No Help Available For Ferals?

[Robyn]

Hi,
This is more of a vent than anything else, and this group seems like
the right place for it. Who knows, maybe you guys can offer suggestions.
I've just spent my entire morning trying to get trapping and spay/neuter
information for the 4 feral cats (all one litter) that came along with
the house we just bought. I don't mind feeding the cats and having them
around, but the females just had their first heat, and are most likely
already pregnant. The mother of this group, after disappearing for a
long time, has also reappeared and is obviously nursing a new litter.
(Whole other problem, but one thing at a time.)

Called the Humane Society, they said to call Wildlife Care, Wildlife
Care said to call the Humane Society, who then said it just wasn't their
problem because the cats weren't pets and to call Animal control. Animal
Control said it wasn't their problem unless I wanted to trap the cats
myself, which I can't do. They then offered to rent me a trap for a $100
deposit + rent, which I don't have. (Even if I did trap them, they just
wanted to haul them off to be euthanized, which isn't an option.) I flat
out asked the guy at Animal Control if no one cared if these 4 cats just
bred themselves into the hundreds, and he said no. (NOT kidding.)

So the long and short of it is, no one will even discuss the matter
unless I pay a fee and deliver the cats to them. These things are
totally wild. Even if I could afford the $250 or so the entire
undertaking would cost, and manage to trap them, what do I do with them
until the vet appointment? No one I've asked seems to have answers. I've
already adopted the runt from this group. He's pretty wild, but likes
living in the house and gets along well with my other 3 cats. I wish I
could take them all in, but they're just too wild, and I don't have any
more room. The 4 I have now are a bit much at times. :-)

Anyway, thanks for letting me vent. I guess I need to get back on the
phone and try a few more places. It's just unreal that all these
organizations that talk about how much they want to help unwanted
animals lose interest when you actually ask them for assistance. But
there's got to be some place that helps with these things. Suggestions
welcome. Wish me luck. :-)

Robyn
--
To avoid grizzlies, the Alaska Department of Fish & Game advises hikers
to wear noisy little bells on clothes and carry pepper spray. Also watch
for signs of activity: Black bear scat is smaller and contains berries;
grizzly scat has little bells in it and smells like pepper.

[Lotte]

Robyn --

What, specifically, do you want from the agencies you are calling? The more
specific you can be, the more they can help you. I can't really tell from
your e.mail what strategy you want to take with these cats. Do you want
someone to come and trap them, and take them in for neutering? If so, and
you're anywhere near Austin (Texas), I can do it, just drop me an e.mail.
After they are neutered, do you want to release them, or do you want to try
to get them adopted? With ferals, if they truly *are* feral (i.e., wild as
all get-out), it's probably better to release them after they are neutuered.
Once they've gone wild, they don't make great pets, but they can survive
quite well if you'll keep feeding them.

There is a wealth of information at Alley Cat Allies' web site
(http://www.alleycat.org/) about trap-neuter-release of feral cats. If you
let me know where you're located, I may be able to put you in touch with a
local feral-friendly person who can help.

Lotte


"Robyn" > wrote in message
t...
> Hi,
> This is more of a vent than anything else, and this group seems like
> the right place for it. Who knows, maybe you guys can offer suggestions.
> I've just spent my entire morning trying to get trapping and spay/neuter
> information for the 4 feral cats (all one litter) that came along with
> the house we just bought. I don't mind feeding the cats and having them
> around, but the females just had their first heat, and are most likely
> already pregnant. The mother of this group, after disappearing for a
> long time, has also reappeared and is obviously nursing a new litter.
> (Whole other problem, but one thing at a time.)
>
> Called the Humane Society, they said to call Wildlife Care, Wildlife
> Care said to call the Humane Society, who then said it just wasn't their
> problem because the cats weren't pets and to call Animal control. Animal
> Control said it wasn't their problem unless I wanted to trap the cats
> myself, which I can't do. They then offered to rent me a trap for a $100
> deposit + rent, which I don't have. (Even if I did trap them, they just
> wanted to haul them off to be euthanized, which isn't an option.) I flat
> out asked the guy at Animal Control if no one cared if these 4 cats just
> bred themselves into the hundreds, and he said no. (NOT kidding.)
>
> So the long and short of it is, no one will even discuss the matter
> unless I pay a fee and deliver the cats to them. These things are
> totally wild. Even if I could afford the $250 or so the entire
> undertaking would cost, and manage to trap them, what do I do with them
> until the vet appointment? No one I've asked seems to have answers. I've
> already adopted the runt from this group. He's pretty wild, but likes
> living in the house and gets along well with my other 3 cats. I wish I
> could take them all in, but they're just too wild, and I don't have any
> more room. The 4 I have now are a bit much at times. :-)
>
> Anyway, thanks for letting me vent. I guess I need to get back on the
> phone and try a few more places. It's just unreal that all these
> organizations that talk about how much they want to help unwanted
> animals lose interest when you actually ask them for assistance. But
> there's got to be some place that helps with these things. Suggestions
> welcome. Wish me luck. :-)
>
> Robyn
> --
> To avoid grizzlies, the Alaska Department of Fish & Game advises hikers
> to wear noisy little bells on clothes and carry pepper spray. Also watch
> for signs of activity: Black bear scat is smaller and contains berries;
> grizzly scat has little bells in it and smells like pepper.
>
>

[Robyn]

