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  #11  
Old May 7th 04, 08:00 PM
KellyH
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

This is just horrible. I can't (well, I can, that's the sad part) believe
that the girlfriend is sticking by him. We had two sweet cats turned in to
the shelter because the boyfriend was beating on them. At least the
girlfriend had the smarts to get the cats out of the house. We had her talk
to a battered women's shelter worker. Unfortuntaely, the last we heard from
her is that she is going back to the boyfriend.

I bet anything in a couple years this guy is going to be abusing children.

--
-Kelly
kelly at farringtons dot net
Check out www.snittens.com

"James Marz" wrote in message
om...
What would you do if your daughters boyfriend did this to your cats?



This was taken from an article by Amber Hunt Martin.

start article

It wasn't just that Edward Baker allegedly bashed the cat in the face.
Or that he chased it around the blood-spattered laundry room. Or that
he extinguished cigarettes on another cat's paws.

It was, authorities said, that he acted methodically, intentionally.


Baker, 20, is charged with animal torture, a felony punishable by up
to 4 years in prison upon conviction. Police said Baker was living
with his 17-year-old girlfriend and her family when he began
tormenting and beating two orange tabbies named Crystal and Haley,
ages 8 and 3.

Crystal had been bashed in the face with a bottle of laundry detergent
so hard, her teeth pierced the bottle. The impact broke her lower jaw
and cracked her sternum and upper jaw.

Her daughter, Haley, had singed fur and charred, black paw pads,
apparently from being burned by a lighter or cigarettes.

Both cats are healing at home, said their owner, Kim Steis.

"They're still a little afraid when someone walks down the hallway,"
she said Tuesday. "I don't think they'll ever be the same."

Steis, whose daughter Tia is still dating Baker, said the man moved
into her Clinton Township ranch in December. Baker seemed friendly,
she said, but the cats clearly didn't like him.

Steis discovered that Haley's left front leg was broken in January.
Steis didn't know how it happened, but she noticed that the usually
people-friendly pet raced from a room when Baker entered.

Then, on Feb. 21, she heard Crystal wailing in the laundry room.

She said she found the cat on her back near the furnace, hissing at
Baker, who hovered nearby.

Crystal's mouth was bloody and swollen; both eyes were bruised.

Steis has paid $1,767 in veterinarian bills.

Baker's girlfriend is standing by him and has offered to testify on
his behalf.

end article

Well, What would you like to do or say to this man?


James Marz

For full article
http://www.freep.com/news/locmac/peta14_20040414.htm



  #12  
Old May 7th 04, 08:11 PM
Cat Protector
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Some people don't have the strength. I have always wondered why women who
get treated badly seem to go back to the guy who does it? Of course when
abuse is involved, the pattern seems to be that the guy promises to change
or says he won't do it anymore. Then he'll get violent again and continue to
do harm. Unless women who are being abused break free from the relationship
and seek help they'll continue to allow themselves to be victims. It is all
about power and control. Of course some men can be the victims in abusive
relationships too. It is sad. It is even worse when the animal is abused.

--
Panther TEK: Staying On Top Of All Your Computer Needs!
www.members.cox.net/catprotector/panthertek

Cat Galaxy: All Cats, All The Time!
www.catgalaxymedia.com
"KellyH" wrote in message
news:[email protected]_s03...
This is just horrible. I can't (well, I can, that's the sad part) believe
that the girlfriend is sticking by him. We had two sweet cats turned in

to
the shelter because the boyfriend was beating on them. At least the
girlfriend had the smarts to get the cats out of the house. We had her

talk
to a battered women's shelter worker. Unfortuntaely, the last we heard

from
her is that she is going back to the boyfriend.

I bet anything in a couple years this guy is going to be abusing children.

--
-Kelly
kelly at farringtons dot net
Check out www.snittens.com

"James Marz" wrote in message
om...
What would you do if your daughters boyfriend did this to your cats?



This was taken from an article by Amber Hunt Martin.

start article

It wasn't just that Edward Baker allegedly bashed the cat in the face.
Or that he chased it around the blood-spattered laundry room. Or that
he extinguished cigarettes on another cat's paws.

