If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below. |
|
|
Thread Tools | Display Modes |
#501
|
|||
|
|||
|
#502
|
|||
|
|||
|
#503
|
|||
|
|||
NO, not at all. I can see where what I typed could be taken one of two
ways. I should have made myself more clear. Forget it, Gaubster. Steve understood the point I was making and addressed it. It went right over your head and still does, I see. No, reread what I posted. I said that I should have made myself more clear. Obviously, you read into it what you wanted to see. However, you aren't addressing the question I asked you: I'll ask you again: Hill's products DO have controlled levels of fat, sodium, calcium phosphorus, magnesium, etc. Do you dispute that? Why don't you get back to me with all of the research YOU'VE done? Hmm? My point (that you seemed to ignore or miss yourself) is that Hill's products ARE LOWER in certain key nutrients that can cause or exacerbate certain disease conditions. I want to lower risk factors for my pets, so I feed Hill's products. That's all. |
#504
|
|||
|
|||
NO, not at all. I can see where what I typed could be taken one of two
ways. I should have made myself more clear. Forget it, Gaubster. Steve understood the point I was making and addressed it. It went right over your head and still does, I see. No, reread what I posted. I said that I should have made myself more clear. Obviously, you read into it what you wanted to see. However, you aren't addressing the question I asked you: I'll ask you again: Hill's products DO have controlled levels of fat, sodium, calcium phosphorus, magnesium, etc. Do you dispute that? Why don't you get back to me with all of the research YOU'VE done? Hmm? My point (that you seemed to ignore or miss yourself) is that Hill's products ARE LOWER in certain key nutrients that can cause or exacerbate certain disease conditions. I want to lower risk factors for my pets, so I feed Hill's products. That's all. |
#505
|
|||
|
|||
"Yngver" wrote in message ... Well, I checked, thinking it was Eukanuba's new formula but I find it's SD's Advanced Protection. You know, the formula that seven out of ten dog owners said made their dogs seem happier? I think Petsmart must have had their signage in the wrong place because I see the Hill's Web site doesn't make quite the same promises for the feline version of Advanced Protection as it does for the canine version. I was hoping this new formula would turn a plump lazy cat into a lean energetic one, but I guess it only does that with dogs. :-) OK, Now I know what you are talking about. Advanced Protection is a high antioxidant product, based upon the work done in Cognitive Dysfunction (Alzheimer's) in dogs. The "cocktail" of antioxidants shows great promise in older dogs who have "slowed" down a bit in life. The biggest activity involves the affects on the beta amyloid plaque deposited in the brain neuron pathway which "interrupts" or perhaps "disrupts" nerve signal passage. Interestingly it is the same 42 bit beta amyloid in humans as it is in dogs. One of the most common reasons pet owners bring a dog into the veterinary clinic to have it put to sleep after many years of companionship is when the dog no longer remembers to defecate and urinate outside. In about 70% of those dogs we can reverse the problem (with Prescription Diet b/d) and extend the life the dog and the family have together. The antioxidant cocktail in Advanced Protection is quite similar to b/d, although not exactly the same. I do not have as much faith in the concept in cats. While they do seem to collect some similar oxidative brain damage over time - How would you know an Alzheimer's cat from a normal one? :-)) All kidding aside the issue of cognitive dysfunction in cats is nearly impossible to test. There are simply not enough of them around to ever set up a decent clinical trial. In dogs we can find cognitive dysfunctional easily, but in cats it's very difficult to locate enough of them. This leaves what are called "In Home User Trials" or IHUT's. You provide food in plain unmarked bags to a large group of animals. Then ask the pet owner to log what they see or do not see. Midway through the trial you switch the food without telling the pet owner that you have done so and again ask for pet owner to continue to log activates and behaviors. The difference between the daily activity logs provides some information about the effectiveness of the food. The pet owners are only told they are testing a pet food. They don't know what the food is supposed to do or not do, nor do they know who the manufacturer is or anything else about the food. |
#506
|
|||
|
|||
"Yngver" wrote in message ... Well, I checked, thinking it was Eukanuba's new formula but I find it's SD's Advanced Protection. You know, the formula that seven out of ten dog owners said made their dogs seem happier? I think Petsmart must have had their signage in the wrong place because I see the Hill's Web site doesn't make quite the same promises for the feline version of Advanced Protection as it does for the canine version. I was hoping this new formula would turn a plump lazy cat into a lean energetic one, but I guess it only does that with dogs. :-) OK, Now I know what you are talking about. Advanced Protection is a high antioxidant product, based upon the work done in Cognitive Dysfunction (Alzheimer's) in dogs. The "cocktail" of antioxidants shows great promise in older dogs who have "slowed" down a bit in life. The biggest activity involves the affects on the beta amyloid plaque deposited in the brain neuron pathway which "interrupts" or perhaps "disrupts" nerve signal passage. Interestingly it is the same 42 bit beta amyloid in humans as it is in dogs. One of the most common reasons pet owners bring a dog into the veterinary clinic to have it put to sleep after many years of companionship is when the dog no longer remembers to defecate and urinate outside. In about 70% of