my 18 year old cat is defacting indoors for the 1st time

I had to go and collect the medication for ringworm to treat the other
cats,so asked If I could also bring Jasper to her for a quick look at
him whilst I was there because for the first time in his life,he has
recently started pooping on the floor as well as wetting himself too
where he sleeps.
I was somewhat shocked when she asked me if I had considered euthanasia
yet,because It hadn't crossed my mind at all!
It has been happening for the last 2weeks or so.I noticed one day as he
was sat on my lap having cuddles,& suddenly I felt a hot wet sensation
on my lap too,but since then he has also started pooping where he wants
to(or needs to?)I put it down to an accident the first time,but when he
started pooping too,I knew the time had come to take him to be seen by
the vet.Jasper has been a very faithful family member for around
14years when he moved in with us because his owners abandond him,& has
never been a spot of trouble at all.I did mention to the vet that we
have a case of ringworm,wondering if that might be the cause...but she
tells me that it has no bearing on it at all-that it is age related and
that he could have a kidney problem that was not economicaly viable
sepecially considering your age;it will only get worse.I am shocked &
don't know what to think to be honest.I don't want him to suffer or go
through any pain that he doesn't need to,but putting him to sleep was
the last thing I was expecting her to say.I must do what is right for
him,so feed back would be good and I will accept her opinion if others
agree it would be best.It is a bit like planning your friends death
though & makes me feel awful;a bit like a betrayal of trust.Thanks
peoples...

on Wed, 08 Nov 2006 15:52:27 GMT, "
wrote:

it is age related and
that he could have a kidney problem that was not economicaly viable
sepecially considering your age

the economic viability of treating your cat for kidney disease is YOUR
decision, not your vet's. My cat, a lovely Manx, was diagnosed at the age
of 15. We successfully treated him and he lived another 5 happy, healthy
years.

--
Lynne

Dear Sheelagh,

Snagglepuss showed exactly the same symptoms at about age 12. The
vet kept him overnight; called the next morning to get my permission
for surgery. I agreed. He found tumors on both kidneys. Snag died
on the table. When I took Snag to the vet, I anticipated an exam,
some meds and we'd go home together. I never got to tell him how
much I loved him before he left for the Rainbow Bridge.

I don't know what sort of kidney problem Jasper has. Your vet's
advice is certainly based on her experience and her commitment to do
right for both Jasper and for you. At eighteen, Jasper has had a
very long and happy life. You're not betraying his trust. You are
giving him a great gift of peace and freeing him from pain. It is so
very hard, but we must do this for the little guys. I have been in
your spot several times (and very soon again). Breaks your heart.

I am sorry. Give Jasper some more snuggles. Tell him how much you
love him. Know that you'll see him again.

Roby

on Wed, 08 Nov 2006 16:55:00 GMT, Roby wrote:

At eighteen, Jasper has had a
very long and happy life. You're not betraying his trust. You are
giving him a great gift of peace and freeing him from pain.

I agree with this. I also meant to say, in my other post, that if you opt
not to treat him, that is certainly a viable option, too.

Good luck in your decision, Sheelagh. Only you can make it, but you will
do the right thing for you and for your kitty, whatever you decide.

--
Lynne

Thanks Guys,
I shall certainly think hard on what you have all said with regard to
Jasper.I thought that it might be a good thing If I were to go back &
see the vet to ask her if there is an other option available to
us...but on the other hand,your all right.Jasper has had a really good
ining's & shared a wonderful life with us and given us as much love as
we have invested in him too.18 Is a very ripe old age &we have been
lucky&privaliged to get this far with no significant problems at
all,haven't we?I cant help the feeling that I am sending him to the
rainbow bridge prematurely,but then again,if he were out in the wild,I
know that he would have a slow decline to a possibly very painful
death,which is the last thing that I would want for him.
I am hoping that with a bit of time to consider the idea,that I will
get used to it..as you say,@ least I get the chance to explain it all
to the children so that we all get the chance to say our goodbye's to
him.Our vet told us to consider it over the weekend then get back to
her with our decision.I did think about a second opinion,but I don't
think our vet is wrong,so it would be a pointless thing to do in
retrospect,wouldn't it?He has been such a tolerant friend,accepting all
of our new feline family without exeption,so I am certain that they
will miss him too.It is one of the most difficult decision's I have
ever had to make,&I am certain it will be the right decision after
talking to you all about it.Thanks for all of your collective help,it
has certainly made me feel a little less guilty as well.I want to do
what is best for him rather than ourselves.It is so tempting to try &
see if we could keep him for another few years yet,but there is his
dignity to consider also,it cant be nice for him either...If only cats
could talk directly to you.We intend to make the most of the weekend
with him,& take him to his favourite field where he used to follow us
when we take the other feline delinquents out..places and memorys are
the best gift he ever gave us.It is just such an emotionally hard
decision to make..thanks for your support too by the way!I have given a
link so that you can meet him too
http://picasaweb.google.com/sheelaghmadden/Jasper
Dear Sheelagh,