It was, authorities said, that he acted methodically, intentionally.


Baker, 20, is charged with animal torture, a felony punishable by up
to 4 years in prison upon conviction. Police said Baker was living
with his 17-year-old girlfriend and her family when he began
tormenting and beating two orange tabbies named Crystal and Haley,
ages 8 and 3.

Crystal had been bashed in the face with a bottle of laundry detergent
so hard, her teeth pierced the bottle. The impact broke her lower jaw
and cracked her sternum and upper jaw.

Her daughter, Haley, had singed fur and charred, black paw pads,
apparently from being burned by a lighter or cigarettes.

Both cats are healing at home, said their owner, Kim Steis.

"They're still a little afraid when someone walks down the hallway,"
she said Tuesday. "I don't think they'll ever be the same."

Steis, whose daughter Tia is still dating Baker, said the man moved
into her Clinton Township ranch in December. Baker seemed friendly,
she said, but the cats clearly didn't like him.

Steis discovered that Haley's left front leg was broken in January.
Steis didn't know how it happened, but she noticed that the usually
people-friendly pet raced from a room when Baker entered.

Then, on Feb. 21, she heard Crystal wailing in the laundry room.

She said she found the cat on her back near the furnace, hissing at
Baker, who hovered nearby.

Crystal's mouth was bloody and swollen; both eyes were bruised.

Steis has paid $1,767 in veterinarian bills.

Baker's girlfriend is standing by him and has offered to testify on
his behalf.

end article

Well, What would you like to do or say to this man?


James Marz

For full article
http://www.freep.com/news/locmac/peta14_20040414.htm





  #13  
Old May 7th 04, 08:11 PM
Cat Protector
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Some people don't have the strength. I have always wondered why women who
get treated badly seem to go back to the guy who does it? Of course when
abuse is involved, the pattern seems to be that the guy promises to change
or says he won't do it anymore. Then he'll get violent again and continue to
do harm. Unless women who are being abused break free from the relationship
and seek help they'll continue to allow themselves to be victims. It is all
about power and control. Of course some men can be the victims in abusive
relationships too. It is sad. It is even worse when the animal is abused.

--
Panther TEK: Staying On Top Of All Your Computer Needs!
www.members.cox.net/catprotector/panthertek

Cat Galaxy: All Cats, All The Time!
www.catgalaxymedia.com
"KellyH" wrote in message
news:[email protected]_s03...
This is just horrible. I can't (well, I can, that's the sad part) believe
that the girlfriend is sticking by him. We had two sweet cats turned in

to
the shelter because the boyfriend was beating on them. At least the
girlfriend had the smarts to get the cats out of the house. We had her

talk
to a battered women's shelter worker. Unfortuntaely, the last we heard

from
her is that she is going back to the boyfriend.

I bet anything in a couple years this guy is going to be abusing children.

--
-Kelly
kelly at farringtons dot net
Check out www.snittens.com

"James Marz" wrote in message
om...
What would you do if your daughters boyfriend did this to your cats?



This was taken from an article by Amber Hunt Martin.

start article

It wasn't just that Edward Baker allegedly bashed the cat in the face.
Or that he chased it around the blood-spattered laundry room. Or that
he extinguished cigarettes on another cat's paws.

It was, authorities said, that he acted methodically, intentionally.


Baker, 20, is charged with animal torture, a felony punishable by up
to 4 years in prison upon conviction. Police said Baker was living
with his 17-year-old girlfriend and her family when he began
tormenting and beating two orange tabbies named Crystal and Haley,
ages 8 and 3.

Crystal had been bashed in the face with a bottle of laundry detergent
so hard, her teeth pierced the bottle. The impact broke her lower jaw
and cracked her sternum and upper jaw.

Her daughter, Haley, had singed fur and charred, black paw pads,
apparently from being burned by a lighter or cigarettes.

Both cats are healing at home, said their owner, Kim Steis.