those dogs we can reverse the problem (with Prescription Diet b/d) and extend the life the dog and the family have together. The antioxidant cocktail in Advanced Protection is quite similar to b/d, although not exactly the same. I do not have as much faith in the concept in cats. While they do seem to collect some similar oxidative brain damage over time - How would you know an Alzheimer's cat from a normal one? :-)) All kidding aside the issue of cognitive dysfunction in cats is nearly impossible to test. There are simply not enough of them around to ever set up a decent clinical trial. In dogs we can find cognitive dysfunctional easily, but in cats it's very difficult to locate enough of them. This leaves what are called "In Home User Trials" or IHUT's. You provide food in plain unmarked bags to a large group of animals. Then ask the pet owner to log what they see or do not see. Midway through the trial you switch the food without telling the pet owner that you have done so and again ask for pet owner to continue to log activates and behaviors. The difference between the daily activity logs provides some information about the effectiveness of the food. The pet owners are only told they are testing a pet food. They don't know what the food is supposed to do or not do, nor do they know who the manufacturer is or anything else about the food. |
#507
|
|||
|
|||
You're kidding, right? A happier dog? That's a pretty interesting claim.
Wonder how SD tries to prove it, LOL Lauren The proof was presented at the World Veterinary Behavior meeting in British Columbia three years ago. It was proven again with military dogs all around the world. As a consequence of the testing done by Dr. Milgram in Toronto in 1999-2000 the US military switched all guard and work dogs over to the diet. Now two years later they have proven the value by being able to keep dogs "on-line" a full year longer than before. No loss of alertness on the job, no need to retire the working dogs as early as they used to be forced to retire them. It generated so much excitement that there are now three human trials underway with human Alzheimer's patients. It was proven again in a clinical study published in peer reviewed veterinary journals. Neurosci Biobehav Rev. 2002 Oct;26(6):679-95. Landmark discrimination learning in the dog: effects of age, an antioxidant fortified food, and cognitive strategy. Milgram NW, Head E, Muggenburg B, Holowachuk D, Murphey H, Estrada J, Ikeda-Douglas CJ, Zicker SC, Cotman CW. Life Science Division, University of Toronto at Scarborough, 1265 Military Trail, Scarborough, Ont., Canada M1C 1A4. The landmark discrimination learning test can be used to assess the ability to utilize allocentric spatial information to locate targets. The present experiments examined the role of various factors on performance of a landmark discrimination learning task in beagle dogs. Experiments 1 and 2 looked at the effects of age and food composition. Experiments 3 and 4 were aimed at characterizing the cognitive strategies used in performance on this task and in long-term retention. Cognitively equivalent groups of old and young dogs were placed into either a test group maintained on food enriched with a broad-spectrum of antioxidants and mitochondrial cofactors, or a control group maintained on a complete and balanced food formulated for adult dogs. Following a wash-in period, the dogs were tested on a series of problems, in which reward was obtained when the animal responded selectively to the object closest to a thin wooden block, which served as a landmark. In Experiment 1, dogs were first trained to respond to a landmark placed directly on top of coaster, landmark 0 (L0). In the next phase of testing, the landmark was moved at successively greater distances (1, 4 or 10 cm) away from the reward object. Learning varied as a function of age group, food group, and task. The young dogs learned all of the tasks more quickly than the old dogs. The aged dogs on the enriched food learned L0 significantly more rapidly than aged dogs on control food. A higher proportion of dogs on the enriched food learned the task, when the distance was increased to 1cm. Experiment 2 showed that accuracy decreased with increased distance between the reward object and landmark, and this effect was greater in old animals. Experiment 3 showed stability of performance, despite using a novel landmark, and new locations, indicating that dogs learned the landmark concept. Experiment 4 found age impaired long-term retention of the landmark task. These results indicate that allocentric spatial learning is impaired in an age-dependent manner in dogs, and that age also affects performance when the distance between the landmark and target is increased. In addition, these results both support a role of oxidative damage in the development of age-associated cognitive dysfunction and indicate that short-term administration of a food enriched with supplemental antioxidants and mitochondrial cofactors can partially reverse the deleterious effects of aging on cognition. Vet Clin North Am Small Anim Pract. 2003 Mar;33(2):405-16, vii-viii Dietary effects on canine and feline behavior. Houpt KA, Zicker S. Animal Behavior Clinic, College of Veterinary Medicine, Cornell University, Ithaca, NY 14853-6401, USA. The effects of dietary deficiency, including both malnutrition and deficiency of specific vitamins, on behavior is discussed with special emphasis on the growing kitten and puppy. The effect of caloric restriction on behavior is reviewed so that owners can be advised what to expect when their dog is placed on a reducing diet. The evidence for influence of dietary protein and tryptophan on canine aggression is presented. The effect of special diets on canine cognitive dysfunction is reviewed. I'd bet your not "LOL" now are you Lauren??? |
#508
|
|||
|
|||
You're kidding, right? A happier dog? That's a pretty interesting claim.