Lotte wrote:
> Robyn --
>
> What, specifically, do you want from the agencies you are calling?
> The more specific you can be, the more they can help you. I can't
> really tell from your e.mail what strategy you want to take with
> these cats. Do you want someone to come and trap them, and take them
> in for neutering? If so, and you're anywhere near Austin (Texas), I
> can do it, just drop me an e.mail. After they are neutered, do you
> want to release them, or do you want to try to get them adopted?
> With ferals, if they truly *are* feral (i.e., wild as all get-out),
> it's probably better to release them after they are neutuered. Once
> they've gone wild, they don't make great pets, but they can survive
> quite well if you'll keep feeding them.
>
> There is a wealth of information at Alley Cat Allies' web site
> (http://www.alleycat.org/) about trap-neuter-release of feral cats.
> If you let me know where you're located, I may be able to put you in
> touch with a local feral-friendly person who can help.
>
> Lotte
>

Sorry if my email wasn't clear. I'm kind of upset at the telephone
runaround I keep getting. The cats are truly wild and hiss when
approached, even when we feed them, so I doubt they're adoptable. But I
don't mind feeding them or having them around, I just can't have them
multiplying all over everything, so I need help with the trapping and
fixing. Unfortunataly, I'm not in Texas, but south Florida, or I'd
happily take you up on your offer. My S/O suggested that maybe we can
try to at least get the females by luring them into our cat carrier, tie
a string to the door and hide or something. I think it might work
once... But what do you do with them until the vet appointment, don't
they go nuts when confined? The last cat I had fixed through a low cost
service was a 3 day wait, but he was a tame pet, so no problem.

Anyway, thanks for the response. I think the next call I make and
hear, "Well, first you have to buy a trap" or "We only help pets" I'm
going to scream...

Robyn

[Sharon Talbert]

Robyn, there may be a rescue org in your area (and it would be helpful if
you revealed to the group where you are), but chances are good that you
are going to have to take care of this little colony yourself. And you
need to move fast!

You need a livetrap or two (buy them; they are not all that expensive, and
it is going to take a few weeks to get the colony in hand). Find a
low-cost spay/neuter service (talk to your vet first; maybe you can work
out a discount) and get to work. Start with last year's kittens; they are
pregnant now and the sooner spayed the better for all. If you can locate
the old cat's litter, bring them in and trap the mom. She can raise her
babies in a cage or secure room until they are 4 weeks or so (when they
can be started on solid food) and then be spayed and released.

Let us know where you are. There just may be a spay/neuter clinic in your
area. Seattle, for example, has a free feral cat clinic for all comers.

Thank you for being so kind and responsible. I wish everyone were like
you.

Email me privately if you would like to discuss any of this. I am always
happy to advise.

Sharon Talbert
Friends of Campus Cats

[Robyn]

Sharon Talbert wrote:
> Robyn, there may be a rescue org in your area (and it would be
> helpful if you revealed to the group where you are), but chances are
> good that you are going to have to take care of this little colony
> yourself. And you need to move fast!
>
> You need a livetrap or two (buy them; they are not all that
> expensive, and it is going to take a few weeks to get the colony in
> hand). Find a low-cost spay/neuter service (talk to your vet first;
> maybe you can work out a discount) and get to work. Start with last
> year's kittens; they are pregnant now and the sooner spayed the
> better for all. If you can locate the old cat's litter, bring them
> in and trap the mom. She can raise her babies in a cage or secure
> room until they are 4 weeks or so (when they can be started on solid
> food) and then be spayed and released.
>
> Let us know where you are. There just may be a spay/neuter clinic in
> your area. Seattle, for example, has a free feral cat clinic for all
> comers.
>
> Thank you for being so kind and responsible. I wish everyone were
> like you.
>
> Email me privately if you would like to discuss any of this. I am
> always happy to advise.
>
> Sharon Talbert
> Friends of Campus Cats
>

Sharon thanks for your reply. As I stated in my post, I just don't
have the cash to do this myself, or I would. That's why I was venting. I
need help and can't find any. A trap is $50-$75. Spay/neuter is $25-$35
times 4 cats. (5 when you count the one I took in the house.) I also
don't have a clue how to go about this, or a lot of free time, truth be
told. I'm online a lot because I make my living on the computer and can
post in between other things.

As for the kittens, I can't get to them, chances are they're in
someone's yard, and everyone around here has fences. There's nothing I
can do until she brings them out, and even then, I don't have a place
for them. I made room for one of the ferals that was smaller and weaker
than the rest (cross-eyed little thing, just adorable), but that brings
me up to four, and my house is small... I also have a 19 year old cat
that is only now getting over the stress of our adding a new cat last
year. (What a nightmare that was.) She's OK with little Froggy so far,
but I don't want to push it by adding more.

I agree that the pregnant females are the first priority. Like I
said, I may try to trap one in my cat carrier, (not real hopeful) but I
don't know what to do after that. I spent most of this morning on the
phone, and everyone says it's someone else's problem, or that no help is
available. (without lots of $$$$) I was under the impression that there
were places that would lend traps and help with the trapping, as well as
assisting with the spay/neuter arrangements. It looks like I was wrong,
but I'm going to try a little more. Tomorrow I'll start on the phone
again. Thanks for the kind words.:-)

Robyn

P.S. I'm in Hollywood, Florida, BTW. That's just south of Ft.
Lauderdale.
--
To avoid grizzlies, the Alaska Department of Fish & Game advises hikers
to wear noisy little bells on clothes and carry pepper spray. Also watch
for signs of activity: Black bear scat is smaller and contains berries;
grizzly scat has little bells in it and smells like pepper.

[Sharon Talbert]

Robyn, try this URL:

www.thecatnetwork.org

They are based out of Miami, if that helps. They might at least be able
to put you in touch with someone who can help. Don't give up networking!
But be prepared to do most of the work yourself, even if you find help
with the expenses.