Snagglepuss showed exactly the same symptoms at about age 12. The
vet kept him overnight; called the next morning to get my permission
for surgery. I agreed. He found tumors on both kidneys. Snag died
on the table. When I took Snag to the vet, I anticipated an exam,
some meds and we'd go home together. I never got to tell him how
much I loved him before he left for the Rainbow Bridge.

I don't know what sort of kidney problem Jasper has. Your vet's
advice is certainly based on her experience and her commitment to do
right for both Jasper and for you. At eighteen, Jasper has had a
very long and happy life. You're not betraying his trust. You are
giving him a great gift of peace and freeing him from pain. It is so
very hard, but we must do this for the little guys. I have been in
your spot several times (and very soon again). Breaks your heart.

I am sorry. Give Jasper some more snuggles. Tell him how much you
love him. Know that you'll see him again.

Roby

Oh dear, my heart goes out to you Sheelagh. He is such a lovely old
gentlemancat. You are right he has had a lovely life. Whichever way you
choose, you have his best interests at heart and I'm sure he knows that. If
you decide to let him go, don't feel as though you are condemning him to an
early death as you said...you are not. You are giving him the dignity he
deserves, and preventing a lot of pain and suffering. If you choose to give
him treatment, you will get to keep him for a bit longer, and his quality of
life may or may not improve; you don't know. Whatever you decide, he knows
you love him and cherish him and that is the most important thing.

on Wed, 08 Nov 2006 19:23:27 GMT, "
wrote:

http://picasaweb.google.com/sheelaghmadden/Jasper

Oh my, you certainly have a way with kitties! Jasper is another beauty,
and he looks so very young and healthy. He must be very, very happy. What
a lucky boy to have found you.

It's such a tough decision to let a loved one go. We finally had to make
that decision for our manx boy at the age of almost 21. His kidney disease
was under control for 5 years, but when he started to deteriote, we did not
wait long at all to say goodbye. I will say, though, that we almost made
that decision a year prior, but were able to adjust his care so he had one
more happy year with us, and us with him.

As I said before, whatever you do will be the right thing, no matter how
hard it is for you to make your decision.

--
Lynne


"Every once in a while, the tables are turned and we get to share our lives
with an animal who takes care of their human." - Tara, rpdb

wrote:
I had to go and collect the medication for ringworm to treat the other
cats,so asked If I could also bring Jasper to her for a quick look at
him whilst I was there because for the first time in his life,he has
recently started pooping on the floor as well as wetting himself too
where he sleeps.
I was somewhat shocked when she asked me if I had considered euthanasia
yet,because It hadn't crossed my mind at all!
It has been happening for the last 2weeks or so.I noticed one day as he
was sat on my lap having cuddles,& suddenly I felt a hot wet sensation
on my lap too,but since then he has also started pooping where he wants
to(or needs to?)I put it down to an accident the first time,but when he
started pooping too,I knew the time had come to take him to be seen by
the vet.Jasper has been a very faithful family member for around
14years when he moved in with us because his owners abandond him,& has
never been a spot of trouble at all.I did mention to the vet that we
have a case of ringworm,wondering if that might be the cause...but she
tells me that it has no bearing on it at all-that it is age related and
that he could have a kidney problem that was not economicaly viable
sepecially considering your age;it will only get worse.