"They're still a little afraid when someone walks down the hallway,"
she said Tuesday. "I don't think they'll ever be the same."

Steis, whose daughter Tia is still dating Baker, said the man moved
into her Clinton Township ranch in December. Baker seemed friendly,
she said, but the cats clearly didn't like him.

Steis discovered that Haley's left front leg was broken in January.
Steis didn't know how it happened, but she noticed that the usually
people-friendly pet raced from a room when Baker entered.

Then, on Feb. 21, she heard Crystal wailing in the laundry room.

She said she found the cat on her back near the furnace, hissing at
Baker, who hovered nearby.

Crystal's mouth was bloody and swollen; both eyes were bruised.

Steis has paid $1,767 in veterinarian bills.

Baker's girlfriend is standing by him and has offered to testify on
his behalf.

end article

Well, What would you like to do or say to this man?


James Marz

For full article
http://www.freep.com/news/locmac/peta14_20040414.htm





  #14  
Old May 7th 04, 09:14 PM
Scumball
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Well said Craig.
All animals are sentient beings - and only a true psychopath would want to
harm them.
A recent documentary on the military and killing featured recent research
which found that just 2% of troops were responsible for 95% of the killing.
This 2% was composed of psychopaths who are not hardwired against killing
their own species - an evolutionary adaptation ensuring survival of the
species.
They usually begin their lives by torturing and killing animals.

"Craig Petersen" wrote in message
...
James Marz wrote:

What would you do if your daughters boyfriend did this to your cats?



rant
Personally I would treat this dickless piece of **** in the same manner.
What would happen to me would be irrevelant, as long as I had the
satisfaction beating the **** out of a sadistic animal abuser. Animal
abusers are PUSSYS, they pick on the most defenseless beings on the
planet, they cannot contribute ANYTHING usefull to society. If I seem a
bit extreme it's because most, if not ALL animal abusers get nothing
more than an insulting slap on the wrist.

I don't consider pets to be "property" or "things to be owned", that's
what your DVD and or TV are for. Animals are beings, just like you and
me. They are just unfortunate enough to be born on a planet that is
populated by a bunch of sadistic cannibals (AKA Man). If you have pets
you are their GUARDIAN ( you don't OWN them anymore that you would OWN
your children ), and are 100% responsible for their well being.
/rant







This was taken from an article by Amber Hunt Martin.

start article

It wasn't just that Edward Baker allegedly bashed the cat in the face.
Or that he chased it around the blood-spattered laundry room. Or that
he extinguished cigarettes on another cat's paws.

It was, authorities said, that he acted methodically, intentionally.


Baker, 20, is charged with animal torture, a felony punishable by up
to 4 years in prison upon conviction. Police said Baker was living
with his 17-year-old girlfriend and her family when he began
tormenting and beating two orange tabbies named Crystal and Haley,
ages 8 and 3.

Crystal had been bashed in the face with a bottle of laundry detergent
so hard, her teeth pierced the bottle. The impact broke her lower jaw
and cracked her sternum and upper jaw.

Her daughter, Haley, had singed fur and charred, black paw pads,
apparently from being burned by a lighter or cigarettes.

Both cats are healing at home, said their owner, Kim Steis.

"They're still a little afraid when someone walks down the hallway,"
she said Tuesday. "I don't think they'll ever be the same."

Steis, whose daughter Tia is still dating Baker, said the man moved
into her Clinton Township ranch in December. Baker seemed friendly,
she said, but the cats clearly didn't like him.

Steis discovered that Haley's left front leg was broken in January.
Steis didn't know how it happened, but she noticed that the usually
people-friendly pet raced from a room when Baker entered.

Then, on Feb. 21, she heard Crystal wailing in the laundry room.

She said she found the cat on her back near the furnace, hissing at
Baker, who hovered nearby.

Crystal's mouth was bloody and swollen; both eyes were bruised.

Steis has paid $1,767 in veterinarian bills.

Baker's girlfriend is standing by him and has offered to testify on
his behalf.

end article

Well, What would you like to do or say to this man?