Sharon Talbert
Friends of Campus Cats
Seattle

[Wendy]

have you checked http://www.petfinder.org/ ? Click on find shelters, enter
your zip code and they will list organizations in your area.

Check with some of them. You'll probably find someone to help with a trap,
neuter and release.

W

"Robyn" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> Sharon Talbert wrote:
> > Robyn, there may be a rescue org in your area (and it would be
> > helpful if you revealed to the group where you are), but chances are
> > good that you are going to have to take care of this little colony
> > yourself. And you need to move fast!
> >
> > You need a livetrap or two (buy them; they are not all that
> > expensive, and it is going to take a few weeks to get the colony in
> > hand). Find a low-cost spay/neuter service (talk to your vet first;
> > maybe you can work out a discount) and get to work. Start with last
> > year's kittens; they are pregnant now and the sooner spayed the
> > better for all. If you can locate the old cat's litter, bring them
> > in and trap the mom. She can raise her babies in a cage or secure
> > room until they are 4 weeks or so (when they can be started on solid
> > food) and then be spayed and released.
> >
> > Let us know where you are. There just may be a spay/neuter clinic in
> > your area. Seattle, for example, has a free feral cat clinic for all
> > comers.
> >
> > Thank you for being so kind and responsible. I wish everyone were
> > like you.
> >
> > Email me privately if you would like to discuss any of this. I am
> > always happy to advise.
> >
> > Sharon Talbert
> > Friends of Campus Cats
> >
>
> Sharon thanks for your reply. As I stated in my post, I just don't
> have the cash to do this myself, or I would. That's why I was venting. I
> need help and can't find any. A trap is $50-$75. Spay/neuter is $25-$35
> times 4 cats. (5 when you count the one I took in the house.) I also
> don't have a clue how to go about this, or a lot of free time, truth be
> told. I'm online a lot because I make my living on the computer and can
> post in between other things.
>
> As for the kittens, I can't get to them, chances are they're in
> someone's yard, and everyone around here has fences. There's nothing I
> can do until she brings them out, and even then, I don't have a place
> for them. I made room for one of the ferals that was smaller and weaker
> than the rest (cross-eyed little thing, just adorable), but that brings
> me up to four, and my house is small... I also have a 19 year old cat
> that is only now getting over the stress of our adding a new cat last
> year. (What a nightmare that was.) She's OK with little Froggy so far,
> but I don't want to push it by adding more.
>
> I agree that the pregnant females are the first priority. Like I
> said, I may try to trap one in my cat carrier, (not real hopeful) but I
> don't know what to do after that. I spent most of this morning on the
> phone, and everyone says it's someone else's problem, or that no help is
> available. (without lots of $$$$) I was under the impression that there
> were places that would lend traps and help with the trapping, as well as
> assisting with the spay/neuter arrangements. It looks like I was wrong,
> but I'm going to try a little more. Tomorrow I'll start on the phone
> again. Thanks for the kind words.:-)
>
> Robyn
>
> P.S. I'm in Hollywood, Florida, BTW. That's just south of Ft.
> Lauderdale.
> --
> To avoid grizzlies, the Alaska Department of Fish & Game advises hikers
> to wear noisy little bells on clothes and carry pepper spray. Also watch
> for signs of activity: Black bear scat is smaller and contains berries;
> grizzly scat has little bells in it and smells like pepper.
>
>

[[email protected]]

In article >,
"Robyn" > wrote:

> P.S. I'm in Hollywood, Florida, BTW. That's just south of Ft.
> Lauderdale.

You could try these guys (I found them through Google):

http://www.catpals.org/

"Cat Pals - A Feline Charity in South Florida
A non profit charity that works off donations and fundrasing and is a
volunteer based to feed and get medical attention to all ferel cats in
the hollywood beach area in south Florida."

The page also talks about a vet named Dr. James Dee of Hollywood Animal
Hospital who believes in trap/neuter/release. Try contacting that clinic
or other vets in your area. They may be able to supply you with lots of
help and info. Good luck Robyn, you're helping put humpty back together
again.

[Robyn]

wrote:
> In article >,
> "Robyn" > wrote:
>
>> P.S. I'm in Hollywood, Florida, BTW. That's just south of Ft.
>> Lauderdale.
>
> You could try these guys (I found them through Google):
>
> http://www.catpals.org/
>
> "Cat Pals - A Feline Charity in South Florida
> A non profit charity that works off donations and fundrasing and is a
> volunteer based to feed and get medical attention to all ferel cats in
> the hollywood beach area in south Florida."
>
> The page also talks about a vet named Dr. James Dee of Hollywood
> Animal Hospital who believes in trap/neuter/release. Try contacting
> that clinic or other vets in your area. They may be able to supply
> you with lots of help and info. Good luck Robyn, you're helping put
> humpty back together again.

Yes, I had found them yesterday, thanks. So far all I get is an
answering maching. But they have the one huge colony they take care of,
and that's all they do. I doubt they can assist, although maybe someone
will be able to advise. :-)

Thanks,
Robyn
--
To avoid grizzlies, the Alaska Department of Fish & Game advises hikers
to wear noisy little bells on clothes and carry pepper spray. Also watch
for signs of activity: Black bear scat is smaller and contains berries;
grizzly scat has little bells in it and smells like pepper.

[Robyn]

Sharon Talbert wrote:
> Robyn, try this URL:
>
> www.thecatnetwork.org
>
> They are based out of Miami, if that helps. They might at least be
> able to put you in touch with someone who can help. Don't give up
> networking! But be prepared to do most of the work yourself, even if
> you find help with the expenses.
>
> Sharon Talbert
> Friends of Campus Cats
> Seattle

Thanks Sharon, I'll take a look, but Miami is a different county and
quite a distance. (I don't have easy transportation.) Still, you never
know.

