Ping: Mary, Phil

I can't get back the original message in Xnews and had to look it up in
google. I'm glad you guys had this discussion because I'm going to talk to
Shadow's vet tomorrow when I take him for his shave and squeeze and ask
about switching him to 10mg EOD instead of the 5 per day he is on. I had
NO idea. Thank you. I hate the pred. He just is enormous. Not just from
gaining weight, but his head is big. A friend of mine was recently sick and
had to be treated with high doses of prednisone to kill an infection and he
said he bloated up to 220 pounds and he's a small guy. He said his face
was mooshed and it reminds me of Shadow.

--
Cheryl

Trapped like rats. In a chia-pet.
MIB II

Cheryl wrote in message ...


I can't get back the original message in Xnews and had to look it up in
google. I'm glad you guys had this discussion because I'm going to talk to
Shadow's vet tomorrow when I take him for his shave and squeeze and ask
about switching him to 10mg EOD instead of the 5 per day he is on. I had
NO idea. Thank you. I hate the pred. He just is enormous. Not just from
gaining weight, but his head is big. A friend of mine was recently sick and
had to be treated with high doses of prednisone to kill an infection and he
said he bloated up to 220 pounds and he's a small guy. He said his face
was mooshed and it reminds me of Shadow.

I nearly died after a near-drowning incident, and was put on high
doses of pred for 9 months - gained 60 lbs almost immediately. It was
the weirdest thing in the world - didn't really eat differently, the
drugs just *completely* changed my body chemistry.

Many purrs to poor Shadow. The bad thing about pred is that you feel
so good on it, and so crappy off of it...

-L.

Cheryl wrote in message ...


I can't get back the original message in Xnews and had to look it up in
google. I'm glad you guys had this discussion because I'm going to talk to
Shadow's vet tomorrow when I take him for his shave and squeeze and ask
about switching him to 10mg EOD instead of the 5 per day he is on. I had
NO idea. Thank you. I hate the pred. He just is enormous. Not just from
gaining weight, but his head is big. A friend of mine was recently sick and
had to be treated with high doses of prednisone to kill an infection and he
said he bloated up to 220 pounds and he's a small guy. He said his face
was mooshed and it reminds me of Shadow.

I nearly died after a near-drowning incident, and was put on high
doses of pred for 9 months - gained 60 lbs almost immediately. It was
the weirdest thing in the world - didn't really eat differently, the
drugs just *completely* changed my body chemistry.

Many purrs to poor Shadow. The bad thing about pred is that you feel
so good on it, and so crappy off of it...

-L.

"Cheryl" wrote in message
...


I can't get back the original message in Xnews and had to look it up
in
google. I'm glad you guys had this discussion because I'm going to
talk to
Shadow's vet tomorrow when I take him for his shave and squeeze and
ask
about switching him to 10mg EOD instead of the 5 per day he is on.
I had
NO idea. Thank you. I hate the pred. He just is enormous. Not just
from
gaining weight, but his head is big. A friend of mine was recently
sick and
had to be treated with high doses of prednisone to kill an infection
and he
said he bloated up to 220 pounds and he's a small guy. He said his
face
was mooshed and it reminds me of Shadow.


Let us know what the vet says. I've seen this sort of swelling in
people
on steroids but not cats. I'll be thinking about you two.

"Cheryl" wrote in message
...


I can't get back the original message in Xnews and had to look it up
in
google. I'm glad you guys had this discussion because I'm going to
talk to
Shadow's vet tomorrow when I take him for his shave and squeeze and
ask
about switching him to 10mg EOD instead of the 5 per day he is on.
I had
NO idea. Thank you. I hate the pred. He just is enormous. Not just
from
gaining weight, but his head is big. A friend of mine was recently
sick and
had to be treated with high doses of prednisone to kill an infection
and he
said he bloated up to 220 pounds and he's a small guy. He said his
face
was mooshed and it reminds me of Shadow.


Let us know what the vet says. I've seen this sort of swelling in
people
on steroids but not cats. I'll be thinking about you two.

"Cheryl" wrote in message
...


