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  #1  
Old March 25th 05, 04:59 AM
Karen
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Default OT Rant, rant rant

I begin to feel as though we are descending into the Dark Ages again.....



Capitol bill aims to control Œleftistı profs
THE LAW COULD LET STUDENTS SUE FOR UNTOLERATED BELIEFS.

By JAMES VANLANDINGHAM
Alligator Staff Writer

TALLAHASSEE ‹ Republicans on the House Choice and Innovation Committee voted
along party lines Tuesday to pass a bill that aims to stamp out ³leftist
totalitarianism² by ³dictator professors² in the classrooms of Floridaıs
universities.

The Academic Freedom Bill of Rights, sponsored by Rep. Dennis Baxley,
R-Ocala, passed 8-to-2 despite strenuous objections from the only two
Democrats on the committee.

The bill has two more committees to pass before it can be considered by the
full House.

While promoting the bill Tuesday, Baxley said a university education should
be more than ³one biased view by the professor, who as a dictator controls
the classroom,² as part of ³a misuse of their platform to indoctrinate the
next generation with their own views.²

The bill sets a statewide standard that students cannot be punished for
professing beliefs with which their professors disagree. Professors would
also be advised to teach alternative ³serious academic theories² that may
disagree with their personal views.

According to a legislative staff analysis of the bill, the law would give
students who think their beliefs are not being respected legal standing to
sue professors and universities.

Students who believe their professor is singling them out for ³public
ridicule² * for instance, when professors use the Socratic method to force
students to explain their theories in class * would also be given the right
to sue.

³Some professors say, ŒEvolution is a fact. I donıt want to hear about
Intelligent Design (a creationist theory), and if you donıt like it, thereıs
the door,ı² Baxley said, citing one example when he thought a student should
sue.

Rep. Dan Gelber, D-Miami Beach, warned of lawsuits from students enrolled in
Holocaust history courses who believe the Holocaust never happened.

Similar suits could be filed by students who donıt believe astronauts landed
on the moon, who believe teaching birth control is a sin or even by Shands
medical students who refuse to perform blood transfusions and believe prayer
is the only way to heal the body, Gelber added.

³This is a horrible step,² he said. ³Universities will have to hire lawyers
so our curricula can be decided by judges in courtrooms. Professors might
have to pay court costs ‹ even if they win ‹ from their own pockets. This is
not an innocent piece of legislation.²

The staff analysis also warned the bill may shift responsibility for
determining whether a studentıs freedom has been infringed from the faculty
to the courts.

But Baxley brushed off Gelberıs concerns. ³Freedom is a dangerous thing, and
you might be exposed to things you donıt want to hear,² he said. ³Being a
businessman, I found out you can be sued for anything. Besides, if students
are being persecuted and ridiculed for their beliefs, I think they should be
given standing to sue.²

During the committee hearing, Baxley cast opposition to his bill as
³leftists² struggling against ³mainstream society.²

³The critics ridicule me for daring to stand up for students and faculty,²
he said, adding that he was called a McCarthyist.

Baxley later said he had a list of students who were discriminated against
by professors, but refused to reveal names because he felt they would be
persecuted.

Rep. Eleanor Sobel, D-Hollywood, argued universities and the state Board of
Governors already have policies in place to protect academic freedom.
Moreover, a state law outlining how professors are supposed to teach would
encroach on the boardıs authority to manage state schools.

³The big hand of state government is going into the universities telling
them how to teach,² she said. ³This bill is the antithesis of academic
freedom.²

But Baxley compared the stateıs universities to children, saying the
legislature should not give them money without providing ³guidance² to their
behavior.

³Professors are accountable for what they say or do,² he said. ³Theyıre
accountable to the rest of us in society Š All of a sudden the faculty think
they can do what they want and shut us out. Why is it so unheard of to say
the professor shouldnıt be a dictator and control that room as their
totalitarian niche?²

In an interview before the meeting, Baxley said ³arrogant, elitist academics
are swarming² to oppose the bill, and media reports misrepresented his
intentions.

³I expect to be out there on my own pretty far,² he said. ³I donıt expect to
be part of a team.²

House Bill H-837 can be viewed online at www.flsenate.gov.