I'd still like to know what to do with the cat if I'm lucky enough to
catch one in my carrier? Will it be calm until an appointment can be
arranged, or go ballistic? Also, how fast do these cats tame down?
They're always wanting to get in the house. They know their brother's in
there, and they're friends with my big male, Squidly. If I just let them
in on the porch, would they adjust enough within a couple of weeks to be
handled so I could transport them? I could probably afford to fix a cat
every week or two until they're done... Maybe that's a bad idea, I don't
know. Hopefully today's phone calls will yield some help. :-)

My S/O is now telling me we should just say the hell with it and take
all four of them in. ACK! Even with only 4, I can't sit down without
shooing a cat. I had to chase one out of the bathtub to take a shower
this morning. (The water tastes better than what's in the dish,
apparently.) Last week I woke up with a weight on my chest and a tail in
my mouth. I can't imagine having 8, especially with 5 of them being wild
things. I think my S/O needs his meds adjusted. :-)

Anyway, I'm rambling. Thanks for the advise, I'm going to see if I
can't get something done today, or at least form a plan.

Take care,
Robyn
--
To avoid grizzlies, the Alaska Department of Fish & Game advises hikers
to wear noisy little bells on clothes and carry pepper spray. Also watch
for signs of activity: Black bear scat is smaller and contains berries;
grizzly scat has little bells in it and smells like pepper.

[Lotte]

"Robyn" > wrote in message
. ..

> I'd still like to know what to do with the cat if I'm lucky enough to
> catch one in my carrier? Will it be calm until an appointment can be
> arranged, or go ballistic? Also, how fast do these cats tame down?
> They're always wanting to get in the house. They know their brother's in
> there, and they're friends with my big male, Squidly. If I just let them
> in on the porch, would they adjust enough within a couple of weeks to be
> handled so I could transport them? I could probably afford to fix a cat
> every week or two until they're done... Maybe that's a bad idea, I don't
> know. Hopefully today's phone calls will yield some help. :-)

The trick is to make the appointment for the neutering before you catch the
cat -- kind of tricky, I know, but people who do neutering for ferals
usually understand that they don't just walk into the trap on schedule.
Here in Austin, Animal Trustees of Austin has a low-cost spay/neuter clinic
that is open Thu-Sun. They take animals in early in the morning on a
walk-in basis, and discharge them later that day. So I usually set my trap
on Wednesday night, get up early Thursday and take the trap (if I've caught
anybody) directly to the clinic. That means they have to spend the night in
the trap, but 'them's the breaks' at our house. It's actually good in the
sense that I know they haven't had anything to eat or drink the night before
surgery.

If you catch one in your carrier, throw a blanket over it as soon as the
cat's in there -- this will help to keep it calm. You *might* be able to
get one of them into the carrier with a treat or something, but let me warn
you, though, most ferals are tough cookies, and as soon as you move toward
them, they're going to be out of there like a shot. Unless the door of your
carrier can be snapped securely shut with the string, you're probably not
going to be able to contain the cat. The fact that they're trying to get in
your house makes me think they're probably not 100% feral -- really wild
cats won't go near humans -- you rarely even see them. So they might calm
down enough if you kept them on your porch (I'm assuming we're talking about
an enclosed porch?) -- I doubt you'd be able to actually handle them, but
they might let you shut the door of the carrier with them inside if you're
quick enough. Put a treat in the carrier and see if you can sneak up on one
quick enough to get the door shut. DO NOT try to "catch" the cat with your
bare hands if it flies out of the carrier though -- you will regret it!


> My S/O is now telling me we should just say the hell with it and take
> all four of them in. ACK! Even with only 4, I can't sit down without
> shooing a cat. I had to chase one out of the bathtub to take a shower
> this morning. (The water tastes better than what's in the dish,
> apparently.) Last week I woke up with a weight on my chest and a tail in
> my mouth. I can't imagine having 8, especially with 5 of them being wild
> things. I think my S/O needs his meds adjusted. :-)

Really wild ferals won't want to live in your house with you, and will
prefer to be outside, so don't try to domesticate them into house cats.
Once they're neutered, just continue to feed them and watch for signs of
injury or illness. They will be your own little feral cat colony.

I know what you mean about the cat crowding -- we also have four, in our 750
square foot house, and it's a damned good thing I love them all. My
youngest cat, Rigby, who weighs close to 10 lb, has taken to "surfing" my
head in the morning to get me out of bed to feed him. Nothing like a fat
cat sliding across your face to start the day. Obviously, you love cats as
well, or you wouldn't be doing what you're doing. Please keep us posted on
what happens.

Lotte

[Sharon Talbert]

> > Seattle
>
> Thanks Sharon, I'll take a look, but Miami is a different county and
> quite a distance. (I don't have easy transportation.) Still, you never
> know.
>

I am hoping they can help you network and find a rescuer or rescue org
closer-in. Meanwhile, let's hope the locals you have found will return
your call. Hound them for a referral if they won't lend a paw. Also talk
to your vet; you may be pleasantly surprised.

You may have to involve several rescuers/orgs/vet clinics in this
operation. You may be able to borrow a trap or two from one place and
get some free or low-cost surgeries from another. Some vets will
vaccinate at no charge if you provide the vaccine (bought mail order,
though I prefer to pay $5 a pop for my vet to do it with her stuff, which
I know has been handled properly). Surf the web for low- to no-pay
spay/neuter coupons. Check out the Ally Cat Allies website and look
under "Find Feral Friends," which lists orgs by state. Keep networking.