James Marz

For full article
http://www.freep.com/news/locmac/peta14_20040414.htm



  #15  
Old May 7th 04, 09:14 PM
Scumball
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Well said Craig.
All animals are sentient beings - and only a true psychopath would want to
harm them.
A recent documentary on the military and killing featured recent research
which found that just 2% of troops were responsible for 95% of the killing.
This 2% was composed of psychopaths who are not hardwired against killing
their own species - an evolutionary adaptation ensuring survival of the
species.
They usually begin their lives by torturing and killing animals.

"Craig Petersen" wrote in message
...
James Marz wrote:

What would you do if your daughters boyfriend did this to your cats?



rant
Personally I would treat this dickless piece of **** in the same manner.
What would happen to me would be irrevelant, as long as I had the
satisfaction beating the **** out of a sadistic animal abuser. Animal
abusers are PUSSYS, they pick on the most defenseless beings on the
planet, they cannot contribute ANYTHING usefull to society. If I seem a
bit extreme it's because most, if not ALL animal abusers get nothing
more than an insulting slap on the wrist.

I don't consider pets to be "property" or "things to be owned", that's
what your DVD and or TV are for. Animals are beings, just like you and
me. They are just unfortunate enough to be born on a planet that is
populated by a bunch of sadistic cannibals (AKA Man). If you have pets
you are their GUARDIAN ( you don't OWN them anymore that you would OWN
your children ), and are 100% responsible for their well being.
/rant







This was taken from an article by Amber Hunt Martin.

start article

It wasn't just that Edward Baker allegedly bashed the cat in the face.
Or that he chased it around the blood-spattered laundry room. Or that
he extinguished cigarettes on another cat's paws.

It was, authorities said, that he acted methodically, intentionally.


Baker, 20, is charged with animal torture, a felony punishable by up
to 4 years in prison upon conviction. Police said Baker was living
with his 17-year-old girlfriend and her family when he began
tormenting and beating two orange tabbies named Crystal and Haley,
ages 8 and 3.

Crystal had been bashed in the face with a bottle of laundry detergent
so hard, her teeth pierced the bottle. The impact broke her lower jaw
and cracked her sternum and upper jaw.

Her daughter, Haley, had singed fur and charred, black paw pads,
apparently from being burned by a lighter or cigarettes.

Both cats are healing at home, said their owner, Kim Steis.

"They're still a little afraid when someone walks down the hallway,"
she said Tuesday. "I don't think they'll ever be the same."

Steis, whose daughter Tia is still dating Baker, said the man moved
into her Clinton Township ranch in December. Baker seemed friendly,
she said, but the cats clearly didn't like him.

Steis discovered that Haley's left front leg was broken in January.
Steis didn't know how it happened, but she noticed that the usually
people-friendly pet raced from a room when Baker entered.

Then, on Feb. 21, she heard Crystal wailing in the laundry room.

She said she found the cat on her back near the furnace, hissing at
Baker, who hovered nearby.

Crystal's mouth was bloody and swollen; both eyes were bruised.

Steis has paid $1,767 in veterinarian bills.

Baker's girlfriend is standing by him and has offered to testify on
his behalf.

end article

Well, What would you like to do or say to this man?


James Marz

For full article
http://www.freep.com/news/locmac/peta14_20040414.htm



  #16  
Old May 7th 04, 10:15 PM
Cat Protector
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Well everyone has a choice. You can lead a horse to water but you can't
force them to drink. A lot of abused women seem to believe everything they
are telling them including that is their fault. If the guy hits them then
they simply shrug it off and keep taking the abuse. If they leave the
relationship then 9 times out of 10 they go back because the other party
says they're sorry and won't do it again or that they'll change. But of
course that's a lie and the cycle continues. I usually say that nobody
deserves to be abused like that but they also made the choice. They can
continue to be the victim or they can fight back, escape the relationship,
and get help.