  #2  
Old March 25th 05, 06:27 AM
Marina
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Default

Karen wrote:

I begin to feel as though we are descending into the Dark Ages again.....



Capitol bill aims to control Œleftistı profs
THE LAW COULD LET STUDENTS SUE FOR UNTOLERATED BELIEFS.


*boggle*


--
Marina, Frank, Nikki, and coming soon: Mere!
marina (dot) kurten (at) pp (dot) inet (dot) fi
Pics at http://uk.pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/frankiennikki/
and http://community.webshots.com/user/frankiennikki
  #3  
Old March 25th 05, 06:38 AM
-L.
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Posts: n/a
Default


Karen wrote:
I begin to feel as though we are descending into the Dark Ages

again.....


snip

/me whacks head on desk again and again.

And yet, people wonder why we refuse to patronize *anything* in the
state of Florida...

-L.

  #4  
Old March 25th 05, 09:36 AM
Jeanette
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Default


Karen wrote in message
...
I begin to feel as though we are descending into the Dark Ages again.....



That is appalling, truly and utterly appalling. If I was an American student
I'd be applying for a European University right now.

Jeanette


  #5  
Old March 25th 05, 09:54 AM
Helen Wheels
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Jeanette wrote:

Karen wrote in message
...

I begin to feel as though we are descending into the Dark Ages again.....




That is appalling, truly and utterly appalling. If I was an American student
I'd be applying for a European University right now.

Jeanette


Once I would have added "or an Australian one", but I'm afraid that all
the signs are that our current govt wishes to push our unis in the same
direction as the US ones.

I certainly agree that _some_ teachers don't always give differing
points of view the respect they might deserve, but this is a nutty way
to deal with it.
  #6  
Old March 25th 05, 02:48 PM
CatNipped
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"Karen" wrote in message
...
I begin to feel as though we are descending into the Dark Ages again.....


snipped a whole bunch of dirty litterbox offerings

Well, maybe the creationists are right - judging by this it certainly
doesn't look like evolution is making the species more intelligent, does it?
;

Hugs,

CatNipped


  #7  
Old March 25th 05, 04:36 PM
Kreisleriana
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Default

On Thu, 24 Mar 2005 22:59:36 -0600, Karen
yodeled:

I begin to feel as though we are descending into the Dark Ages again.....



Capitol bill aims to control Œleftistı profs
THE LAW COULD LET STUDENTS SUE FOR UNTOLERATED BELIEFS.

By JAMES VANLANDINGHAM
Alligator Staff Writer

TALLAHASSEE ‹ Republicans on the House Choice and Innovation Committee voted
along party lines Tuesday to pass a bill that aims to stamp out ³leftist
totalitarianism² by ³dictator professors² in the classrooms of Floridaıs
universities.


The Nation has a whole issue about right-wing backlash towards
"liberal" university faculty. I've spent about half my life in
academia, and I've still never met a "liberal dictator professor." :P

There is a similar bill being introduced in the Ohio legislature too.

There is right now a major political battle going on over Columbia
University's department of Near Eastern and Asian studies. The real
problem is not that the professors are stifling students, but the
students simply don't like some things some professors are saying--
even students who have never taken their classes are getting involved
over things they have "heard" other people report. One of the
problems is that some of these students have simply never been exposed
to the Palestinian point of view before, and this discussion is so
polarized that they immediately think that the whole treatment of the
subject at Columbia is anti-Israel and anti-Semitic. So these
students *are* getting exposed to an alternative point of view-- from
the one they have heard all their lives. But they don't like it

In a way, this is like the evolution debate. Why should
knowledgeable, expert people, people who have been long tried in their
fields by their peers, who have abided by serious, rigorous methods
of study and research, be compelled to give "equal time" to attitudes
that they know are b***s***? Next time we have a discussion about
world travel, shall we have the Flat Earth Society check in with their
views? Did God put the fossil record there just to pull our legs?
Bacteria and viruses are developing more resistant strains in matters
of a few years, not millions. People are dying of resistant
tuberculosis. Anybody can get a bunch of fruit flies, and watch a
hundred generations in just a a few months, and you can see the
changes. But evolution still needs to be "balanced out" by an
"alternative POV. Ridiculous.