> I'd still like to know what to do with the cat if I'm lucky enough to
> catch one in my carrier? Will it be calm until an appointment can be
> arranged, or go ballistic? Also, how fast do these cats tame down?
> They're always wanting to get in the house. They know their brother's in
> there, and they're friends with my big male, Squidly. If I just let them
> in on the porch, would they adjust enough within a couple of weeks to be
> handled so I could transport them? I could probably afford to fix a cat
> every week or two until they're done... Maybe that's a bad idea, I don't
> know. Hopefully today's phone calls will yield some help. :-)
>

The carrier trick is risky business but can be done. Have a vet in place
to do the surgery (with or w/o appointment; just agreeing to take on a
feral cat is the first challenge). We've had success with trap-wise cats
who have a devoted feeder by supplying an over-sized carrier and having
the feeder use the carrier as a feeding station. One cat, Lurchie (read
about her in the website) was trapped in a shelter/feeder the size of a
dog house that we converted with a slider door. A trap is best, though;
safer for the you, safer for the cat, safer for the vet.


> My S/O is now telling me we should just say the hell with it and take
> all four of them in. ACK! Even with only 4, I can't sit down without
> shooing a cat. I had to chase one out of the bathtub to take a shower
> this morning. (The water tastes better than what's in the dish,
> apparently.) Last week I woke up with a weight on my chest and a tail in
> my mouth. I can't imagine having 8, especially with 5 of them being wild
> things. I think my S/O needs his meds adjusted. :-)
>

Oh, sweet S/O! But don't get me started on house ferals. You have to
respect your own limits. Ferals can become your friends; they can even be
"tamed," as much as each individual spirit will allow. Lurchie came to us
as a middle-aged feral (she had been born on UW campus). She never quite
became a lapcat, but she was soon content and glad to be inside at last,
warm and dry and never hungry. And never lonely; ferals are sociable
beasties and need the company of the feline kind.

Keep us posted.

Sharon Talbert
Campus Cats
Seattle

[[email protected]]

well i actually trapped two cats in a carrier with string....i tied the
string to the top corner of the door(not on the side where its attached
but on the side where the lever is to open the cage...I used a cage
about two feet long(its a large size pet taxi) and i baited it with
tuna...firsst cat it took me a few trys but i got him....i braced the
cage against the wall of house and just pulled the string when i saw him
almost all the way in...my second cat was easier to get as i knew what
to do but it took her hour to finaly go into it. tip is to use dry food
for regular feeding and then baiut it with somethign that is realy a
treat for them(tuna or some sort of actual meat)

[Arjun Ray]

In >, "Lotte" >
wrote:

| Here in Austin, Animal Trustees of Austin has a low-cost spay/neuter
| clinic that is open Thu-Sun. They take animals in early in the morning
| on a walk-in basis, and discharge them later that day.

In New York city, the Humane Society of New York has a specially funded
program for ferals with a similar in-by-8:30am and out-by-5pm protocol:
physical exam, spay/neuter, rabies shot, flea+mite treatment and eartip,
all for free (provided they know you.) Appointments need to be made in
advance, of course, but on occasion we've been squeezed in on short
notice (they know what it's like, and they care.)

| So I usually set my trap on Wednesday night, get up early Thursday and
| take the trap (if I've caught anybody) directly to the clinic. That
| means they have to spend the night in the trap, but 'them's the breaks'
| at our house.

I would never leave a trap unmonitored overnight. What if the cat
thrashes and hurts itself? (I've seen this happen.) What if it rains?
(Ditto.) What if some clown stumbles on the trap and lets the cat go?
(Ditto.) What if someone just walks off with the trap? (Ditto.)

In my case, they also spend the night in the trap, but the trap is at
home. For recovery, I have dog crates and a playpen as needed, and for
the trip to the HS and for release I use transfer cages (much less
unwieldy than traps.)

| You *might* be able to get one of them into the carrier with a treat
| or something, but let me warn you, though, most ferals are tough
| cookies, and as soon as you move toward them, they're going to be out
| of there like a shot.

Agreed. That trick is more likely to work with strays.

[Lotte]

"Arjun Ray" > wrote in message
...
> In >, "Lotte" >
> wrote:
> I would never leave a trap unmonitored overnight. What if the cat
> thrashes and hurts itself? (I've seen this happen.) What if it rains?
> (Ditto.) What if some clown stumbles on the trap and lets the cat go?
> (Ditto.) What if someone just walks off with the trap? (Ditto.)

Well, it's not really umonitored, because I set it right below my bedroom
window (feral highway) and can hear it when it trips. If I hear it trip,
I'll get up and go throw a blanket over it. That usually settles down the
thrashers and keeps the cat and trap protected until morning. Thrashers
are, unfortunately, just as likely to hurt themselves in carriers as in the
trap, at least the one I use (hav-a-hart knock-off). If I get a major
thrasher, I'll usually turn him/her loose if they don't settle down under
the blanket. Since they're right under my window, I can hear if they're in
distress.

I did try transferring cats when I first started doing TNR and it seemed to
just stress the cats more. The way I do it now, they never even see me
except for the few seconds when I throw the blanket over them -- I take the
covered trap, cat and all, to the clinic early in the morning. I don't
worry about my trap walking off because I know all my neighbors, and if any
strangers came into my yard to get it (highly unlikely because it can't be
seen from the street), the dogs next door would go ape-****.

> In my case, they also spend the night in the trap, but the trap is at
> home. For recovery, I have dog crates and a playpen as needed, and for
> the trip to the HS and for release I use transfer cages (much less
> unwieldy than traps.)