Wonder how SD tries to prove it, LOL Lauren The proof was presented at the World Veterinary Behavior meeting in British Columbia three years ago. It was proven again with military dogs all around the world. As a consequence of the testing done by Dr. Milgram in Toronto in 1999-2000 the US military switched all guard and work dogs over to the diet. Now two years later they have proven the value by being able to keep dogs "on-line" a full year longer than before. No loss of alertness on the job, no need to retire the working dogs as early as they used to be forced to retire them. It generated so much excitement that there are now three human trials underway with human Alzheimer's patients. It was proven again in a clinical study published in peer reviewed veterinary journals. Neurosci Biobehav Rev. 2002 Oct;26(6):679-95. Landmark discrimination learning in the dog: effects of age, an antioxidant fortified food, and cognitive strategy. Milgram NW, Head E, Muggenburg B, Holowachuk D, Murphey H, Estrada J, Ikeda-Douglas CJ, Zicker SC, Cotman CW. Life Science Division, University of Toronto at Scarborough, 1265 Military Trail, Scarborough, Ont., Canada M1C 1A4. The landmark discrimination learning test can be used to assess the ability to utilize allocentric spatial information to locate targets. The present experiments examined the role of various factors on performance of a landmark discrimination learning task in beagle dogs. Experiments 1 and 2 looked at the effects of age and food composition. Experiments 3 and 4 were aimed at characterizing the cognitive strategies used in performance on this task and in long-term retention. Cognitively equivalent groups of old and young dogs were placed into either a test group maintained on food enriched with a broad-spectrum of antioxidants and mitochondrial cofactors, or a control group maintained on a complete and balanced food formulated for adult dogs. Following a wash-in period, the dogs were tested on a series of problems, in which reward was obtained when the animal responded selectively to the object closest to a thin wooden block, which served as a landmark. In Experiment 1, dogs were first trained to respond to a landmark placed directly on top of coaster, landmark 0 (L0). In the next phase of testing, the landmark was moved at successively greater distances (1, 4 or 10 cm) away from the reward object. Learning varied as a function of age group, food group, and task. The young dogs learned all of the tasks more quickly than the old dogs. The aged dogs on the enriched food learned L0 significantly more rapidly than aged dogs on control food. A higher proportion of dogs on the enriched food learned the task, when the distance was increased to 1cm. Experiment 2 showed that accuracy decreased with increased distance between the reward object and landmark, and this effect was greater in old animals. Experiment 3 showed stability of performance, despite using a novel landmark, and new locations, indicating that dogs learned the landmark concept. Experiment 4 found age impaired long-term retention of the landmark task. These results indicate that allocentric spatial learning is impaired in an age-dependent manner in dogs, and that age also affects performance when the distance between the landmark and target is increased. In addition, these results both support a role of oxidative damage in the development of age-associated cognitive dysfunction and indicate that short-term administration of a food enriched with supplemental antioxidants and mitochondrial cofactors can partially reverse the deleterious effects of aging on cognition. Vet Clin North Am Small Anim Pract. 2003 Mar;33(2):405-16, vii-viii Dietary effects on canine and feline behavior. Houpt KA, Zicker S. Animal Behavior Clinic, College of Veterinary Medicine, Cornell University, Ithaca, NY 14853-6401, USA. The effects of dietary deficiency, including both malnutrition and deficiency of specific vitamins, on behavior is discussed with special emphasis on the growing kitten and puppy. The effect of caloric restriction on behavior is reviewed so that owners can be advised what to expect when their dog is placed on a reducing diet. The evidence for influence of dietary protein and tryptophan on canine aggression is presented. The effect of special diets on canine cognitive dysfunction is reviewed. I'd bet your not "LOL" now are you Lauren??? |
#509
|
|||
|
|||
WOW!!! I don't have dogs, but am c/ping this info for friends that DO! That