The abusers also need to really see what it is to be the victim and get
help. Of course I am not sure how effective therapy is. It seems like a lot
of abusers hide behind excuses like poor childhood, broken home, divorced
parents, etc. The defense lawyers use this one a lot when the abuser is
accused of a crime. Of course this just seems to excuse the abusive
behavior. I think abusers need to stand up and say they have a problem, then
get help. It is all about choices. But no animal should be abused. This 17
year old girl needs to finally wake up and leave this guy or she will be
this guy's next victim.

--
Panther TEK: Staying On Top Of All Your Computer Needs!
www.members.cox.net/catprotector/panthertek

Cat Galaxy: All Cats, All The Time!
www.catgalaxymedia.com

"RobZip" wrote in message
...
Abusers have an incredible ability to be manipulative of all of those they
encounter in the course of and as a consequence of their actions. The

women
usually hear an array of excuses and explanations. I've heard of some who
convinced a woman that they wouldn't have acted out so badly if it wasn't
for the strong love they have for them. Now how warped is that? Others

have
a multitude of rationales to shift the blame for such actions to the

woman.
Along with this comes the psychological modeling in which the abuser plays
on the woman's already damaged self-esteem. He convinces her that she
wouldn't stand a chance being on her own, that she wouldn't be worthy and
capable of survival in a truly equal relationship, etc.

When living in Tampa I was in an area with a heavy Puerto Rican

population.
Certain parts of their culture have a much different view on relationship
power and control than white Anglos. I had a very pretty Puerto Rican
neighbor girl who was flirting with me, hanging around, and generally
'stepping out of line' in order to evoke a controlling response from her
boyfriend whom she suspected was losing interest in her. She told me that

if
he really cared, he would order her to stay in the apartment, avoid me,

and
probably threaten to physically punish her if that wasn't part of his
initial expression of displeasure at her behavior.

Unless women who are being abused break free from the relationship
and seek help they'll continue to allow themselves to be victims. It is

all
about power and control.


These women find it hard to accept that they DO have control. They've only
relinquished it on bad terms to someone else.

An abuser who promises to change and swears he won't do it again most

likely
really and truly believes what he's saying. But there are many reasons why
that always fails. Foremost is that one has to honestly take their own
inventory and understand it before they have any hope of changing it.
On what authority do I say this? I grew up in a home with a physically
abusive father. I swore I would never treat my wife like that when I got
married.

Well guess what? Along the way I never learned any of the proper coping
skills or honest interpersonal relationship skills. How could I?

Everything
was a masquerade to shift blame and deflect the truth. Although I never
sought out to repeat the violent mistakes of my father, I had the same bad
interpersonal and coping skills he did. It was all I ever had a chance to
learn. It was the only example I had. The natural byproduct was that I
bullied, punched, swore and manipulated my way through two disastrous
marriages. At age 36 I was finally tired enough of my life, beaten and

ready
to do something about it. My pride was gone. Funny - most of us think we
have all the answers and it's the rest of the world that is so screwed up.
That's why we are able to do the things we do. You can't make change
meaningful until you lose the false pride and are ready to have every
element of your life taken apart. I invested the next 6 years in one on

one
therapy, 12 step abusers programs, group therapy abuser sessions, etc. It
wasn't an easy or quick fix. Serious matters are never resolved easily.

It's
tough to sit and listen to a group who has been there and done that take
your ass apart piece by piece, telling you everything that is wrong with

how
you think about everything - and you know that they're right. The good

news
is that once you are willing to acknowledge and accept those things, the
replacement skills are much easier to practice.

Unless a person is willing to make that kind of effort for their own self
improvement, the cycle will continue. That's why the young lady involved
needs to drop this guy like last weeks garbage. But since she is already
defending him I guess we really don't need a crystal ball to see where

this
is going. I sincerely hope that both of them are sterile....




  #17  
Old May 7th 04, 10:15 PM
Cat Protector
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Well everyone has a choice. You can lead a horse to water but you can't
force them to drink. A lot of abused women seem to believe everything they
are telling them including that is their fault. If the guy hits them then
they simply shrug it off and keep taking the abuse. If they leave the
relationship then 9 times out of 10 they go back because the other party
says they're sorry and won't do it again or that they'll change. But of
course that's a lie and the cycle continues. I usually say that nobody
deserves to be abused like that but they also made the choice. They can
continue to be the victim or they can fight back, escape the relationship,
and get help.