I'm not really sure what you're saying here -- mine spend the night in the
trap, and the trap is at home... that's where I do my trapping. Maybe I
missed your point? Do you trap away from your own home? I have two crates
I use for recovery, a wire-type one for more sedate cats, and a plastic one
for the really wild ones -- it's more enclosed so the nervous cats feel more
secure in that one.

I think my situation isn't a typical TNR scenario -- I only trap cats in my
own neighborhood (tho I'd be glad to help anyone elsewhere who wanted to
trap), and we have a 'hoarder' down the street that feeds the 'hood strays
but is absolutely clueless about neutering -- I'm sort of 'working under the
radar,' so to speak. I'm sure I've caught and neutered people's pet cats,
because people here let them wander around at will, without collars on.
Incredibly stupid.

Keep up the good work.

LV

[Arjun Ray]

In >, "Lotte" >
wrote:
| "Arjun Ray" > wrote in message
| ...

|> I would never leave a trap unmonitored overnight.
|
| Well, it's not really umonitored, because I set it right below my
| bedroom window (feral highway) and can hear it when it trips.

I'm sorry, I misunderstood. If the trap is on your own premises, that's
different.

| If I hear it trip, I'll get up and go throw a blanket over it. That
| usually settles down the thrashers and keeps the cat and trap protected
| until morning.

Do you still leave the trap outside overnight? (We don't do that.)

| Thrashers are, unfortunately, just as likely to hurt themselves in
| carriers as in the trap, at least the one I use (hav-a-hart knock-off).

In our experience, thrashers settle down when they're removed to an
indoors holding area. There seem to be two main factors in their panic:
first, that they're out in the open, and that they're on familiar ground
(but in a strange predicament). Moving them to an unfamiliar location,
and keeping the trap covered of course, seems to kick in their natural
instinct to be as quiet as possible.

| I did try transferring cats when I first started doing TNR and it
| seemed to just stress the cats more.

That may have been a matter of technique - how did you transfer them?
We exploit their preference to stay hidden - putting the trap and cage
end to end, covered, and then uncovering the area where we don't want
the cat. It may take a few minutes, but eventually they move. We
generally don't use carriers except perhaps for release (in which case
they were recovering in a crate, so we use the same principle: put the
carrier in the crate and then uncover the crate.)

| I'm not really sure what you're saying here -- mine spend the night
| in the trap, and the trap is at home... that's where I do my trapping.

I meant holding them overnight indoors.

| Do you trap away from your own home?

Yes. I live in an apartment, so I don't have "visitors". I help with
various colonies in the area (and in other parts of the city.) I've
used other holding areas, such as the basement of a church for one
colony that I stabilized , but it's more convenient for me to take
them to the HS directly from home in the morning, so I bring them home
when I trap them.

| we have a 'hoarder' down the street that feeds the 'hood strays but is
| absolutely clueless about neutering -- I'm sort of 'working under the
| radar,' so to speak.

Oh man. This feeder is guaranteeing a constant stream of visitors for
you.

| I'm sure I've caught and neutered people's pet cats, because people
| here let them wander around at will, without collars on. Incredibly
| stupid.

Same here, in my neighborhood. It's a nuisance.

Pictures: http://www.picturetrail.com/aray/ . The colony is in
"Colony 5"; one of my favorite fellas, Greystoke, is also in the
"Ferals" album; my foster kittens Katrina and Calvin were also from
there.

[[email protected]]

In article >,
Arjun Ray > wrote:

> I would never leave a trap unmonitored overnight.

Yeah, when I started trapping, I ran into the same question and decided
against leaving the trap for more than an hour at a time--and even an
hour seemed excessive. My reasoning went like this: when a animal is in
the trap, it is helpless and completely exposed.

Already under a great deal of stress just from being trapped, the
animal is also abjectly subject to any passing adversity or threat. If
the trapper's intent is to help the trapped animal, then best to
quickly isolate it safely and comfortably so it isn't at the mercy of
whatever vagaries it might encounter.

If I cannot monitor my traps in a timely manner, I don't trap.

[Lotte]

"Arjun Ray" > wrote in message
...
> | I did try transferring cats when I first started doing TNR and it
> | seemed to just stress the cats more.
>
> That may have been a matter of technique - how did you transfer them?
> We exploit their preference to stay hidden - putting the trap and cage
> end to end, covered, and then uncovering the area where we don't want
> the cat. It may take a few minutes, but eventually they move. We
> generally don't use carriers except perhaps for release (in which case
> they were recovering in a crate, so we use the same principle: put the
> carrier in the crate and then uncover the crate.)

Hmmm.... maybe I was doing it the hard way! I might try this transfer
strategy. The point another poster made about them being left where they
have been trapped struck a nerve also -- makes sense to me that it would
cause them some anxiety to remain where they were trapped. At the very
least I could put the trap in the garage and cover it so they're in a
quieter location that smells different than where they were trapped. Give
them more a feeling of safety.


> | we have a 'hoarder' down the street that feeds the 'hood strays but is
> | absolutely clueless about neutering -- I'm sort of 'working under the
> | radar,' so to speak.
>
> Oh man. This feeder is guaranteeing a constant stream of visitors for
> you.

Tell me about it. I've talked to them until I'm blue in the face, and they
just don't get it -- so I took the path of least resistance and am now the
"invisible caretaker" of their "colony." The only upside really is that
they're very good about feeding. I put a feeding station near where I trap
to keep them coming thru my yard, but the hoarders keep them fed on a daily
basis pretty well.