is amazing! Do they also make cat food with whatever they put in the dog food ? Thanks for that info, Steve Hailey The proof was presented at the World Veterinary Behavior meeting in British Columbia three years ago. It was proven again with military dogs all around the world. As a consequence of the testing done by Dr. Milgram in Toronto in 1999-2000 the US military switched all guard and work dogs over to the diet. Now two years later they have proven the value by being able to keep dogs "on-line" a full year longer than before. No loss of alertness on the job, no need to retire the working dogs as early as they used to be forced to retire them. It generated so much excitement that there are now three human trials underway with human Alzheimer's patients. It was proven again in a clinical study published in peer reviewed veterinary journals. Neurosci Biobehav Rev. 2002 Oct;26(6):679-95. Landmark discrimination learning in the dog: effects of age, an antioxidant fortified food, and cognitive strategy. Milgram NW, Head E, Muggenburg B, Holowachuk D, Murphey H, Estrada J, Ikeda-Douglas CJ, Zicker SC, Cotman CW. Life Science Division, University of Toronto at Scarborough, 1265 Military Trail, Scarborough, Ont., Canada M1C 1A4. The landmark discrimination learning test can be used to assess the ability to utilize allocentric spatial information to locate targets. The present experiments examined the role of various factors on performance of a landmark discrimination learning task in beagle dogs. Experiments 1 and 2 looked at the effects of age and food composition. Experiments 3 and 4 were aimed at characterizing the cognitive strategies used in performance on this task and in long-term retention. Cognitively equivalent groups of old and young dogs were placed into either a test group maintained on food enriched with a broad-spectrum of antioxidants and mitochondrial cofactors, or a control group maintained on a complete and balanced food formulated for adult dogs. Following a wash-in period, the dogs were tested on a series of problems, in which reward was obtained when the animal responded selectively to the object closest to a thin wooden block, which served as a landmark. In Experiment 1, dogs were first trained to respond to a landmark placed directly on top of coaster, landmark 0 (L0). In the next phase of testing, the landmark was moved at successively greater distances (1, 4 or 10 cm) away from the reward object. Learning varied as a function of age group, food group, and task. The young dogs learned all of the tasks more quickly than the old dogs. The aged dogs on the enriched food learned L0 significantly more rapidly than aged dogs on control food. A higher proportion of dogs on the enriched food learned the task, when the distance was increased to 1cm. Experiment 2 showed that accuracy decreased with increased distance between the reward object and landmark, and this effect was greater in old animals. Experiment 3 showed stability of performance, despite using a novel landmark, and new locations, indicating that dogs learned the landmark concept. Experiment 4 found age impaired long-term retention of the landmark task. These results indicate that allocentric spatial learning is impaired in an age-dependent manner in dogs, and that age also affects performance when the distance between the landmark and target is increased. In addition, these results both support a role of oxidative damage in the development of age-associated cognitive dysfunction and indicate that short-term administration of a food enriched with supplemental antioxidants and mitochondrial cofactors can partially reverse the deleterious effects of aging on cognition. Vet Clin North Am Small Anim Pract. 2003 Mar;33(2):405-16, vii-viii Dietary effects on canine and feline behavior. Houpt KA, Zicker S. Animal Behavior Clinic, College of Veterinary Medicine, Cornell University, Ithaca, NY 14853-6401, USA. The effects of dietary deficiency, including both malnutrition and deficiency of specific vitamins, on behavior is discussed with special emphasis on the growing kitten and puppy. The effect of caloric restriction on behavior is reviewed so that owners can be advised what to expect when their dog is placed on a reducing diet. The evidence for influence of dietary protein and tryptophan on canine aggression is presented. The effect of special diets on canine cognitive dysfunction is reviewed. I'd bet your not "LOL" now are you Lauren??? |
#510
|
|||
|
|||
WOW!!! I don't have dogs, but am c/ping this info for friends that DO! That