I can't get back the original message in Xnews and had to look it up in
google. I'm glad you guys had this discussion because I'm going to talk
to
Shadow's vet tomorrow when I take him for his shave and squeeze and ask
about switching him to 10mg EOD instead of the 5 per day he is on. I had
NO idea. Thank you. I hate the pred. He just is enormous. Not just from
gaining weight, but his head is big. A friend of mine was recently sick
and
had to be treated with high doses of prednisone to kill an infection and
he
said he bloated up to 220 pounds and he's a small guy. He said his face
was mooshed and it reminds me of Shadow.

Facial swelling is one of the possible adverse effects -- the increase of
extracellular fluid volume might be a contributing factor in the puffy look
but weight gain is probably more common -- and not in a good way.
Glucocorticoids convert body protein (muscle) into glucose. But even though
steroids cause muscle wasting and thinning skin, gluconeogenesis and
glycogen synthesis and increases in both lipolysis and lipogenesis produce a
net increase in body fat so the cat actually gains weight while
simultaneously losing muscle mass. E.O.D. dosing minimizes this`effect, but
you still should keep an eye out for muscle atrophy.

Just a reminder: If you're switching to e.o.d. therapy, remember, you
should use *only* the *short-acting* steroids (12-36 hr). If you use the
longer acting forms, the doses will *overlap* and you'll lose all the
benefits of e.o.d.

Good luck.

Phil

"Cheryl" wrote in message
...


I can't get back the original message in Xnews and had to look it up in
google. I'm glad you guys had this discussion because I'm going to talk
to
Shadow's vet tomorrow when I take him for his shave and squeeze and ask
about switching him to 10mg EOD instead of the 5 per day he is on. I had
NO idea. Thank you. I hate the pred. He just is enormous. Not just from
gaining weight, but his head is big. A friend of mine was recently sick
and
had to be treated with high doses of prednisone to kill an infection and
he
said he bloated up to 220 pounds and he's a small guy. He said his face
was mooshed and it reminds me of Shadow.

Facial swelling is one of the possible adverse effects -- the increase of
extracellular fluid volume might be a contributing factor in the puffy look
but weight gain is probably more common -- and not in a good way.
Glucocorticoids convert body protein (muscle) into glucose. But even though
steroids cause muscle wasting and thinning skin, gluconeogenesis and
glycogen synthesis and increases in both lipolysis and lipogenesis produce a
net increase in body fat so the cat actually gains weight while
simultaneously losing muscle mass. E.O.D. dosing minimizes this`effect, but
you still should keep an eye out for muscle atrophy.

Just a reminder: If you're switching to e.o.d. therapy, remember, you
should use *only* the *short-acting* steroids (12-36 hr). If you use the
longer acting forms, the doses will *overlap* and you'll lose all the
benefits of e.o.d.

Good luck.

Phil

"Phil P." wrote in message
...


Just a reminder: If you're switching to e.o.d. therapy, remember,
you
should use *only* the *short-acting* steroids (12-36 hr). If you
use the
longer acting forms, the doses will *overlap* and you'll lose all
the
benefits of e.o.d.

She said that she rarely sees side effects of prednisone in cats.
Weight gain, yes. Diabetes if the cat is already a candidate
(pre-diabetic?) She agreed that of course EOD is the way to go but
some cats have flare-ups when messing with pred. I am going to try
EOD, but I have a question. If short-acting steroids (and I did a
little research, and prednisone in the 5mg dose he gets is considered
short-acting (biologic life 12-36 hours) don't remain in the body over
that amount of time, isn't 10mg every other day as opposed to the 5mg
daily overkill? If 5 helps him and 10 doesn't remain in his system
over the 2 day period, what is the point of doubling the dose EOD? I
remember in the past trying to cut back and give him 5mg EOD and he
went back to vomiting.

I ordered him bloodwork and will find out the results of those
tomorrow, but his vet wasn't so open and I may be reading her body
language when I asked, but she seemed hesitant to me. I mean, if pred
is the only thing that gives him relief and it comes back that he is
now diabetic, or worse, what is the answer? Cut out the pred and
treat diabetes? Diet isn't helping his IBD even though he is mostly
on canned food. I can't get him to eat the foods that are better
quality so in his case the canned he'll eat is better than the dry he
will scarf if I were to let him? He won't eat a steady diet of home
made. He's just so freaking hungry all the time and at least he
didn't gain any weight since the last time he was in. Still holding
at 20 lbs.