> | I'm sure I've caught and neutered people's pet cats, because people
> | here let them wander around at will, without collars on. Incredibly
> | stupid.
>
> Same here, in my neighborhood. It's a nuisance.

It's worse than a nuisance, it's practically guaranteeing that their pets
will live short, miserable lives. If I could change *one* thing about what
people understand about cats, it would be DON'T LET THEM FREE-ROAM. It's a
bit like letting your three year-old out at night and expecting him to
return in the morning in one piece.


> Pictures: http://www.picturetrail.com/aray/ . The colony is in
> "Colony 5"; one of my favorite fellas, Greystoke, is also in the
> "Ferals" album; my foster kittens Katrina and Calvin were also from
> there.

Those are some good-looking cats! Nice mix of colors and stripe variations,
you've probably got a nice genetic range in there. Greystoke looks just
like my pet male Rigby -- tho Rig isn't quite that big (yet). I've always
had at least one gray tabby -- my old grinch, Bullet is a grey tabby a
friend rescued in the middle of our busiest downtown street. She's going on
14 now.

Thanks for the tips -- I'll let you know how it works out down here.

LV

[Arjun Ray]

In >,
wrote:

| If I cannot monitor my traps in a timely manner, I don't trap.

With you all the way.

Having said "never", I realized that there was another proviso: never
out in the open.

I *have* left a trap set overnight, but only indoors - the basement of a
church. I also covered the trap to make a "tunnel" - the cat is more
likely to go in if it can see through to the other side, and at least it
isn't completely exposed.

I caught both my foster kitten Katrina and her cousin Jezebel that way.
Katrina, not three months old, held out for five days without food. Her
aunt (1.5 years old at that point) did even better: she held out for an
incredible seven days - while pregnant (with 5), to boot. The stamina
seems to run in the family.

[Wendy]

"Lotte" > wrote in message
...
> "Arjun Ray" > wrote in message
> ...
> > In >, "Lotte" >
> > wrote:
> > I would never leave a trap unmonitored overnight. What if the cat
> > thrashes and hurts itself? (I've seen this happen.) What if it rains?
> > (Ditto.) What if some clown stumbles on the trap and lets the cat go?
> > (Ditto.) What if someone just walks off with the trap? (Ditto.)
>
> Well, it's not really umonitored, because I set it right below my bedroom
> window (feral highway) and can hear it when it trips. If I hear it trip,
> I'll get up and go throw a blanket over it. That usually settles down the
> thrashers and keeps the cat and trap protected until morning. Thrashers
> are, unfortunately, just as likely to hurt themselves in carriers as in
the
> trap, at least the one I use (hav-a-hart knock-off). If I get a major
> thrasher, I'll usually turn him/her loose if they don't settle down under
> the blanket. Since they're right under my window, I can hear if they're
in
> distress.
>
> I did try transferring cats when I first started doing TNR and it seemed
to
> just stress the cats more. The way I do it now, they never even see me
> except for the few seconds when I throw the blanket over them -- I take
the
> covered trap, cat and all, to the clinic early in the morning. I don't
> worry about my trap walking off because I know all my neighbors, and if
any
> strangers came into my yard to get it (highly unlikely because it can't be
> seen from the street), the dogs next door would go ape-****.
>
> > In my case, they also spend the night in the trap, but the trap is at
> > home. For recovery, I have dog crates and a playpen as needed, and for
> > the trip to the HS and for release I use transfer cages (much less
> > unwieldy than traps.)
>
> I'm not really sure what you're saying here -- mine spend the night in the
> trap, and the trap is at home... that's where I do my trapping. Maybe I
> missed your point? Do you trap away from your own home? I have two
crates
> I use for recovery, a wire-type one for more sedate cats, and a plastic
one
> for the really wild ones -- it's more enclosed so the nervous cats feel
more
> secure in that one.
>
> I think my situation isn't a typical TNR scenario -- I only trap cats in
my
> own neighborhood (tho I'd be glad to help anyone elsewhere who wanted to
> trap), and we have a 'hoarder' down the street that feeds the 'hood strays
> but is absolutely clueless about neutering -- I'm sort of 'working under
the
> radar,' so to speak. I'm sure I've caught and neutered people's pet cats,
> because people here let them wander around at will, without collars on.
> Incredibly stupid.
>
> Keep up the good work.
>
> LV
>
>

Any idea why some cats flip out in the trap and others just seem to resign
themselves to their lot in life?


W

[Lotte]

"Wendy" > wrote in message
...
>
> Any idea why some cats flip out in the trap and others just seem to resign
> themselves to their lot in life?
>
>
> W


No idea. Individual temperament, probably.

L.

[RedRiver35]

Good morning:

Animal Control is the biggest joke going!

I have not come across a decent group in the last 3 towns I have lived in.

Chelle.

> I flat
>out asked the guy at Animal Control if no one cared if these 4 cats just
>bred themselves into the hundreds, and he said no. (NOT kidding.)

=============

"The day may come when the rest of the animal creation may acquire those rights
which never could have been withholden from them but by the hand of tyranny.
The question is not can they REASON, nor can they TALK, but can they SUFFER?"
-- Jeremy Bentham

[Sharon Talbert]

> just don't get it -- so I took the path of least resistance and am now the
> "invisible caretaker" of their "colony." The only upside really is that
> they're very good about feeding. I put a feeding station near where I trap
> to keep them coming thru my yard, but the hoarders keep them fed on a daily
> basis pretty well.
>

Here's a tip. If the cats are too well fed to be interested in your trap,
try baiting with fresh catnip. Another benefit of catnip is that possoms
and raccoons don't care for the stuff. For some reason, catnip is most
successful with toms. We once caught two fighting toms the same night,
both still bleeding from their wounds. (In separate traps, thank gawd.)