is amazing! Do they also make cat food with whatever they put in the dog food ? Thanks for that info, Steve Hailey The proof was presented at the World Veterinary Behavior meeting in British Columbia three years ago. It was proven again with military dogs all around the world. As a consequence of the testing done by Dr. Milgram in Toronto in 1999-2000 the US military switched all guard and work dogs over to the diet. Now two years later they have proven the value by being able to keep dogs "on-line" a full year longer than before. No loss of alertness on the job, no need to retire the working dogs as early as they used to be forced to retire them. It generated so much excitement that there are now three human trials underway with human Alzheimer's patients. It was proven again in a clinical study published in peer reviewed veterinary journals. Neurosci Biobehav Rev. 2002 Oct;26(6):679-95. Landmark discrimination learning in the dog: effects of age, an antioxidant fortified food, and cognitive strategy. Milgram NW, Head E, Muggenburg B, Holowachuk D, Murphey H, Estrada J, Ikeda-Douglas CJ, Zicker SC, Cotman CW. Life Science Division, University of Toronto at Scarborough, 1265 Military Trail, Scarborough, Ont., Canada M1C 1A4. The landmark discrimination learning test can be used to assess the ability to utilize allocentric spatial information to locate targets. The present experiments examined the role of various factors on performance of a landmark discrimination learning task in beagle dogs. Experiments 1 and 2 looked at the effects of age and food composition. Experiments 3 and 4 were aimed at characterizing the cognitive strategies used in performance on this task and in long-term retention. Cognitively equivalent groups of old and young dogs were placed into either a test group maintained on food enriched with a broad-spectrum of antioxidants and mitochondrial cofactors, or a control group maintained on a complete and balanced food formulated for adult dogs. Following a wash-in period, the dogs were tested on a series of problems, in which reward was obtained when the animal responded selectively to the object closest to a thin wooden block, which served as a landmark. In Experiment 1, dogs were first trained to respond to a landmark placed directly on top of coaster, landmark 0 (L0). In the next phase of testing, the landmark was moved at successively greater distances (1, 4 or 10 cm) away from the reward object. Learning varied as a function of age group, food group, and task. The young dogs learned all of the tasks more quickly than the old dogs. The aged dogs on the enriched food learned L0 significantly more rapidly than aged dogs on control food. A higher proportion of dogs on the enriched food learned the task, when the distance was increased to 1cm. Experiment 2 showed that accuracy decreased with increased distance between the reward object and landmark, and this effect was greater in old animals. Experiment 3 showed stability of performance, despite using a novel landmark, and new locations, indicating that dogs learned the landmark concept. Experiment 4 found age impaired long-term retention of the landmark task. These results indicate that allocentric spatial learning is impaired in an age-dependent manner in dogs, and that age also affects performance when the distance between the landmark and target is increased. In addition, these results both support a role of oxidative damage in the development of age-associated cognitive dysfunction and indicate that short-term administration of a food enriched with supplemental antioxidants and mitochondrial cofactors can partially reverse the deleterious effects of aging on cognition. Vet Clin North Am Small Anim Pract. 2003 Mar;33(2):405-16, vii-viii Dietary effects on canine and feline behavior. Houpt KA, Zicker S. Animal Behavior Clinic, College of Veterinary Medicine, Cornell University, Ithaca, NY 14853-6401, USA. The effects of dietary deficiency, including both malnutrition and deficiency of specific vitamins, on behavior is discussed with special emphasis on the growing kitten and puppy. The effect of caloric restriction on behavior is reviewed so that owners can be advised what to expect when their dog is placed on a reducing diet. The evidence for influence of dietary protein and tryptophan on canine aggression is presented. The effect of special diets on canine cognitive dysfunction is reviewed. I'd bet your not "LOL" now are you Lauren??? |
Thread Tools | |
Display Modes | |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
Science Diet question... | Joe Canuck | Cat health & behaviour | 188 | December 12th 03 12:30 AM |
Reply for Phil | -L. | Cat health & behaviour | 8 | October 23rd 03 12:30 PM |
Follow-up question about canned cat food | Jerold Pearson | Cat health & behaviour | 34 | August 8th 03 01:52 AM |