The abusers also need to really see what it is to be the victim and get
help. Of course I am not sure how effective therapy is. It seems like a lot
of abusers hide behind excuses like poor childhood, broken home, divorced
parents, etc. The defense lawyers use this one a lot when the abuser is
accused of a crime. Of course this just seems to excuse the abusive
behavior. I think abusers need to stand up and say they have a problem, then
get help. It is all about choices. But no animal should be abused. This 17
year old girl needs to finally wake up and leave this guy or she will be
this guy's next victim.

--
Panther TEK: Staying On Top Of All Your Computer Needs!
www.members.cox.net/catprotector/panthertek

Cat Galaxy: All Cats, All The Time!
www.catgalaxymedia.com

"RobZip" wrote in message
...
Abusers have an incredible ability to be manipulative of all of those they
encounter in the course of and as a consequence of their actions. The

women
usually hear an array of excuses and explanations. I've heard of some who
convinced a woman that they wouldn't have acted out so badly if it wasn't
for the strong love they have for them. Now how warped is that? Others

have
a multitude of rationales to shift the blame for such actions to the

woman.
Along with this comes the psychological modeling in which the abuser plays
on the woman's already damaged self-esteem. He convinces her that she
wouldn't stand a chance being on her own, that she wouldn't be worthy and
capable of survival in a truly equal relationship, etc.

When living in Tampa I was in an area with a heavy Puerto Rican

population.
Certain parts of their culture have a much different view on relationship
power and control than white Anglos. I had a very pretty Puerto Rican
neighbor girl who was flirting with me, hanging around, and generally
'stepping out of line' in order to evoke a controlling response from her
boyfriend whom she suspected was losing interest in her. She told me that

if
he really cared, he would order her to stay in the apartment, avoid me,

and
probably threaten to physically punish her if that wasn't part of his
initial expression of displeasure at her behavior.

Unless women who are being abused break free from the relationship
and seek help they'll continue to allow themselves to be victims. It is

all
about power and control.


These women find it hard to accept that they DO have control. They've only
relinquished it on bad terms to someone else.

An abuser who promises to change and swears he won't do it again most

likely
really and truly believes what he's saying. But there are many reasons why
that always fails. Foremost is that one has to honestly take their own
inventory and understand it before they have any hope of changing it.
On what authority do I say this? I grew up in a home with a physically
abusive father. I swore I would never treat my wife like that when I got
married.

Well guess what? Along the way I never learned any of the proper coping
skills or honest interpersonal relationship skills. How could I?

Everything
was a masquerade to shift blame and deflect the truth. Although I never
sought out to repeat the violent mistakes of my father, I had the same bad
interpersonal and coping skills he did. It was all I ever had a chance to
learn. It was the only example I had. The natural byproduct was that I
bullied, punched, swore and manipulated my way through two disastrous
marriages. At age 36 I was finally tired enough of my life, beaten and

ready
to do something about it. My pride was gone. Funny - most of us think we
have all the answers and it's the rest of the world that is so screwed up.
That's why we are able to do the things we do. You can't make change
meaningful until you lose the false pride and are ready to have every
element of your life taken apart. I invested the next 6 years in one on

one
therapy, 12 step abusers programs, group therapy abuser sessions, etc. It
wasn't an easy or quick fix. Serious matters are never resolved easily.

It's
tough to sit and listen to a group who has been there and done that take
your ass apart piece by piece, telling you everything that is wrong with

how
you think about everything - and you know that they're right. The good

news
is that once you are willing to acknowledge and accept those things, the
replacement skills are much easier to practice.

Unless a person is willing to make that kind of effort for their own self
improvement, the cycle will continue. That's why the young lady involved
needs to drop this guy like last weeks garbage. But since she is already
defending him I guess we really don't need a crystal ball to see where

this
is going. I sincerely hope that both of them are sterile....