You know something? The Catholic Church-- yes, the same people who
persecuted Galileo 400 years ago-- have openly stated that evolution
is *not* in conflict with belief in a Creator God. In a way, the
Christian right wing people have a very narrow view of a God they
claim is all-powerful. I believe if God is all-powerful, He could
have created the world any way He wanted, and that can certainly admit
the Big Bang and evolution. They also think that God has some pretty
petty concerns, like about who's sleeping with whom.

Wow! Thus endeth MY rant.



Theresa
Stinky Pictures: http://community.webshots.com/album/125591586JWEFwh
My Blog: http://www.humanitas.blogspot.com
  #8  
Old March 25th 05, 04:37 PM
Kreisleriana
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On 24 Mar 2005 22:38:39 -0800, "-L."
yodeled:


Karen wrote:
I begin to feel as though we are descending into the Dark Ages

again.....


snip

/me whacks head on desk again and again.

And yet, people wonder why we refuse to patronize *anything* in the
state of Florida...

-L.


My daddy lives there.

Of course his head explodes about four times a week.


Theresa
Stinky Pictures: http://community.webshots.com/album/125591586JWEFwh
My Blog: http://www.humanitas.blogspot.com
  #9  
Old March 25th 05, 04:40 PM
Kreisleriana
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Fri, 25 Mar 2005 08:48:46 -0600, "CatNipped"
yodeled:

"Karen" wrote in message
...
I begin to feel as though we are descending into the Dark Ages again.....


snipped a whole bunch of dirty litterbox offerings

Well, maybe the creationists are right - judging by this it certainly
doesn't look like evolution is making the species more intelligent, does it?
;


BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!


Theresa
Stinky Pictures: http://community.webshots.com/album/125591586JWEFwh
My Blog: http://www.humanitas.blogspot.com
  #10  
Old March 25th 05, 05:41 PM
MaryL
external usenet poster
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Karen" wrote in message
...
I begin to feel as though we are descending into the Dark Ages again.....



Capitol bill aims to control Oleftistı profs
THE LAW COULD LET STUDENTS SUE FOR UNTOLERATED BELIEFS.

By JAMES VANLANDINGHAM
Alligator Staff Writer

TALLAHASSEE Republicans on the House Choice and Innovation Committee
voted
along party lines Tuesday to pass a bill that aims to stamp out ³leftist
totalitarianism² by ³dictator professors² in the classrooms of Floridaıs
universities.

The Academic Freedom Bill of Rights, sponsored by Rep. Dennis Baxley,
R-Ocala, passed 8-to-2 despite strenuous objections from the only two
Democrats on the committee.

The bill has two more committees to pass before it can be considered by
the
full House.

While promoting the bill Tuesday, Baxley said a university education
should
be more than ³one biased view by the professor, who as a dictator controls
the classroom,² as part of ³a misuse of their platform to indoctrinate the
next generation with their own views.²

The bill sets a statewide standard that students cannot be punished for
professing beliefs with which their professors disagree. Professors would
also be advised to teach alternative ³serious academic theories² that may
disagree with their personal views.

According to a legislative staff analysis of the bill, the law would give
students who think their beliefs are not being respected legal standing to
sue professors and universities.

Students who believe their professor is singling them out for ³public
ridicule² * for instance, when professors use the Socratic method to force
students to explain their theories in class * would also be given the
right
to sue.

snip

House Bill H-837 can be viewed online at www.flsenate.gov.



Hidden within this bill -- and not particularly well hidden -- is an agenda
to once again try to insert "creationism" into the classroom. The more I
see of attempts like this, the more I think that is just as well that I am
not far from retirement. It's *really* a stretch to equate the Socratic
method with "dictator professors" in the classroom.


MaryL
(take out the litter to reply)

Photos of Duffy and Holly: 'o'
http://tinyurl.com/8y54 (Introducing Duffy to Holly)
http://tinyurl.com/8y56 (Duffy and Holly "settle in")


 




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