"Phil P." wrote in message
...


Just a reminder: If you're switching to e.o.d. therapy, remember,
you
should use *only* the *short-acting* steroids (12-36 hr). If you
use the
longer acting forms, the doses will *overlap* and you'll lose all
the
benefits of e.o.d.

She said that she rarely sees side effects of prednisone in cats.
Weight gain, yes. Diabetes if the cat is already a candidate
(pre-diabetic?) She agreed that of course EOD is the way to go but
some cats have flare-ups when messing with pred. I am going to try
EOD, but I have a question. If short-acting steroids (and I did a
little research, and prednisone in the 5mg dose he gets is considered
short-acting (biologic life 12-36 hours) don't remain in the body over
that amount of time, isn't 10mg every other day as opposed to the 5mg
daily overkill? If 5 helps him and 10 doesn't remain in his system
over the 2 day period, what is the point of doubling the dose EOD? I
remember in the past trying to cut back and give him 5mg EOD and he
went back to vomiting.

I ordered him bloodwork and will find out the results of those
tomorrow, but his vet wasn't so open and I may be reading her body
language when I asked, but she seemed hesitant to me. I mean, if pred
is the only thing that gives him relief and it comes back that he is
now diabetic, or worse, what is the answer? Cut out the pred and
treat diabetes? Diet isn't helping his IBD even though he is mostly
on canned food. I can't get him to eat the foods that are better
quality so in his case the canned he'll eat is better than the dry he
will scarf if I were to let him? He won't eat a steady diet of home
made. He's just so freaking hungry all the time and at least he
didn't gain any weight since the last time he was in. Still holding
at 20 lbs.

"Cheryl" wrote in message
...

"Phil P." wrote in message
...


Just a reminder: If you're switching to e.o.d. therapy, remember,
you
should use *only* the *short-acting* steroids (12-36 hr). If you
use the
longer acting forms, the doses will *overlap* and you'll lose all
the
benefits of e.o.d.

She said that she rarely sees side effects of prednisone in cats.
Weight gain, yes. Diabetes if the cat is already a candidate
(pre-diabetic?)

HPA supression is the concern. E.O.D. minimizes and in many cases,
eliminates it.


She agreed that of course EOD is the way to go but
some cats have flare-ups when messing with pred. I am going to try
EOD, but I have a question. If short-acting steroids (and I did a
little research, and prednisone in the 5mg dose he gets is considered
short-acting (biologic life 12-36 hours) don't remain in the body over
that amount of time, isn't 10mg every other day as opposed to the 5mg
daily overkill? If 5 helps him and 10 doesn't remain in his system
over the 2 day period, what is the point of doubling the dose EOD?

Better suppression of symptoms - takes longer for the symptoms to recur. If
the cat responds well to e.o.d., you can try every third and sometimes, even
every fouth day dosing - I've never had much luck with every fouth day
dosing unless the symptoms resolved or the disease went into remission. But
I did get lucky a few times with every third day dosing.

Another important benefit of e.o.d. is the cat is less likely to develop
steroid tachyphylaxis.


I
remember in the past trying to cut back and give him 5mg EOD and he
went back to vomiting.

That's because you were cutting the dose in half.


I ordered him bloodwork and will find out the results of those
tomorrow, but his vet wasn't so open and I may be reading her body
language when I asked, but she seemed hesitant to me. I mean, if pred
is the only thing that gives him relief and it comes back that he is
now diabetic, or worse, what is the answer? Cut out the pred and
treat diabetes?

It may not be true diabetes. Glucocorticoids convert protein into glucose
and also stimulates gluconeogenesis (forms glucose from the glycerol in
fats). You may have to treat both - which isn't as bad as it sounds.


Diet isn't helping his IBD even though he is mostly
on canned food. I can't get him to eat the foods that are better
quality so in his case the canned he'll eat is better than the dry he
will scarf if I were to let him? He won't eat a steady diet of home
made. He's just so freaking hungry all the time and at least he
didn't gain any weight since the last time he was in. Still holding
at 20 lbs.
..
Could be the prednisone - its also an appetite stimulant.