  #18  
Old May 7th 04, 11:42 PM
RobZip
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Cat Protector" wrote in message
news:y%Smc.25283$Z%[email protected]

The abusers also need to really see what it is to be the victim and get
help.


There are many excellent materials out there to help an abuser understand
the impact of his actions. This is essential as part of an overall
reprogramming effort.

Of course I am not sure how effective therapy is.


As in anything else, quality varies.

It seems like a lot of abusers hide behind excuses like poor childhood,

broken home, divorced
parents, etc. The defense lawyers use this one a lot when the abuser is
accused of a crime. Of course this just seems to excuse the abusive
behavior.


The root causes of domestic violence are just that - root causes. The abuser
has for whatever reason not developed an acceptable method of dealing with
conflict. The abuser has a choice - continue the behavior or seek ways to
change it. When the behavior continues, the root causes become the excuses
used as a crutch to avoid accepting responsibility for one's own actions.
There are so many complex factors involved in breaking through the denial
and defense mechanisms that abusers invoke regarding their behavior.

I think abusers need to stand up and say they have a problem, then
get help. It is all about choices.


That is obviously the first step. The path to reformation gets tougher from
there.

But no animal should be abused. This 17 year old girl needs to finally wake

up
and leave this guy or she will be this guy's next victim.


She is his next victim already. Even if he has never laid a hand on her yet,
he's already got her defending his seriously abnormal actions. Not a good
sign. He's already noticed that she will defend his senseless violence. Why
should anything he does to her be regarded differently?

'I'm really sorry for what I did to your cats, but it's what you get for
loving me.'



  #19  
Old May 7th 04, 11:42 PM
RobZip
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"Cat Protector" wrote in message
news:y%Smc.25283$Z%[email protected]

The abusers also need to really see what it is to be the victim and get
help.


There are many excellent materials out there to help an abuser understand
the impact of his actions. This is essential as part of an overall
reprogramming effort.

Of course I am not sure how effective therapy is.


As in anything else, quality varies.

It seems like a lot of abusers hide behind excuses like poor childhood,

broken home, divorced
parents, etc. The defense lawyers use this one a lot when the abuser is
accused of a crime. Of course this just seems to excuse the abusive
behavior.


The root causes of domestic violence are just that - root causes. The abuser
has for whatever reason not developed an acceptable method of dealing with
conflict. The abuser has a choice - continue the behavior or seek ways to
change it. When the behavior continues, the root causes become the excuses
used as a crutch to avoid accepting responsibility for one's own actions.
There are so many complex factors involved in breaking through the denial
and defense mechanisms that abusers invoke regarding their behavior.

I think abusers need to stand up and say they have a problem, then
get help. It is all about choices.


That is obviously the first step. The path to reformation gets tougher from
there.

But no animal should be abused. This 17 year old girl needs to finally wake

up
and leave this guy or she will be this guy's next victim.


She is his next victim already. Even if he has never laid a hand on her yet,
he's already got her defending his seriously abnormal actions. Not a good
sign. He's already noticed that she will defend his senseless violence. Why
should anything he does to her be regarded differently?

'I'm really sorry for what I did to your cats, but it's what you get for
loving me.'



  #20  
Old May 8th 04, 01:26 AM
Tiners
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"Cat Protector" wrote in message
news:y%Smc.25283$Z%[email protected]
Well everyone has a choice. You can lead a horse to water but you can't
force them to drink. A lot of abused women seem to believe everything they
are telling them including that is their fault. If the guy hits them then
they simply shrug it off and keep taking the abuse. If they leave the
relationship then 9 times out of 10 they go back because the other party
says they're sorry and won't do it again or that they'll change. But of
course that's a lie and the cycle continues. I usually say that nobody
deserves to be abused like that but they also made the choice. They can
continue to be the victim or they can fight back, escape the relationship,
and get help.