Hi,

I am not as quick as your vet to dismiss Jasper's recent "inappropriate"
elimination issues as age related and apparently not worthy of looking into
to the point of suggesting euthanasia! I do not understand her assumption (no
evidence I have read in your posts and no blood tests) that he may have
kidney problems which are not "economically viable" to treat, etc.

From your initial post about your new Birman, there was nothing to indicate
any problem with Jasper. You have recently brought in a new cat, you have a
case of ringworm which has understandably stressed you considerably already
prior to diagnosis, you isolated two cats, and you cleaned your home from top
to bottom. Cats are exquisitely sensitive to even minute changes and there
have been considerable ones in Jasper's territory. In addition, he is an
elderly cat whose needs may be changing. You are in the uk, so I wonder
whether Jasper up to now eliminated outside, whether there are any and/or
sufficient litter boxes in your home, whether they are easily accessible to
him, etc.

At the very least physical issues must be ruled out via comprehensive blood
tests (geriatric blood panel). It doesn't matter how old Jasper is, if his
quality of life is good, and nothing you wrote leads me to believe that it is
not, you owe it to him to find out why his elimination habits have changed.
It may be physical and treatable or behavioral and dealt with depending on
what the underlying issue is.

It is appalling that a veterinarian would suggest considering killing this
cat based on the above alone. Does she assume (and is she right?) that you
are overextended in more ways than one with the many cats, kids, and disabled
partner? I hope that is not a factor here.

Please do right by Jasper. I would not accept a vet who dismisses old cats
simply because they are old.

I am shocked

You should be

& don't know what to think to be honest.I don't want him to suffer or go
through any pain

What evidence is there that he is doing either of those things?

that he doesn't need to,but putting him to sleep was
the last thing I was expecting her to say.I must do what is right for
him,so feed back would be good and I will accept her opinion if others
agree it would be best.It is a bit like planning your friends death
though & makes me feel awful;a bit like a betrayal of trust.

With the info you provided it would be a betrayal and unjustified.

Thanks
peoples...

--
Message posted via CatKB.com
http://www.catkb.com/Uwe/Forums.aspx...ealth/200611/1

I regret that in my shock on the day I posted my comment about old
Jaspy,that I ommited to mention that I had already taken Jasper to see
the vet a couple of weeks ago.I woul"never" have my faithful companion
put to sleep just because of the inconvenience of incontinence...!!
I had in fact taken old Jaspy to the vets two weeks prior to that visit
because I was concerned that he was loosing wieght,even though I was
feeding him seperately,& also that he seemed to be drinking more than
he normally did.On that visit to our vet,she told me that it was
possible that he could be suffering from one of two things..possibly
kidney problems or maybe diabetes.She took a full account of bloods and
also a urine sample too.A few days later she called me to say that he
had a problem called Decompensated renal failure,& that if there was
any further detrioration,that I was to call her & take him back to see
her again.
On the day that I took him back,I expected her to say that we might be
able to consider dialisys,or even possibly a transplant(in my
ignorance),but she explained that it was not possible because his
condition was so advanced.She explained that some vets would consider
it,but in her opinion it would be false economy because I would be
prolonging his pain & suffering,& that given his advanced age & her
long association with him,that it was her medical opinion that it would
be the kindest thing that I could do for him.I am sorry that I did not
make this clear on my first posting,but I assumed that no one would
even consider doing such a terrible thing;I know that I certainly
wouldn't!So My apologies for not making that clear to you.
I took him back the other day because In my opinion his condition had
got worse,& it was just a shock to hear that there was nothing else
that could be considered to make him a little bit more comfortable & to
keep him with us a little bit longer,but she explained that when a cat
gets to the stage of decompensated renal failure that there is no other
option open to him.I also felt terribly guilty that I didn't know that
his condition had got so far advanced without my knowing so as he is
with me all day most days...but she told me that this is very often the
case,& that it wasn't neglectful,merely unfortunate in this case.
As I explained in that posting,I was advised to take him home with pain
killers& told to think about it for a couple of day's,then make an
appointment to take him back,when we could say our final good bye's to
him,& allow her to let him go peacefully with no more pain.
It is one of the most painful things I have ever had to go through in
my life,I assure you!
Jasper is booked in to see the vet tomorrow mid day,when I will have to
let him go.I regret that I did not make this clear to you-But I know
that I am doing the right thing.I have no wish to wait until he is in
agony then dies a slow painful death too.
I hope that I have explained myself adequately,& that you all think of
old Jaspy as he pass's on to pussy heaven.The only thing that keeps me
going is the memories we share & the knowledge that I am doing what is
best for Jasper,not myself....
paws2 via CatKB.com wrote:

wrote:
I had to go and collect the medication for ringworm to treat the other
cats,so asked If I could also bring Jasper to her for a quick look at
him whilst I was there because for the first time in his life,he has
recently started pooping on the floor as well as wetting himself too
where he sleeps.
I was somewhat shocked when she asked me if I had considered euthanasia
yet,because It hadn't crossed my mind at all!
It has been happening for the last 2weeks or so.I noticed one day as he
was sat on my lap having cuddles,& suddenly I felt a hot wet sensation
on my lap too,but since then he has also started pooping where he wants
to(or needs to?)I put it down to an accident the first time,but when he
started pooping too,I knew the time had come to take him to be seen by
the vet.Jasper has been a very faithful family member for around
14years when he moved in with us because his owners abandond him,& has
never been a spot of trouble at all.I did mention to the vet that we
have a case of ringworm,wondering if that might be the cause...but she
tells me that it has no bearing on it at all-that it is age related and
that he could have a kidney problem that was not economicaly viable
sepecially considering your age;it will only get worse.

Hi,

I am not as quick as your vet to dismiss Jasper's recent "inappropriate"
elimination issues as age related and apparently not worthy of looking into
to the point of suggesting euthanasia! I do not understand her assumption (no
evidence I have read in your posts and no blood tests) that he may have
kidney problems which are not "economically viable" to treat, etc.

From your initial post about your new Birman, there was nothing to indicate
any problem with Jasper. You have recently brought in a new cat, you have a
case of ringworm which has understandably stressed you considerably already
prior to diagnosis, you isolated two cats, and you cleaned your home from top
to bottom. Cats are exquisitely sensitive to even minute changes and there
have been considerable ones in Jasper's territory. In addition, he is an
elderly cat whose needs may be changing. You are in the uk, so I wonder
whether Jasper up to now eliminated outside, whether there are any and/or
sufficient litter boxes in your home, whether they are easily accessible to
him, etc.

At the very least physical issues must be ruled out via comprehensive blood
tests (geriatric blood panel). It doesn't matter how old Jasper is, if his
quality of life is good, and nothing you wrote leads me to believe that it is
not, you owe it to him to find out why his elimination habits have changed.
It may be physical and treatable or behavioral and dealt with depending on
what the underlying issue is.

It is appalling that a veterinarian would suggest considering killing this
cat based on the above alone. Does she assume (and is she right?) that you
are overextended in more ways than one with the many cats, kids, and disabled
partner? I hope that is not a factor here.

Please do right by Jasper. I would not accept a vet who dismisses old cats
simply because they are old.

I am shocked

You should be

& don't know what to think to be honest.I don't want him to suffer or go
through any pain

What evidence is there that he is doing either of those things?

that he doesn't need to,but putting him to sleep was
the last thing I was expecting her to say.I must do what is right for
him,so feed back would be good and I will accept her opinion if others
agree it would be best.It is a bit like planning your friends death
though & makes me feel awful;a bit like a betrayal of trust.

With the info you provided it would be a betrayal and unjustified.

Thanks
peoples...

--
Message posted via CatKB.com
http://www.catkb.com/Uwe/Forums.aspx...ealth/200611/1

On 10 Nov 2006 07:17:43 -0800, "
wrote:

I regret that in my shock on the day I posted my comment about old
Jaspy,that I ommited to mention that I had already taken Jasper to see
the vet a couple of weeks ago.I woul"never" have my faithful companion
put to sleep just because of the inconvenience of incontinence...!!
I had in fact taken old Jaspy to the vets two weeks prior to that visit
because I was concerned that he was loosing wieght,even though I was
feeding him seperately,& also that he seemed to be drinking more than
he normally did.On that visit to our vet,she told me that it was
....

Very tough situation. 18 is certainly a good long life; none of my
cats have made it that far. Thanks for the update and clearly you are
doing what you have to do. None of us is going to live forerver and it
does seem like Jasper's time. Purrs.