Sharon Talbert
Friends of Campus Cats

[Robyn]

Robyn wrote:
> Hi,
> This is more of a vent than anything else, and this group seems
> like the right place for it. Who knows, maybe you guys can offer
> suggestions. I've just spent my entire morning trying to get trapping
> and spay/neuter information for the 4 feral cats (all one litter)
> that came along with the house we just bought. I don't mind feeding
> the cats and having them around, but the females just had their first
> heat, and are most likely already pregnant. The mother of this group,
> after disappearing for a long time, has also reappeared and is
> obviously nursing a new litter. (Whole other problem, but one thing
> at a time.)
>
> Called the Humane Society, they said to call Wildlife Care,
> Wildlife Care said to call the Humane Society, who then said it just
> wasn't their problem because the cats weren't pets and to call Animal
> control. Animal Control said it wasn't their problem unless I wanted
> to trap the cats myself, which I can't do. They then offered to rent
> me a trap for a $100 deposit + rent, which I don't have. (Even if I
> did trap them, they just wanted to haul them off to be euthanized,
> which isn't an option.) I flat out asked the guy at Animal Control if
> no one cared if these 4 cats just bred themselves into the hundreds,
> and he said no. (NOT kidding.)
>
> So the long and short of it is, no one will even discuss the matter
> unless I pay a fee and deliver the cats to them. These things are
> totally wild. Even if I could afford the $250 or so the entire
> undertaking would cost, and manage to trap them, what do I do with
> them until the vet appointment? No one I've asked seems to have
> answers. I've already adopted the runt from this group. He's pretty
> wild, but likes living in the house and gets along well with my other
> 3 cats. I wish I could take them all in, but they're just too wild,
> and I don't have any more room. The 4 I have now are a bit much at
> times. :-)
>
> Anyway, thanks for letting me vent. I guess I need to get back on
> the phone and try a few more places. It's just unreal that all these
> organizations that talk about how much they want to help unwanted
> animals lose interest when you actually ask them for assistance. But
> there's got to be some place that helps with these things. Suggestions
> welcome. Wish me luck. :-)
>
> Robyn

OK, I just wanted to follow up and let you guys know what was
happening, since everyone was so helpful. :-) I was able to borrow a
couple of traps from a *very* helpful person, and found a low cost vet
that didn't require appointments for ferals. So I put the traps out
Saturday morning, and as soon as I stepped away from the traps, there
were cats in them. (yay!) So away they went, and they're playing in the
yard today, a little more wary than before, but none the worse for the
experience, the poor things.

Of the remaining two females, I haven't seen one in several days now,
I'm afraid something may have happened to her. :-( The other one will
not go anywhere near the trap. She comes twice a day and cries to be
fed, but will not go to the trap. We've tried wet food, dry food,
catnip, you name it, she ignores it and just cries at the door for food
as if the trap wasn't there. Any ideas would be helpful.

I had only been seeing the nursing mother a couple times a week. She
looked fed, so I thought someone was looking after her, but now all of a
sudden she's here asking for food as well. At what point after she
brings the kittens out can she be trapped and spayed to stop this damned
cycle? (I have no idea what to do about the kittens. Hopefully she'll
just have a couple...)

Anyway, I just wanted to post a followup, since several people had
asked. I'll post if anything else happens. I'd appreciate any
suggestions on getting that female into the trap, as well as when I can
trap the mother cat.

Thanks!
Robyn
--
To avoid grizzlies, the Alaska Department of Fish & Game advises hikers
to wear noisy little bells on clothes and carry pepper spray. Also watch
for signs of activity: Black bear scat is smaller and contains berries;
grizzly scat has little bells in it and smells like pepper.

[[email protected]]

How to trap a cat that is trap-shy:

First, to ensure the cat doesn't get the food without springing the
trap, when you set the trap, make sure to put a newspaper on the floor
of the trap, folded lengthwise so it doesn't touch the sides and covers
the trip plate. Often cats will step over the trip plate if they see it
and will get the food, but not spring the trap. This is a good
precaution to take that will greatly increase the odds that that won't
happen.

That said, this is what I did to catch a feral that had been caught once
before, and was afraid of traps. It took a little over a week. I used
canned mackeral (any canned food that is really smelly will do) and
started by leaving the trap out, open with the door tied up using a
bungee cord. I put the food about a foot away from the front entrance of
the trap. I continued to do so until I was certain the cat was eating
the food there. Each day I moved the food closer and then gradually
inside the trap, making sure that the trap door was still tied up so it
would not spring. Each day I moved the bowl a little farther into the
trap. When I saw that the cat was always eating the food when it was far
into the trap, I then moved the food all the way to the back of the
trap, removed the bungee cord that was keeping the door up, and set the
trap so it would spring. I got the cat that night. Hopefully this will
work in your situation, but it may take a little time.
Glad to hear things are working out.

Megan



"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do
nothing."

-Edmund Burke

Learn The TRUTH About Declawing
http://www.stopdeclaw.com

Zuzu's Cats Photo Album:
http://www.PictureTrail.com/zuzu22

"Concerning all acts of initiative (and creation), there is one
elementary truth the ignorance of which kills countless ideas and
splendid plans: that the moment one definitely commits oneself, then
providence moves too. A whole stream of events issues from the decision,
raising in one's favor all manner of unforeseen incidents, meetings and
material assistance, which no man could have dreamt would have come his
way."

- W.H. Murray

[IloveicecreamR]

CUTE BEAR STORY, SHOULD FEED FERALS TO BEARS!!!! END OF STORY