The abusers also need to really see what it is to be the victim and get
help. Of course I am not sure how effective therapy is. It seems like a

lot
of abusers hide behind excuses like poor childhood, broken home, divorced
parents, etc. The defense lawyers use this one a lot when the abuser is
accused of a crime. Of course this just seems to excuse the abusive
behavior. I think abusers need to stand up and say they have a problem,

then
get help. It is all about choices. But no animal should be abused. This 17
year old girl needs to finally wake up and leave this guy or she will be
this guy's next victim.

--
Panther TEK: Staying On Top Of All Your Computer Needs!
www.members.cox.net/catprotector/panthertek

Cat Galaxy: All Cats, All The Time!
www.catgalaxymedia.com

"RobZip" wrote in message
...
Abusers have an incredible ability to be manipulative of all of those

they
encounter in the course of and as a consequence of their actions. The

women
usually hear an array of excuses and explanations. I've heard of some

who
convinced a woman that they wouldn't have acted out so badly if it

wasn't
for the strong love they have for them. Now how warped is that? Others

have
a multitude of rationales to shift the blame for such actions to the

woman.
Along with this comes the psychological modeling in which the abuser

plays
on the woman's already damaged self-esteem. He convinces her that she
wouldn't stand a chance being on her own, that she wouldn't be worthy

and
capable of survival in a truly equal relationship, etc.

When living in Tampa I was in an area with a heavy Puerto Rican

population.
Certain parts of their culture have a much different view on

relationship
power and control than white Anglos. I had a very pretty Puerto Rican
neighbor girl who was flirting with me, hanging around, and generally
'stepping out of line' in order to evoke a controlling response from her
boyfriend whom she suspected was losing interest in her. She told me

that
if
he really cared, he would order her to stay in the apartment, avoid me,

and
probably threaten to physically punish her if that wasn't part of his
initial expression of displeasure at her behavior.

Unless women who are being abused break free from the relationship
and seek help they'll continue to allow themselves to be victims. It

is
all
about power and control.


These women find it hard to accept that they DO have control. They've

only
relinquished it on bad terms to someone else.

An abuser who promises to change and swears he won't do it again most

likely
really and truly believes what he's saying. But there are many reasons

why
that always fails. Foremost is that one has to honestly take their own
inventory and understand it before they have any hope of changing it.
On what authority do I say this? I grew up in a home with a physically
abusive father. I swore I would never treat my wife like that when I got
married.

Well guess what? Along the way I never learned any of the proper coping
skills or honest interpersonal relationship skills. How could I?

Everything
was a masquerade to shift blame and deflect the truth. Although I never
sought out to repeat the violent mistakes of my father, I had the same

bad
interpersonal and coping skills he did. It was all I ever had a chance

to
learn. It was the only example I had. The natural byproduct was that I
bullied, punched, swore and manipulated my way through two disastrous
marriages. At age 36 I was finally tired enough of my life, beaten and

ready
to do something about it. My pride was gone. Funny - most of us think we
have all the answers and it's the rest of the world that is so screwed

up.
That's why we are able to do the things we do. You can't make change
meaningful until you lose the false pride and are ready to have every
element of your life taken apart. I invested the next 6 years in one on

one
therapy, 12 step abusers programs, group therapy abuser sessions, etc.

It
wasn't an easy or quick fix. Serious matters are never resolved easily.

It's
tough to sit and listen to a group who has been there and done that take
your ass apart piece by piece, telling you everything that is wrong with

how
you think about everything - and you know that they're right. The good

news
is that once you are willing to acknowledge and accept those things, the
replacement skills are much easier to practice.

Unless a person is willing to make that kind of effort for their own

self
improvement, the cycle will continue. That's why the young lady involved
needs to drop this guy like last weeks garbage. But since she is already
defending him I guess we really don't need a crystal ball to see where

this
is going. I sincerely hope that both of them are sterile....



When your 17 and have a boyfriend of course your gonna stick up for him
because your 17 and you think there's no one else in the world for you
beside's this guy. One day she'll wake up and get a good kick in the
pants.. and leave him. Probably after she's the guy's next victim. Trust
me I know from experience.. nothing like the cat tortures or anything but I
was 17 once with an abusive boyfriend.

Tina


 




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