bowls of soup
no matter what 'dollar value' it has. Maybe we should measure 'value'
in bowls of pumpkin soup?

You're absolutely right. "Dollars" used to refer to measured amounts of
gold, which function as the pumpkins in your example. With the
disconnection of currency from "real" things of value, "dollar" means
whatever the central bank wants it to mean. And the central bank's
decisions are guided by politics, by whoever is well-connected to the
politicians currently in power.

Here's a good video that explains many of the mechanisms:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...74362583451279

(I disagree with much of his proposed solution, though. He wants to put
more power in the hands of the people who got us into the mess.)